Wow. I use LCB all the time for white underwear and there's a little smell at the end but not that much. I also use a little fabric softener and it easily covers up the smell. It's gone by the time they get out of the dryer.

On another topic:
Just curious why people think LCB is not "natural". It's Chlorine, one of the elements and about as natural as it gets.

Yes, chlorine is a naturally occurring element... but so is Uranium, and I wouldn't want to use that on my clothes! Perhaps I should have been more clear by saying that it's more "environmentally friendly" to use percarbonate vs LCB. The former is a relatively innocuous, harmless powder while the latter is a dangerous chemical that can cause bodily injury if not handled properly.

What surprised me was that percarbonate was much better than LCB at whitening after just one treatment. Not having used LCB in the past, is it something that has a cumulative effect over time? I thought it was supposed to whiten after one use - maybe my expectations were unrealistic. But if percarbonate can whiten significantly after just one use, shouldn't LCB?

I use an unscented fabric softener to allow the light detergent scent to come through. In this case, it allowed the nasty chlorine smell to come through and knock me out!

I haven't used LCB in years for whitening laundry. Always use percarbonate.

The other problem with LCB over time, it will yellow whites and cause fabrics to deteriorate.

LCB will def damage synthetic fabrics.

From the "Net" re: percarbonate:

"Oxygen bleach is "safe for all fabrics" or "all fabric bleach". However, if garment Care Label says "No Bleach", oxygen bleach should not be used. This type of bleach is most effective when used consistently. It is not strong enough to restore whiteness to garments that have become gray and dingy or to be considered a "stain remover". It may be added in the recommended amount along with the detergent when loading the washer. Follow Product Label instructions."

Why do your old towels look dingy in the first place if what you are using restores and maintains whiteness?

For a full load of soiled white cottons in my extra large front load machine, 1/4 to 1/3 cup of bleach does the job in addition to Tide HE.

In addition to keeping the whites white; the bleach sanitizes the laundry and the machine. A slight chlorine scent is there when you open the washer at the end of the cycle. Otherwise the clothes don't have a residual odor.

It's possible that the dispensing point of the LCB in your machine's washing program may be poorly timed. And the exposure to the LCB was therefore too short or too diluted to do any good against the generalized dinginess. It may work more effectively against dingness when used on a regular basis.

Not that I want to promote the routine use of LCB, but it has its place in my laundry world.

If I have something that I particularly want to whiten with LCB I find it's very useful. Most recent example was a white canvas grocery shopping bag that I had inadvertently left a plum in while unloading. Days later I noticed a swarm of fruit flies and had rotten plum-muck, and mildew stains from the mess. I washed the bag first with hot water, sodium percarbonate and Cheer. The plum stain disappeared but the mildew stain was left. A day or two in the sun didn't improve it enough for me so I gave it a soak in a 20:1 solution of hot water and LCB in a basin. Within 10 minutes I could see the mildew spots fading and after about 20 minutes it was bleached enough that I rinsed it and then rewashed in the machine. It had no smell of LCB after the wash. I rarely use LCB in the machine except for sick-bed disinfection purposes; for shifting stains with LCB I pre-treat in a basin (wearing gloves) and pretty much watching the process so I can interrupt (or prolong) it as necessary.

IMO, routine (not for medical sanitization) use of LCB in general wash is hard on fabrics, the environment (including septic tanks which loom large any rural house like mine), and reportedly hard on the stainless steel in some machines. As noted it can cause yellowing (mostly I think because of the disturbance of OBA's, at least on cottons) and it permanently sets any iron or rust stains. And of course, it's very damaging to some elastics, most colors and wool fabrics.

Properly dosed, and thoroughly rinsed there should be only a trace of odor after washing, rinsing and drying. Commercial laundries use some specific neutralizers ("Anti-chlor"-type products), but I've never troubled to go that far.

HTH,
L

The one thing I do use is the Clorox Bleach Pen. I think it's a brilliant thing. I don't want to subject an entire item to LCB but for small stains on white items it works really well.

Here is a link that might be useful: Bleach Pen

I'm curious.. when you say you are using "percarbonate".. exactly what are you talking about? Is it what is in Oxy-Clean?.. I have never seen anything just labeled percarbonate on a shelf. Can you only use it on whites or is it ok to use on colored fabrics?... thanks...

I have used both chlorine bleach and Oxyclean to whiten or brighten laundry. The chlorine is great for bluish stains and the Oxyclean better for yellows in my experience. One thing I found though. Clorine bleach works much better in the old top loaders with plenty of hot water and long wash times. With front loaders the amount of water is so small that it is hard to figure out the safe dose. Also I think the manufacturers delay adding the dose so that the bleach does not have time to cause damage. Possibly adding a small dose to the dispenser and running the sanitize cycle would work. That runs for well over an hour and heats the water too. The only problem is I'm not sure the bleach dispenser works in Sanitize mode.

i dont use LCB in my miele either. it is very difficult to remove all the odor no matter how good the rinsing. rinsing is not only a function of the machine. there are some detergents that are impossible to remove the smell as well

at the OPs suggestion i use the purer form of oxiclean available at whole foods (and other places). better whites, safer for clothes, machine and you

@ dbfirewife

I use 100% pure sodium percarbonate. You can purchase this online in bulk from The Chemistry Store, or you can find it available as Ecover Non-Chlorine Bleach Powder. This is the same active ingredient that is in OxyClean and most other powdered "oxy" type products. However, brands such as OxyClean are only about 30%-50% sodium percarbonate (active ingredient) and the remaining stuff is either washing soda or filler. As a laundry additive, you don't need it to contain washing soda - you are already using detergent. Filler is just bad. Why not use 100% pure active ingredient for the best results?

Due to the natural properties of sodium percarbonate, I don't recommend using it at cold temps. Percarb works best at higher temperatures, so for whitening you will need to go to 120F-140F for best results. If you want to use oxygen bleach at colder temperatures, you will need to buy a "cold water" type of product that has ingredients which will activate at lower temps.

I will sometimes allow items to soak in my laundry sink with sodium percarbonate and water. This really helps to whiten items like dirty white socks. I then wash them on hot with a good detergent like Persil Universal. Most people comment on how I keep socks so white (even my two small boys).

I use percarbonate for other things around the house and it's truly amazing (clean the coffee pot, white cast iron sink, toilets, etc ...). I could not be without the stuff.

Thank you for the explantation.. I will definately check it out.

@larsi, I'm shocked! As a German you would love LCB so much.

FWIW, Excerpted from Seventh Generation's Information Bulletin, "Facts about Chlorine."

Should I worry about chlorine in household cleaners? In a word: Yes.

Whether found alone or in a mixture of other chemicals, household products that contain chlorine pose a number of serious health risks. Products of special concern include: automatic dishwashing detergents, chlorine bleach, chlorinated disinfectant cleaners, mildew removers, and toilet bowl cleaners.
Many household cleaners contain chlorine, though it often masquerades behind aliases such as "sodium hypochlorite" or "hypochlorite."
Breathing in the fumes of cleaners containing a high concentration of chlorine can irritate the lungs. This is particularly dangerous for people suffering from heart conditions or chronic respiratory problems such as asthma or emphysema. And the risks are compounded when the cleaners are used in small, poorly ventilated rooms, such as the bathroom. Chlorine is also a highly corrosive substance, capable of damaging skin, eyes, and other membranes. Chlorine was listed as a hazardous air pollutant in the 1990 Clean Air Act, and exposure to chlorine in the workplace is regulated by federal standards.

Using detergents that contain chlorine in the dishwasher or clothes washer can pollute the air in your home. The water in the machines, which contains chlorine from the detergents, transfers the chlorine to the air through a process called "volatilization." We then breathe the contaminated air. Choose instead cleaning products made without chlorine.

@ larsi

That is just so disgusting...

I know, I know. I will even pour a small amount of LCB down sink drains, and splash a little in the toilet bowls...and let it sit. The whole house smells disinfected and clean (but my partner from Sweden thinks it smells like a public pool house...but clean though, kind of). LOL

@ larsi

So funny... I was carrying my bleached load the other day while simultaneously gagging and thinking the nuclear reactor down the road had leaked. I remember thinking to myself, this is how all of my towels will smell once the pool in the backyard is finished! LOL

When it comes to my house smelling clean, I'm much more of a pine oil guy.

You guys are so funny ;-)

Personally, I think that chlorine bleach is evil and I avoid using it unless I really, really have to. I never use it for laundry, although I have to say that I recently used it for Clean Tub cycle in my machine and it worked very well. I keep a bottle of it on the highest shelf in my laundry room and every time I take it down (which is not often) I feel like I should be wearing a haz mat suit ;-) I am terrified of spilling or splashing it and ruining my clothes, towels or rugs.

Regular hot washes with good detergent and oxy bleach keep my whites nice and bright. No need for LCB.

@Sstava....

We converted our swimming pool to a salt water pool. It generates pool salt to a gentler form of chlorine. NO more burning eyes, dried out skin, green hair (I am a platinum/white blonde...gotta love us Germans & Swedes LOL), smelly skin, faded swim clothes and smelly towels.

It is much better for the enviornment, less money each month with chemicals, and the water and your skin feel silky after swimming. I cannot recommend it enough!!

ditto the salt water pool

Salt Water pools may not be that good for you too:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_water_chlorination

I had to look to see if I even have bleach in my cabinet (I only use it to clean the outside water fountain). I use Charlie's Soap exclusively, along with Oxyclean and my whites are as white as anyone would want. Occasionally I mix Oxyclean with hot water and and some Charlie's Soap to soak items such as dish cloths that have become dingy over time. If there is a stain on some items, I soak the same way. The need for bleach is something passed on by old family members. It was a good thing before we learned differently.

The first time I used bleach in my LG I had the same problem with the smell. It turns out that the bleach is dispensed with the last rinse. When i added an extra rinse, that took care of the problem.

Bleach in the Miele W4842 is dispensed during the last 10 minutes of the main wash portion of the cycle.

The sodium percarbonate whitened far better than the LCB, and of course it's natural

It's about as natural as chlorine bleash. Sodium percarbonate is produced industrially by combining sodium carbonate and hydrogen peroxide, followed by crystallization. Alternatively, dry sodium carbonate may be reacted directly with concentrated hydrogen peroxide solution.

*******
The whitening is from the hydrogen peroxide it releases in water.

@ lazygardens

Sodium percarbonate is certainly far less dangerous. It is also the predominant bleaching agent for natural brands. I don't know any green or natural laundry brand that has chlorine bleach in its lineup.

Bumping this, because I run across it so much. For what it's worth though.. I personally think the bottle @sshrivastava ran across as very old and had sit awhile, or wasn't full strength regular bleach.

I don't use a lot of LCB, but when I do.. I'm amazed at how thoroughly, and just wonderful everything looks. It's so dazzling, and everything just smells kinda heavenly, and CLEAN afterwards (although, I use a antichlor agent). That.. and fabrics feel a little bit softer to the touch.

Mitch what is an antichlor agent? Vinegar?

@hmorton, I use an ingredient called Sodium Bisulfite. You add it into the wash, after the bleach solution is down the drain (although others will tell you to add it, while the water is still full of bleach). It seems to do a good job of stripping the remaining Chlorine, and preventing damage. You could also follow up after the antichlor rinse, with a Vinegar Rinse.

I've mentioned it a few times on here. I think it can be useful if used properly :)

Thank you. Can Sodium Bisulfite be purchased locally or do I have to special order it from a chemical supply house?

I can't say I've found it locally, but if you search online.. you'll find it on places like eBay and a lot of fabric & quilting websites, like this one.

http://www.dharmatrading.com/fabric/bleach-stop-sodium-thiosulfate.html

http://www.artisticartifacts.com/product/896.html

Thank you, I will look for it and give it a try.

When I use an antichlor after chlorine of course I always add it to the first rinse...Morton..you can find antichlor in petstores also..its used in aquariums to neutralize chlorine in tap water before filling a fish tank. Vinegar can be used as a mild laundry sour to neutralize carbonates but I don't think it will neutrilize chlorine.

Mich, you always bring up such good topics.

I am almost used to not using CB now for whites. When the US version of Persil Megaperls came out I was stunned on the vivid whitening of the wash load. Now I use the Universal Megaperls. I feel it is so better at that alone vs Tide w/Bleach. Ya not a fan on smell of it although washed and dried the smell is not musty but very light.

I use chlorine bleach exclusively and never had a problem. If your claims of dingy towels after use are true, you got something else going on. Percarbonate while an oxidizer, will not outperform LCB as a stain remover.

My suspicion is you used too much. 4 rinses is substantial to have lingering effects. All LCB is not the same just as detergent. My question is why are your towels dingy anyway if you have been a user of percarbonate? Dingy clothes are caused by redeposition of soils not remaining in suspension during the wash process, or too low of temperature.

Everybody has a preference, but LCB always has a place in the kitchen, bathroom, and laundry room. It is the gold standard for disinfection!

Mamapinky I will check the pet store. I used to buy chlorine neutralizer for the fish tank. Is it needed if you rinse really well?

I use vinegar if I accidentally get any bleach based cleaner on my skin. It immediately stops the slimy feeling. I was told that the slime feeling was the defatting of your skin. Before this forum I only had one detergent, an occasional fabric softener, oxi, chlorine bleach and a stain stick and now.... It's out of control.

A couple other things that will neutralize chlorine: Hyrdrogen peroxide/sodium percarbonate! and potassium or sodium metabisulfate (I use it to dechlorinate tap water when I make beer) . Also used to sanitize during winemaking to kill yeasts and molds naturally found on the fruit

YEs sodium percarbonate will neutralize chlorine. .that's why its in Cheer powder. Just enough to neutralize the chlorine but not enough to fade colors.

Morton no you don't need an antichlor at home if your rinsing. Antichlor is mostly used by prof. Laundry services who have a step by step procedure they follow. Rinse well and that's all that's required.

Sin I absolutly agree with..chlorine is still the best disinfectant and whitener, hands down..

Dingy can also be caused from improperly rinsing out carbonates.

Slimey or slippery hands from chlorine bleach. ..our Sandy can probably touch on this.

I don't often use chlorine bleach in the laundry, but if you've ever seen what I've said in the past, if my bedding, towels, ect need disinfected..I grab the Clorox brand bleach, regular...because as Sin says it is the gold standard.

I just don't rely on it for regular washing to keep things white. I prefer a good TOL Whites detergent. On the other hand I don't care how brilliantly white those white sheets are or how sweet they smell..add a dose of chlorine to them and there's a whole new level to WHITE and FRESH.

On that note for the next week everyone's bedding is getting bleach..LOL.

Sodium Percarbonate *can* act as a chlorine neutralizer, but it's a very weak one.. and beyond that I wouldn't want to use it in the rinse water, like I'd use a normal AntiChlor.

Main reason is it contains Carbonates which are very hard to rinse, and can leave fabrics very stiff. But I also wouldn't depend on it, to fully remove chlorine as well as a normal antichlor.

Although.. if you were forced to use it, I'd consider Hydrogen Peroxide instead.