Like dcarch, any scraps that the chickens don't want go into my garden, but the chickens really like the fat. Since they live in an unheated coop in Michigan, I think the fat is extra energy to help keep them warm, even though they are Rhode Island Reds and are extremely cold tolerant. Heck, they go outside and scratch in the snow and sun themselves sitting on top of snowbanks, so I like to help them out with extra nutrition if I can. Annie

Hawk, to me, if it has milk it may be nice braided bread but it isn't challah. Traditionally challah is used at Shabbat and holiday dinners and that would usually mean a meat meal. Someone who keeps kosher doesn't eat milk and meat together so challah would not have milk. pkguy and Carol, at the point where I realized the recipe called for powdered milk, I had already added the liquid so substituting wasn't an option. If I did add milk I remember the earlier discussion about the need to scald because of the enzymes. In any case, I don't think the changing the amount of liquid in the recipe to milk would provide an equivalent amount of milk solids as 2/3 cup of powdered milk. I did wonder about substituting evaporated milk which would be closer. But because we keep kosher, I generally prefer my bread not to have milk so if the bread comes out fine without it I'd be happy with that. But we don't eat much meat so I could make it with milk and just not use it with meat.

lpinkmountain - Cake flour is milled from soft wheat and is also bleached, which is one thing I avoid in flour (although King Arthur has a new unbleached cake flour available). Whole wheat pastry flour is also milled from soft wheat, but not so low in the protein as cake flour is. Using ALL cake flour (7.5-8.5% protein) would be a little too low in gluten for soda bread. I've seen soda bread recipes that use a portion of cake flour and all-purpose flour to lower the gluten level. Other flour choices would be Southern All-Purpose flours such as White Lily (which has always been the flour-of-choice for making biscuits for generations), Martha White, Gladiola, and Red Band. Yogurt is a good substitute for buttermilk because it is acid enough to react the soda in soda bread recipes, an acid ingredient is a MUST. Just give the yogurt a stir to liquefy it (which breaks up the curds), and you can add a little milk or water if you want to thin it a bit. In fact, yogurt (4.3-4.4 pH) is more acid than buttermilk 4.5-5.1 pH) - the lower the number the more acidic the food. Sour milk would also work, naturally soured or soured with lemon juice or vinegar. Powdered buttermilk is rather insipid, compared to commercial buttermilk. It just doesn't have that tangy flavor that is part of soda bread - BUT - if you want to use powdered buttermilk, you can use it to culture and make your own homemade buttermilk, and it will be nice and tangy like commercial buttermilk. How to: In a quart jar, place 1/2 c. buttermilk (commercial buttermilk or reconstituted buttermilk made from powdered buttermilk - according to package directions). Fill the remainder of the jar with regular milk. Stir well. Let stand in a warm place (at least 80°F - I place mine in the oven with the light on, as far from the light as possible). Leave the mixture until it clabbers - 12-18-hours. Stir when done and refrigerate. You can take a 1/2-cup of homemade buttermilk to culture your next (1-quart) batch of homemade buttermilk if you use it within two weeks. BTW - When making biscuits, once the liquid ingredients are added to the dry ingredients, keep mixing (by hand) to a bare minimum so you don't develop the gluten strands in the dough. I pat biscuit dough into a nice square with floured hands (no rolling pin) and then cut them into squares with a pizza cutter. When you cut biscuits into rounds, you have all that leftover dough which is balled up, patted out and cut again. Those biscuits are called "second cuts" and are generally more tough than first cuts because the gluten has been over-worked. So to save time and avoid second cuts, try cutting your biscuits into squares. -Grainlady

Thanks for all the answers, folks: I'm glad to hear from other bakers! Of all the breads I hear about here, plllog's are the ones that speak to me most. But, although, if I really set about it with determination and a decent financial investment, I might be able to get the tools and supplies necessary to make bread as I see described here, I'm not willing to do that. I live in the country in Italy, and 98% of my groceries come from our small local supermarket. There is no Costco. No Whole Foods. I have no store that offers rye flour, grain berries, molasses, bran, wheat germ, reasonably priced oatmeal, or a host of other ingredients for baking standard in the U.S. I don't like to drive, I don't like to run around, I'm reluctant to add to our terrible air pollution, and gas costs about $7 a gallon. Add to this the absolutely horrible dis-service offered by our post office-affiliated package delivery company, which, after my last traumatic experience, caused me to swear that I would never again order by mail anything that would have to be delivered through them (there are other couriers, if one has a choice). So I work with what I have. This suits me, from a philosophical and practical standpoint, and while it's likely possible to make better bread, mine makes me happy. I've gotten used to the fresh yeast, which is reliable, and I have a fair variety of recipes I've worked out. The last one was potato and buckwheat (I was able to find buckwheat flour again, thank goodness!) and it turned out really tasty. That one was majority whole grain, simply because I had run out of white, and that improved it. Plllog's comments make me think, again, about how much I could learn about bread baking. The "soaker" is new to me. Who knows, this may stimulate me to some modest experimentation. Like Annie, if I want substantial nourishing bread, I have to make it myself. The Italian bread is good with a bowl of beans and broth but it just doesn't work as standalone food. Add to this that Italians don't really eat breakfast, so there's not much of an offering of sturdy food for the start of the day. I think my tolerance of grain-based foods has diminished as I've grown older, and it may be that baking with a sponge, and adding a variety of ingredients improves the digestibility of my breads. My diet is relatively low in cereals--I eat them regularly, but in much smaller amounts than when I was younger--and I mostly eat bread as the centerpiece of breakfast. It powers me up! in the most satisfactory way. Today is the potato and buckwheat bread--we're on our last loaf; I'll have to make more. There's a non-sweet almond bread in the freezer, made with milk, olive oil, and lots of almonds. If it gets cold enough I might even want to try a sweet bread. I made one last year with raisins, fennel, and orange juice and peel that I remember as being good. The basic dough of that one was similar to that of the almond bread, made with milk and oil. The loaves made with fats don't need butter. All my breads are part whole-grain, usually one third, though I may try upping that in some cases.