I can't do the Icon because my understanding is it's only available in 30" and I'm stuck with 27 unless I want to start ripping out cabinets... which I don't.

The owners manual is really a good idea - thanks for your help

Hilltop55, The only thing the pure convection MIGHT be useful for is when you have the oven really full. I never have had to use in on my Wolf oven and have never wished I had it on my Electrolux oven and I have packed them both out over the 3 1/2 years I have had them. The third element comes on during the convection modes and keeps the heat very even. I had a Dacor Discovery oven and it took so long to heat, at least 30 min, while the E-lux(30 inch) heats to 350 in about 7 minutes. It takes a little time after that for any oven to stabilize, but as soon as it preheats, I start baking. Sorry I have not baked in a Bosch.

wekick, You have both a Wolf and an Electrolux? I don't want to hijack this thread but I would love to know whether one cooks better than the other.

The Wolf is in a range and 36 inches wide so a little different than the wall oven and I tend to use them a little differently but both bake equally well I think. I use the Electrolux the most because it is smaller, heats quickly and is waist high. I tend to use the Wolf for things that take longer. I usually bake cookies and appetizers in the E-lux though and it works great.

I have bosch 800 series 30" oven for about 6 months now. I really like it. Bakes/broils everything great. I can agree about the looks - perhaps more SS would look better. Also the control panel takes some getting used to but it is a breeze to clean. I find it very accurate - love all the different settings and the racks work well. one is telescopic. the cavity is huge as is the window and the lighting inside is very good. the only i haven't tried is the probe.

Thanks - we've decided to go with the Bosch -- wish the 800 series was available in 27" but, it's not.

I purchased a new Electrolux Icon Pro 30 inch double oven (Model E30EW85GPS5) May 2011 and they were installed in late July 2011. I have had problem after problem with these ovens. This is so different than what my research showed prior to this purchase. Here is the good and then l'll give the problem history following:

The good:

� Great lighting and design big window
� Brilliant use of interior space- some people have discussed that the interior of the ovens are a bit smaller than other 30 inch ovens but I have found them large and with a great capacity- my 30 pound turkey roaster fit in with no problems as do my sheet pans. I think some people have measured the interior dimensions and not looked at the usable dimensions. The lowest rack (roll out) is dropped down so I found as opposed to straight across so it actually gives you additional usable space.m When baking cookies all 4 shelves are usable.
� Ovens stay very cool on the exterior and do not excessively heat up my kitchen, even when doing the self clean.
� When they work (see below) they seem to do a very good job but I do find it necessary to use convection bake if I'm cooking things on 3 or 4 shelves to keep the cooking and browning even.
� They clean up very nicely and I have not has any problems with stuff getting between the two panels of glass even with construction and a house full of animals.
� They preheat faster than any oven I have used if you use the rapid preheat feature.
� The meat probe works great and its location in the oven (top front) meant I could baste my turkey without moving it. I liked this feature so much after using it the first time I ordered a second one so I could have one for each oven
� The ovens have more features than I will likely use and because of some of the features eliminate the need for other appliances since they have a keep warm setting so we passed on a warming drawer. I have not used all the features but have used many including the bread proof which worked great

While I believe the Electrolux is a good oven it is also very clear that they do have some problems and as a newer appliance line the problems are now just coming out. So here are the problems only one of which I believe is a design issue, the balance I think are bad parts and that I unfortunately have a very expensive lemon in my new kitchen.

The problems:

�September 2011- the upper oven door frame started to separate and come apart-- a new door frame was ordered and installed-- 2 vists to complete repair
� November-December 2011- upper oven did not seem to be accurately calibrated and was running either too cold or too hot. This caused my cooking time to be off for both Thanksgiving and Xmas parties. January 2012 and new circuit board was installed after the technician verified that the ovens were fluctuating at times as much as 85 degrees above and below the set temperature. - 2 visits to complete this repair.
� January 2012- The bottom oven has stopped heating completely following running it through its first self cleaning cycle (that did work but made my house smell for two days diid something internally in the oven melt?). The oven has power and the fan comes on but none of the heating elements heat up, so it can't be used. Waiting for a technician to come diagnose the problem
� January 2012-The door frame is coming apart on the bottom oven, same problem that I had on the top oven in September 2011. Waiting for a technician to come evaluate this problem too.
� The glide out racks continuously roll in and don't stay out. When I asked the first technician about this he said that they will stay out when a pan is on them with weight--not so. These ovens were installed into a brand new custom built kitchen and we have checked and rechecked; everything is plum level in the cabinet box the oven was installed in. This was 100% custom built kitchen not a prefab kitchen boxes kitchen. If the ovens worked I could live with the annoyance of the racks but it has caused me to burn myself since you have to hold onto the rack once it is pulled out and if you are trying to turn thing over you need to master holding the pan AND rack with one hand as you use the other hand to turn the item, a third hand would be nice OR racks that stay out when you pull them out.
� The non-glide out standard racks (one in each oven) tend to stick unless you pull those out perfectly straight. When I complained to the technician about this problem in September he said "yes they tend to do that and Electrolux is aware, there is no fix, just don't use those racks".

BTW I also had a problem on my Electrolux Icon Pro 36 inch slide in gas cook top. One of the cast iron grates cracked the first time I used the cooktop. I was told that was not a warranty item and had to purchase a replacement grate at a cost of over $150.

My experience is soooo different than what I had researched on these appliances. .To be continued I'm guessing

Guess I should be glad that I decided against the elux icon at the last minute. I really liked a lot of the features.
Went with the Wolf e series during their sale - Can't wait til the remodel and install!

alysson1111 - so sorry to hear of your troubles with the Electrolux, but really appreciate you sharing the pluses and minuses. I looked everywhere in the area and could not find anyone who had an Electrolux on the floor. I can't buy a major appliance sight unseen. At the last showroom, they said they had trouble getting parts and trouble getting service for the Electrolux. That may be a problem unique to our area (San Antonio), but it was the deciding factor for moving to Bosch - we know service is readily available as well as parts.

Txjoyce, that is interesting. We were looking at Viking, Elux Icon and Jenn-Air at the same dealership, and the guy said that of all of them Electrolux had the best service and support. We are moving to a remote area, and he said his remote customers had gotten parts directly from Electrolux with no hassle. I know sales people don't always know the score on service, but I can't think why he would say that about the least expensive of the three unless he knew it was factual.

I thought it was strange also - may have just been his experience, or perhaps he didn't make as much from selling Electrolux. I looked high and low in our area and no one had one on the floor, so I decided against it. Like I said, maybe it's just a San Antonio thing!!

Sorry to hear about the problem with ovens.
Unfortunately there are no ovens where at least a few don't have problems, Of Course, if it's yours, It's a real "Bummer"!

This does not seem to be typical of the Electrolux ovens.
Google that model number + the word reviews--just like I did. Here are 8 reviews from AJMadison web-site.
(Click the link below)

Gary

Here is a link that might be useful: Elux oven reviews

I am not sure if there has been any problem with the Bosch ovens. I think I will need to do a search. I went to the big online dealers and only found two unsatisfying reviews among them all. Most had none.

We are shopping for a wall oven and other appliances. Trying to weigh pros and cons of all the brands in our feature and price range is mind numbing as others have also posted. Electrolux Icon has the smoothest rolling racks of any we've seen. They're so smooth that unless the rack supports are perfectly level, I can see the racks rolling in and out on their own. Allyson1111's racks would not stay pulled out. Google "Electrolux oven rack problems" and you'll find four YouTube postings from earlier this year by a very disgruntled couple showing racks that drift the other way - they won't stay in.

I'm beginning to be skeptical of the Electrolux rack support design. The supports are not permanently fixed to the sides of the oven but clip in and are designed for removal along with the racks before self cleaning. We took all the racks out of an Electrolux Icon display oven and unclipped/re-clipped one of the supports. It all seemed solid to us, but we still think it makes more sense to have the rack supports permanently mounted and designed to self-clean with the oven. That is, if you are inclined to even use self-clean on any brand oven after all the warnings.

Nobody has yet mentioned that only the Electrolux allows for open-door broiling, which helps properly make the top of your foods crispy without cooking all the way through. Most closed-door broilers I've used bake more than broil, although Bosch and Thermador seem to get better reviews than most others that are closed-door-only.

Just a followup to my original post -- our Bosch 500 series double oven has been installed for about 6 months now and we love it. Temperatures are even in both the conventional and convection ovens - no hot spots. Convection roast produced the best roasted turkey we've ever had. Just one wish - we would have preferred to have the electronic touch screen controls, but they don't make the 800 series in 27" and we weren't ripping out cabinets.

I have owned a Bosch 36" range for several years with good results. I wanted the convection although I haven't used it as much as I thought I would. For the most part it has worked well, although it doesn't reach temperature until about 5 minutes after the pre-heat beeper goes off. If the temperature needs to be accurate I check the thermometer I have inside the oven. I actually wanted more stainless steel as well but now am happier with the combination of black and stainless because it's so much easier to clean! One other issue - and I think this is not uncommon with self-cleaning ovens - it doesn't get as clean as I would like after the self-cleaning feature runs.

For the price point it has been a great range with few issues and hasn't needed a repair even though it has gotten a pretty good workout in my kitchen.

I choose E over B for those reason. 1: E has both convention bake for upper oven & lower oven. B modle800,only upper has convention Baker . 2: E has child lock Which is important for me. 3: E has 3year limited warranty.4: E has fast heating function, I love it!

only one thing I dont really Like Side look of the E. if you touch the side of the door. You will understand what I talk about!

But for functional reason, I got my E double wall oven!

Electrolux does not provide good customer support Our Double oven is 6 months old. Got a F14 code they cannot get anyone to come and fix it... Don't buy. No one gets back to you. Loved the oven when it worked... What a useless company....

I have a 30" oven that worked well until I used the self-cleaning feature. The two inner panes of glass exploded. I have been waiting for nearly 6 months for the replacement glass. Electrolux customer service has been very frustrating. I also have the five burner gas cooktop and that has been very good.