Well, it drives me bonkers that the fast food joints automatically put onions on burgers. I really dislike raw onions and the whole thing tastes like onions even if you get the juice on one.

And I stopped going to subway because they don't carry swiss cheese and well, they're not really very good. The other sub place, who's name just went right out of my head, is much better and they do spread the mayo/mustard on the bread. And toast it.

Beth

Love oil & vinegar on my sub but don't want oiled & vinegared bread so Subway's system works for me.

Subway's sandwich is a poor excuse for a sub IMO and it's not just about how they apply the mayo.

Jim

Spreading the condiemtns would require spreaders and all the handling they require. Squeezing somehting out of a bottle is faster and the product is exposed less to potential contamination. (Which, IMO, is a load of hooey. Take the time to properly train staff and it shouldn't be an issue.)

Beth, I agree. Onions should be optional. Even more annoying to me, though, is trying to get a burger WITHOUT cheese. I thought that's why they were called HAMBURGER and CHEESEBURGER, so it would be obvious whether one wanted cheese. I can "no cheese" as much as I want, but it's always on the blasted burger.

"Even more annoying to me, though, is trying to get a burger WITHOUT cheese."

Annoying it right! That and trying to get a martini, which is NOT a vodka martini.

I can get a hamburger where I go, but not without a discussion over it. The same goes for the martini.

Jim

I don't like onions on my cheeseburgers, always order them without, and they never get it wrong. One of my kids orders his the same way, and his is always correct. Maybe it's just the places that you frequent, but we never have a problem.

Here's another who is sorry indeed that a hamburger suddenly became a cheeseburger by the hamburger name no matter where you go. I love cheese, just not on my burger please! And I hate those huge pieces of onions they automatically put on every hamburger. And even if I wanted cheese, I wouldn't want the junk cheese they put on there. Oh wait a minute, the burger is junk food anyway. Think I'll go to Quizno's from now on.

It doesn't matter where I go, fast food chain or local diner or moderately-nice restaurant. It's gotten to the point where it's a running joke with all our friends. They get the "no onions" right most of the time, but there's no getting away without the cheese. I've even had servers read the order back to me. Then when they bring the burger out and I point out the cheese, they just look incredulous at it.

But back to Subway. Not a place I usually care for, but if we're traveling, we'll grab lunch at one rather than stop at the burger joints. A while back, I had a two-hour wait for a ride one day, and the Subway across from the high school was the least unhealthy place to grab some lunch. The store was extrememly busy (the manager said it's like that every weekday), and the sandwich was the best I've ever had at a Subway -- very fresh. I don't know that I'd go out of my way to eat there, but there's worse lunches to be had by far.

Subways here are pretty good, and they put the sauce on last, so it's on top of the salad.

For sub sandwiches, we skip Subway & Quiznos and go directly to Publix deli. They are the least expensive, and much better quality. And they will put the oil & vinegar in a little container for you to take and apply as you wish. If you have Publix in your area, do yourself a service and try them.

I actually like Subway. Really like their Italian herbs and cheese bread. I would not want my "sauce" on the bread, cause I have them toast my sub and don't want the condiment toasted. They toast before putting on all the veggies. Maybe you could ask them to put the mayo on first?

I haven't eaten at Subway in years. I honestly can't figure out what makes them so popular. Their bread is bland and the fillings are boring. The only thing that gives the sandwich flavor is the oil & vinegar or whatever it is they glop on at the end. Have you ever tasted the meat or cheese on its own? Do they have any real flavor? Apologies to those of you who like Subway, I just don't get it!

There are two places I frequent for ready made sandwiches. Schlotszky's and Jimmy John's. Do y'all have those? I know Schlotszky's started in Texas so I don't know how far out they go but their bread is wonderful (and the bread can make or break the sandwich IMO). Jimmy John's is relatively new around here, but pretty darn good!

I'm not a Subway fan either, though I do have to eat there sometimes. If I have to eat a sandwich I try to get to Quizno's most of the time.

Schlotszky's is very popular here. I don't like Schlotszky's at all because to me their so-called sourdough bread is more like cornbread.

I never heard of Jimmy John's. We have Firehouse Subs. Anyone have those? I'd still rather have Quizno's.

They just recently opened up a bunch of Firehouse subs near me. Two within a five minute drive of my office. Went there once and it was OK. I plan to go there at least two more times to try different sandwiches but if they are not better than the first one I had I'll probably cross it off my list. I figure sometimes it depends on which sandwich you get as to what you think of a sandwich place.

At Schlotszky's I always get the jalepe cheese bread. I've never tried their sourdough.

We had Schlotszky's here, there were a couple in Grand Rapids, but they went out of business, mostly because the service was slow and the sandwiches were terrible, but the soup was OK. I think Quizno's is OK, there was one locally but it went out of business too, only lasted about 3 months.

The only fast food place in White Cloud is a Subway, of course. Ashley loves the toasted subs they sell, I don't eat there because I can taste the preservatives they put on all the vegetables.

There is a pizza joint here in town that sells pretty good subs, at least they used to, it's called WhataPizza. I haven't actually eaten one there in at least three or four years.

We also have a Mancino's locally, and a Jimmy John's. I've never been to Jimmy John's and Mancino's is just OK.

Now that I think about it, I'm probably not a good example because I'm not really crazy for sandwiches, whether made at home, at chain places or in restaurants. Once a year I get the free lobster club for my birthday at Blue Water Grill, but once a year is enough. I'll have a chili dog once a year and occasionally a greasy bar burger but I'll bet I don't eat more than 6 sandwiches a year, probably not that many.

Annie

The sourdough buns at the Schlotszky's here is truly real sour dough.
It is delicious.
True, they do apparently put corn meal on whatever it is they bake their buns on, as there is a bit of corn meal on the bottom of the buns.
But the buns bear no relation at all to any corn bread I've ever had.
And here there is a LOT of corn bread.
I do believe that there can be a big difference in chains like that, depending on the cooks, etc.

When Subway first opened here, I wanted to try them.
Everything on their menu had bologna on it.
I HATE bologna, so I asked them if I could have one without it.
Sure, they took the bologna off, but did they replace it with anything?
Nope.
So I had a practically meatless sandwich.
And I have never gone back.
Never will, either, if I have any choice in the matter.

Rusty

To experience a great sub, get one from either DiBella's or Wegman's, both Rochester, NY based but expanding to other places. DiBell's is in the process of opening stores in the Cleveland area. DiBella's set the standard and Wegman's followed. Subway bears no resemblance to either of these nor does Quiznos, IIRC. I just remember being disappointed with Quiznos.

If you are travelling the NYS Thruway, both DiBella's and Wegman's are easy off, easy on at the Rte. 15 Rochester interchange.

Jim

beanthere dunthat: You are correct, I read elsewhere in a forum re: Subway that it had to do with handling and potential contamination.

annie1992 is also correct, it takes too much time and there is ALWAYS a line for that $5 sub, but I will agree with most that say that the breads are a bit bland. It is only the price that has lured me there to begin with, but I have
always gotten the sandwich to go and put the mayo and mustard on the bread when I get home.

The problem which I think will basically address all of the issues, is that Subway is a franchise and the workers are taught to deal with the public based on a script. Have you ever walked in and all of a sudden you here "Hello, welcome to Subway" and you look around wondering which one of the college students making the sandwiches said the hello?

Give me a diner, drive-in or dive any day, run by a mom and pop where you get a huge hello, your order as you like it and worth the wait and a more natural feeling because the employees are not talking from a rehearsed script.

On another subject, I took a seasonal job as a checker at Von's a couple of years ago, and unlike some of the other grocery chains, I was rated on how many times I asked
the shoppers if they would like to donate to a cause. The supervisors would hide behind the cereal display that was advertised as sale, just to spy on the checker's,
then those that stock the shelves will ask you if you found what you are looking for and if not, they are taught and told to say "may I take you there"? I just
hated the scripting, and worse yet when the Supervisors and Managers will all of a sudden ask as checker to take a break so they can 'work' the check stand near you
so they can see and hear how you handle the customers. They never had me fooled, needless to say I just couldn't work there after the season.

Maybe I need to join Flo over at Progressive, where I can be myself- LOLLL

I've never been a fan of any of the Sub sandwich places.

I have the same complaint with the burger joints. I order mine without ketchup , but with extra tomatoes. And I'm always asked if I want cheese. Wouldn't I order a cheese burger if I wanted cheese?

Ann

I sent this question to my sister that has several Subway stores in East Texas and this is her reply. Thought it might be interesting.

Actually,......any non oil or clear based sauce is to go on the meat......three stripes of it.... That would be the mustard and mayo products.

Yes we do not spread the stripes together. The reason the oil or clear base goes on to the veggies is that the substance oozes into the veggies and holds. No sauces go on the breads for the reason of soggy and for clumping....that is it would not be smooth or would get on the edges of the bread.....

As Franchisees we are graded monthly that our employees are doing it correctly.

My sister & BIL were owners in Idaho & Montana of several franchises selling the famous (or infamous?) fried chicken with the special spices. They, obviously, did not serve subs but I know that how their employees served meals was very strictly monitored & pre-determined by the corporate office. Many an employee was fired for not scooping the 'taters correctly. When I owned the A&W we would often discuss how difficult it was to get employees to strictly follow set procedures. As a franchise, we also had to be rigid in how our product(s) was prepared & served. If an employee thought a procedure was "dumb" or "unnecessary" they often disregarded instructions. There really are reasons behind sometimes strange processess...usually sanitation and/or to maintain standardized quality reasons.

At our A&W, I also would "work" the middle window to monitor how employees on either side handled customers. Unfortunately, in the case of fast food, it was also to slow down the incidence of theft. A terrible problem in the industry. Many fast food restaurants hire teenagers. They would push "free" food out the windows at alarming rates & $20 bills were slipped from the cash registers to their friends adeptly stuck to the bottom of a cardboard box full of French fries.

One of our local grocery stores (we have 2 local stores) hires mentally challenged young adults. I admire management of that store tremendously. It takes an enormous amount of work, patience, & constant reforcement to run that store with their employee set. While I admire them...as a customer, I sure never expect to get a question answered. Trade-off, I guess.

Ann T, at the A&W we always had our window staff ask if a customer wanted cheese...no matter what they ordered on their hamburger. Too many orders returned with the customer insisting they'd ordered cheese & really had not....would have fired an employee who consistently failed to ask.

I'm sure our employees thought we were horrible people due to the way we constantly monitored their behavior(s). Even with rigid supervision & emptying cash drawers every 45 minutes or so on an irregular schedule we still lost $1K+/month to theft. Those employees are so difficult to manage. We needed a couple dozen employees during lunch & dinner rushes. We had to have 50 available due to "no shows". It's not an easy business.

Most fast foods try to accommodate special orders but it's a fine line for the staff to alter a standard procedure for the customer & violating company policy. So, yes, they are scripted & closely monitored. A safety violation can close a business down overnight. Remember the contaminated green onions at Taco Bell? That cost millions in lost business...some of it permanently.

Tough business. It's the nature of the beast that you'll never please everybody largely due to rigid standards/policies/procedures. As consumers, we complain loudly when there's a problem &, I suppose, rightly so. But, IMO, it's a miracle that there are not more problems considering the huge quantities of food sold through fast food joints every day. Since we're not all getting sick the procedures must work...mostly.

/tricia

It's interesting to get the perspective from the other side of the counter. I have come to expect the "you want fries with that?" type of question from fast food places and it doesn't really bother me. It's clear that the workers are told to ask all those "extras" questions.

But I was at a regular restaurant the other day, order at the counter and pick up your food, but reasonably nice - not fast food. And the guy at the register pulled that on me twice! Once, ok, but after I'd refused the first offer, whatever he was pushing, he asked didn't I want some other specific item! I was like, is it ok if I just get what I've already ordered and nothing else? Oy, I was not impressed.

So there we have it. Thanks, aclifton, for getting it from the source. :) I knew there had to be a logical reason.

Subways are ubiquitous primarily because it's a relatively inexpensive franchise to buy into. And like any franchise, they are very strict about protecting their concept. The product ideally is to taste the same at every location every day. You have to micromanage every aspect of every process to even stand a chance of making that happen.
Restaurant and fast food chains really are not in the hospitality industry (although they like to say they are); they are in manufacturing. The same process applies to making burgers or subs as applies to assembling widgets. I don't expect a lot from such places because I know the old rule of "Fast, cheap, quality -- pick two because you can never have all three at the same time." If you want it fast and cheap, don't expect quality.

Tricia, is there anything you have not done or are an expert on? You must have cloned yourself or be immortal. LOL! How wonderful to have had such an intersting life.

Tried Schlotszky's somewhere back east and didn't find it much better than Subway. DH used to eat at the ones in TX years ago and says it was not as good as it used to be. Our Quizmo's went out of business recently. (Annie, they lasted all of a year here. There's a more local chain in the next town, but they consistantly score low on health inspections and the service is bad. We used to grab lunch at ToGo's in CA, which was decent. It's not like I'll go out of my way looking for a sub anyway, but I'll go to Subway before other fast food places just to find lunch that isn't deep fried. Probably the best sandwiches in tow are at the Raley's deli.

Hey, Michiganders! There is a DiBella's sub shop in Ann Arbor!

Also Cleveland, Pittsburg and Buffalo.

Those other sub shops will not be able to compete with DiBella's in those locations. I'm very sure of that.

Jim

Here is a link that might be useful: DiBella's locations

Sigh. But then there's the local sub place that was fabulous. Crusty but bitable bakery bread delivered every morning. Everything to order. Cranky owner/counterman ladling on the political yawping with the pepperoncini. Highest quality ingredients. An institution. Then one day they had different bread. The bakery is still there so I don't know why. Then they were gone.

Whether it's the franchise or the one off, changing things that people are used to can be the way to close down in a hurry...

Jim, I'll have to check that out, we were just in Ann Arbor Saturday and I think that's pretty close to Trader Joe's.

They'll have to compete with Zingerman's Deli if they are in Ann Arbor. That's another place I want to go to, but haven't made it yet.

Annie

I happen to like Subway, primarily because it isn't fried food, and because they are willing to squirt light mayo on the bread for me before adding the main part of the sandwich. I hope they wouldn't get in trouble for providing that service, which is as much a part of the food business as the food is.

We have Quizno's in Baltimore, but I have yet to go to one that felt as clean as the Subways; maybe Quizno's color scheme is darker. I like their food, just not the feeling I get in their stores. Their wall menus are in very fine type, which is also annoying; we have to read the printed take-out menu to decide what to order.

In the mid-80's we took a long car trip to Iowa, avoiding interstates as much as possibles. Our kids, then 4 and 7, thought Subway was The Best in every town. We loved it for them because they ordered extra lettuce, tomatoes, and other good things on their sandwiches -- but they would never order a salad at a sit-down restaurant.

Subway doesn't taste anything like the upstate NY subs that I grew up eating but it is a pretty good sandwich. I love that you can load up on veggies. There aren't many places where you can add lettuce, tomato, onion plus green peppers, cucumber, carrots and spinach. Add some pepperoncini and I'm a happy camper.

Last month we had to spend the weekend in Ft. Myers (where I have always said I wouldn't go in the Spring months). Anyway, we went to SEVEN restaurants and not one had seating times less than an hour wait. We gave up and stopped at a Subway for sandwiches to take back to our hotel. I have them occasionally but these were unlike any I've had. They were very good, very fresh! Two mature, responsive Indian gentlemen waited on us, I think they were the franchisees.

I make my own sandwiches with bread that I bake and turkey breast that I smoke myself, and I often use pickles that I make myself. I mix my own smoked Habanero sauce with mayonnaise for the sandwich, and I do put it on the bread, but the bread I make does not get soggy. However I do toast it first. I have a professional meat slicer that will slice meat any thickness I want, and this gives me a lot more control over my sandwich. I buy sliced cheese, however, just for convenience.

I used to go toan Armenian deli in Houston (when I lived there) that made very good Po' Boys, and I used to get great Muffuletta sandwiches at Central Grocery in the French Quarter of New Orleans. Normally, I do not go to sandwich shops - at least not lately, except to get falafel or some other Middle Eastern sandwich on pita bread.

Here in Florida Publix deli beats the Subway hands down. They make it exactly how you want it, and they have those to-die-for Italian multi-grain subs. I haven't been to a Subway in years since I'm close to a Publix.

I've only eaten Subway food once. (I am so not a fan of thick wads of tasteless bread, so subs are not my go-to-food-of choice -- for my sandwiches I like toast from loaves of quality). I did wonder about that mustard being in the middle -- but it did make it easier to dispose of that excess bread (the wad on top).

I haven't tried any of the other sub places - most of them aren't in my area, anyway. I think we have a Quiznos. I'm not crazy about over-processed deli meats (oh, much as I do love pepperoni and hard salami, I try to limit that!) The veggie selection at Subway didn't look good that day.

I guess my chain of choice on the road is Panera's -- I get a soup (black bean is great) and salad (Cobb or Greek, dresssing on the side) and call it good. Currently they also have a quinoa lentil kale soup bowl with an optional hard boiled egg, which I also like.

My first job was at subway. I worked there for 4 years. The answer is in their sandwich building formula. Bread first then meat then cheese then toppings. They have an assembly line type model. It's very efficient. A lot(and i MEAN ALOT) of people would ask me to put mayo or mustard on the bread before I did anything else. That's all you have to do. The closing of the sandwich spread the mayo fairly evenly. I haven't eaten there since I stopped working there and never ate their before I started working there. I don't get the appeal. But at least you can watch them make it and tell them how you want it done. I would rather make my own.

You guys are so lucky to have such choices. What if you don't have any choices. ? I for one want to know if Subway still have the problem with the preservation of the veggies. Also, what the heck has happened to Bob Evans.? It used to be one of the best places but anymore their chicken pie is lousy and they have changed their salads. If they don't straighten up, they will be another one out of business. It I knew where to complain to their head office, I surely would. We need that place badly, but they won't make it with the type of food they are serving now. Barb

Subway is a poor excuse for a sandwich, as McDonalds is a poor excuse for a hamburger, it's just another fast food place...

A true "sub" from an Italian deli would never have mayonnaise or mustard on it... oil and vinegar only

I think it might be a regional thing, Cookncarpenter. We had a marvelous one off submarine place near where I grew up. The owner was a character, and it had all the ambiance of a 1970's bus station snack bar, but the food was awesome. He contracted crusty, two foot long bread from a local French bakery, and all the ingredients were top notch. Mustard and mayonnaise were standard, though, of course, you could get it how you wanted it. Not "Italian" submarines but West Coast ones. Submarines (the word he used for them) nonetheless.

Barb, we have a local Bob Evans, and it wasn't bad, my Dad liked to go there for catfish. Then the food got awful and the parking lot was always empty. Then they fired a bunch of people, got some new cooks and the food was OK again. It's chain restaurant food, but Elery likes to go out for breakfast, so sometimes we end up there. I'm just as happy with a cinnamon roll or piece of pie for breakfast, but restaurant eggs are restaurant eggs. (shrug) I won't eat their meat but their potatoes are passable. So, anyway, maybe YOUR Bob Evans just needs a new cook!

Here we have Firehouse Subs and Mancino's. Amanda likes Mancino's because they have gluten free sub buns and it's the only place I've seen that does. I've only eaten at Firehouse Subs once, and it was OK. When I eat at Subway I throw the top bun into the chicken's bucket, it's too much bread and I hate the taste of all the preservatives they put on their vegetables, so I stick with dill pickles, leaf spinach, maybe some sliced onions if I feel up to the heartburn. Of course, I have two nieces who work at Subway, so I go there maybe once a year. I tried Jimmy John's once with Bud. Even if it's "freaky fast", it's still just another cold sandwich, the allure of that one escapes me.

And I don't like vinegar and oil on anything, including salad. Sorry cookncarpenter. I want mustard or horseradish, occasionally mayo.

I did get the winter squash soup at our local Panera once, and it was OK. Their pastries are outrageously expensive and not as good as the local bakery, VanBrocklin's, which was voted one of the 10 best donuts in Michigan.

Annie

I used to manage the Subway store years and years ago. I was 19 and in college. I can tell you they don’t put any condiments on the sandwich on purpose – it’s company and franchise policy

They do this because every sandwich is made to your specifications… You tell them exactly how you want to sandwich or sandwiches as they make it… So if you want mayonnaise you simply tell them… Same with oil and vinegar… Or mustard or whatever the condiments they have

They also do it because if they put any sort of condiments on the bread without asking people tend to get very angry… There are many people who don’t like mayonnaise… There are many people who are watching their weight and don’t want extra fat in the diet and want mustard or other type of low-fat condiments… But what it really boils down to is you, the customer, are supposed to customize your subway sandwiches

No I can understand if it’s a different type of sandwich shop… Or restaurant… Maybe even a fast food hamburger place… However, in my opinion, no condiments be put on any type of sandwich, or hamburger and the people making it should always ask what you want on it… No condiment should ever be put on by default… For example I only like mayonnaise on sandwiches… I think mayonnaise on hamburgers is the most disgusting thing ... hamburgers are already greasy… Adding mayonnaise, to me, is just like adding more grease

Hi David, it's good of you to drag up an ancient thread, but I think you misunderstood the question. The question as I see it was, why do they not put the mayo on _first_ so it can be spread over the bread, rather than squirt it on last? None of us can see a reason for the procedure being this way around, unless the suggestions about possible contamination and extra time to spread rather than squirt are in fact the answer.

I know this is a very old thread (on which I made a couple of posts back in the day!) but I'm just now seeing Lars' comment posted back in January 2016.

Lars, Antone's is still around. You can now pick up their sandwiches in many grocery stores as well. I haven't had one in years but yeah, they were always delicious. I remember when they were 50 cents for the regular and 60 cents for the super back in the 60s. Prices have gone up since then! LOL.

I was thinking about you when I wrote that post about Antone's! I have very fond memories of going there. It was a great place to go as a college kid. We also used to go to Alfred's deli in the Village, just a few blocks from Rice, but I know that's not there anymore. They made the best corned beef and pastrami that I had had at that time. Alfred's sandwiches were huge.

I'd love to revisit Central Grocery in New Orleans as well. I told my sister that we might go back to Texas in 2020 (as it is a nice round number), but we might actually go back before that. I want to go back to Houston and New Orleans. I have not even seen the latest buildings at Rice, notably Duncan Hall.

Anyone ever been to a real honesttogod Italian sub?, south side gangster run and frequented shop that sells those long sandwiches? No mayo....no mustard....never ever! Just meat, capiocola, proscuto, salami, provolone, ham, red onion, tomato lettuce, maybe some hot pickled peppers, all drizzled with good olive oil and sprinkled with oregano!....OMG!!

I love Subway, but wish they would offer a 3 or 4 inch. Sub. I can't finish a 6 inch. That said, i go for all the toppings except the jalapeño peppers.

Lindac, you'd be happy here- lots of places do Italian subs as you describe. As well as pickled peppers I like sliced olives and melanzane on mine :-)

LindaC, now you're talking Elery's language. He spent his teen years working in a small neighborhood grocery owned by an Italian family. Now we sometimes go to GB Russo's and he gets a sandwich from the deli, much like you describe, but with a special "dressing" that seems a lot like vinegar and oil with herbs to me. The capicola is too spicy, the raw onions give me heartburn, even if I pick off the hot peppers the residue remains and I don't like vinegar and oil dressing, LOL. So, I'll pass, but Ashley and Elery think they've gone just this side of heaven. (grin) Ashley likes the addition of mortadella on hers, and as far as I can see, that's bologna!

I've had Jimmy John's once and that was enough, and the only sub joints here now that I've moved is Subway, Mancino's and Jimmy John's. They all have way too much bread and not enough "stuff", so if there's no other choice I'll throw away the top half of the bread and eat the rest of the sandwich. I do the same thing with most restaurant sandwiches anyway, everything now has seemed to go to "artisan" bread and it's inches thick, far more bread than filling.

Annie

Best sandwiches back in Northern California were from Ike's. Dutch crunch rolls.... yum!

Now we live in the land of hoagies. Even Wawa makes a great sandwich, exactly like you want it, from the touchscreen board. 4" rolls? Got it. No onions? Got it. O&V? Got it. Or however else you want it.

Not to take away from a 100 other way-above-average places. But Wawa is quite amazing.

What I miss are the Dutch crunch rolls and real crusty sourdough rolls.

I just got a sub opened it while side dry as ever had put mayonnaise on it got home

Sauces, mayonnaise, mustard,

( always go's the bread ) don't ruin sandwich

so 14 years ago ...

now days, just ask and they will do it your way.

I just thought of something... Because the condiments usually protect the bread from too much moisture, rather than making it fall apart. Perhaps they do sog up the house made bread (which may still be damp inside), But it could be something they don't want to say: if they put the mayo and mustard in the center, where there's nothing to absorb them, they'll ooze out a but and give you concentrated flavor, meaning you'll have a particular experience of them, rather than background, and they can use less because they don't have to cover the bread, and you'll taste more while being given less.