Life Expectancy of an HVAC System?
friedajune
16 years ago
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bob_brown
16 years agoRelated Discussions
Extreme Price Difference on 'same' HVAC System
Comments (12)Thanks again. I feel we fall somewhere in the middle of your two descriptions. Our design was created with Southern exposure, solar gain, ample overhang, high efficiency, quality construction, etc. in mind. Architecture and aesthetics undoubtedly played a major role. I don't think we will be LEED certified but it is not your average house. That being said, we did not begin with our expected monthly utility bill as the basis for design. I think we have been reasonably responsible with our design choices thus far. Hence the Geo system. I, not knowing the trade inside and out, am just trying to get the most comfort (and pleasure) out of our system. I think that the higher end system will, without a doubt, provide the level I expect. What I am trying to glean is the sacrifices we would make if we spend less. I realize that the desuper heater and boiler will provide more consistent heat in the basement and that it will also be a more efficient back up/supplemental heat on the very cold days. The question becomes how much less comfortable will the basement be? How many days a year will we need the supplemental heat and is it worth the extra expense. How much better is an Infinity Carrier air handler than the Trane air handler? Will it be noticeably better? I need someone who knows to help me answer these questions. We are not against spending the money if the differences are going to be compromises we regret but we don't know how to figure that out before hand......See MoreHave you switched from traditional HVAC to Geothermal HVAC?
Comments (19)I'm disappointed that what had at first seemed a very balanced comment was followed by what seems to be misinformation and misdirection. People buy ground source heat pump equipment because they want to and can afford it. Or decide they need to in their locations. They're hugely more expensive than alternatives, which is why they're still not very common. "When’s the payback on a Tesla? People still choose to buy them for reasons other than the ‘bottom line’." Not a comparable. A false analogy. "I would not choose natural gas or propane for reasons relating to the environment, safety, IAQ & paying for yet another utility hookup for an energy source that might not even be used for months on end during the year." What effect having a gas furnace has on indoor air quality. Another hookup? Most people prefer gas cooking appliances and besides, the OP is talking about an existing home, he either has gas service or he doesn't. "Rather than spending perhaps tens of thousands of dollars on a Solar Array, I would sooner invest that same money, hopefully less, in a ground loop for a Geothermal system." Sure you would, that's the business you're in. The ground source heat pump market is not growing as expected by those in the industry, which suggests that your opinion isn't widely held or easily sellable. In many parts of the country, solar panels can have a quick payback. Not so ground source heat pumps. "I often hear about Solar Panels when geothermal is mentioned, as an alternative way to save money by creating energy." In a place like Texas, where electricity is cheap (other than during cold weather crises as they just experienced) there's likely no payback from a solar panel installation. People do it as a personal statement, call it for environmental or other personal reasons. Like buying the Tesla, not a financial decision. An HVAC system blows warm air when it's cold, cool air when it's hot. It's one of those things people don't care about - either it works or it doesn't work. Spending extra money for an exotic system doesn't equate to extra payback when the home is sold. Neither owners, nor visitors, nor people passing by, nor anyone else, concern themselves with what's doing the work. It's equipment that doesn't produce an experience for someone in the house if it's working. In the US, there are vast areas where electricity is cheap. It will remain so for some time. People don't spend money today to potentially save money 10 years out when market conditions may or may be different. I suspect you could build a house with mahogany or teak framing. Or you could paint the framing bright colors. Why bother, you can spend less money and effort and get something else that will do the same job. "We almost never use setbacks at our home - even when going on vacation for weeks on end with no one home, our geothermal just runs." You're combining two different things to produce confusion. Thermostats that have a setback feature ALL are set up to provide lower overnight temperatures to have more comfortable sleeping conditions and then a recovery in the morning before wakeup time. As sleep specialists recommend. That in demand comfort features isn't possible with ground source heat pumps because the warm up period from a setback is too slow to be convenient to use, absent triggering a secondary heating source (like a furnace) to help. THAT'S why you don't "believe" in setbacks with a heat pump - they don't work. Turning down a thermostat during heating season when the home will be unoccupied is not a "setback" as that word is most commonly used. It's done to save money, why heat a vacant house? No setback thermostat is needed, even a dumb 50 year old analog thermostat can be turned down....See MoreReal-world cost savings on variable speed HVAC systems?
Comments (84)At no point did I ever suggest "everyone is going through the same kind of weather". Not even close. In fact, I was.... click to enlarge... So I guess we got another engineer who has trouble remembering what they say... how ironic. Even after I highlighted it in a previous post and responded to it. What are your words exactly? We are experiencing the same weather you are right now. When did you say it? yesterday. From a utility billing standpoint, climate is irrelevant. A month of 90° weather is the same anywhere you are. Your equipment has to work just as hard if it's in Philly or Houston to cool a house and remove humidity. It doesn't know or care what the geographic location is. Not really if you look at the whole picture. If you're only going to look at part of it sure... you could easily say there is no difference. Run time / number of cycles all contribute to wear. If you use an AC for 3 months / maybe marginal for another month... compared to an area that uses it nearly triple that amount. Maintenance is another part. The equipment I pull / replace is often times full of dirt. If coils are full of dirt how hard will the equipment work in 100F heat? Sure I could have pulled an average for Houston, but that doesn't come near to explaining the heat we are having right now. The comparison was to heat right now, the 10 year average to philly was to show how far away you are from "norms" right now as in only yesterday. Anyone looking at the current heat H-town is having would realize these aren't normal temps. I guess Ryan could argue he's not anyone. LOL. It's pretty amazing that you cannot seem to see irony in the remarks you make or have the capacity to self-reflect. You think you're being talked down to? My last post was in response to another one of your self-aggrandizing and condescending posts which was in part directed at me. You've taken a number of jabs at me throughout this thread because I haven't necessarily subscribed to whatever the hell you're trying to pedal. You repeatedly ignore critical information and fabricate other details I have someone telling me I am not an electrical engineer, I have another proclaimed engineer who says Philly and H-town weather is virtually the same thing "right now" and that equipment is going to work just as hard as where ever in the world they may be right now. It's ok for you to be condescending to me but harsh my mellow when I do it to you? If someone drives with their brights on do you not flick your brights back at them? Or are you one of these guys who drives with sunglasses on at night? Self-aggrandizing. The subject we are on, is what I do for a living. For some reason you think I am only talking about myself? Merely talking about my experiences in working on equipment that you are paying a small fortune for. But you want something with a "track record". A track record is important, because a trane doesn't run without one. Cost of ownership: it's higher with a Trane. Yeah this is more self-aggrandizing. It's not telling you anything you need or want. 30-40k for two systems up front on top of that. Utility bills that will be higher and? The list goes on... But it's just me self-aggrandizing pay no mind to it. What could I have possibly learned over 28 years of doing this for a living? How to self-aggrandize on a forum board. Nice. LOL. You have your opinion based on what? How long will that last? 1 repair? I've gone down that trane track. I still go down it on occasion "for others". I love Tranes but for different reasons than you think. LOL. ---------------------- Charles, I think Ray is asserting that A/C is used more in Houston than in Philadelphia. Do you dispute that? LOL. Yeah so we can start comparing Virginia to H-town weather as well. "right now". ha, ha, ha. --------------------- Ray, You have removed all doubt about your knowledge of electrical engineering. Thanks Mike_home I don't go on Air Conditioning & Heating forum boards to pretend to be something I'm not. I am licensed to repair HVAC systems. No where in those licensing requirements does it require me to be an electrical engineer. Reminder this is Air Conditioning & Heating, not electrical engineering. I don't need an engineering degree to fix an air conditioner. I have fixed engineer's air conditioners in the past, still occasionally do so now. Right tool - right job. The word is still out on what kind of tool you are Mike....See MoreIssues on the new HVAC systems
Comments (2)"Both systems(two zones) have been running well and making the house cool since the installation" You can't go by the colors of the wires - you have to trace them from the thermostat to the furnace to the condenser. The fact that both systems are working fine (7 degree drop is an hour ain't bad but you need to measure the delta for a more accurate assessment) suggests everything is OK. DON'T go changing any wires around unless you do the above. Better yet, call the guy and ask him what you asked us and ask him to take a look at it....See Moregaryg
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