Adult Stepchildren returning home

patriffel

My husbands son is in a jam, 27 years old, wife and two toddlers and is returning home--much to my dismay. I have parented him since he was 12 years old and feel I have done my "duty". My husband on the other hand, it thrilled at the idea of having his son and grandchildren in the house--they have been away for a few years and he is just excited to have them back--we have a 15 year old at home and a fairly strong marriage--I want to keep it that way!!

Is there anyone out there with some help--or just an ear.

Thanks

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doodleboo

EW EW EW. It sounds like a good idea to your husband now but I bet the welcome will wear out quickly. Is he really ready to have toddlers around full time again? That's a handful.

Are the limits being set on the stay or is this an open invitation to stay as long as necessary because I can tell you if boundaries arn't set they could wind up living there for years.

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lovehadley

HA. If I told my dad--or my mom--that my DD and I were "moving in," I think they would flip!

I don't think this is a step-parent vs. bio parent issue. I think it is just a matter of--you have done your duty, you and your DH have raised the kids, and now it's more than time for them to be on their own.

NOW--I will say, in fairness to your DH, that my parents (who are divorced) would NEVER turn me and DD away if I fell on hard times. They would for SURE let me move back home TEMPORARILY but I'm just pretty darn confident they wouldn't be HAPPY about it.

I can certainly understand your hesitation here. I think you and DH need to sit down and discuss some ground rules. Dlo NOT let son and family move back in with no clear expectations/guidelines or doodleboo is right---they will be there forever!

What is the reasoning for them needing to do this? Lost job? Debt?

The answer kind of determines the boundaries...if son has lost his job, then I would definitely require that he be actively looking for a new job. Can they afford to pay rent, even if it's just a small amount? I would spell out what you expect them to do--pay rent, buy their own food or contribute to the grocery shopping for the household, etc. What chores will they do? Do not let yourself get into a situation where you are doing the kitchen cleanup for all these extra people every single night.

Also, be very careful with the childcare. I can totally see you guys getting roped into babysitting the grandkids. I think it's TOTALLY fine to help out with that IF you guys WANT to...but don't let yourselves get taken advantage of!

Good luck!

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kkny

LH,

I seem to recall your parents/grandparents/trust helping you with buying condo, childcare and tuitiion when you found yourself unexpectedly pregnant. Not all parents can afford to do that.

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lovehadley

"I seem to recall your parents/grandparents/trust helping you with buying condo, childcare and tuitiion when you found yourself unexpectedly pregnant. Not all parents can afford to do that."

What does that have to do with the situation at hand?

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mom2emall

Where does that fit in KKNY???

Anyways, I think it is great that your dh is helping his son and family out. He just needs to set some boundries right away to keep the peace.

1. If you use it clean it!
2. If its not yours then ask before you use it!
3. You need to work and take care of your children!
4. A plan needs to be made by the son of how long they intend on staying with you.

My friend stayed with her parents temporarily. Her dad charged her "rent" with the understanding that her "rent" would be returned to her as a down payment on a home or a security deposit on an apt. when her time was up in his home. He took money weekly and put it in a savings account. I think that is a wonderful idea to help your ss save up money to help him move out down the road.

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lovehadley

Actually, I see what you are getting at...

That my parents would never BE in the situation OP is in because they can afford to help me out. Right?

Well, I will say this. There were CLEAR expectations when I was in college and also being a parent. I was to be IN SCHOOL. My educ. trust would not even pay out if I didn't provide my school schedule AND grades every semester.

I would NOT have had the help/resources I did if I had been goofing off/cutting class, or out partying. The SECOND I graduated and got a job, I took over paying my own bills because THAT was the agreement.

My dad continued on to say that he wanted to pay for my DD's private school education, but he sees that as a gift to her.

SO--while I might not have had to move home, my parents CERTAINLY set guidelines about what they expected of me.

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doodleboo

There is NOTHING wrong with helping a kid out who really needs it but I do stress boundaries and deadlines be set.
The son needs a plan of action and a time line to remedy the situation and if it becomes obvious the plan isn't being followed...you are no longer helpping, you are enabling. Once that transition happens in comes the marriage problems.

Also, how do you and his wife get along? I hear alot of step parents have problems with adult step daughters or the wives of the Step son's. Women can be catty like that.

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catlettuce

Ugh...insist on boundaries now, or else read up on some of my posts regarding the same situation then you'll know you must set boundaries if you want to survive with your sanity & marriage intact. I would set a move OUT date before they move in. If your DH thinks it is going to be fun, well maybe for a week or so, then let me tell you it gets old.

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imamommy

Yep, set up boundaries.. deadlines.. and by goodness STICK TO THEM!!! The minute you let it go once, you've lost control and six weeks turns into six months... then come the excuses.

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theotherside

Not everyone hates having their children come home. I am also thrilled when my adult children are home. Raising my kids is/was not a duty - it is a privilege.

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lovehadley

"Not everyone hates having their children come home. I am also thrilled when my adult children are home."

Yes, but IMO there is a BIG difference between an adult child/and or family coming for a VISIT and an adult child AND two toddlers AND wife MOVING IN *temporarily.* From the way you phrased the above comment, I get the impression that you enjoy it when your adult kids come home to visit.

Would you really have NO boundaries if one of your adult kids and his/her family moved back in? What would happen if the situation became too overwhelming, or you found yourself being taken advantage of? It happens and I think the best way to prevent that is to be clear from the beginning on what you do/do not expect.

I'm not saying there aren't positives to the situation, but I just think the OP needs to make sure her DH sets clear boundaries/expectations about how the situation will work, what limits there will be, etc.

I agree raising children IS a privilege but come on, let's be realistic....I don't think any parent would consider it a privilege to be supporting a 27 year old and his family.

I'm not saying that is what will happen here, but I just think OP needs to set some basic ground rules to ensure that she and her DH don't wind up supporting this grown person and his family with no end in sight. It's fine to HELP someone get back on their feet as long as that person/people is doing everything they can to help themselves, as well.

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pseudo_mom

Love don't waste your time.

She's a saint, her children are perfect .....

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athlete2010

Hi Pat,

At this point, I would be more concerned about what caused the "jam" and how the decision was made to move them into your house.

Did your husband consult with you in advance? If so, how did he react when you expressed dismay? Did he even care?

The answers to those questions will be an indicator as to how successful you will be in setting a time limit for their stay at your house.

Also, what responsibilities will the adult "kids" have around the house? What rules will be followed? This is a whole family that is moving in with you for a total of seven people in a house. Some order has to be established and agreed upon to prevent complete chaos.

What kind of example will this be setting for your 15 year old? The answer lies in the reason for the return of the adult son, and what gets established when he and his family arrive.

How is your 15 year old going to react to this situation?

I agree with Cat that after a week it gets old.

Hopefully, these questions will help you. You have found a place where people are willing to listen.

Athlete

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steppschild

P. -

Take heed to what everyone is saying about setting up boundaries and rules in advance AND BY ALL MEANS STICK TO IT. Our similar situation arose 6 months ago when BF's DD(24)asked if she could move back home when her April lease expired. She and her BF couldn't afford their upcoming rent increase, nor could they afford a new place because she acquired many pets after moving out and this really limited their choices of rentals and or/increased the amount of rent/pet deposits. She said that she would be here 6 months, which means the end of October. I totally understand why BF wants to help his DD and I know I would want to do the same if I were in his shoes. She's not a bad person, I know that she was struggling and probably partially supporting her BF because she has a much better job.

DH told her she'd be paying him X-amount in rent (he was going to save it and give it back to her when she moved, but she didn't know this), she was also expected to contribute with household chores and clean up after her animals on a regular basis...

Cliff's Note Version: She never stepped up to the plate like a responsible adult should have and handed over any money as she agreed. Pitching in around the house - NOPE. Cleaning up after pets - NOPE. A couple days after moving in, she informed DH that she was taking a month long trip abroad w/her BF. This was obviously planned soon after getting the word that she could come home because most of her trip and itinerary were already completed and paid. A couple of weeks after her return, while we took off a few days to visit family, she enrolled in school to get an additional degree - as I have said in another post, I don't think she'll be leaving at the end of October because of this. An hour ago I overheard her say that she was going to get another tattoo today, this makes fifteen and they aren't cheap. Clearly she has no intention of saving any money for rent and deposits.

DH didn't enforce "his rules" when she first moved in, so most of this is his fault. He didn't want to be the bad guy and he wanted to respect her as an adult, which clearly she isn't maturity-wise and she doesn't reciprocate with respect. Something happened the other day and DH finally did blow and he approached her about several issues, she gave him a check for the month of August, but nothing retro. AND it's too late with regard to her staying 6 months because she will have tuition and books to buy.

You guys really need to discuss things together first w/regard to what you each expect and then DH will need to set the rules and firmly adhere to them, otherwise they will never want to leave.

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athlete2010

I just wanted to clarify what Pat said and didn't say in the orignal post.

She did not use the word "hate", she said she was "dismayed". She also referred to the family of four moving in with her, not just "coming home" for a visit. There is a difference.

Also, she used the word "duty", but I believe she meant it in the sense of responsibility. When parent have raised their child to adulthood, then they have fulfilled their responsibility. Whatever they do beyond that point is certainly up to them.

I hope that Pat will continue to post and share her experience.

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theotherside

No, I was overjoyed when my adult kids moved back after college, and I missed them terribly when they moved out after a year, though of course I was happy for them that they found good jobs with benefits, etc. Their first year out of college, both of them worked 2-3 part-time jobs at a time.

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athlete2010

I think that Pat has every right to be dismayed in her situation. Her step-son is not a recent college grad returning home to work and save money for a short period of time. He's married with kids and he's 27. Something obviously has gone wrong. I would be dismayed as well - especially about the cause of the return.

It is a priviledge to raise kids, but it's not fun if they do not mature in their 20's (I'm not saying that's the case here, I don't know). There aren't any good books on raising a 27 year old that I know of.

We should be happy when our adult children want to be independent and they take the steps to make that happen.
That is the goal most parents strive to achieve.

It's understandable that Pat's husband has missed his son and grandkids for the past two years. He wants to spend time with them, and that's fine. However, he could be creating a dependency here that might do more harm than good. That's why it is best to proceed with extra caution, some ground rules, and a firm date of departure in the not too distant future.

In this situation, it's easy for some people just to focus on the dad and his relationship with his older son and grandkids. Lost in the picture is his wife and 15 year old son whose home life has just been turned upside down.

Has the husband considered their concerns and their rights in the home? If not, he could be carelessly harming his own marriage and his relationship with his younger son.

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theotherside

It's reasonable to be dismayed at the cause of the return - her SS is probably dismayed, too, if it is job loss, or illness, or foreclosure, etc. Why do you assume it would be a problem for his brother, though? He may well be overjoyed - I know my younger kids would be very happy if their sister of that age moved back, especially if she brought along a couple of little kids. My kids miss their older siblings SO much, probably almost as much as I do.

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catlettuce

"Why do you assume it would be a problem for his brother, though? He may well be overjoyed"

At age 15? Lol, I doubt it..he might be worried about losing his privacy, having little kids going through his "stuff" and having to share his room..

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athlete2010

"Why do you assume it would be a problem for his brother, though?"

Actually, I never said it would be a problem, but it could be. What I did say is that his home life would be turned upside down (when you go from three people to seven overnight), and that his father should consider any concerns that the 15 year old has.

The point is that the father should not assume anything - especially that his wife and younger son will be overjoyed with this situation. He should take their feelings into account and frequently talk to them about what is going on in the house.

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kkny

Why is it if 15 year old is stepchild, it is do as your parents tell you, but if he is child of stepmom, it is consider his feelings? What happened to if parents decide to let SS27 stay, 15 year old should deal with it? But enough of that, it seems to me that parents want to help children more than steps. My god, look at all LoveHadleys parents did for her. You can listen to the arguements here re setting boundaries, but in the end you may have to deal with Dad wants to help his child. If SS27 has lived away for a number of years, it seems as if he is generally capable of providing for himself, but has suffered a setback.

OP, I'ld like to hear more, why is SS27 moving in, what are his goals?

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lovehadley

My DD and I went to Maui with my dad, and my brother (23) and my dad's GF and her two kids last year.

My brother (who is in grad school and has NEVER lived with a young child) seriously looked like he was about to LOSE his mind at the trip's end!

This was a year ago---so the kids were 5, 7, and 10.

If this 15 year old's brother is 12 years older than him, chances are they have never really lived together--assuming the older brother moved out when he was 18, then the younger one would have been only 6.

So I am guessing he's not really "missing" having older bro live at home.

Plus, having two toddlers suddenly living in your home IS a big deal. It changes a lot of things. The 15 year old might have to keep his noise/friends down to a bare minimum at a really early time if the two little ones have to be asleep, and the house isn't large enough for them to be out of earshot.

Don't get me wrong, I love children, and toddlers just crack me up--but having two suddenly come live with you IS a big deal.

DH should definitely take his wife and other son's feelings into consideration and at least make sure that THEIR rights are respected.

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lovehadley

"My god, look at all LoveHadleys parents did for her."

LOL, why does that bother you so much? You certainly bring it up every chance you get.

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kkny

It bothers me that you stand at the front of the line when it is time for parents to help children. I would think you would be more understanding.

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theotherside

I have quite a bit of experience living in a household with babies and toddlers as well as teenagers, and quite a bit of experience living in a household with adult children, teenagers, and younger ones. I HAVE children with the age difference of the OP and even greater, and the younger ones WERE heartbroken when the older ones moved out. They most certainly do remember, and remember fondly, having their older siblings at home.

"The 15 year old might have to keep his noise/friends down to a bare minimum at a really early time if the two little ones have to be asleep, and the house isn't large enough for them to be out of earshot."

Out of earshot? There is no out of earshot in my house. No one has ever made much of an effort to keep the noise down when their little siblings were asleep, in our "huge" 900 square foot house. My kids learned to sleep through anything.

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lovehadley

"It bothers me that you stand at the front of the line when it is time for parents to help children. I would think you would be more understanding."

I am NOT saying parents shouldn't help their children. I just think the parents/stepparents should also set their own terms/boundaries to ensure that the ultimate goal is met---for the children to be independent.

I also don't think it is a fair comparison to compare me to this situation. I got pregnant when I was a sophomore in college--20 years old. It was irresponsible of me, and my parents let me know that. BUT I did what was expected of me from the get-go---because my parents had clear expectations and guidelines. If I had not been in school and getting good grades, I would not have received money. Period.

Anyway--I was 20 years old, not 27, married and with two kids. IMO, there is a difference.

I am 27 NOW, almost 28, and have a college degree and the means and ability to support myself and my daughter.

NOW--I might not have gotten here without my parents' help and support--but I am still here.

AND I firmly reiterate that it is FINE for parents to help IF they want to---but that clear guidelines and expectations need to be ironed out BEFORE problems arise. I knew right from the start, before I got PG with my DD, that my trust would only pay my tuition/room & board if I provided my school schedule and grades EVERY semester. I KNEW that if I slacked off, I would jeopardize my help.

When my DD was born, my parents pretty much said "this is the deal: you go to school, take 12 credits/semester, graduate, and become self-supporting. If you hold up your end of the bargain, we will honor ours." Now that's not verbatim, but in so many words...

So now tell me---what is your problem with what I said about the OP setting boundaries?

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athlete2010

"Why is it if 15 year old is stepchild, it is do as your parents tell you, but if he is child of stepmom, it is consider his feelings?"

Shouldn't most 15 years olds do what their parents and step parents tell them to do? I think that goes without saying.

The fact that he is the child of the stepmom has nothing to do with the recommendation that his feelings be considered. We're talking about his dad making a decision to allow his grown brother to move his whole family into the home - that's the issue.

From the many posts I have read here, I can't agree with the general statement that the step parents don't want to help as much. There are examples of dedicated step parenting, patience in difficult situations, and financial support.

To me, OP's post is more of a parenting and marriage issue than anything else. It may be ok to help for a short while in her situation, but when does it cross the line and create a dependency? Is that really helping the adult child if that happens?

Yes, it can be sad for young ones when a much older brother and sister move out after age 18. However, most kids that I knew when I was young accepted that their older brothers and sisters had moved out or were going to move out, and that this was just part of growing up.

When a parent wants their adult children well in their twenties to be home more than he/she wants them to be independent, then perhaps it's the parent who hasn't accepted the reality that their children have become adults.

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theotherside

Why is everyone assuming that the son and his family are not going to move out as soon as possible? The original poster said he was in a jam, not that he just decided he would rather live with his father. Most young families I know would much rather be living independently.

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loladoon

Is there any deadline for how long they will be staying? Are they living there rent free?

If they are not expected to pay rent to you, I would collect it anyway. Take the money and make them think they have an obligation to pay it every month. Put the money in a savings account and don't tell them you are doing that. Give them the money after the move out.

If you give people something for nothing, they take it for granted. Be careful that you and the 15-yr-old are not treated as a built-in babysitters.

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colleen777

Where is mom? Why aren't they moving in with mom? I know some will say well mom's house just isn't big enough, or she doesn't have as much money, bla, bla, bla. If she is still around they should move in with mom, and you can provide some extra dollars to help her offset additional costs. It is more than passing strange that these situations so often end up on dad and stepmoms front door.

There will be lots of extra costs: Water, food, electricity, gas, wear and tear on appliances & furnishings, all kinds of stuff.

What about all the extra housework, shopping and cooking? Who is going to do that? Dad?

What about your routines like when you get up in the morning for example? You are used to having a coffee and watching the news, having a shower. Now you find, you can't watch the news anymore because the little kids are chattering and running around, as little kids will and should do, you can't have a shower because all the hot water and towels have been used by other people, etc. etc.

The only way this situation can work successfully even on a short term basis, is if your routines and needs always come first. That the way you like to keep your house is how the house will be kept and also that you will assume no extra duties unless you choose to. It needs to be clearly stated that they have no decision in how things will be done in your home. Skip the rent! Once people start paying rent, no matter how miniscule, they think they have rights.

Most men are oblivious the amount of time and energy that goes into keeping a house. They also tend to see their routines as the only ones that matter, and rarely is it the male whose routine is disturbed.

So the fact of you being gracious enough to invite so many people to share in your home should be honored as a privilege, not a right. And the person who must understand this most of all is your husband and if he doesn't "get" it, don't even consider it.

Problem is, this kind of situation is a damned if you do, damned if you don't one. It was thoughtless of your stepson to ask dad first. He should have asked you first and avoided a whole can of worms. I mean is saying no even an option without causing hard feelings?

But I still ask where are all the moms in these kinds of situations? Please forgive me if she is passed away.

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theotherside

I thought most of you thought the father was just as much a parent as the mother - why, then, should the family necessarily move in with the mother?

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steppschild

TOS:

The reason why Colleen is suggesting the SS move in with the mother is because women usually get the brunt of the household chores, i.e., cooking, grocery shopping, cleaning the bathroom, laundry, vacuuming...you've been there as a woman.

Since you're not a step parent, you don't realize that the kids (adult or not) would be the first ones to say, "You're not my mother" or "I don't need a second mother". Yes they are right, they do have a mother and I don't think many of us would want to take that from them. The flip side of this coin is that since they already have a "mother", they should have her cook, clean, and grocery shop because as step parents most of us feel that our efforts are not appreciated.

How would you feel if you spent years in the life of a child and loved them, helped provide for them and were there when they asked for a favor or help, but then you were not wished a happy birthday nor included in photos when the kids were taking pics at family gatherings or asked to leave the house on their prom day because their mom was coming over and it was their day? All of those things happened to me and to rub salt into the wound I am shown the family photos. It took BF awhile to realize I wasn't in any photos - he felt badly. These things happen to many of us and it's hurtful and it's not right, but we often silently suck it up to not cause problems. Would you like to feel excluded and used? If you were a SM,do you think your kids would want to see somebody else's kids treat you like this? Before jumping down all of the SM's throats on this site, just try to put your foot into our shoes once.

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kkny

Gerina,

But the dad is still the dad. Some people here gripe why is it dad is viewed only as a wallet. Well, if he isnt doing parenting things, that may happen. And we are talking about adults here (27SS).

Frankly -- I dont think my Xs SO belongs in prom pictures -- but DD didnt go to dads that day.

You are not the mom. That doesnt mean Dad isnt the Dad.

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theotherside

Why are you assuming anyone is going to be cooking or cleaning for this family? Maybe the son or his wife are wonderful cooks. My oldest kids are fantastic cooks. My exH is an excellent cook, too. There would now be FOUR adults to share the cooking, cleaning - that sounds really good to me.

Sure they should wish you a happy birthday - how is that related to being a stepparent? I wish my coworkers happy birthday. I would not feel slighted if I were not in family pictures - but I am not sure how this relates to my question about why Colleen suggested that they move in with their mother.

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petra_gw

Patriffel, in my opinion having children or stepchildren move back in will only work if the relationship between all parties is great, and everyone generally gets along well and truly agrees it's a good idea. Unfortunately, that's not the case for most people. I think it's terribly unfair of your husband to expect you to agree to this. It's very disruptive to have other adults (and children) around for extended time periods, unless you live in a huge house where everyone can stay to themselves, if necessary. Would there be another way to help out, perhaps with a few month's rent? Not fair, I know, but probably cheaper than supporting a whole family for an undetermined amount of time. Utilities, groceries, etc. will take a huge chunk out of your budget anyway.

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imamommy

Adult kids that need help should, before they even ask mom or dad, consider how their problems are going to affect the parent/family they are moving in with... not just the mom or dad. Mom may also be remarried and have other people to consider here.

If I lost my job and had two small kids and needed a place to go, I would first look at all my options... then choose who to ask first. I would not just assume that my parents would be thrilled to have me move in with young kids and interrupt any peace they might be enjoying, whether they are remarried or not. If they were remarried, more kids (step or bio), I would probably sit my parent down alone, tell my problem and not expect an answer right away as they have to consult with their spouse and/or minor kids that will be impacted. Then, I'd expect to have a sit down with all the adults to discuss terms and conditions of my stay and house rules. That is how I would handle it as an adult. At 27, it doesn't matter what the reason for having to move back in is, it happens. Understood. But, in being a grown up and realizing you NEED your parents help and you are not really ENTITLED to it, you should be grateful and respectful of their life.

Think of it this way, if you had to move in with your boss, or a friend, or anyone else, you would not expect them to put up with too much. Why should parents and/or step parents be expected to?

Adult kids returning home can be a blessing if you have wonderful children that contribute, clean up after themselves and are pleasant to be around. They can also be a nightmare if they are dirty/messy, can't hold a job and stay up all night/sleep all day, don't discipline their children/yell at the kids non stop (and the kids are unruly), bring strangers into your home, things start disappearing, they won't do any kind of chore to help out, they expect to be fed but won't cook or clean up, they expect you to babysit regardless of your mood or prior plans, etc. It can be fun or it can be chaotic. IT ALL DEPENDS ON THE KIND OF PERSON THEY ARE.

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steppschild

TOS and KKNY:

As usual you two miss the point. Regarding the prom photo, I wasn't talking about that. I'm talking about Thanksgiving (where I wore my "June Cleaver Apron", TOS!!!) where I cooked for nineteen poeple including BM, her parents and siblings and her BF, as well as other events like that. Why are you assuming that the SS,and his wife are going and his father for that matter are excellent cooks? You don't know and I don't know; but this is what you two always do, make assumptions and pick everyone apart. I think as women, most of know that we are the keeper's of our homes and that's all Colleen was getting at, or oops - I assume.

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catlettuce

"Why are you assuming anyone is going to be cooking or cleaning for this family? Maybe the son or his wife are wonderful cooks. My oldest kids are fantastic cooks. My exH is an excellent cook, too. There would now be FOUR adults to share the cooking, cleaning - that sounds really good to me. "

Great!!! Both of My SS's & my DS are excellent cooks also- I will send ALL of them to you and I'm sure they would be happy to cook for you in exchange for free room/board.

Enjoy, my compliments! Keep them as long as you like I am sure they will get the best of accomadations there and I could use a little "me time".

p.s. can I send DH & the pets too? I'm sure they'll be no trouble at all.

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theotherside

WHY IS EVERYONE ASSUMING THE WORST??? Most parents DO get along well with their children. Most adult children ARE responsible. The OP said the father was looking forward to this. Why are you all jumping to the conclusion that they are lazy, good for nothing layabouts?

gerina,

"Regarding the prom photo, I wasn't talking about that."

You weren't talking about the prom photo when you were talking about the prom photo?

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catlettuce

I don't think anyone is assuming any such thing.

My Skids aren't bad or good for nothing, or lazy when it's something they want to do, but because no ground rules or limitations were placed when they moved in they do take advantage. It happens. Not because they are bad but because of family dynamics. When kids move back home no matter how old they are old patterns emerge and old roles of parent/child are in place again.

Unfortunately TOS, not everyone wants our grown kids living with us til we die-some of us would like to retire, travel and have them visit-key word being VISIT (then go home).

The fact is though having adult kids move in and taking over your space and having no privacy might be fun for a week or two, after that it gets a little trying to say the least.

Ground rules, and a move out date are essential. Unless of course you don't mind having them live with you forever.

Speaking for myself though, the goal has always been to have the kids grow up & be self-supporting as we won't always be there to bail them out. I don't mind helping short term, but I do mind when instead of saving for a down payment they are going to bars and buying motorcycles. Does that make them bad? No, just irresponsible.

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steppschild

TOS:

If you're going to continue to be petty and argue with people, then get your facts straight and LEARN HOW TO READ.

""Regarding the prom photo, I wasn't talking about that.""

""You weren't talking about the prom photo when you were talking about the prom photo?""

Again, I said:

"How would you feel if you spent years in the life of a child and loved them, helped provide for them and were there when they asked for a favor or help, but then you were not wished a happy birthday nor included in photos when the kids were taking pics at family gatherings or asked to leave the house on their prom day because their mom was coming over and it was their day?"

I say nothing in this of not being included in a prom photo. I was speaking of three different things, my friend. Again, you fabricate and twist things to suit your argument.

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kkny

MY BIL is a great cook and does all the cooking on holidays and at home with my sister.

My sister btw has a SS she has loved and supported. But never once does she feel she is a mom. She has enough confidence in herself, her life, her husband, her career, etc., if soemone wants her in a picture, fine, if not OK too.

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theotherside

"I will send ALL of them to you"

Go right ahead. If they will cook, and especially if they'll clean up afterwards, I'll be happy to have them. And my kids would be happy to take the pets, too.

Not all twenty-something's are irresponsible. Most of them are not. Most of them would rather be out on their own, but sometimes circumstances make that impossible.

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colleen777

So as long as they will serve you meals they can live with you TOS? Big deal! What if they like to drink and smoke. Is that going to be allowed in your house?

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kkny

I think parents and stepparents see children differently. I think everyone sees the best in their own children. The parent remembers the meal the child cooked, the stepparent, the ones they didnt.

PS I dont smoke, but I drink wine. My mom would welcome me back.

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athlete2010

The parent remembers the meal the child cooked, the stepparent, the ones they didn't."

The blanket statement above belittles the effort and sacrifices that most stepparents in these posts make - which is exactly what they would do if these were their "own" children.

From the many posts I have read here, the stepparents do appreciate their stepkids, and in many cases go the extra mile to show them.

According to the protocol of this site, "This is the spot for those in stepfamilies to offer each other advice on dealing with problems that may occur."

This is not a place to bash stepparents. This is a place to offer support for problems like the one the OP described - which could occur in any family.

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kkny

Athlete, OPs comment may have been fair, but then responses like why cant the kids move in with the mom to me at least show some difference between how parents v. stepparents would see thing. And athlete, you cut off the beggining of my paragraph, twice modified with I think.

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imamommy

"I was overjoyed when my adult kids moved back after college"

Did they bring a spouse and two small kids with them? In fact, how many of your adult kids are married? What if they marry someone you don't like? Or if you like who they marry, how would you know that you'd want them living with you? When best friends get an apartment together, it can often end up in the loss of the friendship. Living together can be stressful when you don't have the same expectations or lifestyles. (that is also why it's hard to blend families sometimes) While you may enjoy YOUR child moving home, you can't really say if you'd enjoy his/her spouse living there too, unless you have actually been in that situation.

"Not all twenty-something's are irresponsible. Most of them are not. Most of them would rather be out on their own, but sometimes circumstances make that impossible."

That is true. But, in OP's situation, it would depend on the reason they are in a jam. There are two adults (in my prior post, I thought it was just the son moving home with his kids, but he has a wife) and there's not much reason for two able bodied adults to 'have' to move home, unless one is disabled or can't work for some reason... or they were irresponsible in racking up debt and got in over their head... then you can't argue that they aren't irresponsible, because they might be. (Doesn't make them bad people, just irresponsible and gives OP a reason to be concerned)

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lovehadley

KKNY,

I understand that your ex-DH cheated on you, and now his SO is your DD's stepmother. I can clearly see why you would feel bitter and angry towards your ex, and even why you wouldn't want TOW to have any sort of role in your DD's life. I know for SURE that if I were in your shoes, I would feel the same way.

but I don't understand how it makes you feel better to come on this forum--a SUPPORT FORUM for stepparents--and spread negativity.

Believe it or not, the majority of stepparents did NOT break up happy homes. My fiance's and his ex had been broken up for WELL OVER A YEAR before I even MET him.

And I am fairly sure the same goes for all the other stepmothers on here.

Most of us are just trying to work through and address issues that arise in stepfamilies. We are trying to do the BEST we can for our families, and we want support and understanding from other women that have walked in our shoes.

don't you think you would feel SO much better if you were on a forum specifically for women whose DH's had cheated? It really is true, you cannot understand what someone feels unless you've walked in those same shoes.

I just don't understand what you get out of this forum.

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steppschild

KKNY:

This is the last time I will engage you in one of your (and TOS' for that matter) pissing matches because it really is unproductive and we are only trying to make our families work. Like it or not KKNY these families include children from previous marriages that unfortunately didn't work. Most of us have the best of intentions for these kids and we don't want to tread on your feet, believe you me. Since the below comment was directed at me, I will respond with the same thing I said to TOS:.

If you're going to continue to be petty and argue with people, then get your facts straight and LEARN HOW TO READ.

You said:

"MY BIL is a great cook and does all the cooking on holidays and at home with my sister.

My sister btw has a SS she has loved and supported. But never once does she feel she is a mom. She has enough confidence in herself, her life, her husband, her career, etc., if soemone wants her in a picture, fine, if not OK too."

...And I said:

"Yes they are right, they do have a mother and I don't think many of us would want to take that from them."

I don't see anywhere in that statement where I say that I felt like a mom or want to be their mom. Although you may have deduced by all of the things that I have done for these kids throughout my time in with them, that they were motherly. KKNY, these are things that you would do for your own kids. I guess the truth hurts.

It must really kill you to have another woman fill in during your absence (and in most cases we're not even filling in because you're incapable - it's just the fallout of divorce). I think it is you who feels insecure and threatened by us. Get over it. We probably all have the same goal for your kids - their well being.

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kkny

A lot of people here assume the stepchildren are not just in a jam, as OP stated, but not deserving etc. I dont feel insecure. I do feel some SMs want the benefit of family but dont really regard the stepchildren as they do their own.

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athlete2010

What I quoted in my previous post was an exact sentence by someone else which was used as a concluding and condemning statement against stepparents.

I think that it is rather obvious that it's what that writer "thinks".

I stand by my response.

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petra_gw

* Posted by kkny (My Page) on
"I do feel some SMs want the benefit of family but dont really regard the stepchildren as they do their own."

How can they when adult stepchildren disrespect them at every opportunity? I am always overlooked when it comes to giving gifts, I am lucky if I get a candy bar. When I make a special effort to bake or cook something SS likes, he rarely says "Thank you" or even comments that it tastes good. Contrast that with my son who never excludes me when giving gifts to everyone, and who inhales everything I cook, praises it and asks for seconds. Which one would you prefer??

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kkny

Athlete, I stand by what I said too, and have just as much right as you to say it.

Petra, I dont know about your family dynamics. Maybe when your son comes down you have a smile onyour face. I have heard another of SMs complaining about disrespect, including a wide range of things such as not saying hello I have read comments of a SM who cut downs already very limited visitation and then complain about not being invited to SDs wedding.

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petra_gw

You are right, though I try to conceal it, I am no longer happy to see my SS. You can stick a fork in the relationship, and that does not make for happiness to see each other. But I am still entitled to be treated with respect, just as I treat him with respect, and I don't think excluding someone from gift giving and ignoring their efforts to be nice is respectful.

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finedreams

I do not see anything wrong with grown children living with parents temporarilly to get back on their feet. I would have a problem with permanent arrangement, but other than that I would not say "no" to my DD. Neither would my X.

My parents always welcomed me to live with them in time of need. I refused and was on my own since I was 18, but I still am always welcome to live with them and I am in my 40s!

Unless this young family plans on always living wiht their parents, not working, not helping, not contributing and just running their parents lives, I do not see any problem wiht them moving in for a reasonably short period of time. Who else should help kids if not parents?

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colleen777

Well TOS how about it. If they like to drink and smoke would you allow that in your house?

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finedreams

I think the fact that dad wants his adult kid and his grandkids to move in wiht him means a lot. It says a lot about him- he must be a kind hearted person. he is thrilled to have grandkids around!

I would be rather concerned if he would not want his children around. would OP be rather married to a guy who does not want his kids around? or does not want to help?

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colleen777

What we are trying to show here is that TOS has many more rules and demands than she is willing to admit to. It is that deceptive side of her again.

The meal is the least of it. I expect that she is a very demanding person and wouldn't accept even one hundredth of the crap stepmothers deal with. But of course it is a moot point isn't it. There is only one person setting the agenda in TOS' house and that is TOS. She still doesn't play well with others:D

She has no clue what it means to have someone else deciding what will happen in your life without even consulting with you.

PS: I have no problem at all inviting children, stepchildren, etc into my home long as they know I am the boss of my own home.

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petra_gw

* Posted by finedreams (My Page) on
Sun, Aug 3, 08 at 17:34

*********I think the fact that dad wants his adult kid and his grandkids to move in wiht him means a lot. It says a lot about him- he must be a kind hearted person. he is thrilled to have grandkids around!*********

That might work when both parents are still together, but if there are step parents involved, their feelings should come first once the step kids are adults. OP's husband should consider her first, and not force this on her if she is not comfortable with it. I really don't understand why moving in is the only option, this is a young, (presumably) healthy couple and they should be able to find a way to deal with this without disrupting someone else's household. It sounds to me like everyone is taking the easy way out. What about second jobs, two part-time jobs, one working during the day and one at night to take care of kids, etc.? But with the entitlement mentality many adults have nowadays, I guess that's not even a consideration. My husband and I would not have even considered expecting our parents to bail us out, and there were no step parents involved.

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finedreams

so if parents are still together then adult kids should be helped when they are in trouble. but when it is a stepfamily then stepparent's feelings should come first. why? why is it that not bioparent's or adult children's feelings should come first but stepmother's?

you did not even say that should be equally considered but COME FIRST. on what grounds? dad wants kids there, stepmom does not. so why her feelings should come ahead of his? and then if dad tells his kids that SM is against the move, then she would be angry when stepkids resent her in the future.

once again in time of trouble who is supposed to help the kids if not parents? just because parents are remarried, we should not help adult children in times of need? hhmmm

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theotherside

There are lots of reasons why they might need to move in with the father, many of which involve no irresponsibility whatsoever.

No, I don't have tons of "rules." My adult (over 21) children occasionally drank alcohol when living at home - although I don't drink, they were of legal age so it was up to them. If they smoked, which my kids don't, they would smoke outside. My father used to smoke outside when he came to visit. It has nothing to do with their relationship to me. What does this have to do with children moving back in anyway? Talk about going off on a tangent...

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petra_gw

finedreams, these are ADULTS, not children. And yes, when both parents are still married, they are both more likely to be happy with their children moving back in, or to at least tolerate it better than a step parent would. However, I know plenty of people who enjoy their empty nest, and would be very resistant to their bio children moving back in.

Dad married step mom, and they have a life together. Kids are grown and should be expected to make it on their own. If they need help, fine, but why does the help have to consist of moving in and disrupting another household? As I wrote in my previous post, it sounds to me like everyone is taking the easy way out. Responsible ADULTS will do everything in their power to avoid imposing on their parents, and from what OP wrote, that is not the case here.

Moving in with parents (whether bio or step) should be the absolute last resort, unless everyone gets along wonderfully well and there are no reservations on anyone's part. The OP made it clear that she feels she has done her duty and is not thrilled about this, so her husband should put her first and find an alternative to them moving in. The children are grown, but this is the woman he (presumably) wants to spend the rest of his life with, and her feelings should be his priority.

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catlettuce

Very well put Petra.

I love mySkids very much but neither one of them even considered getting a second part time job, though they are busy with lots of activities, motorcycling, 2 differnet softball leagues, bowling, fishing etc..Lots of money for those things.

Why didn't they go to or think about living with their Mother? Because she charges rent!
Of course I enjoy having them around but no I do not want to live with them indefinately so they can live beyond their means at our expense. Unfortunately I was not consulted or considered prior to them moving in.

My advice to OP stands, insist on a target move out date, set basic household rules and try really hard to not always be the fall back babysitter (unless you want to of course).

I babysit occasionally but stopped for a long time because DH was commiting me to babysit without asking me first. It's very easy to get taken advantage of.
Why didn't they move in with BM? Cause she charges rent!
And DH & I disagree on this also as I think thats a GOOD thing.

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theotherside

I, for one, would never marry someone who would put anyone, including me, before his children, whether they were adults or not.

I don't believe that you answered finedreams' question:

"you did not even say that should be equally considered but COME FIRST. on what grounds? dad wants kids there, stepmom does not. so why her feelings should come ahead of his?"

Why should her feelings come before those of the adult children or of the biological parent?

"but this is the woman he (presumably) wants to spend the rest of his life with, and her feelings should be his priority."

This is the man she (presumably) wants to spend the rest of her life with, so why shouldn't HIS feelings be HER priority?

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colleen777

Stop with the circular arguments TOS. They are unproductive and a waste of time.

So you do have a few other rules, no smoking in the house, I would even hazard to say that you wouldn't allow drinking either. There are so many ways in which people's living habits don't match.

Television. Let's say your stepson has trouble sleeping so he likes to fall alseep on the couch watching television into the early morning hours. Although it isn't way too loud, it disturbs your sleep because you can still hear it, and when you get up the morning there he is snoring on the couch.

Should his needs come first and before anyone else's because he is dad's son?

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finedreams

of course SM's feelings have to be considered. and her DH"s feelings are important. also adult children's needs are important. so everybody is important and everybody's feelings need to be considered. it is a ridicilous statement that SM's feelings have to come first. i think when people marry the second time they need to discuss what is going to happen if adult children would need to come back home.

of course it is going to be difficult and stressful. no question. and SM need to be respcted and taken in consideration. Just not ahead of everybody.

I also found rather starnge that 15-year-old would have a problem with it or that his feelings should come before his father or his stepsiblings. again why are his feelings more important than his father's?

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doodleboo

OK...We are forgetting that this is this woman's HOME people. It is HER and her HUSBAND'S home. This is why her feelings should be considered above the adult step child's.

So you mean to tell me if a couple was to share a home together for fifteen plus years (or however many)that if Jr. decided to move back in with his entire brood, that she should just eat s***, grin and be happy because dad is glad to have them and she is only a Step? Um no. I'm sorry. This is MY house. I would divorce dad and take the house and then they could ALL look for some place else to live happily together. It is beyond inconsiderate to take away a persons sanctity of home with out so much as a "what do you think?" It is the ultimate slap in the face. Totally disrespectful IMHO.

First of all, in my experience, MEN DON'T HAVE A FREAKING CLUE!!!! He is not thinking of all the implications of what having the entire family along with two toddlers moving in will entail. He is not thinking in terms of messiness, cooking, costs, possible conflict, screaming children, young couple arguments, etc. Men don't think about crap like this. When it all starts happening Dad is going to be utterly stupified and will probably bow out and use the "I just don't like conflict" routine as an excuse leaving the "horrible" step mom to be have to be the bad guy.

I'm not saying these people are going to be slobs but boundaries and deadlines are a MUST regardless. If they plan on getting out ASAP anyway the deadline won't bother them. It also doesn't matter how easy the two adults are to live with...toddlers are NEVER easy. It isn't just the son moving in, It's his entire family! That alone makes the situation more likely to have conflict involved.

BOUNDARIES AND DEADLINES! Don't make the mistake of not setting them. Start by maping them out for your hubby right now before he starts overstepping his line.

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catlettuce

I'm with you Doodle cause that's exactly what happened to me and now my DH travels for work & I'm left home to deal with it. At least OP got the benefit of a warning. I came home to DH's EX moving SS & Gson into our house..

I do feel disrespected and it was a slap in the face that no one thought to ask me about any of it first. But I am the one who has to live with them all.

Be careful OP, Doodle is right, boundaries and deadlines are a must (and frankly that includes adult Bio & Step kids).

If your needs/feelings are not taken into account I'd suggest an apt or traveling. Sorry, just being honest here.

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kkny

Doodleboo,

In your situation, I assume from what you wrote that is is YOUR house. In many situations it is Dads house (oops, but then SMs says OURS). I am glad my X is legally restricted as to what he can do with home, becuase I want my DD protected. Again, I see that SOME SMs want benefits of being dads wife, but not responsibilities, and in order to avoid inconsistency define responsiblity as narrow as possible.

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doodleboo

KKNY

If there is a couple living in a home and the expenses to run said household is coming out of both of their pockets....then yes, It becomes both of theirs. I am pretty sure most couples help pay mortgages together whether the house actually belongs to both of them or not.

I also think the courts wouldn't send a second wife away empty handed in the case of a divorce if she had helped pay insurance, upkeep, mortgage on the marital home for X amount of years. I think that's why men who have been divorced multiple times often claim bankruptcy. If the first divorce doesn't wipe them out the seond one does.

Not to mention it's just common decencey to involve a person in choices concerning their home. Even if it was a rented apartment both parties should have EQUAL say, not one more than the other just because they are a bio parent.

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petra_gw

Finedreams, I don't care if you disagree with me, but to write "it is a ridicilous statement that SM's feelings have to come first." is rude.
Doodlebug, that is EXACTLY what I was trying to get across, it's husband AND stepmom's home, and the decision to allow kids to move back in has to be mutual. And it's only going to work if everyone agrees.
And finedreams, do you really think one spouse has the right to expect the other spouse to put up with disruption and force him/her to live with other people for an undetermined amount of time?? I don't think so!

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kkny

According to my X, his SO pays nothing except food for herself. She should have the money she received from teh sale of her condo (if she didnt spend it all on plastic surgery). I know my X and check real estate records every now and then. Actually he has yet to move property out of joint name (his an mine), even though he could. Many men get prenups etc before marriage number two.

But, back to common decency. Common decency also says if you want to regard a house as OURS, you take on responsbiltiy for stepchildren, even if you dont like them.

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imamommy

"In many situations it is Dads house (oops, but then SMs says OURS)."

The house my husband and I live in was mine before he moved in. The day he moved in, it became OURS. What is written on the title/lease is irrelevant. We both live here, it IS OUR HOME. If my adult son wants to move back (and he has a few times already) then my husband and I discuss it FIRST and his opinions are considered and we have to come to an agreement. It is HIS home too and he has a right to have input in what happens in OUR home. When he got custody of his daughter, he discussed it with me as well and made sure I was okay with it. He knew I'd be supportive (of course I didn't have a choice, her mom had already moved) but my husband did discuss with me, any of my concerns and he listened to my opinions and he supports me in every way when it comes to his daughter. It is disruptive when there is ANY change to a household. Whether it's a new baby, change of custody of an existing child, or an adult child returning, and the people that already live in the house will be expected to make accommodations for the new people and THAT has to be considered. With adult children, they are old enough to accommodate their hosts as well. They are old enough to contribute and follow rules, as guests. There HAS to be boundaries and deadlines!!! If they are responsible adults, they will have no problem adhering to the rules and respecting the dad and SM's life. If they are irresponsible, they will whine and complain about the rules or just ignore them and make it miserable.

KKNY:
Your ex may be legally restricted in what he does with the title of the home, but he cannot be legally forced to take in his adult (or even minor) child while he is still alive. It may not be her HOUSE (as it may be titled to dad and then your daughter), but as long as his SO lives there, it's her HOME/RESIDENCE too. (Whether your ex considers her feelings is a different matter altogether, but she does live there)

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petra_gw

kkny, why does anyone have to be responsible for adult step children?? I don't quite understand that. They are adults, so they should be responsible for themselves.

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doodleboo

KKNY-
Honestly. It isn't about liking or disliking the step kids.

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finedreams

doodleboo, in my understanding it was suggested that SM's feelings have to considered above her DH's feelings. It is his house too. So why are her feelings more important?

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kkny

The problem is that I dont see a way to reconcile between "considering SMs feelings" and giving her veto power.

As to adult children, it is hard to draw the line. Some people here say 18 and out. Some dont.

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finedreams

no petra I don't think one spouse should be making decisions uniliterally. absolutelly not. One spouse cannot move anyone in their house without discussing it. but it does not mean that feelings of one spouse come first.

and frankly OP knew that her DH has children and one can never guarantee that somehting would not happen with adult children and they would not need some help.

look at imamommy. she married a guy with 50/50 custody. shortly after it BM moved and DH ended up having a kid full time. should she say no, i don't want your kid here full time and you should count my feelings first? things happen. kids of any age get in trouble. there is no guarantee. even wiht your own children, let alone stepkids.

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petra_gw

kkny, it IS a difficult situation. If step parent and step kids don't have a good relationship, step parent will be miserable. If bio parent really wants his/her kids to move in, bio parent will be miserable if they can't do it because step parent says no. And if there is no pre-arranged move-out date (light at the end of the tunnel), and the visit drags on for months and months and years with no end in sight, it will get old really fast and everyone will get sick of it, probably even bio parent. I would not want to be in this situation.

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colleen777

What about the social influence aspects of this situation, and there are many. So, the new adult family that has moved in with you likes to smoke but they do smoke outside.

One night you go outside and to your horror find that your 15 year old is out there with them lighting up a cigarette.

So whose rights come before whose?

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doodleboo

FineDreams-

Becasue it his her home. It isn't the child's or his families home. She had a pre existing residence set up at that house. Her interests are invested in that house. her finances are tied up in aspects of the house, her routines aare set in that house, her belongings are in that house. in some cases her JOB may even be ran out of that house.

I'm not saying that the step parents feelings should be the be all end all but I get the feeling that people have a "well where that man's kid's are concerned she should have to get over it" attitude. That's wrong. First and foremost she has already "raised" her kids, including the SS involved, and none of the children are really kids anymore.

All I am saying is there should be BOUNDARIES and even more important DEADLINES set. If the family starts getting "too comfortable" there needs to be an action plan that can be refered back to. And yes, I believe she should be able to say no if she is uncomfortable with it. Dad could support his adult child in other equally positive ways without letting the entire family move in.

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petra_gw

Finedreams, in my opinion Imamommy's situation is quite different, because the kids are still minors. Of course you have to put children first, I agree with you there. And if your spouse gets full custody, no question the kids will live with both of you. But in this case, the kids are adults. If it were a young kid who has fallen on hard times and wants to move back in for a few months to save money, that likely wouldn't be a huge problem for most people. But in this case, there are two adults and two toddlers, which makes a big difference.

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imamommy

Colleen said:
"What about the social influence aspects of this situation, and there are many. So, the new adult family that has moved in with you likes to smoke but they do smoke outside.

One night you go outside and to your horror find that your 15 year old is out there with them lighting up a cigarette.

So whose rights come before whose?"

I agree 100%. My SD is 9 and lives here full time. As I said, I had no choice because she is a small child and her mom moved away. But, I disagree that my feelings weren't considered. The decision for her to live here was no choice, for me or for DH. Neither of us would have said no, because we knew it was best for SD anyways. But, should my feelings count? YES. My husband counted my feelings, not in the decision to move SD in full time, but in how we run our house with her here full time. and again... there is a difference between a minor child and a 27 year old adult child with a wife and two kids. A HUGE DIFFERENCE.

But, back to my point about what Colleen said. My son is 21 and has moved back a few times. The last time, he was here, he promised he'd get a job right away and save up for a car. He eventually got a job (two jobs even) but he'd get paid and disappear until his money was gone. Well, he still has no car. He moved out when he tried to bring a girl over to spend the night with him and I refused to have my 9 year old SD wake up to find my son and his GF asleep on the livingroom couch (where he was staying). Most of the rules that my son complained about were put in place for my SD's benefit because she is 9. I didn't want him watching TV or movies that have inappropriate content, no loud music that will keep her up, and of course, no overnight guests. The needs of the children in the home DO come before the need of an adult child (step or bio) that is there because they got themselves into a JAM.

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finedreams

we don't know if stepkids are troubled ones who smoke in the house or behave inappropriatelly. why do we assume they are horrible? how do we know that adult stepchildren would be bad social influence? i did not see OP saying that. i had some rough times in my life struggling financially, but I was not a bad influence because of that. i was not a bad influence on anyone at age 27. in fact these adult stepkids might be a very good influence on 15-year-old.

so if people smoke, they should not be allowed to live in the house out of fear that 15-year-old would pick up smoking? I have never heard such argument. Plenty of people smoke. it does not make them bad influence.

I used to smoke. Luckily quit few years ago. it did not make me a bd influence on anyone. should i not be allowed to share a house with anyone? I was CP and my ex was NCP, both of us smoked until few years ago. But DD does not smoke. and certainly did not smoke at age 15. maybe we had to be denied parental rights and she had to move to foster home just because we smoked? what kind of argument is that? unless of course we are talking about smoking illegal substance.

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doodleboo

Ima's Steps are minors. Veto power is no longer even relevent when the child becomes an adult. If the woman wanted to, in my state anyway, she could have the law come and remove the family from her household veto power be damned. All she would have to do is pay for an eviction if they had lived there more than thirty days. It isn't a matter of a child anymore. It's an adult situation and as far as the law is concerned it is that woman's house (if she has proven residence for over X amount of months in household).

I am NOT saying she should drop to this low. But regardless of whether she should or not the point is IT IS HER HOUSE and it doesn't really matter who thinks what about adult children situations....the house will be viewed LEGALLY as her residence and not the son or his families. Who needs Veto power over the bio parent when you have veto power over the situation where the law is concerned?

Bottom line: Once the child becomes an adult LEGALLY there is no need for the step parent to Veto anyhting. It is an adult/adult issue not an adult/child issue.

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kkny

Doodbleboo, so just so I understand you when you say if the woman wanted the stepchild out, she should just file eviction notice, are you referring to situations where house or lease is in SM's name alone?

Are you an attorney advising people that this is an option?

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doodleboo

No...I didn't say she should but in my state she very well could even if her husbands name was also on the lease. It doesn't matter here.

I have had friends who have split leases and one friend will get sick of a girlfriend or boyfriend of the other lease holder so they call the county office, file an eviction notice, the contstable comes and out they go....it didn't matter that the other persons name was on the lease or not. If a LEGAL resident wants a non-legal resident out all they have to do is pay the county eviction fee. That's how it is here anyway.

I have seen it more than once and have even looked into it myself once when I had a pain in the hiney roomie who let an even MORE pain in the hiney friend move in with her and I wanted her gone. I could of had her booted her at any time because she was not a legal resident to the property meaning her name appeared no where on the lease.

The resident will win out every time against the non-resident.

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doodleboo

It also doesn't matter if the other "legal" resident likes it or not. It becomes a domestic issue at that point and the law leaves it to the two parties to argue it out but the non-resident has to hit the road in the meantime.

I think it's a DRASTIC scanario but I have heard some pretty awful adult child horror stories and in some
(some,not all) cases I believe these people would be JUSTIFIED to have the adult child removed from their home and if the Bio Parent don't like it let them move out with them!

And no I'm not a lawyer but I do know the local laws.

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serenity_now_2007

"The children are grown, but this is the woman he (presumably) wants to spend the rest of his life with, and her feelings should be his priority."

That statement really says a lot, and it's not very nice at all. "The rest of his life" used in this sentence implies that a person's children ---in contrast to step-parent--- are NOT a part of "the rest of" their parent's life. And that the bond between a new spouse and the children's parent is somehow of a superior and more durable kind than the parent-child bond. Regardless of what you may feel about living arrangements or particular kinds of assistance for said children, they do not magically disappear somewhere completely separate from their parents' "rest of their lives" at any age, nor in deference to a step-parent (or anyone).

I continue to be flabbergasted at the hubris and illogic of somehow a second spouse becoming "more important" than a person's flesh-and-blood children. Who was there first? Who did the parent co-create and bring into this world? Who literally carries part of that parent inside their every molecule? Call me 'blasphemous' (or, as a child of divorce, merely cynical about the institution of marriage), but I hardly think that the combination of courtship + a piece of paper + a name change + a piece of metal on someone's finger automatically grants that person the right to feel themselves a superior or more 'permanent' entity over their spouse's children. And it certainly doesn't give a person the right to imagine that the children will disappear "for the rest of his life".

I'm all for considering everyone's needs equally, and not putting any one person above the other wherever possible. Seeking fair and harmonious ways to get everyone's needs met unless it is absolutely 100% impossible to do so. If it comes down to having to make an either-or choice, it seems proposterous to me that the step-parent should automatically expect to be "first".

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kkny

OK, assuming your legal advice is correct (apparently Ima only polices the board for legal advice given by moms), does it apply to situations where Dad, Dad and SM togethor, own the home???? Most people in this country live in owner occupied homes, not rentals. And even if it were legal, I think anyone considering it is in for serious relationship issues.

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theotherside

In my state, it is a lot more difficult to evict people. A relative of mine owned property and rented it to four guys, who one by one moved out and were replaced with four other people - without consulting the owner. Not one of the occupants' names was on the lease, and the people whose names were on the lease were long gone. In addition, for the last few months the tenants were there, none of them paid rent. It still took months and a court hearing before she was able to evict them.

serenity summed it up so perfectly with this sentence:

"I continue to be flabbergasted at the hubris and illogic of somehow a second spouse becoming "more important" than a person's flesh-and-blood children."

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petra_gw

Serenity, my point was not that his children should be pushed out, it was that the woman he is married to should be his first priority BECAUSE THESE ARE ADULT CHILDREN.

If a parent is ALWAYS supposed to put their kids first, even when they are adults, then it works both ways, and the parent should expect his children to always put HIM first!! Well, good luck with that!

Don't you think once children are grown the husband-wife relationship should be a priority, and take precedence over what adult children want/expect? I just do not understand this attitude that parents need to sacrifice what they want all their lives and that children should always be their first priority. It does not make any sense to me. This is normal and understood when they are minors, of course they should come first. But not once they are adults!!!

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serenity_now_2007

kkny: do you know if your ex's S.O. ever rewrites history and tries to present herself as a co-contributor?

Recently, ever since the Oct. 2007 wedding which made my SM "legit", she now feels it appropriate to re-write history. I have heard her on more than one occasion completely misrepresent the facts of just how much a "contributing partner" she has been. Referring to a time several years back when *my DAD* was paying two mortgages after buying a house and waiting for the old one to sell, SM has balls-out LIED to people by phrasing it: "WE were carrying two mortages for 18 months". Like SHE had any part in any of these expenses, or like she ever contributed ANY money to ANY household expense whatsoever (besides her clothes, her hair, her car, her nails). It's like she now fees like she has this magical wife power to not only control things henceforth into the future but also to rewrite the past and pretend she has done things which she has not.

I think the very fact that she feels this need to misrepresent her "stake" in the house, etc. reveals her awareness that if she wanted to be taken seriously and have respect in the eyes of others as my Dad's "partner", that she should have offered to chip in some more. But then again why should she, when all she needed was my father's last name on an official document to go back and artificially rewrite some respectability into her role by fabtricating contributions she never made?

I'm not saying that JUST BECAUSE she never contributed money to my dad's home that she automatically has no rights to respect. Just that it makes it so much harder to take her seriously in any of her (very numerous and frequent) attempts to establish that she is somehow "owed" things, or respect. Respect, also, being extremely hard to feel towards her when she LIES about contributions she never made because she knows that she SHOULD HAVE made them.

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petra_gw

And by the way, the above goes for bio children as well. Ask a few people in nursing homes where the children they sacrificed everything for are, many of them are lucky to get a Christmas card. I've heard some really ugly, sad stories. It would behoove everyone to make sure they have a good relationship with their spouse, because all too often, children don't step up to the plate in the time of need and the spouse is the only one to rely on.

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kkny

Should husband-wife relationship take priority? It depends. If husband and wife have tickets to show, and adult kids want them, it is up to H and W. What if adult child is 19 (some here consider that adult and dont let the door hit you on the way out), I think parent should help with college. If SM disagrees, it is a problem.

And I agree -- this argument that SM will always be there and childre wont is not only arrogant but almost comical considering dad has likely been divorced at least once.

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imamommy

"That statement really says a lot, and it's not very nice at all. "The rest of his life" used in this sentence implies that a person's children ---in contrast to step-parent--- are NOT a part of "the rest of" their parent's life."

My children will be my children for the rest of my life. My husband is the person I chose to spend the rest of my life with. There IS a difference. No, my husband does not become more important than my children, nor does he expect that. But, when it comes to my adult children, my life with my husband is more of a priority than taking care of adult children that have their own families and should be taking care of their own families, not expecting me to take care of them. What happens when a parent puts their adult child before their spouse and when the adult child FINALLY gets it together and leaves to have their own life? Well, when the spouse has enough and leaves, then the parent is alone, without their life partner. Do you think those adult kids will give a crap that their mom or dad has made that sacrifice? Seriously doubtful.

Petra is right: "If a parent is ALWAYS supposed to put their kids first, even when they are adults, then it works both ways, and the parent should expect his children to always put HIM first!!" That rarely happens. Maybe a child that is also alone will spend time with a lonely parent, but if they have a spouse and kids, they are not likely to spend all their free time doing for the parent that sacrificed for them.

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kkny

Serenity,

I dont think Xs SO misrepresents finanical situation. I think she is busy misrepresenting that she did not have affair with X and that I had affair(s) while married. Xs family and close friends still talk to me and say this is laughable.

As much as Ima laughs at me, I do have contractual arrangements that Dad must provide for DD. Rather than taking CS for a few short years, I made certain DD would have college, car, and inherint home. Dad wanted to maintain current lifestlye. I wanted DD to be taken care of.

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doodleboo

Yes...in the state of Georgia it means that exactly. Even if both names are on the home. The law looks at it like it is their duty to remove the "Non-resident" and then leave it up to the two joint residents to battle out their disagreements over it.

They (county,cops,constable) only concern themselves with the party whoes name is NOT on the property,lease or whatever. It only takes ONE member who has some legal ownership over the property to make that call. The two legals do not have to agree in order for the third party to be removed.

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imamommy

"And by the way, the above goes for bio children as well. Ask a few people in nursing homes where the children they sacrificed everything for are, many of them are lucky to get a Christmas card. I've heard some really ugly, sad stories. It would behoove everyone to make sure they have a good relationship with their spouse, because all too often, children don't step up to the plate in the time of need and the spouse is the only one to rely on."

My dad has taken care of my step mom for the last 12 years while she's been in a permanent vegetative state after she suffered a brain aneurysm. She has three adult children that she sacrificed for. In fact, she (with my dad's help), either helped them with college or starting their own business. Two of them moved in with my dad and step mom to 'get back on their feet', one brought his wife and small child. So, where are they now that mom needs care 24/7? Well, they had time to hire an attorney and sue my dad to try to lay claim to the family business that HE inherited from his dad. But, none of them have time to come by and help take care of their mother, nor do they even call to ask if she's still alive. (I'm pretty sure they'd have life insurance policies on her life if they can get it though)

She is being cared for by her fourth husband (my dad) and her step child. WHERE ARE HER KIDS????

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doodleboo

All that is needed here for an eviction is the fee and thirty days eviction notice. The party needs thirty days to find a new residence.

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kkny

I find that difficult to believe Doodleboo. But go ahead and advise people.

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athlete2010

The OP said that she has a "fairly strong marriage" and she wants "to keep it that way". I think that it's only natural for her to want to protect a stable home life.

She most likely has invested in all aspects of her marriage and family life, and she is obviously concerned about what might happen now.

I think that it is admirable that she didn't say anything critical about her husband or kids when she asked for help.

She didn't say that she should come first over the kids.

I think that she needs to think about what has made this a "fairly strong marriage," and discuss this with her husband. How do they continue to make their relationship strong under the new circumstances?

They can work together on this, hopefully. It doesn't have to be "my way or the highway" for either of them.

I know that many posters on this site have had bad experiences when adult kids have moved back home, and I can certainly sympathize with them.

I hope that for OP that whatever is causing her "dismay" will be temporary.

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doodleboo

It doesn't matter if you believe it or not KKNY. It's how it is here. It may be different in other states but in our state it falls under the renters/homeowners rights. Cross my heart. I have no reason to lie.

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kkny

Ima, I am truly sorry about the misery some of the people in your life have to deal with. But if your SM had the aneurysm while she was living with husband number 1, 2 or 3, would they have cared for her? I dont think you can extrapolate from your experience to every family situation. And I am aware of situations where elderly person gets sick and his SO disappears.

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imamommy

"As much as Ima laughs at me,"

I don't laugh at you. I also don't criticize that you get all your daughter deserves. I don't suggest your ex's SO deserves any respect.

What I find humorous is how you spend your time here, day after day, criticizing SM's and making generalized statements about SM's when you don't have any connection with SM's. You are not a SM. Your daughter does not have a SM. Your situation is NOT similar to anyone else's here.

Sure, you have a right to have an opinion. I can have an opinion on long term marriages, but then again, if I make a comment on long term marriages, I am told I haven't been married that long so what do I know?

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tamar_422

I am flabbergasted that so many of you posting here on this thread seem to lack common sense. Look, if an adult child, with his wife and two toddlers, needs to move home because they are in a financial jam, it does not matter if it is dad and mom, dad and stepmom, or mom and stepdad. BOTH adults whose home will be disrupted need to be consulted and in agreement before allowing son and his family to move in. I'm speaking as both a biomom and a stepmom.

Having a family of 4 move in with you is no small disruption. Rules, boundaries and a firm move-out date are absolute musts. Why is this becoming such a big deal here?

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kkny

My DD has Dads SO. Many people here identify themselves as fiance etc. Which I consider about the same thing. If all the SM crowd here wants to consider is the opinon of other SMs, so be it. But I have as much right as you to post.

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theotherside

"It would behoove everyone to make sure they have a good relationship with their spouse, because all too often, children don't step up to the plate in the time of need and the spouse is the only one to rely on."

If your goal is to make sure you are taken care of when you are old, I would think it would behoove people (especially women, who generally outlive their spouses) to make sure that they have a good relationship with their kids, because all too often, when they reach their "time of need" their spouse has already died.

I don't put my children first because I want something out of them. I don't expect them to "pay me back" by putting me first. I would hope they would "pay me back" by always putting their children first.

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serenity_now_2007

Just to clarify: the point I've taken up to argue against isn't the one about how much or little material aid (or housing) a parent should give their adult kids (b/c that will vary from person to person, based on many factors, and there are plenty of valid arguments on all sides of that question). And I'm also not arguing about who should "always" be "first', b/c in my opinion there are far more ways than not to ensure that everyone can get their needs met without having to put anyone "above" someone else, ***IF*** all parties are willing to be flexible and compromise. My point was specifically in reaction to the *justification* that was being given as to WHY the step-parent oughta be "first", which was that the step-parent was going to be a factor "for the rest of [the bio-parent's] life", suggesting that the kids were not going to be. It's one thing to be against pampering adult children (however that's defined) or taking them in for extended periods as a specific belief set in itself. It's not necessary to bolster that belief with an implication that by nature, somehow, the kids are inherently less important or deserving of consideration. That was my bone to pick: the MEANS used to rationalize the belief and the subsequent "ranking" that establishes one party as inherently superior in status to an inferior party. I don't believe in that principle, even from my perspective as an adult daughter. If the issue is not being forced from the other side, I would never consider myself automatically "superior" to or more important than my step-parents just because I am the blood offspring of my parents. But if a step-parent is going to force my bio-parent into an either-or choice based on what s/he believes as their place as "first priority", that's when I acutely question what I feel to be an illogical fallacy.

btw, as a side-point: for every neglectful adult child who sticks their parent into a nursing home and never visits, there is a also somewhere else an adult child who takes care of not one but BOTH of their parents b/c the parents are both elderly and CAN'T take care of each other. There's no reason to assume that the spouse will be any more likely ---or ABLE--- to care for the ailing bio-parent just because they live in the same house. In a situation where one spouse is much younger, it is often the case that the timing means their own parents may have to be cared for at the same time. If the younger spouse is not fortunate enough to have a sibling to take that responsibility and/or enough money to make other arrangements, then the spouse will have no choice but to care for his/her parents and the adult stepchild will have to come in to care for the bio-parent.

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kkny

When responses start spewing dislike of stepchildren, that advice is likely more limited to a specific family.

And PS one of my favorite comments was

"Also, how do you and his wife get along? I hear alot of step parents have problems with adult step daughters or the wives of the Step son's. Women can be catty like that."

Was the inference that SMs are never catty???

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imamommy

"Ima, I am truly sorry about the misery some of the people in your life have to deal with. But if your SM had the aneurysm while she was living with husband number 1, 2 or 3, would they have cared for her? I dont think you can extrapolate from your experience to every family situation. And I am aware of situations where elderly person gets sick and his SO disappears."

I agree. It is possible husband 1, 2, or 3 may not have cared for her. They all divorced her. BUT HER KIDS HAVE BEEN HER KIDS THE ENTIRE TIME. WHERE ARE THEY???? She was there for them when they needed her... in fact, my dad has been there for her daughter and all her grandkids even after she got sick. They not only abandoned their mother, they stabbed my dad in the back too.

Just pointing out that blood is not always thicker. Just pointing out that putting bio kids first does not guarantee their loyalty or devotion or that they will even be thankful, let alone return the favor.

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doodleboo

Tamar- HAHAHA. I know right? It seems so simple but it just flies over so many heads.

If the kids are minors reposibilitie is owed after that it should be jointly decided on both homeowners whether or not the adult child moving in is appropriate.

It has nothing to do with rank and everything to do with rights. My girls can come to us for help any time and we will do all we can WITHIN REASON to help them out. There will be boundaries, rules and deadlines and if they have a problem being an adult and following the boundaries,rules and deadllines they can move out.

We love our kids but will not let them constantly disrupt the sanctity of our home. If they need a little boost that's one thing but that little boost turns into MOTEL 8 really fast if everyone isn't very clear on the game plan up front. Then comes financial issues and marital struggles. Not going to happen with J and I. That's our decision and it's our right to make it.

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doodleboo

No all women can be catty. You tend to bring ALOT of Catty out in people....case in point.

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doodleboo

My point was when people here on this site get catty I can shut my computer off. Cattyness in my own would not be tolerated.....ever.

Step Moms can be catty. I can be DAMN catty but this is my home and if I want to be catty in it I have that right:) A stranger coming into my place of comfort and coping an attitude with me would not fair well and would find their name on next months evictions notice list.

Life is too short for the BS and like it or not there are alot of people out there Bio and Step who would agree with that. Many parents boot their deadbeat kids out every day....gasp!

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imamommy

"My DD has Dads SO. Many people here identify themselves as fiance etc. Which I consider about the same thing. If all the SM crowd here wants to consider is the opinon of other SMs, so be it. But I have as much right as you to post."

How often does your daughter visit her dad and his SO in their home? Outside their home? From what you say, the majority of her contact is with dad, away from SO. How is that the same or even similar as a 'fiance' that is going to be a SM that is in the home where the child is visiting or living?

I never said you don't have a right to your opinion, but just like you would point out to me when I offer mine on long term marriages, I think you might know more if you were actually in a step family situation.

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finedreams

I think if you raise children properly, they will step up to the plate and help you when you are old and in need. if you raise them properly, they will behave fine and contribute when they are adults. If OP worries that stepkids will behave like morons and destroy her family life, then does she supsect her DH did a poor job raising them? was he a bad father? OP also mentioned that she PARENTED SS, so i assume she did a good job. then why would she worry how SS is going to behave?

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athlete2010

We don't know exactly what OP is worried about (ie. behavior, etc). We only know that she is dismayed that the adult son and his family are moving in.

She could have done an excellent job raising the son, but there are three other people besides him moving in. What if she doesn't get along with the son's wife? What if the grandkids misbehave a lot? Maybe it's not a behavior issue at all with any of them. What is the cause of the dismay? Again, we don't know.

I hope that OP writes again with more details.

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loladoon

Company and fish stink after 3 days. It's true. Even if they were the most well-behaved people in the world, a married couple craves their own home. There will be conflict between the 2 married couples.

I don't know if the OP is watching this thread or not, but I suspect your DH will tire of them living there. They don't anticipate any problems, but he'll see.

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gajopa

It appears all this arguing is a moot point since the OP registered, asked the question and left.

I think Doodle knows what she's talking about regarding the eviction. My DH is long term law inforcement so I asked him what the law is here (Alabama) and he said the same thing. Of course other states could be different.

Neither of us want adult children/grandkids moving in with us regardless of if they are bio or step. If it were an absolute necessity we would let them but it would have to be more than mis-managing their funds or wanting things easy. We let my SS stay here for a short time when he divorced and it certainly wasn't any fun. Then he moved out, soon got a DUI and couldn't pay the fine. My DH refused to get him out of it like he had done several times before and consequently he spent 6 months in jail. When he got out there was no offer to stay here again. He managed to figure it all out and now says that was the best thing that ever happened to him. We get along well with all 6 of ours (3 each) and any of them would take care of us IF it was necessary but we hope that never happens. It would be a last resort. Not many people care about someone moving in with them. Just my opinion for what it's worth.

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kkny

Gajopa,

I accept this is your opinion, but when other SMs ask why cant the kids move in with mom, it has a different slant.

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colleenoz

I'm with Tamar on this one. It doesn't matter which is the bio-parent and which is the step. The issue is that the home is both of theirs (whover is doing the actual financing: minor children do not generally contribute financially to a home but no-one would dispute that it is, indeed their home) and there is a status quo- husband and wife and 15 y.o. In my opinion ANY party who wants to change that status quo has to have the agreement of the others. I would not condone the wife moving in any family members of hers unless the husband was in agreement. And if the 15 y.o wanted to move someone in and the adults objected I doubt there would even be a discussion here.

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finedreams

iamommy said: "Just pointing out that putting bio kids first does not guarantee their loyalty or devotion or that they will even be thankful, let alone return the favor."

there is no guarantee but in decent families (or at least majority of them) children are raised properly and grown children are loyal or at least try to do their best. If children are not thankful and are not helping their parents, then parents did something wrong. Of course there are exceptions. Some decent families have criminal kids etc But those are exceptions.

loladoon, children (grown or not) are not exactly a company. when i come to my parents' house I am not regarded as company. We are family.

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imamommy

FD, that is right. There is no guarantee. That is the point I am trying to make. As I said earlier in the thread, helping kids depends on the kid. Some kids deserve, some not so much. (what about kids that have burnt their bridges?) Some parents are in denial when it comes to some of their kids. They don't want to face that they have raised a child that is irresponsible or they don't see things for what they are. I'm not saying that is the situation with OP, but it does happen. Then there are some really great kids that ARE responsible and probably not be a problem to have living there. The problem may be that one of the adults doesn't want ANY changes in their life.

The rights of the people affected (dad, SM and 15yo) should be considered first. As Colleen (and others) have said, it would be the same if SM wanted to move someone in, dad has a right to have a say. You kids are ALWAYS going to be your kids, that's true. But when they grow up, get married and/or start their own family (not 18-19 year olds) and you are remarried, then you have more of an obligation to your minor children and spouse than to an adult child that has a spouse. That doesn't mean you should never help an adult child, because every case is going to be different. The general statements that they are your kids first and that gives them the right to get your help over the rights of a spouse that lives in the home, well, that is a bunch of crap.

and if your daughter moved in, I'm sure you would be happy. If she brings someone else with her, would you be equally as happy? How about a couple of kids too?

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kkny

Ima, my DD is old enough to have this, but fastforward to the future. If the need arose, I would rather DD and family move in with me than rack up debt she would never be able to get out from under, I would rather she and family move in if it meant her or SIL not being able to finish school.

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finedreams

I would help my DD and let her move in. I am pretty sure her dad would do the same.

My parents and my grandmother lived wiht me and my DD once for about 4-6 months in MY PLACE. it was a situation when they had to be somewhere temporarilly bedore moving. Yes it was disrupting to my routine. My parents are making a lot of noise and I like quiet, they stay up later than i do, they had to sleep on reclining sofa in a living room so i had no living room and could not watch TV, they also ate late at night, my mom cooked in my tiny kitchen and I had no place etc. But they are my family and I would never say "no", and all these minor inconveniences were not that important. that's why i think OP's DH is fine with his kids moving in. Minor things are not as important as helping a family.

Of course if someone wants to live with permanently it isa different story. but hopefully that's not the case.

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colleen777

I'm not sure what you people are saying. That you are better, more loving, generous people, or have more functional families? FD would you have let your previous soon to be SD and her soon to be husband move in with you two?

You are comparing apples to oranges.

In the situations you refer to there isn't anyone actively trying to undermine you. How you can say they are the same thing? Because they are not.

When people post on this site it is usually because they are full of angst and confusion and they are looking for advice not to have people brag about what they would do in situations that aren't even similar.

And, yes I most certainly do think mom should bear part of the hardship of situations of adult children, their spouse and their children being forced to move home.

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kkny

"And, yes I most certainly do think mom should bear part of the hardship of situations of adult children, their spouse and their children being forced to move home."

At least you are honest enough to say this, and not cop out with adult children shouldnt be helped, dont need help, etc. And btw in the large majority of cases, mom is the one children of any age live with. Why do you think there are support groups all over with children not living with dad, but less for children not living with mom? This validates my belief that Dads should be very careful as to SM getting house, money etc -- becasue she wont be the one there for the kids.

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theotherside

Why would you assume that there is anyone trying to undermine the OP?

Yes,I think people who wouldn't think twice about having their adult children, or their parents and grandparents, move in temporarily are more loving, generous people than those who would not. I also think people are far more likely to be loving and generous to their biological (or adopted) family than to their stepchildren. There is absolutely nothing in the initial post that implied that the SS was a lazy alcoholic who was planning on sitting around all day doing nothing, and the fact that the father is looking forward to this implies that that is not the case.

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colleen777

What a bunch of gobbledegook that is KKNY. What in the world does my statement of responsibility have to do with honesty. That is a personal value. And anyone who tries to undermine me in my own home will be shown the door...period. BS about SM's too! Good grief woman.

You are closed minded and selfish about SMs, so just hold on to that view. I hope it keeps you warm at night. Even though you aren't exactly young, neither am I, you have a lot to learn about people.

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colleen777

If you KKNY and TOS ever were to become stepmothers, you would definitely treat your stepchildren as second class citizens. One can only speak from what lurks within one's own heart can't they.

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kkny

I said you were being honest, I am not certain why you took it otherwise.

How would you expect me to view SMs with your statement that children should live with the mom? Isnt that treating them as second class?

Fact is I wouldnt live with or marry someone unless I could treat his children fairly.

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colleen777

KKNY, You couldn't by your own definition treat your stepchildren fairly because you would be a stepmother!

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Vivian Kaufman

FWIW, I would GLADLY take in either of my stepchildren at any time. They are no less my family than my sister or my uncle, my only living biological relatives. I cared for my mother at the end of her life and I would absolutely be there for either of my kids. They should always know that they can count on me...

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finedreams

coleen, I might not be excited about SD with kids moving in. Of course not. But it is not about being excited. it is about doing the right thing. if they would want permanently live with us then "no". he would not want his kdis to live with him permanently either. But as a temporarilly helping family members, why not? I would welcome by brother with his two kids and lazy SIL to my tiny place if they would be struggling. Would I be happy? No. But this is not about what makes you happy. It is about doing the right thing. the right thing is to help your family.

I probably would not be too happy if DD brings bunch of people to my tiny place. But...This is a family, not neighbours we are talking about. This is not about me excited or not.

I frankly was not excited when my parents (they are not elderly, and my mom was 50 at the time) had to move in into my place temporarilly. But it was a situation that they had to and I had to put my feelings aside and do what is right. And it worked out fine. And yes I was pretty happy when they moved out because I could get to my routine. lol But i am glad I opened my doors for my parents as they open theirs for me any time.

sometimes we have to put up with stuff for the sake of a family.

Sometimes it is time consuming and troublesome to take care of elderly grandparents. But it does not mean we should say 'no" just because it disrupts our routine.

So OP won't watch her favorite TV show for a year. Big deal.

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finedreams

coleen by no means i am more loving or more functional than others. in fact i hate when bunch of people live with me. I like peace and quiet. More so I even like to live alone.

My point all along is not that we have to LIKE when big families move in with us and disrupt our routine. I personally do not like it. My point is that in situation like this we HAVE to do what we do not LIKE. I do not know too many people who LIKE changing adult diapers. I certainly don't. And yet I did it.

I totally support that OP is unhappy about 4 people moving in. I mean it is a big disruption. But it is still the right thing to help them out.

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organic_maria

Patriffel,
I know its a dismay from the mere fact the daily routine life will change. And it will be crowded in the house. BUt you have to set guidelines and define a time limit here. Its doesn't matter if its a stepchild, a biochild, a cousin or best friend.
I just had my house usurped for the last month and i had enough. I told my husband ' no more stray dogs, we did our help with two people and now the doors are closed. ' We had two people stay in our house for two different reasons. We set time limits and it worked well but let me tell you , it was a relief when these people left.
Both were in a jam. One lost their job and their apartment but she got on her feet quick and was out in a month. The other i gave her 4 months to get on her feet because her husband booted her out of the house. She has worse issues and i'm glad after 2 weeks she left!
Its nice to help. Its your husbands son and two grandkids so of course he will be thrilled. But i'm sure after a few weeks that thrill will definitely subside. Its only natural. People need their space.
So you need to sit down with your husband and your SS to set a time limit. You tell them its fine but there is a time limit. Set a reasonable time. Now it might be 3 months or more but set the max you can handle and then just deal with it. Its not forever but hey, its a jam, help out a bit , i know you've done your duty but be very open and honest about the time limit and make sure its kept.
If several months pass then scrap it out with hubby and tell him , its been so many months and if no progress is made its abuse. Period. If he wants to help his son and his son is not responsible to fix things in a few months, then he can help his son by finding him another place to live and he can baby sit the grandkids. This is another solution.
I do not know all the details and of course knowing more info will help all of us to give you advice but we'ld like to hear how its going.
THis is not a permanent thing. So do not worry.

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colleen777

It is not smart to bring people aboard a ship if the extra weight is going to take the whole thing to the ocean floor is it? FD you are fortunate in that you make the decisions what happens in your house, it is quite another thing when someone else decides for you, and you can lump it or leave it.

Who is to say it is right or wrong? God? That is another value decision only. I'm pretty sure that when you came home after a long day at work and your lazy SIL was lounging on your couch, in your favorite dress, swilling beer, reading your journal, barking out what's for dinner sis, you would likely have a thing or two to say. And if it continued I am sure you would show them the door.

Moot point isn't it? And easy enough to say what you would do when you have never had to do it.

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