- 2+ years old middle of the 500 Integra series line. Shx46 or 56 or something.

1. Cleans very well. I just don't ever have crud left on my dishes after a wash despite that I only get rid of gross bits of food before loading and if risotto crud or pasta sauce or a bit of onion, parsley or grain or so of rice is on the dishes, well it goes in the DW. Yogurt likewise. Always comes out perfectly clean.

2. Holds a lot in my opinion. I only do a load every 3 or 4 days - only 2 adults in house. Many times I have to do a load because the dishes are starting to grow things and become a bit toxic, not so much because it is full.

2. Dries very well, plastics included. However, there may be some legitimacy to the much-touted plastics complaints. While I had never had any problems with drying anything, I have a recently purchased tupperware rubbermaid item which is the same brand as all my previous ones except that it has a red lid while all others have the pale yellow lid. This one piece of tupperware will simply not dry in the DW. Everything else in the DW, old tupperware and rubberized plastic lids included, is perfectly dry (barring some residual liquid in flipped over bowls), but this one comes out perfectly wet. Wierd. While it has the same recycling classification as the other tupperwares, perhaps the new tupperwares use a different plastics composition than the older ones?

3. Quiet but not dead silent. According to Bosch, babies can sleep through their DW operation even when laden on top of one. I don't know much about babies but from what I understand, they will awaken and yell bloody-murder if a gnat so much as walks across the floor in the opposite part of the house. Well, if that is indeed true, my mid-line Bosch DW will most certainly rouse their ire. There are definitely times in the cycle that I can hear a soft whump-whump-whump. At other times in the cycle, I need to be down by the door to hear that whump-whump. (The sight of someone pressing up to a DW should frighten most ambulatory bodies, but hey, you know... )

5. Definitely sensitive to installation issues. Initial install had the top of the DW about 1.5" beneath the countertop. Well, while it got top scores for washing and drying, I wanted to hurl it at somebody during every wash because it was NOT a quiet dishwasher. Took over a year to learn that the 1.5" gap on top was an undesireable. Since then, see 4 above.

6. Installed with the high loop. No smells unless dishes left in too long (see 3).

7. Has that cylindrical bar handle which I must say looks terribly cool. :-)

Thanks mindstorm. Thats a lot of info and a very thoughtful response. We do have children in the house, but not worried about them waking. It sounds like it is probably quiet enough. Good to know about the install. Did you have Bosch people tell you about the gap? For some reason, your number 4 disappeared. How did you correct the gap?

Thanks again

curious,
Sorry my points got mislabeled. There are 2 (2)s so the second (2) should be a (3), the (3) should be a (4). (5), (6), (7) are as they should be.

Nope, neither the Bosch people's service guys nor the service guys from the retailers I bought from were helpful here. Both said: "Its a Bosch, it *is* quiet" sort of like I was disputing the value of PI or the gravitational constant. I learned this was my issue right here at the GW (this place seriously rocks). Someone else with one of these purportedly quiet dishwashers - Bosch, Miele or Asko - had the same complaint as me and they posted some pics of their installed DW and the 0.5" or 0.75" gap above their dishwasher was flagged as their problem. Well, when I checked my top gap (it really wasn't visible unless you're looking at it from the floor) it was 1.5"! So it was clear that that was problemmatic.

The fix was easy - raise the DW! Its legs/feet are adjustable and we just needed to turn the screws to lift the DW to abut the bottom of the ctrtop. Very easy to do - there is a turn-screw just behind the toe-kick that adjusts the back two feet. The front legs are readily accessible of course. So adjusting the height is really easy. Once you know to do so, that is.

Our Bosch (at our last house for 7+ yrs) was an integrated style..I don't remember the model number. Very quiet so that we often opened it, forgetting it was running. We never could have made that mistake with the top-of-the-line Maytag we made the mistake of buying for the dining room buffet area. The Bosch cleaned well and we installed it ourselves without any trouble, during or after... No smells or anything.

Our new Bosches (2 of them) have just been ordered for our new house. They are SHV45M03UC.

BTW, Mindstorm...I think you could set off bombs next to my kids (especially when they were babies) and they would sleep right through! I think it depends on what they get used to... Our youngest had too many active siblings to hope for silence while they slept. ;-D

We have a pair of Thermadors (Bosch in disguise). I don't have the moel number here, but they are the next to the top of the line in the integrated style. Ive had several people ask what the red light on the floor was and be surprised when I told them it was the DW. They didn't even know it was on.

It took me a while to relearn the loading, but we're doing pretty well now. They clean well and they dry as well as any DW I'vd had -- some plastics may have water on top or inthe ridges, especially if not angled when loaded. Usually dry of angeled.

BTW, we got the THermador becaue it was less in the ready for panel model than the simialr Bosch -- and we were told the light was blue instead of red, but the light is red after all. So it's not perfect. ; )

I can't really tell you my experience with the bosch, because I just ordered it two weeks ago. But I am a research nut and even though I have read a lot about the smell thing, I still ordered one. Mine is the SHV45 (fully integrated with the panel. I also have a weird feddish about handles matching on all my kitchen appliances, so I got the paneled so it will look like my kitchen cabinets instead of a handle not matching my range and fridge. I can't remember the exact noise level but the kitchen will be open to our family room and DH wanted assurance we would not hear the dishwasher running.

Mid range, don't remember the model no. Two adult home. DW is great! Quietly, efficiently washes all dishes, pots/pans daily. Usually run on light, using 3 1/2 gals water. No smell, I stood over installer like installation police to be sure of high loop. 5 yrs no issues.

Mine's the SHX57C05UC, in service for about 15 months.

Very quiet. Most loads are barely audible. Occasionally, depending on what's being washed, I can hear the soft whump-whump-whump that mindstorm mentioned. Still a FAR cry better than any dishwasher I've ever owned, and definitely not a complaint. My dishwasher is on an interior wall that goes part of the way up to the vaulted ceiling, with the family room on the other side of the wall. Unlike its predecessor, it causes absolutely no problems with conversation, television watching, etc., in the family room.

Love the racks. I can't think of the term Bosch uses, but mine are the premium ones that have all the fold-down tines, height adjustable upper rack, etc. Very flexible when it comes to loading the dishwasher.

Cleans great, and I'm not a pre-rinser. Large pieces of food get scraped into the trash, and dishes then go straight into the dishwasher.

Dries very well. Even plastics come out dry if the dishwasher is allowed to function as it is meant to, meaning the condensation drying process is given ample time to work. However, the plastics aren't all that wet at the end of the wash cycle, and a quick swipe with a dish towel is all that is needed if you're in a hurry to get the dishwasher ready for the next load. I really don't think the end of cycle moisture is much different than what my former dishwasher (2004 Maytag) left at the end of its drying cycle, plus my plastics aren't water spotted like the Maytag left them.

No installation issues. Mine was installed by the retailer's service team, and has been fine from day one.

No smells.

Filter seldom needs to be rinsed, and when it does, it's a very simple, very quick process. It's not a nasty job, and rinsing a filter once in a while certainly beats listening to a food grinder on a daily basis.

I definitely recommend Bosch, and would buy another in a heartbeat.

SHU66--the one rated #1 by Consumer Reports. Have only had it for 6 months but I love it. Previously I had a Thermador that lasted about 20 years.

SH?66 also- with the premium racks that are the same ones offered on the current top of the line Bosch. This replaced a 10 y.o kenmore/whirpool. It is very quiet, I installed it myself very easily, it has never smelled, and it cleans superbly, and dries even plastic fine with the addition of white vinegar as my rinse aid.

However- I loathe the racks and cutlery baskets. It fills up much quicker for my 2 adult household than my kenmore did because things just don't have a good place to go so everything is just piled in (literally).

Pulling out the top rack with any other than the gentlest motion smashes all of my glassware together- forget just letting the door shut on its own weight(or god forbid- back kicking it shut like is used to do with my kenmore)- you'll have shards. This is because the glassware rows of tines are so far apart the only thing holding a glass in one place is OTHER GLASSES. On my kenmore there were more rows of tines and you could use the tines to hold up the glasses by putting the glass on top of a tine or two- you cannot do this on the Bosch or you will only be able to fit a few glasses in it whole top rack, as it dedicates an entire top rack row to what I can only imagine are saucer holders- which take up most of the space in the top rack. Who uses 12 saucers?

As far as regular dishes go unless I am washing what the Bosch clearly excels at- plates and lots of them, I have constant problems. We use bowls, lots of bowls, big bowls collapse the fold down tines with their weight so i am constantly taking things out to unfold the tines to put things back in, soup bowls do not fit in the plate holders (plate holder tines are tall and angled) and are too shallow to stand up to get correctly dried if put "between" the rows of tines (they tilt backwards and end up filled with dirty water at the end). I have to put my regular bowls and rammekins in the top rack saucer-zone so it is usually a way full top rack that makes me have to run the DW every day- I ran the kenmore every three or four.

The cutlery baskets are so small and require that you put cutlery in handle down for maximum loading and cleaning- and forget the separator grid on the basket- my silverware (and it is not huge) will not fit easily through the holes- and the holes are different sizes so while you may be able to fit a knife handle through one hole you cannot fit it through all holes- so to use it you would have to memorize which holes fit which types of your cutlery- ugh. Anyone who spent age 16 in foodservice knows that this silver loading/unloading is counter intuitive- not only are you forced to grab things by the dirty end to load them- you then touch the clean "eating end" to unload them.

The Bosch racks have been clearly design by someone at a drafting table who asked themselves -How can I accomodate 12 plates 12 saucers 12 coffee cups 12 bread plates 12 knives, forks and spoons. Not by someone actually living a life cooking in their kitchen and loading incrementally.

wow- can you tell this rant has been building? sorry for the longwindedness.

I was all set with my choice, the top of the line Integra. Then I realized it does not have the 1/2 load option. So I'm changing it to the next one down, the SHX680MxUC, since this offers this option.

To be honest, I'm not in love with the set up of the racks and can already tell I hate the cutlery basket. I figured since it's so small I could just order a 2nd one since it would be filled up after one meal in our house. DH thinks none of this is a big deal it's just a matter of getting used to a new loading technique. Now this comes from a man who has no idea how to load things because I am constantly going behind him and changing everything.

Joslin's post now has me a little more than worried about my choice. Do I take a stack of dishes/bowls/cups/etc to the appliance store and load it just to see? Like Joslin, we go thru lots of bowls. As far as glasses, we rarely use glass, pretty much plastic while the kids are still young. But I couldn't imagine washing fine crystal if they would slam together.

Does anyone else have any of these same issues? I'd hate to have to start my search over.

taking a load to the store sounds silly, but it would undoubtedly be the best way to know for sure!

Funny, I just this morning unloaded a half-rack wash (*love* this) with delicate stem-ware in it. The china/delicate/something cycle. No shards. The load consisted of several glasses, about 8 or 9 glass and ceramic bowls, several (3 or 4) thin wine glasses, a few cups and some other nondescript items. Now if my things were ever going to smash together and break, it would be these particular wine glasses - they are crate and barrel wine glasses, very thin and light-weight, I wish we *would* go through them but we don't seem to. I don't think I'd be happy if my DW took them out, certainly, and sure enough, it doesn't. The only thing I've ever broken in there was a port wine glass and it was because I dropped it onto something else.

I wasn't aware that I operate the racks with the gentlest of motion but I must because I simply do not back-kick my appliances thusly:
forget just letting the door shut on its own weight(or god forbid- back kicking it shut like is used to do with my kenmore)- you'll have shards
If I did, I would not expect things to survive. The Bosch upper racks are (well, on some of the models at any rate) designed so they can be mounted on the slider arm at one of two different levels - or split with one up and one on the lower. Because this flexibility needs to be built in, the slider is going to allow play in two degrees of motion.

Good luck trying to convince the Europeans to design their dishwashers that will stand up to such behaviour. I suspect, you'll just remind them why they kicked the settlers out of their various countries! :-)

I didn't bother taking my stuff to the store because it seemed a bit much, but plenty of people do it and if your suspect that you may not be able to deal with the loading, then why not preempt the eventuality and test your stuff in a test model. No sense winding up with an expensive white elephant.

I don't have fine crystal just ordinary wine glasses. 5 yrs no chips, no crashing together. Oh and I don't bother with the drop down holder, just line them up. I put my Lenox china in with a platinum ring. No wear or scratches on the pl. ring or china. I put pots/pans even broiler pan in and all comes out perfect. I have never used the top only option.

I have a Bosch Integra SHX33A05UC. It absolutely cannot dry plastic. FULL STOP.

is my favorite appliance for 3 yrs. now.
plastic may not dry entirely due to bosch washers have no drying element and need 120 degree water, and your hot water heater must be at a certain temperature. some models i believe have water heaters inside. some new tupperware and gladware has a coating on them for microwavwe use, no (melting) and i have noticed they are hard to dry in my dishwashers. but, hand drying is hard also. actually harder. they are like ducks. for proper drying you must keep your drying agent full at all times. i top mine off once a week. silverware basket thing, flip the top over and you can load anyway you want. handles up or down. i use my silverware baskets with the tops down. the thicker slots were designed for your knives. knives to your stainless sets have a different type of stainless and should not be touching other stainless pieces, or they will etch. that is the reason for the different size slots.
i put all kinds of glass items on top and do not have any breakage. i really have never kicked any of my dishwaher doors shut. i have a wood panel on my bosch and would not want to ruin it.the door is quite heavy, with or without panel and slamming it, causes the dishwasher to move,and the glassitems in it may break or chip. i have had 3 bosch dishwashers in different houses. i will have nothing else.
these dishwashers are quiet,but most important my dishes are always clean. some items such as plastic lids with the lips will nest water. stand up these items, or lean them for best drying results. my husband sells high end appliances, and i can have any appliance i want. a bosch dishwasher is my favorite appliance.

I have the Integra model shx55m. I echo Joslin's comments. The openings in the cutlery separator grid on the cutlery basket are too small. 90% of the openings won't hold any of my silverware outside of baby spoons (I have the two baskets that can separate). I'm thinking about cutting some of the separators out to try to solve the problem. Also, when not using the separator grid, the cutlery "flops" because the walls of the basket aren't very high. So I am not finding that a good solution to the grid problem. I also find the fold down tines collapse quite easily, and then I have to pull things out and reload - huge pain. I might try bending the tines that lock into the adjustment slots to make it a tighter fit.

I also don't have a rinse and hold cycle - not discovered until after I had installed it. It was described as having a quick rinse in the spec sheet, but I have no idea what that is and it isn't mentioned in the user manual. Fortunately, the machine washes well enough that a rinse and hold cycle hasn't been a problem, and I'm not much of a pre-rinser. However, we run it once, sometimes twice, a day. So things don't sit very long.

Those are my main gripes. I'm happy with how it washes in general, and it is quiet. I was worried about how well my cereal bowls would wash - unless I waste a huge amount of space, they nest into each other a lot. So far, they have cleaned very well despite being very cozy with one another. I've only had it a month, so can't speak much about reliability.

I have 2 stainless SHV99A03 somethings. Very quiet except at one early phase of a cycle when I hear the aforementioned whump wwhump and which may have to do with loading because I don't always hear it. I am extremely pleased with mine. Most Rubbermaid does not get dry in it and I do not like the silverware basket. I do, however, like the knife holder. I think the capacity is smaller than my old Kitchenaid, but I have had so much trouble with so many Kitchenaid appliances that I would never buy another (with the possible exception of an icemaker, which only needed one motor replacement on warranty, but I digress). The Bosch gets my dishes clean, has no odor, has a high loop installation, is reliable, does all that I need it to do on the delicate cycle, and dries the rest of my dishes. I'm very pleased. I do not put antique crystal in it, or any china with metallic accents, because I am chicken, so I'll make no recommendation there. I do have some plain, generic crystal that is quite fragile and I have used the Bosch on it from time to time sans problem. I always use Cascade powder and Jet Dry or another rinse aid. If it would clear the table, load itself, and put the clean dishes away, I would be happier, but I guess that's a generation away.

I have two of the SHV46C1, Integra fully integrated with top rack only capability.

Previously I had a Bosch for about 7 years and it was one of the last to come out of Germany. I think the older one was far superior to cleaning and about the same with noise (I haven't had the panels installed yet.) Plastic does not get dry, but I knew it wouldn't. My complaint is the quality of cleaning. I'm not crazy about the racks, either. I didn't want to spend more for another brand, such as Miele, but maybe I should have.

ctkathy, your dishwasher should be able to clean perfectly. What sort of detergent are you using? Perhaps there is a difference in that the older dishwasher was engineered for one sort of detergent and the new ones are designed for another? I do know that the enzyme-based powder stuff is necessary.

If not detergent, you should call service or the retailer or someone about less than perfect cleaning. I can tell you that even with quite messy dishes including bits of dough stuck on dishes and whatnot, likewise with gravy or yogurt remains and dried on for a few days, the dishes in my dishwasher have always come out spotlessly flawlessly clean.

I've had the Bosch 440C05UC / 40 for about two years and I've never liked it. My first surprise was its depth -- quite a bit less than the screaming, on-its-last-legs Kenmore that it replaced. It holds less, no matter how it is loaded. I didn't notice this in the store where it was on display. It certainly looked normal there.

It seems quiet enough, especially compared to that poor Kenmore. I can hear it when it's running because my kitchen is open to all the rooms on this level of the house. But the sound isn't obnoxious or loud. The salesman claimed that I wouldn't be able to hear it running. Of course I can hear it! But it's not terribly intrusive.

It smells funny. Did from the moment of unpacking. Not swampy, but weird, sort of strangely metallic, unlike anything else in my olfactory repertoire. The smell is strongest just after a wash is completed, and it won't subside unless I open the door and let it air out. We've checked the installation, the filters, the detergent, the rinse agent, and all are correct; besides, the smell was present even during installation.

This model does not have a delay start, which I miss very much and will insist on if I ever purchase another dishwasher.

My Bosch doesn't clean well. Glasses are usually a bit streaky and filmy, even with enzyme detergent and rinse agent. It has several wash options, but the full-on potscrubber one is the only one I use. The others simply don't clean my dishes.

I have a set of gold-rimmed crystal glasses from my grandmother. Stupidly I put four of them in the dw one time after dinner with friends. Now those four no longer have their gold rim.

If I remember to open the door when the cycle is complete, most things end up being dry enough to put away. Plastics are another story, and other posts have provided detailed information.

The potscrubber cycle doesn't scrub, not like my old Kenmore anyway. All pots with anything cooked on emerge from the Bosch with stuff still stuck on. I now set aside time to finish scrubbing pots and casserole dishes and so on.

The rack system is a nuisance as has been noted in some previous posts. There are tines where I don't want them and blank spaces where I'd like tines. I removed the cutlery basket altogether and put in the old Kenmore basket.

In sum, its prettier and quieter than my old Kenmore, but in every other respect it is a disappointment.

Sorry for the negative post. How frivolous it can seem to complain about a dishwasher when there are people all over the world without dishes or food to put on them.

Good luck on your search for a good dishwasher.

I have a SHU43C of some sort, and I hate the thing. Sure it's quiet, and yes, the dishes are clean, but the stupid lower rack is impossible to load well. The top rack has too few tines.

I wish I still had the Kenmore from my old house.

SirWired

Purchased an 800 series Evolution model. Installed it pre-renovation and was all prepared to love it, but just don't somehow. Liked my previous dishwashers better - one lower end, one higher end.

The good - it is efficient and quiet, the plates are clean (then again I never put food-caked items in there), and large pots fit. It is supposed to be reliable.

The not so great - it smells if I don't do a load every day (will be doing the fix suggested elsewhere), the rack tines are too closely spaced to comfortably fit my bowls and I swear I fit in fewer cups/glasses. There is water on plastic items (expected) and the tops of cups/glasses (not expected) - do use rinse agent and run the full cycle. Also not crazy about the suggested rinse agent. Green machine - toxic chemical.

I finally got around to taking some bowls to the appliance store to test the layout in the Bosch. It just doesn't work. DH even played with the darn tines for a few minutes to see what he could come up with. He didn't like it. So...I think I'm going the other route with the Miele Optima. I like the racks much better and I really think that we will like the cutlery rack much better than the normal basket. The salesman is going to Miele school next week so he will have more info for me. Price wise - they are about the same (panel ready) with the package pricing I'm being offered.

The interior of the Bosch seems very small to me. He measured the lower rack and it is the same as the Miele but the Miele holds more. However, it is 1.5" smaller than the Kitchenaid that I currently have but appears to be much smaller.

As far as noise level, I think the Bosch was 48 db and the Miele is rated Q3 but I'm not sure on the exact db level.

I only hope I have no regrets with this decision.

hell, if the cost of the miele and bosch are the same because of the "appliance package" you're getting, I would get the miele by far! more features with the miele than the bosch (water softener, cutlery tray, better water leak detection, better build overall). hell, if possible, for a small upgrade cost of course, move up to the excella with the split cutlery tray and better rack configuration.

Here is a link that might be useful: Official Miele Dishwasher Brocedure

Thanks Mando_p. Actually the salesman called me and the Optima is $40 cheaper than the Bosch so it's a no brainer which one to get. I'll check into the Excella as well. I don't really need all the different wash cycles but the one feature I did want that the Optima doesn't have is the 1/2 load or upper rack only wash. Then again I've never had this feature so I wouldn't miss it.

the main driver for our purchase of our excella over the optima had to do with child locks. in addition, the feature i'm looking forward to using that is available on the excella and not on the optima is the "large items soiled." I like to BBQ (REAL BBQ...slow cooking smoked meats) and I would love to stick my large grates (four 18" by 18" steel grates) in the dw. i hate cleaning my grates, but the excella should take care of this.

the excella also has the "load sensor" that will adjust the cycles based variables include upon how much is loaded. so, the "top/half load" option is not really needed with the load sensor of the excella.

good luck!

I called for the price on the Excella and it's $350 more than the Optima, so I can't justify the additional cost. I do like that it has the load sensor feature that the Optima doesn't. As I said before I've never had this so it's nothing I will miss, just wish I had.

I'm still a few months away from ordering as our build has slowed down, but I'm so glad that I've finally made a decision.

Good luck to you!

jgirl

This thread is about Bosch and not Miele so I don't want to keep jumping from the topic but will say only one other Miele thing.

You will like the flexibility in the racks on the Optima, Excella, or Laperla since you can wash glasses as well as plates in the bottom rack and in fact this is where the stemware rack is found.

The Excella and LaPerla also have two bottom only cycles(one with high heat, one with cooler temps) which lets you remove the middle rack and wash very tall items in the bottom along with your glasses and plates.

jgril,

you may want to push the salesperson on the excella. i don't know the configuration of the excella he's quoting you, but since you're getting a package deal, i would push him for a better deal. because of my situation, i got my excella for $1749 (SS control panel, but I'm making my own door panel from plexiglass). $2000+ for an excella seems excessive (the SS control and door panel is retailing for $1989).

good luck!