So far my lid failures have been almost nil. I even used some old canning lids that belonged to my daughter. She passed away with lymphoma almost 15 years ago. I didn't realize she did that much preserving, but I decided to use those lids recently. Even as old as they were, - they all sealed.

But sometimes it is best to review the basics - like:

Pre-soak lids in hot water.

Don't re-use old lids.

Wipe the rims of jars with a damp paper towel before attaching lids.

Don't over-fill jars causing them to boil over - watch head space when filling jars.

Observe temperatures when filling jars - and water temperatures in canning container - preventing siphoning, boil-overs, cracked jars, etc.

I would hate to think that the manufacturers were "cutting corners" on the sealing compounds they use - which would account for these failures.

You have had a significant and impressive canning experience, apparently, so it certainly is difficult to pin-point the cause.

Just my 2 c's.

Bejay

Agree with Bejay that a step-by-step review might be of help to you. That is a high rate of failures but there is nothing unique to tomatoes that would explain it other than it is a messy process and so needs good jar rim cleaning and avoid over-filling.

Are you doing them BWB or pressure canning?

Dave

I had three batches with some lid failures this year, and I almost NEVER have lid failures. After I got through that batch of lids, the problem ceased. I always inspect my jars and lately have been inspecting my lids and noticed the sealing compound on some is irregular and sloppy and also thinner in width than some older lids I had. There is no excuse for this and if I find more, I'll be complaining to the manufacturer. This prompted me to buy some bulk at our local Amish market and I haven't had any problems with them.

If it isn't a freaky manufacturing problem, suspect siphoning. Most of my past lid failures in my early days of canning have been from that.

Each year, they seem to be using less and less sealing compound on the lids, and less shellac as well.

Unless you used different lids with your tomatoes than with other products, I would guess it's not the lids but something having to do with the canning method. I agree that siphoning is a real possibility. If tomato exudes from under the rim, it can definitely interfere with the seal. Especially with a densely packed or thicker mixture where there's expansion under heat I'd be looking at that or insufficient headspace, perhaps both.

In a typical canning season I have no seal failures. Last year I did have one. I've found that whether packed in the small boxes or placed atop jars in seal-wrapped cases, the newer lids have more flaws. I haven't had a problem with the sealing compound, but more routinely I am finding lids with bends and irregularities that prevent a good seal. I don't believe they're manufactured to the same standard and they certainly seem to sustain greater damage in shipping.

It's a real pain to take additional time with canning inspecting lids and sighting along the surface to make sure they're level and undamaged, but now it's a standard element of my canning procedures.

I've used some of my MIL's excess lids going back to the 1950's with no problems whatsoever. If I were lucky enough to find more I would happily use them.

Carol

There was some discussion about this about a year or two ago. I bought some new jelly jars - pretty things with fruit design on the lids - and white rings. There were quite a few failures in that particular batch. I attributed it to the rings - with the threads not having proper spacing.

However, after several discussions on the forum, several folks thought it might be due to the way the jars were packed for marketing - with the lids and rings attached to the glass jars. This could, conceivably, be a box that might be exposed to heat - either in storage or transit - that might cause the lids to seal on jars prematurely.

We were in hopes that the manufacturer would wrap the lids separate from the jars, but were advised that it would not be economical or practical for them to do so.

Anyway, if the lids were at fault, at least purchasing a new box of new lids - perhaps tossing the attached lids that came with the original package, should have solved that issue.

But if lid problems continue with new lids, then that would rule out that particular item.

P.S. Didn't some folks write to the mfg, who gave them new lids in exchange for the faulty ones? Seems I recall something like that.

Bejay

You're right Bejay. It seems that writing at least elicits a coupon for fresh lids. Not ideal but better than nothing.

Carol

I'm BWBing my tomatoes.

The lids I'm using are all old. I bought a few hundred jars off craigslist last spring, and one lady threw in a few hundred lids as well. They are a mismatch of brands and styles - but I've been using them with everything I can, not just tomatoes. I have some of the new silver lids, but I haven't opened the case yet.

A couple things I'm thinking about.

I'm doing my tomatoes in WM quarts. I was reading on another board (Preserving the Harvest at Homesteading Today) that some people think there is a higher rate of lid failure with WM lids. Though nobody had any "scientific proof" of such.

Also, I'm typically processing late at night. IIRC, all my lid failures have been from the 2nd batch of the night, where I'm typically getting stuff in the canner close to midnight. So maybe I'm just not doing the best job of inspecting my lids, rings, wiping down my jars, etc? But then, this is how I do all my canning - late at night. I put up 13 jars of pears last night - last batch went in at 1 AM. No lid failures.

I just went blank. WM quarts???

Sorry, it's been a long day.

Carol

WM=Walmart.

I'm doing ok with new boxes of jars/lids, but getting failures with 'just a box of lids' new lids.

From the perspective of an inveterate lid-reuser, they sure don't make 'em like they used to.

WM = Wide Mouth

(though I do buy lots of my canning stuff at WM = Walmart)

If all your failures happen late (2nd batch), even though not all late batches have seal failures, then I'd attribute it to fatigue and unrecognized short-cutting.

Somewhere on the NCHFP site, I believe, there's documentation about fatigue as a risk-factor in canning. Believe me, it's a significant one.

Having done late-night (and early a.m.) canning myself, I know exactly where you are. One option, if possible, is to space out the canning tasks. In other words, prep beets for pickling one day, refrigerate, heat and can batch one during dinner prep or just after dinner and another single batch later in the evening or even the next day.

You know your own schedule and routines best, but if you can do more tasks ahead and space out the process, you may find that helps.

Carol

I just picked up another 20 lb box of tomatoes at the orchard today. I spent the past 1.5 hours peeling and dicing all the tomatoes. They are in a huge pot in my fridge. I'll boil them up and can them tomorow. I'm going to try my best to pay attention to every little detail. Hopefully I can do a batch without any lid failures.

I just did a salsa workshop and had five lid failures on forty-nine jars - most ever for me. However, I was using "Golden Harvest" - a cheaper brand possibly only available in Canada, that comes with the lids stuck tight to the jars already. They were standard mouth pints and half-pints.

I just pulled out two dozen new wide mouth quarts to do my tomato sauce. They've been in the pantry a couple months but still wrapped. Had to toss 4 lids or more out of twenty four jars due to obvious dents!
These are the silver lids.

9 quarts of diced tomatoes came out of the canner tonight. Along with 4 pints of zucchini relish. So far it looks like I had no lid failures.

The only thing I know I did different - I filled my jars one by one this time. Filled jar, cleaned rim, added lid and ring, placed in BWB. This way, my water stayed close to boiling the whole time. Usually when I fill the BWB up with quarts, it takes a long time to come back up to boil. Not sure if that had anything to do with it.

Also - I peeled and chopped the tomatoes yesterday. Just had to bring them to a boil and can them tonight. This is the earliest I have ever been done canning!

Great! I saw my MIL do that - pace out the canning. Working on a farm, it was hard to come in after a long day and can, so doing it in stages when things were especially hectic really helped.

So glad there were no lid failures tonight.

We can buy Golden Harvest here. Walmart carries them. They have worked just fine for me. But it's possible your supplier was less careful stacking cases on those pallets. Those shrink-wrapped boxes are more susceptible to damage anyway.

Carol

I have always had seal failures with the two piece lids. I have a jam business now, use the one piece lids, and never have had a failure (unless I happen to bang the edge of the lid on something).

So I thought about the process of using two piece lids. I am scrupulous about cleaning the rims of the jars. The jars and the jam or tomatoes were really hot and stayed that way for a while. However, the lids cool off fairly quickly when pulled out of the water and I think this is the weakest link in the process. When I called the Department of Agriculture here about using one piece lids, she had said to me "if you have a hot jar, a hot lid and hot product, you've maintained the integrity of the process" (I was nervous about the one piece lids as you can't check them very well).

So I started to do what Pixie has done but doing two jars at a time. Pull out two, fill and place lid. So far, so good - no more failures.