First, maybe you need to establish ground rules for her picking up the kids -- time, for dinner? overnight?, etc. Then she will know what is expected and maybe no be inclined to say something about what you did or didn't do that she expected. Second, our 15 y/o stepson's therapist (got him in because his mother moved away with his sister when he was 13) says that you have to say age-appropriate things to the kids....so you probably shouldn't counter her comments with defenses. They don't really understand. Maybe just tell them that their mommy is very upset and confused right now and says a lot of things that aren't true. As for the judge said....maybe you and your husband have a discussion (or email or a letter) with her explaining why saying things to the kids violates the #1 rule of divorced parents and that it only hurts her children. In my case, the bio mom is too selfish and incapable of putting her children's needs above her own so that doesn't work -- but it reminds her that what she is doing is not right. If it continues, maybe you do go to the judge to get full time custody to protect the kids.

My very spoiled 19 y/o SD lived through that with her mother -- at 14 when mom left due to an affair, her daughter became her confidante and best friend. That girl was not done any favors and now has a lot of baggage to deal with (eating disorder to name one....).

Do whatever you can to protect the kids....but it won't be easy.....

Sorry, guess I was rambling too.....:-)

My Ex used to say things like that too -- totally outrageous, inappropriate and untrue. And (IMO) horribly damaging to the child. I verbally asked him to stop, wrote him a letter documenting the incidents and asking him to stop, and finally, got him to agree to "parenting counselling" and raised the issues there, where, of course, the therapists were shocked and asked him to stop.

Nothing worked -- He just had his own warped view of things, and anyone who disagreed with him was wrong. I honestly don't see how you can reasonably change the conduct of a person who has such a self-centered view and poor parental judgement. BioMom has serious issues, and it's these issues that drive her comments. You can't fix them, and you can't fix her.

I'd suggest you read the book Divorce Poison. (The therapists we saw recommended it to me privately.) It's a horrifying but enlightening read with lots of useful suggestions for how to handle those types of comments. The book's premise is that some statements can't be left unchallenged or else the child is likely to believe them. But the challenges to those statements need to be handled very carefully to avoid creating further damage. Jersey's suggestion about "mommy is very upset and confused right now and says a lot of things that aren't true" is reasonably consistent with the book's advice.

I'm all for taking the high road. Seriously. But sometimes you have to 'fight back' because it's just too important.

We do have full custody she has vistation but "her boss says" she has to work so she can't pick them up today betwen her boss and the judge she can't be a mom Yes this is what the kids say.

They will get ready for her to pick them up and she'll call "stuck at work" can't pick them up we have a court order as to visitation and support she completely ignores it and does what she wants when she wants. Blames the boss and judge its the judges fault she has to have a boss and its daddys fault the judge made her get another job. See the cycle... everyone else's fault but hers.

Each time we go back to court it costs us over $1000 and we still don't get any help. He tells her you are going to end up in jail... her response "I'll go to jail before I pay you anything" and "will you bring the kids to visit me in jail?" yes she has told the kids daddy and the judge are going to put me in jail. They don't get to visit with mom they take a guilt trip and we have to deal with the meltdowns.

We cannot say mommy is hurt or angry the 11 yr old says we "pick on mommy" and "talk about her" when we say anything about mom that so we can't. He feels he has to defend mommy because she is the victim because its 2 against 1.
Dad told her until you pay your support and bills you are going to equally provide meals for them if its your day you feed them. She makes twice the money he does. She wanted the 5:30 pick up time. Mcdonalds is open 24 hours a day she can feed them anytime she wants. They stuff themselves and their backpacks with food/snacks when going to moms she doesn't have anything in her house they only have fast food with her.

The 7 yr old had a meltdown over not having dessert ( I usually bake something or we have fruit but I didn't bake anything that day) ... Do you have dessert at mommy's? (this would be a comment the 11yr old thinks we are picking on mommy about) No it costs too much at mcdonalds... then don't expect it here she now knows dessert is a treat not an everyday event ... even though we have something just about everyday.

This mom has NO limits! She's already manipulating the 11 year old to misperceive even the most benign questions or statements. That exaggerated loyalty to twisted BioMom will do some serious psychological harm to those kids, and to your marriage.

You need to read that book Cawfe! Fast --

I agree with sweeby. I want through adn still going through a really bitter exwife. Uses the kids to no end. But her daughter is now seeing the light. Just last week, she turned to her father and said " i dont like mommy anymore. I dont like how she acts and what she says. I wish she would be more like maria" It broke my husbands heart. I never really counteracted her statements. I would just tell the kids that their mommy is still very angry at their dad with all the fighting theyve done and she will take it out on anyone. And she really does. She has segregated her parents from holidays and now her sister! My stepkids are really getting angry that she just doesn't get along with anyone. Her selfish ways are ruin things for them.
Protect the kids as best as you can and your husband is right. The kids will realize more as they grow but keep open communication with them. Let them talk about their feelings. Its very important!!!

Here we go again, the 8 yo fell down at school last week scraped elbow and knee not a big deal... yesterday we were served with another court date ... for violating court order not informing BM of the incident at school. 8yo to daddy "mommy said the judge said you were supposed to tell her if I fall down"

Dad called BM (reminds me of another term which is fitting for her) do you want to be called everytime the school calls she said YES ok when they forget violins, papers, notes, lunch money, everytime the school calls you will be notified I will call your work and inform you of these situations ... will you also be available to bring them the things they need?

We get anywhere from 3-5 calls a week because "they forgot something" her response no I just want to be informed.

So this morning :) the 11 yr old called forgot his violin called BM at work to inform her, then the nurse called for the 7yo, tummy ache nurse gives her a tylenol and sends her back to class, what to do what to do?? so I called BM at work to inform her "stop calling me at work" well when would you like to be informed ? hangs up! :)