As far as the controls: Honeywell offers 12 or 18 months, Beckett offers up to 5 years on many of their parts, the manufacturer may have their own warranty. Our local manufacturer offers 3 years on any part, so check it out. If Armstrong claims 5 years on parts, then your dealer can't charge you for parts for 5 years. My experience has shown that parts usually fail within the beginning of the warranty period or not until much later. Also, some of the large companies, maybe once every 10 or 20 years, will replace a good part to pad the bill.

A Hallmark furnace is a well built unit. Do you have any dealer in your area?

When you have a crack in your heat exchanger, you can usually smell the fumes. Do you? Is your chimney base clean of ash and the chimney unobstructed? Did you see a legitimate CO reading? Do you have a small family-owned oil company in your area in business for a long time who is known to be honest? We are fortunate in PA because we have many of them.

I would want great clarity as to why you didn't smell fumes and why the CO was high, both of which are not typical of oil heat without a good reason.

Make sure you really need a new furnace before you buy.

Thank you for your reply. Last spring we actually felt fumes in the house, but it didnt ring a bell: it was my first heating season I was using an oil-based heating system, and I didnt know what to expect. And because it was at the end of a heating season, I was inclined not to do anything and deal with it next fall (i.e. now). One thing that started really bothering us last spring was the noise coming from the crawl space; I found the cause: the exhaust pipe was vibrating. I tied it to the ceiling, and vibration and noise went away. Now I realize that the fan in the chimney probably went bad.

So I tend to believe (and accept) that the furnace needs to be replaced, esp. since the new one will most likely will consume less oil. The questions are really which deal to go with, and whether it makes sense to replace the A/C coil and coolant compressor at this time. Please share your opinions thanks!

Quote" Now I realize that the fan in the chimney probably went bad."
What fan in what chimney? Do you know that you have an inline fan? I would not take the word of one tech from one company for his assessment. The CO in the house could be the result of a cracked vent or poor combustion. Turn on the furnace and smell it now . Do you smell fumes? If not, get another opinion before you plunk down money to replace a fairly "new" furnace. If you do and another guy comes up with the same conclusion, ask for proof.

Forgot to mention another question as to the accuracy of the CO readings. Like, when was the measuring instrument calibrated? Also, many of the techs doing PM work are fairly inexperienced and it is quite possible that the tech got it wrong.

Silent CO poisoning, like you will get with gas heat, is uncommon with oil heat. You will be offended by the odors long before you ever pass out from CO, and I'm not talking about the odor of fuel oil. You'll have to learn the difference in the odor of fuel oil and leaking exhaust; something that you may not know with only one year experience with oil heat.

Trane has to pay for alot of advertising. All things being the same, I'd pick the Armstrong (or a Hallmark, if you can find one up there).

I don't work with A/C.

The exhaust smell from a turboprop plane is very similar to that of an oil furnace. See if you can arrange to be in the area of the taxiway when one gets ready to take off. Diesel engine exhaust under some conditions smells similar. A cracked heat exchanger will have such smells in the living area.

Thanks all. Yes, I know how exhaust smells :) You are right, I want to know for sure if the furnace needs to be replaced, and I am having a service appt on Friday to inspect the system.

In the meantime the third contractor gave me their estimate today: $8350. The furnace is Carrier 58VMR. The reason its so expensive (comparing to $4800 from HD) is that he says they have to bring the system up to the code. Quote: "The exhaust pipe is 10ft, it is horizontal in the crawl space with low clearance, so it has to be a double-layer pipe (or double-wall?) thats $700. The exhaust pipe terminator (the box with a fan that sucks the exhaust out of the pipe) also needs to be replaced, and its very expensive, $1000."

He also quoted replacing my AC system (the coil and Carrier 13 SEER R-410A Condenser) at additional $4600, bringing the entire bill to $13K.

Frankly, I am under sticker shock. Should bringing the system to the code be really so much more expensive? What do you experts think?

Also, how is $4600 for replacement of the coil and the condenser? The contractor is telling me that by doing both at once I am saving some labor cost (i.e. installing A/C with them at a later time will cost more than that). $4600 is basically the cost of equipment. Is that a reasonable price tag or is it too much?

Thanks so much for all your responses.

I am actually thinking that for this money I can install electrical baseboards (radiators) in every room and have a system like in a condo. I would have a thermostat in every room and have full control over room temperature. No oil fumes either when kids play in the backyard. Does this sound like complete absurd or do people actually do this?

Thanks a lot for all your help!

I don't think anybody would convert to electric heat anymore. It sounds like you have a power venter, but I would skip the third guy anyway.

At this point I would be taking a DIY course and replacing the furnace myself.

Baymee,

Can I ask why you would skip #3? Because of high price or because what he is saying is not correct?

dandm2007...

My old Magic Chef oil furnace cracked a heat exchanger last year. There was a mild odor in the house when it ran - kinda like kerosene. Sometimes, the CO detector would give a warning beep-beep-beep - although it never went on to the constant BRAAAAAP, which means "get out now!"

I didn't have a smoke bomb, so I removed the supply plenum and with a flashlight I found an 8 cm crack on the heat exchanger. It was on the weld between the "inner drum" and "outer ring" (ptimary and secondary exchanger?). It was not easy to spot.

The supply plenum - and the ductwork closest to it - had light coat of soot on the inside. It was most noticeable on the joints and elbows. That was the exhaust leaking by the crack. I've dark-coloured log walls. So I couldn't see soot above the registers. Light-coloured walls may have shown some sooting.

A properly running oil furnace should emit no odor. I can't smell my furnace at all inside or outside the house. There is NO visible smoke from the chimney. On really cold days I'll see some water vapour, but that's it.

Unfortunately, when I first put in the replacement furnace there was an even stronger kero odor from the vents. That was all my fault. During my DIY install, the edge of the exhaust duct slipped under the collar on the back of the furnace. This allowed exhaust gases to get sucked into the return plenum, then right out the supply. It took me a day to figure out I had botched it. Oddly enough, the CO detector never made a peep.

Is it possible that the vibration from a faulty power exhaust fan wiggled your exhaust duct past the collar? If your furnace pre-heats the return air over an internal exhaust tube like my Crown does, then you'd get the same kerosene odor that I did. I'm sure your CO levels would go up, as well.

A wobbling exhaust fan could have also loosened your chimney.

*** CALLING HAVAC and OTHER PROS ***

Does dandm's horizontal furnace pre-heat the return like my Crown lowboy? If so, could it be sucking in fumes because the exhaust duct slipped behind the collar on the furnace?? Finally...could fan vibration loosen the collar or move the exhaust in that way?

Peace.

Marco

At this point I've can no longer visualize your heating system. The third guy introduces another variable into the mix which the first one(s) didn't.

I have OJT where I hear of circumstances such as yous all the time. Who knows the truth with so many opinions of your needs?

If the first guys can do a competent job, let them do it.

As I said earlier, look for a small, family-run company, with a reputation for honesty and quality work.

I have been a customer of Standard Oil for over 40 years and have found them to be very fair and honest. They maintained a 300 hp. boiler at my business as well as my home oil burner. If you are in the Fairfield county area, another very honest and reputable company, although on the high side of price, is Edgerton Company in Monroe,CT. They do a very thorough and professional analysis of your heating/cooling requirements, and their advice is sound even if you only use it to educate yourself. Their installations are extremely neat.