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badin_gw

First house - can't get a mortgage

badin
16 years ago

I hope it's okay that I also posted in the finance forum; it doesn't get nearly as much traffic, though.

I have a relative who wants to buy his first house right after graduating from college this fall. Since one of my own kids is thinking about this too, I'd appreciate advice from anyone in the business. He has enough saved to put at least 15% down,and may be able to put 20% down, on a new construction single family house. The estimated P&I on a 30 yr. fixed rate mortgage would be about 20% of his expected gross monthly income, and he has no debt. He has one credit card, which he pays off each month. He's got enough cash for the downpayment and a great income ratio, but he has no credit history or employment history (other than a summer research job at the university.)

Because most lenders sell their mortgages instead of keeping them in-house, they stick pretty close to standard guidelines. Recent events in the mortgage industry may make things even tougher for an unusual request. The one lender he's called suggested that he ask his parents to co-sign, and said that his rate would be 1/2% higher than the usual. His parents said they'd rather finance him, but then he would still have no reported credit history. Is there another approach to this situation? (Besides waiting two years, which was that lender's second suggestion.)

Comments (49)

  • mariend
    16 years ago

    Does he have a checking account?? Or is there a Credit Union he could join?? Right now is not a good time to deal with ANY mortgage company, because all they want to do is sell your mortgage to someone else--and yes it happened to me to the point we almost lost everything. There are loans out their for first time buyers and any bank will have this infomation.
    Because he is just graduating, unless he knows where he will be living for several years, he should rent. That way he will be able to build up credit thru his regular bills etc.

  • homeownersue Homeownersue
    16 years ago

    I also suggest holding off for a bit, saving more (20% is best because then no mortgage insurance is required). He should get a credit card--department stores give them pretty easily, and it is the first step to establishing a credit history. I agree with mariend's suggestion about a checking account. I also think that even six months of work history will help (though a year is better). A realtor friend tells me that the lending market has gotten EXTREMELY conservative in light of what has happened with foreclosures, subprimes, and so forth. Establishing good credit will help BEFORE getting a mortgage.

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  • quip
    16 years ago

    I think he should rent for a little while; lenders seem to agree. The first job out of college is an important step, and he should concentrate on his career and young life, not on a house. Meanwhile he can build his work history, build his credit history, and visit open houses to get a feel for the housing market. The data suggest that housing prices will be stable or declining in most of the country, so waiting may make sense even if he could get a loan.

  • eal51
    16 years ago

    Our oldest son and his new bride have the same problem. Even though both are employed and making good money, her job record is only one year as an educator, part time employment doesn't count. The banks want her to have two years experience to qualify. The banks have really clamped down on qualifying for mortages

    As for your relative's situation, a car loan will do wonders for a credit rating. Helped two of our sons establish their credit history.

    It seems that the housing market, depending on your location, will be stabilizing. But this make take another year or so. Better prices may be available then.

    The advice to rent and wait is good advice for now.

    Enjoy the journey.

    eal51 in western CT

  • mfbenson
    16 years ago

    "He has enough saved to put at least 15% down,and may be able to put 20% down, on a new construction single family house."

    Okay, I just have to know: How in the world does a college student make enough to be able to save 15% to 20% of the cost of a new construction house?

    I graduated college with enough debt that homeownership wasn't an option until I was 30.

  • theroselvr
    16 years ago

    There are a few posts here:

    1. Getting a mortgage loan for our son
    2. Co-signing a condo/house for my son

    You might want to read them. There's a lot of discussion on the consequences of helping a child by cosigning.

    His parents said they'd rather finance him, but then he would still have no reported credit history.

    Can the parents afford to make payments (or eat the loan) if he doesn't pay? Read post #1 for more thoughts on this.

    If they do decide to have a loan put in their name, make sure they have a promissory note.

    As was mentioned, I would focus on the job and establishing credit. If you have Exxon / Mobil by you, have them get a CC there. It was one of the easiest gas cards to get. If he doesn't have a cell phone and needs one, a cell plan goes on your credit history. This will also help build credit.

  • dreamgarden
    16 years ago

    With the market being the way it is, there are probably more than a few homeowner's who might be willing to help with financing.

    Especially since he can put down a sizeable deposit.

    He could try posting on Craigslist and/or look at FSBO's and see if anyone is willing to do this.

  • jy_md
    16 years ago

    Following up on dreamgarden, how about finding or asking the FSBOs about a lease with option to buy? That way, he can change his mind about the house purchase if his plans change (e.g., job change or decides to go to graduate school). The downside is the rent would be higher than usual.

  • badin
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Thanks for all of your responses.

    To answer mfbenson, the money for the downpayment comes from a variety of sources, mostly gifts and a small inheritance. He, like my own child, has saved at least 3/4 of the cash presents received for birthdays and holidays since early childhood. Add to that earnings from baby/dog sitting, lawn mowing, and more recently the research job, and it's enough. Scholarships paid for college tuition, and parents paid the rest. Both will graduate summa cum laude.

    Starting salary will be $55-60K. In their market, it's still possible to buy a new, four sides brick, 3 bd., 2 ba. house on a 1/4 ac. lot within 15 mins. of work for $150 - 200K. However, prices have been steadily rising and are expected to continue to do so there for at least another 4 - 5 yrs. All markets are not the same. In comparison, a 2 bd. apt. costs about $800/mo.; some are more.

    Roselvr, the parents can easily afford to pay the loan. They're liquid enough to be his mortgage bank, also. For that matter, they could buy him the house, but no one thinks that's a good idea, including the young man.

  • sue36
    16 years ago

    Once he's been working a year he should be able to qualify for a mortgage.

  • jy_md
    16 years ago

    This will probably be an unpopular opinion but I think this is one of those situations where a parental co-sign on the mortgage is a good option. The buyer will have the income for the house (especially given the size of the downpayment), he seems responsible and driven (evidenced by the scholarships and summa cum laude - or am I just naive? as well as the long-time savings habit).

    I don't know if I think buying a home at such a young age is a good idea or not. But that may because it took ME a long time to grow up. At 22, I was definitely not mature enough to handle being a homeowner. But then again, I didn't win any scholarships, I didn't graduate summa cum laude, I didn't save the money I got during my teens - you get the idea.

  • theroselvr
    16 years ago

    Roselvr, the parents can easily afford to pay the loan. They're liquid enough to be his mortgage bank, also. For that matter, they could buy him the house, but no one thinks that's a good idea, including the young man.

    This will probably be an unpopular opinion but I think this is one of those situations where a parental co-sign on the mortgage is a good option. The buyer will have the income for the house (especially given the size of the downpayment), he seems responsible and driven (evidenced by the scholarships and summa cum laude - or am I just naive? as well as the long-time savings habit).

    I have to agree, he does sound responsible and the parents can afford it. They can help him build his credit until he can get his own loan. All kids are different as are situations. If something happens and the son doesn't pay, the parents can either deal with it or let him have the house.

  • brickeyee
    16 years ago

    Credit cards pair off every month do not go very far to convince a lender you can handle long term debt like a mortgage.
    Auto loans are a better bet.
    The rate will be slightly higher if you co-sign as a non-occupant owner/mortgagee.

    All the fools who thought they could flip with huge profits and banks greedy enough to bite have created the mess.
    The 'old rule' of 20% down on investment property was not just for the lenders protection.
    It also usually made the mortgage payments low enough to be covered by the rent.
    All the easy financing for unqualified buyers also allowed the renters to dig a nice hole to look out of as their finances collapse around them.

    Your son will now be in a tight lending market and the lenders will all swing the other way.
    In a stable market with 15-20% down he should be able to buy.
    One option is for the parents to actually hold the second to ensure 20% down.

  • sparksals
    16 years ago

    This boy seems very responsible from the OP's description. However, I still don't think that they should co-sign, let alone buy the house for him. Here's why. Even though the kid IS obviously very responsible, I think credit is something you earn yourself. Sure, the parents can pay for the home if something happens, but what does that teach the boy about real life? A home is something that should be worked for, including the credit to buy it. It sounds to me, that while the boy seems to be on the right path, that he wants the home too fast. He should buy a home when he doesn't need his parent's help - be it co-signing, making payments if he can't or buying it for him.

    Also, I'm really curious about the location since the market is not declining where they are. I'm guessing in the Seattle area, but I could be wrong.

  • chisue
    16 years ago

    These young men have achieved a lot in academe, and also come from affluent families. (Not too hard to save your b'day money if you don't need to spend it on anything.)

    I understand the financial sense of investing in a house. But, maybe this is a time to go against a financially-based idea. Could they live for a year or two without locking into a purchase -- while getting used to life outside of school and establishing credit?

    Unless rentals are unavailable or ridiculously costly, might they not take a less permanent step for now? IME, 22 today is still immature. The Real World of work and grown-up relationships may proove to be quite enough to take on for a while. A little 'freedom'?

  • quip
    16 years ago

    I'm curious about the location, too. I doubt Seattle, as I do not think one could buy a new home for that price.

    I would not co-sign a mortgage. A co-signer cannot easily remove one's name, so the young man would have to be able and willing to refinance to remove the parents. If things go poorly for anyone involved (health issue, job loss, family disagreement, lawsuit, addiction, divorce, or whatever else one might imagine), the parents are still liable for the note, but they cannot sell the house to pay it.

    Per the OP, "His parents said they'd rather finance him, but then he would still have no reported credit history."

    The young man does not need to have the mortgage note to build his credit and work history. Multiple good suggestions are offered above. And paying utility bills and his own cell phone etc will help too. So, if they wish, the parents could buy the home and lease it to the young man with the understanding that he should build his credit and get a mortgage soon. If they do this, he should save the cancelled rent checks; the loan officier will want to know he is really paying.

  • terezosa / terriks
    16 years ago

    Another hint that it isn't Seattle (other than the price) is the 4 sided brick reference. Brick is not a common siding material in the PNW.

  • rivkadr
    16 years ago

    What's the big rush to buy a house? I have yet to see an answer to that. He's not married, and doesn't have kids. He should work for a year, establish some credit, and then do it on his OWN.

  • badin
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Thanks again. Lots of good suggestions, here. Our (extended) family has always counseled against car loans, or any debt for depreciating assets, but in this case I can see that it's a good idea. As long as there's no prepayment penalty, he could pay off in 6 - 12 mos. from the money he'd saved up for the car. However, both he & my child have low mileage cars only 4 & 5 yrs. old, and had planned to wait to replace them until a couple of years after buying a house. Dh has also suggested a bank loan secured by CDs, for $10K+, that he could pay off in 3 mos., just to help establish credit.

    Rivkadr asked (& I think some others wondered) what's the rush? To be frank, he's (well, actually they're) somewhat spoiled. Responsible for their ages, yes. But they're still used to living in a SFH and not an apt., even during college. They like having a garage for the car, no shared walls for privacy and less noise, and the ability to grill out on the patio. I empathize, since dh & I hated apartment life and we bought our first house when I was 21. Also, rentals in the area are scarce. There's been an influx of people to the area recently that will continue at least through 2011.

    I hope that Sue36 is right, and that a mortgage would be feasible within a year of starting work. The families may be able to make other arrangements for the interim.

  • sparksals
    16 years ago

    Paying off a car loan in three months is not a good idea because part of establishing a credit score is the amount of time one has had the credit. Having a credit card for a long period of time with a lengthy history of repayment on time increases the Fico Score. Newer credit intially may reduce the score but helps it increase over the course of the loan. So, paying the car loan over a very short period of time may actually hinder his chances of establishing a favourable credit score. ratio because he has less open credit

    Below is a link to a document from Suze Orman's MyFico site on how FICO's are established.

    To be honest, it does sound like these kids are spoiled. While it's nice their parents want to help them out, it doesn't teach them anything about real life.

    Here is a link that might be useful: Understanding your FICO score

  • terezosa / terriks
    16 years ago

    A rental doesn't have to be an apartment. Many people rent SFHs, condos, etc., that have garages and outdoor living spaces.

  • chisue
    16 years ago

    Um...are you saying these students lived at home while attending college?

    Also, are they planning on buying property together? (not clear on this)

  • sweeby
    16 years ago

    Buying a house now would tie them down geographically, which may not be a great idea when just graduating from college. Sure, a house close to work is nice -- but how likely is it he/they will stay in that first job or with that first employer long term? Statistically, not very. But perhaps your area's different?

  • xamsx
    16 years ago

    If he can afford it he should go for it! If he can secure a loan with 20% down in his own name (even if he needs to have a parental "loan" to make up the difference), even at a slightly higher rate he'll be building equity. Remember, the interest and taxes are deductible at full value - unless he's in a really high tax bracket.

    Many moons ago my parents purchased their first property when my Mom was 19 and my Dad was 22. They flipped other homes long before flipping was a common-knowledge term and used that original home as collateral. They still own the original home.

    Some people are ready for homeownership at an early age, some are not. If he is responsible and can afford a SFH and never have to live in an apartment, good for him!

  • badin
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Chisue, in some areas it's not uncommon for parents to buy a condo or house for college students to live in while attending college, then they sell it afterwards. That's the case for both of these students (who aren't living/buying together.) Dh & I expected to sell our "dorm" house shortly after our kids graduate. It's not so much the money as the worry and hassle, although that has lessened over time. If we were to hold the house a while longer, it would be with the understanding that the new grad would have to deal with any installation or repair appointments (barring some major catastrophe like a tornado hit.)

    While I'd never say never about a possible relocation, having moved around a lot over the years, in these cases it's unlikely. They chose their school because of its close ties to major employers in that area and they each plan to settle there permanently.

    Thanks for all your input. We'll have a lot to discuss tomorrow.

  • sojay
    16 years ago

    Being a foreigner who a few years ago couldn't even get a credit card with a credit limit of $500 without it being secured with a $500 CD as collateral because I didn't have a credit history, I've learned to play the game. Look online for advice in building credit history. You wouldn't believe what credit lines companies are willing to throw at me now, just a few years later. I've noticed if I for some time have nothing financed, my rating goes down, and if I carry a balance over for a few months I must be getting on some list as a desirable customer who is 'stupid enough' to pay finance charges (read: they can make money off me), I get one solicitation after the other. Key is to finance something over a couple of months from time to time even if you can pay it off. But not to max out too much the credit limits. It's silly, but that's how the game is. Take out a couple more credit cards, use one to be paid off every month, another to finance things over a couple of months. Even do 'balance transfers' where the credit card deposits cash onto a checking account, put that money in a savings account for say 6 months while paying off a bit more than the minimum payment. Will do wonders for his credit history. Goes against a lot of traditional saving values, but that's how the system works today where everything is computerized. I wouldn't recommend a car loan for the sake of it, since cars depreciate so fast, but the credit card game is easy to play once you know the rules. BTW, I did this without any stable income. I wanted to see how far I could push the game, and the more I played it, the easier it went. BUT, you've got to be disciplined. The finance charges seem silly to spend if you don't need them, but it's earned back in long run, IMO.

  • trilobite
    16 years ago

    What's the big rush to buy a house? I have yet to see an answer to that. He's not married, and doesn't have kids. He should work for a year, establish some credit, and then do it on his OWN.

    Buying a house now would tie them down geographically, which may not be a great idea when just graduating from college. Sure, a house close to work is nice -- but how likely is it he/they will stay in that first job or with that first employer long term?

    I'm quoting extensively because I agree strongly with ALL these points.

    Early twenties tends to be when you have some truly wonderful opportunities to explore life and make your way.

    Next month, he could start chatting with a woman from England and end up falling in love. He could visit Vancouver, really like the city and decide he wants to live there for a year. He could get sick of his current job and decide to teach English in Japan. But it'll be more difficult to do anything like that if he's stuck with a mortgage.

  • chisue
    16 years ago

    I began reading this thinking that here's a young person whose entire life is dictated by his family, and now they want him to buy a house, further tying him down.

    Then I wondered if he sees buying his own house as a means of independence!

    Ah, the Gilded Cage.

  • rivkadr
    16 years ago

    All I can think is that in the first few years after I finished college, I moved almost every year, due to job changes, life changes, etc. -- and this was very, very common amongst the majority of my friends as well. I just can not imagine why in the world you would tie yourself to a house immediately after college. This is when most people are entering the "real world" for the first time (college doesn't really count -- especially if mommy and daddy foot all the bills), and in most cases, it's a chance to explore different jobs, find a partner, try out living in different areas of the country, etc. It's going to be hard enough to figure out life and make it on your own without messing things up as it is. Why take on more responsibility than is needed at such a time in your life, when things are usually in a major state of flux and uncertainty, unless you have a really compelling need to do so?

  • theroselvr
    16 years ago

    It was asked what state they are in... By the OP's name, I might think North Carolina, and if that's the case, can understand why they want to help the kids buy a house. NC is getting popular with a lot of people from NJ wanting to relocate there due to our housing prices, thus driving prices up there also.

  • badin
    Original Author
    16 years ago

    Roselvr, you're a good detective. ;-) My screen name does indeed reference NC, but that's not our (or the kids') current location. It's just a small town that I used to visit, back when it was really a nice little place.
    However, as in parts of NC, the city where the students are located is experiencing growth and prices continue to rise. There are still some places where that's happening.

    FWIW, even these students' siblings do not agree with their choice, but they're still trying to find a way. One of my kids is looking forward to lots of corporate relocations for at least the first 8 - 10 yrs. of his career; then he will choose a place to settle. Some folks enjoy a nomadic life while others strongly prefer to be rooted at an early age. To each his own.

    Due to recent events in the mortgage industry, I think that family financing may be the solution, with the understanding that once a credit/employment history is established a mortgage will be obtained to pay off the parents (assuming the market hasn't returned to double digit rates by then.)

    It's been bad enough witnessing a return of some unattractive fashions from the early '80s, I sure hope we don't see a return of interest rates from that era. Our second house was purchased with a mortgage that had a 13% payment rate while it accrued at 17.9% (yep, negative amortization!) and that was considered a "good" deal since we had steady jobs and excellent credit.

  • ntt_hou
    16 years ago

    This is the same reply to your other posting at the Household Financing forum...

    You should look into the Acorn Housing program, link below. This non-profit organization helps first time buyers, from low to mid income, to get a loan. Depends on which bank's mortgage they go through your local area, the qualified salary maybe a bit different.

    Here in Houston, the banks used are Bank of America and Chase Bank. I went through Bank of America because they had better benefits. 4 yrs. ago, my salary was about 45K/yr. and I was easily qualified for the program. The program only required a minimum of 3% downpayment without paying PMI penalty. A 1% discount rate is applied to the loan. 1st mortgage is normally higher and this 1% rate discount is very helpful. With Bank of America, there was no extra fees at closing; even my real estate agent was very impressed with the clean (no fees) closing papers.

    The program requires that your son & relative go this 2 hrs. class. It basically help them to be awared what's involved in purchasing a home and be more ready. The whole process may take 4-6 wks. so, it's best to go throught the process of the program before looking for a house.

    If this program is available in your area, it's worth looking into it. Best wishes.

    Here is a link that might be useful: http://www.acornhousing.com/index.php

  • saphire
    16 years ago

    While it is nice that your ds can be spoiled, I am not sure it is the best thing for him. My parents strongly encouraged me to buy a co op in Manhattan when I finished graduate school. I would be making a very nice living in what was then my chosen field. They paid the down payment as a gift. I also had very impressive academic credentials. The reality is that internships at pretigious colleges and dogsitting do not an employment history make.

    I am not speaking from the credit point of view, I have always had excellent credit which is not difficult if you have the money to pay your bills or have parents you can rely on. I am speaking in terms of being in the job market where you are no longer coddled, where you are expected to perform rather than everyone simply being impressed by your academic credentials and how smart you think you are.

    I simply did not love my job, it was ok, it paid the bills but I started feeling like I was working to support my co op. Then after 8 months the apartment suffered major damage while I was work (not my fault). Fortunately my father had insisted I get insurance and I ended up with the Tax loss on the repairs actually making money. Still less than a year out of school I had to be in charge of a major kitchen and bath remodel. Thent he recession hit, my job was no longer secure and my condo was no longer worth what I paid. Also my mortage which stared at 8 had reset to 10.5%

    Then I got married and DH absolutely refused to live in the city. Fortunately because of the renovations, another spoiled brat (like me) wanted to buy the place at the price I asked even thought the realtor told me her father thought is was worth 20k less. I still ended up losing some transfer fees and so forth. I consider myself very lucky that I got out. Sounds like it could be 2006, right? Well it was 1987-91

    If it turns out that he loves his new job, meets someone who wants to be in the area, great. As for not liking apartments, I really think they need to get over themselves

    Your area may be great, it may be booming but the reality credit is tightening everywhere. People that could have qualified for a mortgage last week, cannot any longer. So they take themselves out of the housing market, this increases supply which may keep prices stable or even lower them. Still you never know. You may have ideas about your market that the price appreciation is there. Still I think it is worth losing 20k on appreciation to let your ds stand on his own feet. It took me a very long time to do that. Sometimes I envied my friends who had no choice but to make it on their own

  • pamghatten
    16 years ago

    My mother co-signed my first house with me. It worked out great for both of us.

    I have now been in the mortgage industry for 20+ years, and have my third and hopefully last house.

    Some mortgage comments: there are lots of programs for 1st time homebuyers out there, ACORN mentioned above is only one of them. But no one will lend to them until they are out of college and have a job and paystub in hand. The original post did say they were graduating THIS fall?

    Do they have any "alternative" credit sources? Did they pay their own utilities? car insurance? cell phones? Or did Mom & Dad pay for everything?

    Do they have a credit score at all? Are they buying a home priced within the Fannie/Freddie limits, less than $417K? If so, they should look at Home Possibe, or My Community loans.

    Employment history shouldn't be an issue once he starts working, college education is counted towards employment history as long as they start work soon after graduating.

    The more money down, the more willing a bank would be to give him a mortgage. maybe Mom & Dad could gift him some towards a bigger downpayment?

    Just some thoughts from a mortgage perspective ...

  • solie
    16 years ago

    What I don't understand is why the kids (or you) *want* this. The alternatives as presented:

    "In their market, it's still possible to buy a new, four sides brick, 3 bd., 2 ba. house on a 1/4 ac. lot within 15 mins. of work for $150 - 200K. However, prices have been steadily rising and are expected to continue to do so there for at least another 4 - 5 yrs. All markets are not the same. In comparison, a 2 bd. apt. costs about $800/mo.; some are more."

    To me, it's a no-brainer. I would want a nice, easy to clean, easy to furnish apartment in a good building with other people my age and a gym. In a house they will spend hundreds a month on lawncare, cleaning, utilities, taxes, and eventually (even on a new house) maintenance. I highly doubt that a house is really going to appreciate by an amount that will offset their forgone monthly savings. Especially after they pay a realtor. And if their family is affluent and their careers are promising they probably aren't going to spend the rest of their lives in a $150,000 house.

    If they were in an area without affordable options (or were disabled and unlikely to ever afford a reasonably nice place) I could understand helping with a house or condo. I just don't understand why anyone would bother when they can easily rent. Let them have the experience of doing for themselves for a year rather than accelerating their lifestyle progression when there is no compelling reason. Is that such a hardship?

    As someone else pointed out - it's easy to save when your expenses are covered by someone else. It doesn't sound like they have really "saved" the downpayments and pretending that they have does them a greater disservice than just giving them money and letting them know they are lucky guys.

  • terrig_2007
    16 years ago

    I haven't read all the posts, but did catch the ones about an auto loan boosting a credit score. I agree entirely with that suggestion. I got my first auto loan at age 18, and today my credit score is 800. I have no problem getting loans and credit cards at good interest rates. My CC is at a permanent 5.9%.

  • cordovamom
    16 years ago

    My third child graduated from college a year ago. He decided to live at home for a year and save as much money as he could (he's a mechanical engineer making $63,000 per year a year out of college.) He bought himself a car to establish credit, got a credit card to use for business expenses and pays it off monthly with expense checks, and basically established his credit for a year before he bought a house. With a year's good credit established, he was able to buy a nice home for he and his new bride. They used his salary only to qualify, and his payment is only slightly more than he'd be paying for a two bedroom apartment in our area. He was able to save enough to put 20% down on a home and he had the seller's pay closing (it was a bank owned foreclosure). So my best advice would be to build a credit history first, before even considering a home purchase.

  • mary_md7
    16 years ago

    Perhaps I missed it, but I'd love to know what a new college grad is going to be doing to earn so much right out of school.

    I agree with those who say that it would be a good idea not to be tied down right away. The first years out of school are all about choices, and they sometimes involve moving.

  • infodivamary3
    16 years ago

    Salaries in finance fields for kids from top schools with excellent GPAs are routinely in the $55-$60K range.

    Engineering, computer science, etc--new grads with hard skills who can hit the ground running--also command these salaries.

  • dreamgarden
    16 years ago

    mary_md7 wrote: "Perhaps I missed it, but I'd love to know what a new college grad is going to be doing to earn so much right out of school."

    This was at CNNMoney.com/Most lucrative college degrees

    What does your major pay?
    Summer 2007 Survey

    Major Offer Change
    Chemical Engineering $59,361 +5.4%
    Computer Engineering $56,201 +4.8%
    Electrical Engineering $55,292 +3.2%
    Mechanical Engineering $54,128 +4.6%
    Computer Science $53,396 +4.1%
    Civil Engineering $48,509 +5.4%
    Economics $48,483 n/a
    Management of Information Systems $47,648 +4.2%
    Finance $47,239 n/a
    Accounting $46,718 +2.3%
    Business Admin/Mgmt $43,701 +3.9%
    Marketing $40,161 +6.1%
    Political Science/Government $34,590 +5.9%
    History $33,768 +3.3%
    English $32,553 +5.3%
    Sociology $32,033 +3.5%
    Psychology $31,631 +4.7%

    Source:National Association of Colleges and Employers

  • brickeyee
    16 years ago

    Revenge of the engineering nerds!
    I am a PhD EE and a PE.
    It has always payed very well.

  • solie
    16 years ago

    "Revenge of the engineering nerds!
    I am a PhD EE and a PE.
    It has always payed very well."

    Some English lit PhD working at Starbucks just had her head explode!

  • kitchenshock
    16 years ago

    My 2cents. Credit comes from credit history. It has to be earned just like a college degree. Banks have no business lending to people with limited credit history regardless of what they make out of college. Just because someone makes good money out of college does not mean they will pay their bills on time. I have friends even today that make very nice incomes that are financially irresponsible.

    Secondly, I would rent coming right out of college. You don't even know if you like your chosen field or the place you are working. The best thing young people have going for them when they join the workforce is that they are flexible and can deal with rapid change in their life. Why tether yourself to a house?

  • Pipersville_Carol
    16 years ago

    Solie.... your post made me LOL.

  • garysgirl03
    16 years ago

    Add me to the list of those who think a house right out of college is a bad idea. I speak from experience in that I made that decision myself not so long ago. My husband and I are 27 now, and we signed a contract for our new construction house just a few months after we graduated (we were engaged at the time).

    When you're 22, you're just learning how to be an adult and be on your own. You don't really know who you are outside of the influence of your parents and family, especially if your family is very close. You just CAN'T know exactly what you're going to want in several years, even if you're SURE that you do at the time. I'm still trying to figure it out, but I'm old enough now to recognize it!

    My husband and I both agree that we would have been much better off renting than buying that pretty, new construction 4 bedroom house. It was convenient to work, but not much else, and it turned out that we didn't really like living there. Plus, my husband ended up taking a great new job last year which was far away from our pretty house, and we had to sell at a loss because of the sorry state of the housing market.

    I also have to agree with the others that 55-60k seems like an awfully high starting salary. I'm assuming they are in a field like engineering, but even then, are they really going to command a salary that high in a place where the cost of living is so low? We paid almost $300,000 for our new construction house, which is considered quite cheap in my area (Chicago northern suburbs). 55-60k sounds about right for engineering starting salaries here, but low COL areas usually pay less, too. I'd definitely have a firm offer before I started calculating the kind of house they could buy.

  • sojay
    16 years ago

    Frankly, I don't understand all the life advice given on this thread, although well meant, everybody's situation is different.

    I was 22 when my boyfriend (future husband) and I bought a house. I still had (yikes!) 6 more years of college to go, and he was in his first job after college. OK, we only stayed there 2 1/2 years, relocated (to a different country) for his job, I transferred to another college, rented the place out for another 2 years and then sold it when we knew we weren't coming back. So what? Didn't stop our plans.

    These kids might very well know what they want and be very mature for their age. Who are we to tell them what's best for them? If it seems like a good investment instead of throwing money out the window for rent, and if they appreciate the quality of life home ownership CAN bring, all the best to them.

  • thetews
    16 years ago

    "Early twenties tends to be when you have some truly wonderful opportunities to explore life and make your way."

    If that's what you want fine. I wouldn't change a single thing about my life. I would make the same choices.

    I enlisted in the AF at 18, had DD at 20, married DH at 21 (he was 22 and just out of the AF) and we bought our first house within the year with help from his father, had DS about 8 months year later and I got out of the AF at his birth and started college when he was 4 weeks old (It was DH's last semester*) .

    My FIL loaned us $3500 on a $38.5K house which we repaid (he only asked for what he would've made on the money in a Money Market account) when we sold the house for $46K a few years later.

    Life's been good. Kids are grown and on their own, but are renting because of house prices here in northern VA. I got my degree at the age of 32 (life happened), but I make great money 17 years later. We're on our 3rd house and even in the depressed market it's worth $500K more than we paid for it 14 years ago and we owe very little on it.

    I'm so thankful that my FIL was willing to take a chance on his 23 yo son and the son's 22 yo wife of 1 year and loan us the money for a down payment on that first house. Those were great times then! DH was in college with only the GI bill and Ready Reserve income, I was an E4 in the AF, we had one child and were trying for our second.

    I loved that first house - our 1000 sq ft rancher on 1/2 acre in Gloucester County VA. It was white with black shutters, 3 BR and 2 baths and a one car garage with washer and dryer in the garage.

    Now DH and I have our retirement almost completely saved for (and still 10 more years to put away more money) and we have money to help the kids out (but not too too much, which wouldn't be good for them), plus money for vacations. Our credit history/score has always been perfect.

    To get back to the topic at hand, there has been good advice for how the son can get a credit "history" fairly quickly, and I would advise that route over buying the house for him outright, or co-signing.

  • rivkadr
    16 years ago

    That's the point, though, thetews. The kid in question isn't married, and doesn't have kids. So why tie himself down to a house that he doesn't need yet?

    Obviously, with millions of people out there, you can find someone who bought a house in their early 20's and it worked out great for them. But the point that I and several others are trying to make is that for the majority of people at that age, it's unnecessary and probably undesirable to place yourself in the position of making mortgage payments straight out of college when for most people, this is the time when your life is full of upheaval and change. Maybe this kid is the one in however many who can do it and it will work for him -- if so, great. But experience shows that for most kids his age, it's probably not such a great idea.

  • jy_md
    16 years ago

    That's the point, though, thetews. The kid in question isn't married, and doesn't have kids. So why tie himself down to a house that he doesn't need yet?

    Because he wants to? While I wasn't the type to get married, buy a house, have children right out of college, plenty of people do one or more of those things without mishap.

    Of all these big life events, buying a house too young is probably the least devastating mistake to make. I'm assuming here that it's just home ownership and "being tied down" that's the problem, not making payments.