Hee.You really don't expect an agent to show your house for $5,000, do you?
It's not worth their time. Some have to split that with their broker. The "babysitting" they have to do with a FSBO (so they claim)costs a lot more in aggravation than that.

Trust me, the wording on your sign will NOT lure them in. It's all in the commission. Offer them 3.5% & then they ones who don't hate FSBOs may start showing your house.
The others will still try to boycott & prove to the world that you cannot sell without a traditional listing, hence they won't even mention your property to their buyers.

I know the realtors will attack me on this board, and deny that it's all about greed, but I'm speaking from LOTS of years of experience with realtors.
Good luck.

I have not seen the term "agents protected"' on FSBO signs here. The term I see used is "agents welcome."

What's the price on your house?

I am selling for $208,000

$5k is 2.4% of $208k. I would up that a little. To 3% at least, probably 3.5%.

I've seen that term on a flyer from a FSBO house, but have no idea what the term implies. Can anyone explain fully how that works?

"I've seen that term on a flyer from a FSBO house, but have no idea what the term implies. Can anyone explain fully how that works?"

It means that although the owners haven't entered into an exclusive listing agreement with a RE firm to market their house, they will pay any agent a fee or commission for procuring a buyer for their house.

I have never seen that term in my area, though I understand that it is used elsewhere. I think I would go with "agents welcome".

Hee.You really don't expect an agent to show your house for $5,000, do you?
It's not worth their time

Dabunch when you made this comment, you didnt even know what the price of her house was. $5000 is a fair commission for a house that is listed for $208,000. Perhaps you should have asked that question first.

swebb, yes, if I saw agent protected, I would be more inclined to show the house than a FSBO without it. Good Luck!

In my area, people are more inclined to say "will coop X%."

I think this may be another one of those regional things, I would use whatever phrase is used on signs of other FSBOs.

The agent/boycott FSBO thing may be regional or market driven, too. All I know is that last spring, in a better market, not one realtor showed our house when we were FSBO/Discount Broker. This spring, in a worse market, with an agent, the house has been shown at least a dozen times by other agents. It may be anecdotal evidence, but it works for me! In a buyer's market, FSBOs can become totally irrelevant.

Can someone explain this to me? In my area, you are either FSBO or you are listed with a full service agent/broker or a discount agent/broker. You can't be both. How does this work?

we were FSBO/Discount Broker.

Linda117-
Since you are such an altruistic agent. Would you please come to this area & save all the FSBOs?
J/K
I think that realtors ARE necessary in many instances. The bad ones, give the good ones a bad name.

Many realtors find 2.4% unacceptable. Ok, I didn't want to get into specifics, but here it goes:
When selling my house I met with 3 realtors (later a 4rth one chimed in). They all told me that they wouldn't suggest ONLY a 5% commission, because not THEY, but the "other realtors" may not want to show my property. My property was a 600k house. The fourth realtor was a friend of my neighbors & she told me lots, off the record....nothing I didn't know or already suspect ;)
That's where I get my irritating (to you) statements.

I have lots of experience in the RE business & with realtors.

To answer your FSBO/Discount broker question. Some sellers now opt to go FSBO & list with a flat fee broker. More FSBOs are finding out about these brokers. You may reside in NY & list with one in California through the web. These brokers will put your home on Realtor.com & the MLS for a one time flat fee i.e. $399-$499. They even assist you with the paperwork, send you a sign & a lockbox. Mlsyourway(dot)com is one of them. I'm not advertising them. Just letting you know how they operate. You still do all the work & advertising. But with a lawyer, you're all set. No agent necessary.

This is where the realtors get ticked off (here, anyway)thay you don't list the traditional way with an in state realtor. Going the FSBO/Discount broker way, you eliminate the listing agent, but still benefit from Realtor.com & the MLS. You offer some (1%- whatever % you wish)commission to the SELLING broker only. The realtors are afraid that their bread & butter (traditional listings) will go to an outside flat fee broker for $400-$500, instead the typical 5%-6% commission.

In my previous posts, I kept referring to those type of FSBO listings. Trust me, the realtors HATE them. If I were a realtor, I would hate them too. However, not everybody who lists that way, wants to eliminate the listing realtor. I went that route, but I did it for personal reasons. The realtors judge FSBOs too quickly & boycott these type, primarily.

Going that route gave me better control of the showings & allowed me to lower my price considerably to antice a buyer. I sold it on my own, but I also had a contract coming in through a realtor (one who didn't boycott-lol). I made out better going with my own buyer, though.

When selling my house I met with 3 realtors (later a 4rth one chimed in). They all told me that they wouldn't suggest ONLY a 5% commission, because not THEY, but the "other realtors" may not want to show my property.

For the most part, this is true, especially in a buyers market when there are tons of houses available. Your commission has to be competitive, just like if you were applying for a job, their salary would have to be competitive in order for you to consider the job. I will admit, there are times when a home fits one of my buyers needs that is offering less than a competitive commission and I will show it, but I am not happy about it, however, if there is a choice, I show whatever is paying more.

Since you are such an altruistic agent. Would you please come to this area & save all the FSBOs?

THere is nothing altruistic about this. A house listed for $208,000 which will probably be negotiated down to $200,000 and is offering a $5000 commission, is competitive. Currently in my area, customary commissions are between 5 and 6%. 5% of 200,000 is $10,000, half of that to the buyers agent is $5000. That is no different than showing any other $200,000 house, there is no reason not to show it.

Going the FSBO/Discount broker way, you eliminate the listing agent, but still benefit from Realtor.com & the MLS. You offer some (1%- whatever % you wish)commission to the SELLING broker only.

As long as the commission is competitive, I couldnt see any realtors boycotting the listing as you say. But at 1%, its not competitive, why would anyone show it?

With your scenario, this is what it looks like. House is listed with discount broker for $200,000. Seller is offering 1% to the selling agent. Humm, thats $2000. Their office will take half of that, now you're down to $1000, if you work for a francise, like Coldwell Banker or Century 21, they will take up to 8.5% of that, so now you're down to, $915, if your office has admin fees or MLS fees, you could be paying another 2% of that, so now you're down to $896.70 to sell a house that in my area takes 2-3 months to close. Thats hardly worth the time. I'd rather show a rental and be paid in a week the same amount without any of the headaches.

I told the OP that offering 2.4% didn't seem good enough, for the same reason the realtors told me-at 5% realtors may not want to show it.
At first I didn't know the Op's house was 200k. Our half acre lots, if you can find one, start at 300k. I assumed the house was more.

Usually when people go with a FSBO/Discount broker they offer 2.5%-3.5% (I played around with both figures)to the selling agent. That's what I've seen.

"With your scenario, this is what it looks like. House is listed with discount broker for $200,000. Seller is offering 1% to the selling agent. Humm, thats $2000. Their office will take half of that, now you're down to $1000, if you work for a francise, like Coldwell Banker or Century 21, they will take up to 8.5% of that, so now you're down to, $915, if your office has admin fees or MLS fees, you could be paying another 2% of that, so now you're down to $896.70 to sell a house that in my area takes 2-3 months to close. Thats hardly worth the time. I'd rather show a rental and be paid in a week the same amount without any of the headaches."

This really bothers me. Just like every other business, the model is changing. Americans have to compete on a global scale with labor rates, and as a result our incomes will decline. This causes us to adapt, and look for ways to save. The 6% model will die - replaced with a lower one (3% + fee?). This isn't 1990 when realtors monopolized what buyers saw. Most houses are scrutanized online, and buyers just need to get inside. To show, offer, and counter only takes a few hours over those "2-3 months" - and most of the time is waiting for funding. I guess the extensive real estate schooling regimen demands more compensation for such endeavors. Why is the seller made responsible for those PITA buyers who need to see 90 houses from the agent? That should be the BA's problem, not the guy who owns the house they eventually buy. He probably did everything right, and got the fast offer because of it. Should there not be discounts for this (saving the precious agent's time)?

The discount agent I use lists for $495, and will rebate 2% back at closing if used as buying agent. He charges more for services as needed (out of pocket costs like virtual tours, electronic lockboxes, showing me houses, etc.). I get the listing agent to open the door, and my agent just writes up the contract if I like it. This is how it should be. And I tell everyone I know about him. Amazingly - he is still in business over the years with just 1%. I think the problem is the laziness some agents aquired during the boom when all they really did was plant a sign or open a door, and deposit a check. Those days are long gone...

I can tell you that very few agents could afford to stay in business if they received less than $1000 commission per sale. In order to make $50,000 pre-tax income they would need to sell 50 homes per year. I can tell you that you are not going to get very good service from an agent that is handling that kind of load without an assistant. Not to mention the fact that Realtors are independent contractors who pay for their own insurance, advertising, association dues, etc. As an assistant to an agent I can tell you that the real work starts after an offer is accepted. Getting deals to closing can sometimes be a major undertaking, with countless hours on the phone or at the property, making sure that inspections and repairs are done properly.

Most people working in my business (which requires six years of college) also are independent contractors who pay their own office costs, SS, taxes, etc. We get our half from hourly fees that range between $52 to $112, depending on the insurance companies our clients have. Any paperwork we do after the client leaves (ie: all of it!) is done on our own time for free. Why did we get into this field? We liked the work. Times have changed and our fee rates have fallen drastically. The model for providing our services changed, and we have had to accept it. It happens in some professions, and it looks like the old realtor's job is going to be one of them.

I was the one with the FSBO/discount broker comment. I started out FSBO. Then DH remembered that the title company where he went for a seminar on selling your own home was offering to get you onto the MLS with a 0.5% commission. Technically, we were then represented by the guy who owns the title company, who had recently gotten his broker's license again. He had started out in real estate, so had a broker's license in the past. He fought to get it back, apparently realtors knew he had plans to help FSBOs with a very low fee.

For the 0.5% I would have gotten his title company's lawyer to review the contracts, and I did get into the MLS. But I was listed with him as my broker, and I think that prevented us from being shown. I offered 3% to the buyer's agent. Not one agent showed the house. This was in April, May, June and July. I had his sign on the lawn, and had his name on my flyers, with my number listed in the flyer and the MLS ad. So I was sort of FSBO, sort of discount broker. In August we signed with a full service agent and he is still trying to sell the house.

This isn't 1990 when realtors monopolized what buyers saw. Most houses are scrutanized online, and buyers just need to get inside. To show, offer, and counter only takes a few hours over those "2-3 months" - and most of the time is waiting for funding

LOL, every once in a blue moon, you get a deal like this. How about the other 99%? I have a transaction going on right now, the purchaes offer was accepted on March 26th. We still haven't closed. The new closing date is 'on or about' July 15th and JUST last week, we FINALLY negotiated thru all the issues with the house. The majority of people think you just pop someone in your car, show a house or two, make a sale and sit back and wait. This is far from the truth. Its a very stressful business with long hours especially for new agents. The only way to get a vacation is to go out of the country where there is no cell phone signals. Otherwise, you're getting called. When we're going out to dinner or doing something special, my kids often comment, can we not talk real estate tonight or can you turn off your cell phone? Its a rewarding business and I love it, but its not all cake and icing like many want to believe. The "average" agent in NY makes about $40,000 per year, and that is selling about 7 houses per year, which for a new agent is not easy to do. $40,000 per year in NY is just about poverty level. Its a highly competitive business and there is much less greed in this business than people think, those agents don't last.

"LOL, every once in a blue moon, you get a deal like this. How about the other 99%?"

So is it the seller holding all this up, or are they just having to endure as you are? I just think everything should be fee based instead of percentage based. $50 bucks a showing; $700 a contract; $500 a listing; virtual tours, signs, extras more, etc...all payable at closing. All I hear is moaning about how much money agents don't get, when it sounds like a pyramid for the brokers. Get a broker's license and change the model. Then again why would you if you get half of everything at that point...

Mudd belly, what you fail to see if that home prices "include" real estate commission. Do you really think that the prices are those prices without the commissions included? When a home is priced, its price is based on comparable sales that have closed "with commission". This is why people looking at FSBO's, want the seller to reduce his price by whatever the customary commission rate is in that area.

Get a broker's license and change the model. Then again why would you if you get half of everything at that point...

If you are so unhappy with the way it is, perhaps you should be the one changing the "model". It works for me.

I have a brokers license. I'm not interested in running the show. Its why I am a RE/MAX agent. I get to run "my own" business without the liability of what other agents do.

The bottom line is, no one has to use a real estate agent if they dont want to. So quit complaining that it costs too much. If you don't want the product, don't buy it. Its that simple.

lin da117,

I deleted an earlier response thinking I may just get my license, and do just that (change the model). However, I really enjoy my current vocation. So I re-wrote the post to maybe let someone else take the reigns (which of course would benifit me in the long run). Besides, my agent does this already. I told him I was going to do a online course for $600 to save the commission, and he said, "What's the point when you already have me?" He's right.

You may be correct that home prices are inflated because of high agent commissions. Just like many goods were in the past before the retail juggernauts began cutting the margins and increasing volumes. Walmart Realty anyone? I could see it. However, the FF listings I wanted to buy were not discounted at all. The price of a house is what a person is willing to pay.

I don't think I'm the only one complaining here...

Can I choose to not use a buyer's agent and get 3% back if I write up the contract? No I can't. A monopoly exists, which gives me the right to complain.

"Can I choose to not use a buyer's agent and get 3% back if I write up the contract? No I can't."
Yes you can. If you have a real estate license you are authorized to get paid a RE commission.
The seller authorizes the listing agent to pay the selling agent (buyer's agent) a co-op commission and not an unlicensed buyer.

OR, You can get your license and become your own listing agent. Pay the buyers agent 3% and pay yourself nothing. If you think all the BA does is "write the contract" for 3%, you will never think the commission is worth it. By the way, in my area, I have nothing to do with writing the contract. Attorneys do that. :)

OK, thanks for everyones take. I have actually decided to offer 3.5% instead of the flat $5000. Do you think realtors will be jumping at that?

Swebb.If you are willing to pay 3.5%, why not just go the other 1.5% ($3000) and get the full service broker? For $3000, you are getting ALL the exposure, MLS, websites, internet, advertising, flyers, signs, maybe DVD or whatever else they do in your area. It doesnt seem worth it for $3000 not to list it and have access to all the companies, especially since everyone who is in an area where this is popular say FSBOs get boycotted. You could also raise your price $3000 to cover the difference. Anyone looking at something for 208,000 will also look at something for $211,000. Just curious?

It would actually be 2.5% more. Realtors here get a total 6%. So that would be about $5200 more. I do have it on MLS, signs,flyers, internet. I guess there are just no people buying.

Realtors here get a total 6%.

Swebb, commissions are negotiable. If "customary" is 6, there is probably alot of 5's. In that case you would still be competitive. If customary is 7 and they were negotiated down to 6, then 5 probably wouldnt work. I would double check on it.

Linda, in my area, commissions with full service brokers are not negotiable. Of course, nobody admits that, but you won't find an agent who will take a listing for 5% instead of the "customary" (meaning "required") 6%. It's de facto price fixing (well, really rate fixing) but that's the way it is.