I'd charge the going rate and save every penny toward his independence. He needs to learn how much things really cost and allow him to figure out his own priorities. Lots of wonderful people place no value on material goods. Maybe living in a trailer or cheap apartment is fine with him for now.

Heck, I have let my kids live in cars...

Sue, if it's any consolation, my oldest DD is coming from CA to live w/me in TX, and I'm facing the same scenario~~she recently turned 50! I know she won't be getting a job immediately, has only a couple of K in savings, yet don't want her to use up what she has paying me rent. I feel it's more important for her to have some financial security before she moves out so she won't have to move back IN! Helping him save by charging him rent/saving half, is a great idea. Once he leaves you'll get so used to your new-found freedom you won't want him moving back in.

While we love our kids, there does come a time when they need to grow up and consider the choices, good or bad, *they* have made.

Sue, if it's any consolation, my oldest DD is coming from CA to live w/me in TX, and I'm facing the same scenario~~she recently turned 50! I know she won't be getting a job immediately, has only a couple of K in savings, yet don't want her to use up what she has paying me rent. I feel it's more important for her to have some financial security before she moves out so she won't have to move back IN! Helping him save by charging him rent/saving half, is a great idea. Once he leaves you'll get so used to your new-found freedom you won't want him moving back in.

While we love our kids, there does come a time when they need to grow up and consider the choices, good or bad, *they* have made.

This is very tough. In a way you are putting the cart before the horse. How is he going to pay rent if he doesn't have a steady job? A friend's son graduated with a film degree and started out freelancing. In this field it is all about the connections. This young man went any where and every where to work and build his resume. He now is working at a full time job in California. But, what he also did was volunteer to gain experience.
This is such a popular field for young kids today. You have to also consider his ADD. He is also only 20. Ideally he needs flexible part time work that he can shift around if a job comes up in his field.
I would get involved in his job hunting process. The longer it takes to find a job, the harder it will be as new kids are graduating and competing for the same jobs.

I'm with Gold 100% on this. It's called life...it's not always fair, but it also doesn't come with guarantees.

Right now my son is renting a room in a house with four other kids. He is working at a minimum wage job and picking up work where he can. It kills me, I could open our doors and let him stay with us rent free, but HE insisted on moving out. He's currently trying to sell a lot of his video game systems and comic book collection so he can get extra money to pay a speeding ticket.

I am so proud of him, but at the same time, I want to help him out. But he won't accept money from us, and I know he's going to be fine in the end.

I'd charge him just below the going rate for rent, and if he can't swing it, then he'll have to figure out how to do so, if it means finding some roommates and moving out. Put that money aside, as suggested, but do not expect him to pull his weight voluntarily. Sorry, but it just sounds like you're being set up for a lot of heartache and tension as he could take serious advantage of you unless you set very, very strict boundaries at the very beginning.

Ellen, I guess my hope is that, in giving him 6 months' notice, this will spur him to find more steady work. Who knows. This is obviously our first time dealing with this, so it's hard to know the right thing to do. Also, since we have two younger kids, we sort of feel like how we deal with #1 will set a precedent for how we deal with the others when they get to be this age. Am I prepared to kick any one of them out when they're 21? No, I don't think so.

He WANTS to move out. He has told us many times. He doesn't like our rules and he wants independence. So, that's good. And I think that if we tell him we'll be charging rent as of April, he may just find an apartment instead -- like, "if I'm going to pay rent, I might as well be somewhere where I don't have to follow my parents' rules." But if that doesn't happen, at least we have made it slightly less cushy for him to live at home. I guess my goals are to make him responsible for paying a bill each month, to make him slightly less comfortable so he will maybe move out sooner, and just to make him realize that we're not providing a free ride for him for the rest of his life. Because he does not have a steady job, we're taking baby steps with the money stuff. As soon as he started working a bit, we told him he had to pay for his own transportation (we had been giving him a few dollars here and there for bus and train fare). Next is his cell phone bill. And then, rent. The good news is that he hasn't asked us for a dime (except for the bus fare) since he's been home.

He has been working fairly steadily for the past couple of weeks. He did camera work and editing for a charity event that will actually be shown on TV (small cable channel) next week, I believe. That came from the career office at school. He has also connected with someone who graduated from the same film program a year before he did, and he is making a music video with that guy for a supposedly up-and-coming local hip hop band. He did some of the camera work and is now doing the editing, and getting paid a small amount but it will be good for his resume. So the work is coming, but obviously it would be better to have a steady job, and that is his goal -- we are still working on him to make him understand that a job isn't going to just fall in his lap, though. Even thought he's working today, he needs to be constantly looking for the next gig, and/or full-time job.

What about some kind of a matched savings account rather than rent? Since he is 'terrible with money' that is really the parenting opportunity here as I see it. So rather than squirreling away the 'rent' money for him, which takes him out of the active role of taking financial responsibility for his life, maybe you support him by saying, "we're happy to let you stay here while you're looking for a way to get this career of yours going. We'd like to really give you a launch pad here, so whatever you save while you're here, we'll match. And that will give you money to move if an opportunity presents itself somewhere else, to invest in equipment, to travel for projects, etc....."

I don't think in this situation that I would charge rent. I know that isn't what you asked, you asked how much to charge but I'm just saying that 20 is young, 20 with ADD is developmentally younger still. It is a tough job market and he has only just gotten out of school. But you know your DS best and you know what realistic expectations of him are.

What I might do is ask him to set up a savings account with the express purpose of saving towards that security deposit and first month's rent that landlords want. Say a certain percentage of whatever income he makes. And the amount is deposited before he spends anymore of his paycheck; the pay yourself first thing.

That way he gets some money management skills and sees tangible evidence that the more he makes, the quicker he acheives his goal of living under his own rules. And as long as he is living in your house, keep your rules. I think that is the way to not let him feel too comfortable.

I think having him pay his own phone bill is a good step in having to pay a monthly bill. If he can't pay it because he hasn't budgeted for it, you won't be affected when his phone is turned off. But if you charge him rent and he can't pay it, you will be in a difficult position deciding do you let it slide or kick him out.

I couldn't kick my kid out either.

If he has not found a steady job in 6 months, what are you open to ?
He might do seasonal work for the holidays, maybe find a part time job that allows him some flexibility for permanent job search ; I think you'll know in 6 months what he is facing financially and you'll adjust the amount you would like to charge him.

I agree with Barb above, he seems to be a young 20 and needs to adjust to this new reality since he is not in school anymore; I think the important thing is that he learns and matures about the situation he is in, he has to make some moves.

You seem like a good and caring parent !

Exactly! I agree totally with Barb's post.

Yes -- another vote for Barb's posting.

Start with small steps -- and do your own research into the rental market around your area so that you confidently talk to him about the cost of living on his own.

Also -- within your everyday life -- talk about your own finances (within general terms) of cost of food, transport, doing taxes, medical expenses, saving for retirement etc.

Gold, because of his issues, my DS knows a lot about struggle. Has he struggled in terms of nowhere to live, or no support from family? No, but every day is a struggle for him, more so than I can ever understand, I think. His childhood was extremely difficult.

You are all helping me to think more about the whole idea, though. I am not trying to be extra hard on him, but I basically want him to take some steps that show all of us (himself included) that eventually, he will be out and responsible for himself. And also that it's not enough to work a few hours a week and then use the money to buy a video game! I don't necessarily know if paying rent is exactly the right way to do that, but I think asking him to contribute something is appropriate. I also like Barb's idea about the savings account, as long as it doesn't lead to angst around here. For example, when he was in college his spending money came from the money he earned from his summer jobs. But we knew if he had ALL the money from the summer sitting in his account, he would blow it all in a month. So WE held onto the money and put a certain amount each month into his account. He was fine with that for a while, but later it became a source of arguments. So I wonder if "forcing" him to put money into an account is going to lead to something similar. It's worth thinking about, though, for sure.

Both of our sons have diagnosed ADD so I an not unfamiliar with the affliction. I did not treat them any different than I did my daughter. Life lessons still have to be learned.

I am sure you will figure out what works for him and your family and I may be jaded by a close girlfriend whose children have been so protected that she is still rescuing them at age 26. I think her kids will always live with her. I watch them making poor choices and spending their money on silly things while Mom pays for their basics. They are great young men who have been misguided. Parents can damage their children's character by helping too much.

I do know that the sooner people join the adult world, the sooner life's lessons are learned. That said, I am sure you will figure it out. I would not kick my 20 year old out either but my expectations might make them want to leave.

I am glad you are reconsidering charging rent. I believe he will be a responsible adult when he is ready and able to be because you have done your very best in raising him. Pushing is different from guiding, and guidance is what he needs.

I wish you great patience, for however long it takes.

I would be thinking about what goals you want him to attain and not necessarily monetary rent.

His "rent" could be:
- Showing proof that he applied for X many jobs in the month.
- Showing proof that he is accumulating money in a savings account.
- Completing specific chores around the house.

Make sure you tell him in no uncertain terms that, while you love him dearly, he has to move out in the near future. if he is not paying his "rent" then he'll be moving out and into an uncertain world for himself.

My son is in the TV industry, and I think the film business is similar in that most people work as contract workers - not many are hired as full-time employees. My son worked freelance when he first got out of college, and the work was not very steady, so he worked tending bar and promoting music in local clubs to pay for his low-rent shared house situation in a sketchy part of town. About 2 years out of school he got a job in NYC with a TV production company as a full-time contract worker - we knew an Executive Producer there and honestly that's how he got an interview. The first month he had absolutely no money to even get to work so I loaned him the money for his commuter ticket and gave him food money. I bought him some new clothes too. He was in his early mid-20's at this point. He didn't make much and the first year was rough and fortunately they took taxes out of his paychecks because otherwise I'm sure he would not have planned for that. At my insistence he bought private health insurance, and I helped with that once or twice as well. Things did improve and after 3 years they hired him on as an employee and now he has benefits and a nice income - he expanded the position he was originally hired for and now has two assistants, so he did a good job, but he needed to have the first lucky break and some help in the beginning. Your son's small jobs now will hopefully bring him more work by meeting more and more people, but it may be very slow going for a few years, and with his young age and other issues he's going to need a lot of guidance. Of course he wants his own place with no rules! Charging him rent will be a big reality check when he suddenly has to use what little money he has for something other than fun. But a PP mentioned what will you do if he doesn't have it one month and that is a good question. The idea of starting with the phone bill or a savings account is worth considering. My son also does not handle money very well; he's almost 29 and is still figuring it out, but he's on his own.

The one good thing he has going is his age. Some boys take forever to mature, but they do. My brother finally got his act together when he was in his 30s, and when he passed away he was the best father, husband, and owned two homes! He started with nothing. Almost the same thing with DH's brother.

The good thing is not one family member on either side gave up on them. Homelessness can lead to bad bad things.

My niece is 30 and has ADD. It took her 7 years to graduate from college. You should have seen her parent's celebrate. lol. It wasn't until her mid-twenties that she was given the proper meds. She also suffers from depression.

Now she has a good paying job and is engaged. She just couldn't get her act together, but everyone was patient with her and it paid off.

It will take baby steps. The first step I'd take and hoping no argument ensues is, sit down with him and tell him from now on when he gets a paycheck, he will give you a percentage, and then you put his money in a savings account with your name on it, and he as the beneficiary. Or an account where both parties have to sign to withdraw money.

When my kids started working, they each handed over their paycheck to me. I put part in their checking account, and a larger part in their savings. They had no problem with it either.

Hang in there. Time and patience.

Does the school help them find jobs? Not sure if I told you in one of your other posts about my son going to Art Institute Philly for animation; they supposedly helped them find jobs. Back then the field was hard to get into & I don't doubt this field is similar. My son dropped out after 3 quarters & while I was heart broken (even more so because he stopped drawing) it actually was a good decision because the ones that did stick it out; found there were no jobs in the field & the few jobs that there were; the pay was around minimum wage. I don't know how anyone payed the loan back because the school wasn't cheap. Computer animation was all the rage; the field got flooded & only the best moved on with jobs. I don't know how flooded this field is; but I can imagine that a lot of people are running out to work in the field; so he could have a lot of competition in the few jobs that are available.

My son delivered parts for a car dealer to bring cash in while he debated on what he wanted to do. My step son started with DirecTV; my son decided to do the same & found that he's really good at trouble shooting. The pay is actually pretty good too; plus they train them. I don't know if your son would be interested in something like this & if there are other areas that he'd be good at that could potentially break into another part of the field where he could use his skills.

My son has always paid his own way; just like I did. Cell phone came out of child support & when he got a job; we had a joint bank account; his money was deposited directly there after he decided how much spending money he needed for the week. When he turned 18; the cell phone went in his name. He bought his own cars; even if he bought from me or my hub at a cheaper price. He's also paid rent; even if it was $25 a month. He's had it pretty good; never has to buy his own work clothes because I take care of that at Christmas; plus he get regular gifts.

With your sons cell; is it on your account? If so; depending on what you spend; it may be worth it to have him go to Boost or Virgin mobile in his own name with a $50 plan.

I have to run out; but I want to post about ADHD when I get back..

my oldest son has very similar struggles as yours- life is just simply much more difficult for him to navigate... he is currently in his 5th year of school...
20 is very young- esp for some kids!! if i charged my son rent, i would definitely bank at least some of it and give him it to him once he was gainfully employed and out on his own- and what i deemed responsible/mature enough not to blow it!

I do think he should pay rent, but I don't know how much. It has to be a fair amount, not more than he has, or all that he earns. I suggest that you put whatever he pays to you into a Roth IRA for his future. Can you open one for another person? I'm not sure, but I bet none of those part time jobs offer any kind of retirement plan.

The day will come when he will be grateful to you for those savings. It may grow considerably over time.

This isn't a direct answer to your question.

But I wonder if you have considered consulting for a session or two with a behavioral psychologist or other such adviser about what techniques and expectations are best suited to your specific situation to foster your son's maturation.

You are certainly dealing with a lot of converging issues: self confidence, sense of pride from the dignity or work and being capable of taking care of himself, time planning, career planning and networking, fiscal budgeting, deferred gratification, impact of his action on siblings and you, health care as it relates to both ADD and depression, exercise and positive self calming techniques vs retreat or drug/alcohol use or other negative self calming techniques, focus on goals, recognizing when goals are not realistic, recognizing when behavior is not productive to achieving goals.

I guess what I see here is that your individual son's issues make this a much bigger question than whether to charge him $50 a month or $250 a month. That really won't make much difference in helping him mature into the adult he needs to become if these other issues are not also explored.

Have you asked your son about how he feels, and if he wants some help with how to structure and balance these areas?

To answer the OP, I would start small. Maybe $75.00/month. Explaining that the rent will go up every 3 or 6 months after.

I Would also have him start paying his share of the cell phone bill starting January 1. He needs to decide if he wants a phone or video games.

I am mean. My kids paid their own car insurance when they were in high school....

ML

I think if your DS gets angry about putting money into a savings account dedicated to moving into an apartment, then despite what he tells you about wanting to move out, he may know that he is not ready for that step.

" he will be a responsible adult when he is ready and able to be because you have done your very best in raising him. Pushing is different from guiding, and guidance is what he needs." I keep coming back to Shermann's post. There is a lot of wisdom in it.

Your DS sounds like he is trying. He is working and interviewing and he is not asking you for money. Maybe he is exactly where he needs to be at this time of his life, and handling what he can handle for now.

I agree with the baby steps advice. I too have a challenging young adult child. My husband and I constantly worry about how to set up consequences for irresponsible behavior without sending her off the rails.

I think too that the situation for young adults is very different than when we were kids. They have grown up in a society full of conspicuous consumption. Well meaning parents, myself included, have provided things for kids that our parents never dreamed of buying. When kid's lifestyle expectations run smack into financial realities it's no wonder that many young adults are confused and unsure of themselves.

Is he having counseling sessions with anyone right now? It seems like I remember that he might be resistant to therapy. Perhaps he might be open to a life coach that can help him set goals and break the process into steps.

I haven't read all of the responses and I know that your situation may be different from what I was doing, but I worked for a few years in a program that helped challenged adults learn to live independently on their own. While their diagnosis were very different from your son's, most of my clients had similar types of issues. I personally don't believe that it would be wise to have the same expectations of him as one would have of someone without similar challenges. If you do, I seriously doubt that you'll get the response you're looking for and in the end, it could turn out to be nothing more than a very stressful thing for him and you.

Don't get me wrong, I totally agree that its important for him to learn how to live on his own and plan for the future. I just think that if you're expectations are too high, you're basically setting him up for failure which is not what you want. Instead you need to be careful and set goals that are more realistic with his abilities. I would start out asking him to help with the costs to feed him, say 50-75 a month. Whenever he has work, he has to accept that part of his earnings will be spent on his own needs (not wants). Those were to very important words when I was working with my clients, they needed a home and to eat, but they wanted videos and games. Which was more important them? When he's not working, make him earn the money through household chores (and lots of them) so he understands one way or another, he has to earn a living to pay for his needs. Having lots of housework to look forward to may prompt him to look for regular work harder without you having to get after him. Then when you feel he's accepted that as part of being an adult, up your expectations to the next level which is to pay for his room. I would quietly put the money in savings for him, but I would also maybe require as part of that rental agreement that a certain percentage of all his earnings go into a rainy day savings so he does learn how to save. And I would draw up an agreement which could help him take it more seriously; it will also help as a tool when you're experiencing a set back (which you should expect will happen). Every child (or adult) is different and it's obvious you know what he can handle and what he can't. Figure out the priorities of what he needs to learn first and work from there one step at a time. The last thing you want is for him to get overwhelmed or feel like he can't manage. He sounds like a very special young man who has a lot of potential. I hope this new challenge goes well.

Sueb, has your son ever considered an internship with the directors guild as an assistant director? We know a family whose son (creative but lacking in direction, not to make a pun) who majored in film who got one of these internships and it was incredibly helpful for him, career and otherwise. They like to take people from different walks of life, so lack of a 4 year degree would not necessarily be a drawback, I don't think. The application is due soon, if he is interested. The stipend is enough to live on but you may end up supplementing it depending on where he ends up living---- but that wouldn't be much different from paying for grad school, and this is real career training that leads to membership in the directors guild.

Here is a link that might be useful: Directors guild training program

Sue, I'm sorry---that link is for the production program. Below is the link to the two year directors guild, which is really more of a paid apprenticeship .sorry!

Here is a link that might be useful: Directos guild two year program

I have ADHD; I don't know how it differs from ADD; but your son sounds like he has other things & I wonder if some genetic testing may be worthwhile to find out where the depression comes in. I know something has been off with my ADD daughter & recently I think I figured it out. She'll also need genetic testing because her depression & recently such bad anxiety that she can barely ride in a car; would be a different diagnosis. I also feel she has my med sensitivities; which could be the case for your son if medications are not helping.

As I said; I have bad ADHD; so bad that if you watched a video of me in a wedding party; I cant stand still for one second. Something is always moving on my body. My mind is always racing; school was not pleasant; especially since I was compared to siblings. I do know that if something interests me; I can focus; do the task & complete it & do it really well. I've always worked in the family business & when I was divorced & living home; I was expected to work in the family business where I was paid peanuts but I did not pay rent. I went shopping for myself & son because at 20; we were not my parents responsibility.

Yes; it's rough having ADHD & I hope I do not offend anyone; but I do not consider it a disability. It does not affect my mind with knowing right from wrong or that if I want to buy things I need money. It does not affect me that I can't choose food or rent over pleasure items. Unless something else is going on besides ADD; he knows that to buy video games he needs to find a way to get money.

My daughter with ADD (probably aspergers too) does not have a drivers license because she doesn't have a job. When we shop; she knows the value of a dollar & always shops sales. If she wants a new video game; she goes to Game Stop & buys preowned. I took her to Lane Bryant for clothes the other night; she almost walked right out because of the prices lol The point is that she understands & I don't doubt your son gets it too. My son does save his money; but likes to spend money foolishly; refuses to take lunch; likes to buy Xbox games & has an expensive hobby. As soon as he moves out; he knows his life will be changing really quick.

I don't doubt that when he's ready to move out; he'll figure out a way to pay it & yes; he'll probably screw up with rent; utilities; food because he's not budgeting for other things he buys. Some people seriously never get this; for all anyone knows; he could either flourish or fall on his face. The best thing you can do is make some rules to start teaching him. Find out what his real faults are & what he could use professional help with. He could have more medically wrong with him or he just knows that he's not expected to have to help; which I'm guilty of with my kids because I did bust my butt working all my life.

Your son is good at editing; he found something that interested him & he went for it. He's not always going to have you around to pick up the slack. I don't think that it would hurt him to find some sort of part time job to have a regular cash flow coming in. I don't know what the industry is like by you; but it's possible there is not enough work for him to make a decent living with it. My son had a hard time stepping away from delivering parts; he was there maybe 6 months but he couldn't pay his gas; car insurance & cell phone with the crummy pay; because he was used to making more at Burger King; which he got fired from due to my dads cancer. I feel like all we did was get on his case but when he finally jumped; it was a great decision.

Your son need gentle pushing in the right direction. The worst that happens is he gets pissed off & moves out; then falls flat on his face & is ready to come back & follow whatever rules you make. My son moved out for maybe 2 months but came back because he knows its a better life being at home.

He WANTS to move out. He has told us many times. He doesn't like our rules and he wants independence. So, that's good. And I think that if we tell him we'll be charging rent as of April, he may just find an apartment instead -- like, "if I'm going to pay rent, I might as well be somewhere where I don't have to follow my parents' rules." But if that doesn't happen, at least we have made it slightly less cushy for him to live at home.

A good way to prepare him is to start sitting down with him while you're paying house bills- the cell phone; show him his share; electric for various months with & without AC so he sees what realistic utilities look like. Take him food shopping so that he has that skill; I know a 50 year old man that can't do it; he also can't write checks. If you buy him certain foods; you can let him put his food on the belt 1st; then have them total it before starting your food so he can get an idea of how much he needs for certain things. You can go one further & look at apartments locally to show him how much rent is; what's included & what's not.

Of course he wants to move out; it sounds real good until reality hits & he realizes he can't just yet; that he's screwed & has to try to compromise while living with you. What rules can you bend on because of his age & what won't you bend on? If my son was out passed a certain time he had to call & same goes for if he was not coming home.

You also mention he's been in therapy; can they help too?

Pesky mentioned her son selling stuff to pay his ticket. I know this is a totally different situation but selling stuff like this is pretty common & eventually your son may start doing that too. My daughter did something similar behind my back; sold stuff that I bought; she did not have permission to sell. It's ridiculous what these stores give for used games & cell phones; probably equal to 10% of what was actually originally paid. She thought she was slick getting money for a new cell by selling her 7 month old cell to Radio Shack for 1/2 of what it was worth used. You may notice things of his missing out of the house; but its also possible you won't notice until almost all of the games are gone. If you can take photos of his stuff; it will help you in the long run to see if he catches on to this.

Pesky; if this is the son you've spoken about; my heart breaks that he's paid such a high price already. I give him credit for wanting to do this on his own but at what cost if he's selling things he loves? I'd hate to see him get really depressed when reality hits & he realizes how little he got for all of his stuff. Is it possible that he'll give you the video games as collateral; then as he gets the cash later on; he can buy each back?

I just wanted to quickly thank everyone for your thoughtful advice. I'm away for the weekend with only my iPhone for Internet access, so will write a better response when I get back home!

Just a quick thought... I don't think rent is a bad idea, but if you want to start small and are having a chicken/egg problem with him and a job, why don't you charge a percentage of his income with some reasonable cap on it? I like the idea of putting it into savings.

When my marriage fell apart, my parents allowed me to move back into their home with my son for a time. I only had part time work but they did not charge me rent, they bought me a good used car (7 year old subaru with 20k miles on it, my ex had completely trashed our older car I ended up with due to lack of maintenance and I needed something more reliable than a 2001 accord with 100k miles burning oil at an alarming rate) and they allowed me to save every penny I made, which gave me enough of a nest egg (I came out of my marriage with nothing but custody of my son) to be able to move out and be independent. It will be 2 years since I moved in with them the end of January but I have been in my own place with a full time job and self supporting since last November. I could not have gotten to that point without the nest egg they allowed me to accumulate.

Maybe a serious talk about how to get to his goals might be in order - you can't just move out without money for deposits and some kind of backup for unexpected expenses etc. If not rent then some kind of strategy for getting to his goals is in order - I had my own, of course, but am grateful that my parents helped me to become independent as quickly as possible (I am a hell of a lot older though and have not lived with them since I turned 18, not even for summers after leaving for college). BUT he needs to know that spending his money on video games will not get him to independence.

One of my siblings had similar issues. At age 21 he was working full time but spent every penny having fun and still at home. My folks were concerned he would still be there when he was 40.

For a few years they kept talking to him about budgeting, saving, etc. with no results. Then they charged him rent, which he paid. . . and then spent the rest of his check on following his teams and hanging with friends.

Finally my mother took over his finances and gave him an allowance. Far from being upset about it, he was relieved and happy.

After a year or two my parents made him buy a house for tax purposes. He STILL did not move out. The bought house stood empty. After another year they made him move into it. I think he was 30 by then.

He's almost 50 now and my mother still makes sure all his bills are paid (though with the online and automatic payments and reminders now available, he probably could do it himself if he had to), but she no longer gives him an allowance. He has shifted from spending on beer and sports events to spending on things like kitchen remodels :)
She will call and check if she sees a strange charge, but she doesn't need to control the purse strings anymore.

While many people might be critical of my step-brother for never fully taking charge of his own finances, the end result has definitely been better for him than if he'd been left to hang on his own rope.

He owns his home and car flat out, he's got savings, his bills are paid. I don't think that he'd have gotten there on his own, ever. But now that the house is there, he takes good care of it and takes pride in it.

All of this is just to say that making the money and being in charge of the money don't necessarily have to go hand in hand for kids who feel overwhelmed by the struggle to manage it on a daily level in a way that will get them what they want long-term. Your son may not be at the point where he welcomes parental oversight of his money right now, but if your fears come true and ten years from now he's working and has nothing to show for it, he may welcome more help and it doesn't have to seem like a failure so much as a decision that will get him the results he wants.

The architect on our project wanted the kids all to have their own bathrooms and also made their rooms quite large. They even had laundry for their "wing", in her plans. I took out the laundry and made two jack and jills to serve the 4 bedrooms, instead of 4 baths. I also made their bedrooms smaller.

The architect said "you don't realize how many kids are moving back home nowadays. You need to plan for that." Yikes, I thought! What is this, a multifamily project?

All of this is by way of saying that this has become very very common. I am impressed that your son has found something that he likes and is good at, and applied himself enough to complete his studies. Many kids with no issues at all fail at this! So i want to start by putting that into perspective ... and it is not gratuitous.

I apologize that I have not read all of the replies. But a few general thoughts. I do think you need to charge him rent, because he needs to have a job. He needs to earn money, doing whatever is available. I know he wants a career in film, but that is something he can probably pursue while keeping some sort of job. First and foremost he needs to learn that we all need to do what we can, not necessarily what we want, to earn a living.

I would determine his rent based on his income. The actual costs or comparable rent are meaningless in this exercise; you don't need him to cover any of your costs, and he is not able to pay market rent (what 20yr old is?).

I would also, without telling him, put aside what he pays you so that you can refund it to him when he has proven responsible and need it for say, 1st and last months rent.

best of luck to your son and to your family as you work through this!

In the past the US was one of the few countries where 18 year olds went off to collge and never returned home. In many European and South American countries young adults (specially males!) continue to live in the family home, only moving out if they get married. We have many Korean families in our CA town and many have 3 generations living in the home ... lots of young adults with expensive cars and few living expenses!

Things have changed here in the US in the last 20 years. High unemployment and real estate bubbles have made it much harder for young adults to leave the safety and comfort of home. Our young adults also seem to be more immature and have a large sense of entitlement.

I hope the OP and family can figure out a solution that will work for them. It isn't easy raising kids today ...

There is a different angle too. I can only talk about the NYC area. Rents are sky high. In the NY Times Real Estate section, there is an ongoing feature about peole finding a rental or home. This week's was two students and their quest for an apartment. Long story short,their parents help them with security, etc. One said that she did not know how you could do this without the financial help of parents.
I see this happening where my daughter is. We do not help her with rent, and her apartment is shabby to say the least. The area is trendy and there are lots of young people and lots of renovating going on. But, with those rents, you know most are being subsidized by their parents.
Years ago, I was able to afford a nice studio aparment in a safe neighborhood with the income from my first job out of college. I was even able to save money to travel. Todays kids hve to double and triple up, and divide already tiny rooms in order to live on their own.
It's very sad and says a lot about what is going on this country today.

Please take a look at this MIT brain research on young adults.
I too have a 20 year old living at home. I am so happy to have him living here. I love that we are able to give him time to mature and persue his passions in a safe environment. For us, it has nothing to do with money. It is all about character, commitment and growth.
My DS1 has a friend that has been on his own since the age of 15. This kid is a talented artist, skilled athlete and a good student. He has managed to support himself and stay in school. He seems to have the maturity of a 35 year old at just 18. Hardship may make kids grow up faster, but I would never wish his life on another child.
I got pushed from the nest early. I know what that did to me.
Development takes time. It is a gift I am happy to give. Nan

Here is a link that might be useful: MIT young adults

I have been on my own since age 14. At 15, I had a child to raise. I am so glad my Mom declared me an adult when I got pregnant. I have had a wonderful and interesting life. I raised my child by myself and she is wonderful. There was no one to fall back on except myself. That said, I knew my parents loved me. I just had too much pride to ask them for anything.

I guess that always comes to mind when dealing with my young adults. They only have to worry about themselves. That is a real luxury in my book.

Sue-

I have not chimed in until now because I feel funny talking about my son on a public forum but after reading roselvrs response I really felt the need. She really touched a chord with me.

I have 4 kids. My 2 oldest are girls and were always easy, straight A, high achievers. They are adults and are successful. I have 10 yr old twin boys. One is like my girls and the other is my challenge.

He had problems from kindergarten. Extensive and expensive private testing revealed ADHD, executive function issues, dyslexia, anxiety. He has a high IQ but you would never know it, because he is a visual spatial learner and most teachers don't know squat about this type of learning.

Further, after screwing around with every stimulant on the market and making my son look like he had Tourette's by causing Tics we gave up on the Stims---then we tried the other stuff--Straterra, and Tenex. Put him into medication driven mania.

So he is not on any medication, and just works his butt off to learn the things that it takes most kids 1/3 the time to learn...just to get a C.

And this is with an IEP and accommodations at school and me fighting for him with everything I've got.

So from where I'm sitting with my 10 yr old and worrying about his future and what often happens to these kids as far as drug abuse, alcohol abuse and suicide...I think Sue that it looks like you have done a pretty good job and that your son has accomplished some pretty amazing things.

Of course I would love to see my son become a great success but what I really want is for him to just grow up to be happy and productive.

And for anyone that has never had a child with these kinds of special needs...I didn't get it either until I had My son.

" my DS knows a lot about struggle. Has he struggled in terms of nowhere to live, or no support from family? No, but every day is a struggle for him, more so than I can ever understand, I think. His childhood was extremely difficult."

You described my sons life every single day. Every time he has to leave the classroom to go to the resource room, so his test can be read to him, every time he has to stay after school to be tutored and the other kids know it, every time he says to me "mom, why can't I just be normal like brian?".i could go on and on, but I've written enough of a novel.

Sueb. Follow your gut. You've done things right so far.

Roselvr,

Our school psychologist told me she thought my son had Aspergers as well, after her testing and observation. I promptly came home from that meeting and ran into the wall of the garage with my car, lol.

It was ruled out by the phD that I hired to do further extensive testing.

Thanks for sharing so much.

I'm back! And there are so many responses here and I'm limited for time, so I can't respond to everyone individually. However, kswl, thanks for the info on that program -- you have to be over 21 to apply. He's only 20. Also, he is so focused on post-production, I don't think the AD role is necessarily for him. Thank you, though!

And thanks to everyone else. Red lover, our kids sound somewhat similar! Briefly -- my DS was basically kicked out of kindergarten by our very rigid public elementary school principal. He went to a therapeutic elementary school til he was 12, then a nightmarish middle school, and finally a "regular" private high school that was open to kids w/ learning differences. When he was in kindergarten the dr. we saw thought he had Aspergers. In 1st grade, when he was in the therapeutic school, they said no way is he on the autism spectrum, but he has a general anxiety disorder. It wasn't until HS that he was diagnosed with ADD, and at the time, THAT dr. said the anxiety was probably brought on by the ADD. Finally, after he dropped out of college we saw yet another highly-regarded dr. who diagnosed him with the executive functioning disorder and said he could have told us that college would be a disaster. Well, thanks. Okay, so that is the very short story of his life. We are really lucky that he decided at age 13 that he had a passion and has stuck to it all this time. And also lucky that we have found (college level) educational programs that have been fantastic experiences for him.

Anyway, here is what we've decided to do -- baby steps. I can't remember if I already said this, but once he started working a bit, we told him transportation costs are now up to him. So that was one small step. (He does not have a car and uses the bus and/or train or subway to get everywhere -- fortunately all are nearby, and we live close to Boston). As of Jan. 1, he will start paying his cell phone bill. It is on a family plan so he will pay his portion to us. It's a basic, inexpensive plan, maybe $30 or something. (DH pays the bill so I'm not 100% sure.) Then, next step will be rent, as of April 1 probably. It won't be high. Maybe $50 a month. I think my goal is mainly to get him to understand that he has to start getting used to paying bills (i.e., the not-fun stuff) first, then figure out what he has left over for the fun stuff. But I like the idea someone had of increasing it every 3 or 6 months. And if he is unable to pay these bills on the money he has coming in from film/video work, then yes, we have talked about the fact that he may have to get some kind of night job to supplement his income. He was open to it, but he hasn't made any steps toward doing it. The big problem with a kid like him is that he can talk the talk, but he doesn't (or can't) walk the walk! We can sit with him and talk about all the things he should do, and he says, Oh yes, good idea, I'll do that... and then it never happens. We have been trying to have "meetings" with him on a regular basis so we can check in and remind him of his to-do list.

One good thing that's been happening is that he has hooked up with these two guys who graduated from the film program he also graduated from -- they are both older, one in his mid-late 20s and one in his early 30s -- who are in the beginning stages of putting together a production company, and they want him on board as much as possible. He has done one music video with them for an up-and-coming (according to DS) hip hop band -- DS did some camera work and the editing -- and this weekend is starting work on another video for another band. DS is really into music, so I have often thought music video work would be right up his alley. Anyway, who knows where this could lead. These guys seem to be real go-getters. Also, he did another project for this woman who turned out to be really difficult, gave him incorrect instructions that led to him having to talk to a TV person out in CA to sort things out, and then her check (to pay him) bounced! The good news about that mess is that I overheard his conversations with both the client and the TV person, and he was so professional. So -- he's certainly not a hopeless case. It is hard -- and has always been hard -- to figure out what he is and is not capable of. You talk to him and he is SO smart and articulate that it's easy to forget that he has a lot of wires crossed in that brain of his!

And for those who asked about therapy. Yes, we are actually in the process of finding a new psychiatrist as the last (current) one turned out to be kind of a dud, and he is located too far from us to be convenient. My son's PCP gave us a list of names and I consulted with DS over which one he wanted to try -- there was a woman, an older man, and a younger man, and he felt that he could relate best to the younger guy, so I'm calling him this week. We have also seen an executive functioning specialist in the past, but after several weekly meetings, DS refused to go because she was "condescending." He's at the age where we can offer help, but we can't force him to accept it. Every so often we remind him that we are willing to pay for that kind of help if he wants it...

This was longer than I intended but I wanted to fill in some of the blanks. Thanks again for all of your thoughtful input.

Red Lover; I don't understand what chord I struck; but I'm glad that you shared. I also dislike this board being so public; I could have written a lot more. Aspergers was not even considered with her because she was early with a lot & typically did not fit. I've been very upfront about my nephew who is diagnosed; as well as all family history; so it really could have been a combo of all. There are also undiagnosed mood disorders; unfortunately; the person that she's the most like is deceased & was never diagnosed.

In your case; you had someone rule it out; but please keep it in the back of your mind because if he is a mild case; you may not be sure for a few years. She has seen a psych since 4th grade; he's trained with Autism/Aspergers & missed it. She was 15 when I started noticing it a lot that I realized how wrong the psych was; but my hub was just diagnosed with cancer. I had better confirmation when she did something stupid last year & was under watch; the head psych also felt her DX is wrong.

I now know the lack of friends is due to it because she can cover herself when she meets new people but when she gets comfortable; all bets are off & you can tell she's not as mature as her peers. She's always had signs- no one can touch her hair; certain socks; shoes & clothes.

As for the job; how much of it did you hear for yourself because I've been down that road where she makes something sound definite but it really was not; it was more of a conversation on what they should do & no money was involved either; so he could be hearing things different then what was actually said. As I said; mine was early with everything; walked before 9 months; rode 2 wheeled bike a few months before her 3rd birthday & was always sociable & actually has to be around people. We've had school issues since 2nd or 3rd grade (could be earlier); I know she has sensory issues but there's always been more that I could never put my finger on. The biggest confirmation for me was an email from my friend who's son is the same age; but he's been diagnosed for years. I could have written everything in her email & this is where I'm curious if your son is similar too.

I'll try to write more later; Sue has replied too since I started writing right after you posted. I'm having one of those days.

Sue; if you'd like to email me; I'd be happy to compare our kids; mine is 19; so they're the same age. I wonder how similar they are?

rose, my DS can't remember to brush his teeth in the morning but he is pretty meticulous about things that are important to him. He had instructions in writing from this woman -- asked her specifically "Are you sure you want it in this format? People don't really use this format any more." Yes, she assured him, do it in that format. So he did, and then the people from CA called him and said, what the heck, this is not the format we wanted. Of course. So yes, it was in writing and he followed her instructions but then ended up having to reformat the DVD and fedex it to CA. Long story but in this case, he was following instructions.

Sue; when I mentioned the job; I meant the new one from the part I pasted in below.

One good thing that's been happening is that he has hooked up with these two guys who graduated from the film program he also graduated from -- they are both older, one in his mid-late 20s and one in his early 30s -- who are in the beginning stages of putting together a production company, and they want him on board as much as possible. He has done one music video with them for an up-and-coming (according to DS) hip hop band -- DS did some camera work and the editing -- and this weekend is starting work on another video for another band.

Oh, that job. Well, no promises have been made; they just told him they'd like him to work with them whenever possible. He's done one music video with them, and he did get paid -- not a lot, but something. Now that the band has ok'd the video, he will get paid more and his name will be on the credits. He's working with these guys again this weekend. So it's nothing steady, but it's something. We just need to push him to look for other jobs as well. I think part of him is just scared about getting out there. Again -- baby steps!

Of course he's afraid to make the step to get out there. Who wouldn't be in this economy. You know your son; know what you have to do on your end to get him to take the steps. I know what I go through with my daughter but with baby sitting & other jobs that never come. She tells me she's putting apps in but there's never any call backs. I went as far as to log into each site & she did. It's a horrible job market out there; most places do not do paper apps any more. Gone are the days where someone hired you because they liked your personality when you applied in store.

I've been reading a lot about college & various job markets; I'll have to see if I can find the link because most people that go to college will not find a job in their field. You would not believe the people swimming in student loan debt who want to file bankruptcy but can't because student loans can't be included in bankruptcy. I'm straying.. but you're lucky he decided not to go to college but instead go to film school; that decision saved him a lot of money in the long run.

Hopefully he'll be motivated to try to find a part time job for the holiday; whether this or next; he may end up one of the lucky ones that are hired on that way. My daughter has not been lucky with that either.

I can't believe I typed this out the other night & never hit submit! lol

Great thread. I had not checked back in because I am on grandma duty. Now have my first grandchild--a boy. And have been at daughters house for almost 2 weeks.

Thanks for the info rose lover re: Aspergers. Son has lots of sensory issues with foods and does have some stimming on occasion when anxious?? Who knows.
Sorry about your dhs dx.

Sueb. I hope my son is lucky enough to find a "passion" for something that will lead to a productive life, as early as your son did. My son also has anxiety disorder and i was told that it often co-exist with ADHD. All of his dx were made early. Sounds like your persistence finally paid off. The schools cooperation means so much....

Sounds like you have some good strategies.

My son won't brush his teeth either unless reminded.

Steve Jobs was put on night shift because his coworkers couldn't stand his lack of personal hygiene, lol.

My theory is simple. In order to allow my adult children freedom to be who they are destined to be, I must continually throw them out of the nest.

Brushing teeth is optional.

I came back to this thread because our daughter is visiting for about a month. She wanted to take some time between her job in Miami and the new one in California---she will still be living in Florida and commuting four days a week to Santa Clara. I worry that she is not organized enough to live in two different time zones, that she's a terrible packer (undeniable fact), that she will run herself ragged with the schedule she keeps, etc. It astounds and worries me that people are willing to pay her to fly back and forth, and that this will suddenly end with her unemployed. I am concerned that her field is so esoteric that there's no future in it, that she will somehow render her own self obsolete. I worry that she is not worried enough!

My point, of course, is that parents of adult kids worry about a lot of the same issues regardless of what specific problems or issues the child has. It's been a joy to have her here, but I can see that if she were to actually move in we would have to have a frank discussion about her laundry, dishes and the general detritus she leaves in her wake. But I think I would love it if she came home to live, at least for a little while----one last chance for the kind of everyday time we haven't shared since she went away to boarding school as a teen. She hasnt lived at home since and she's now 25.

I hope you really enjoy this time with your son at home, Sueb, and look back on it as a precious interlude in your lives!

So I haven't seen Max in a few months before he came to THE party. He and his wife spent two nights at the lodge and when it came time to leave (at 6AM Sunday), he realized he left something on in his car so it would not start. He called a tow truck.

Yes, my brilliant boy has issues too. But he copes. Didn't even wake anyone up to jump start his car. That is what I mean by constantly throwing them out of the nest. They will learn the way they were meant to learn.