Why do my two blue spruce trees look different?

12 years ago

I am new here. I need your help to figure out why my two newly planted blue spruce trees look quite different.

I bought the two trees from two different places.

The first blue spruce was a small one, about 4-5ft. It looks very full, with 'chabby' branches. Now it has a lot of new growth. It looks very healthy.

The second one was planted yesterday, by a different nursery. It is 6-7ft tall. The seller said it is a picea pungens. But the branches are much narrower than those of the smaller one. It does have new growth too, but not as much as the small one either. Some parts around the lower half don't have new growth at all. It has a rather dull color, desipte being in June. (I will try to see if I can post a picture of this taller tree).

My question is why they look so different, being the same kind of trees? Was it due to different ways of pruning when they were young? Or due to different cutivers, if there are such things? Are there ways I can use to make the taller one's branches grow thicker?

Thanks so much for your help in advance!

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Comments (11)

donn_
12 years ago
There are lots of cultivars of P.pungens, including:

var glauca

'Fat Albert'

'Glauca Pendula' AKA 'Glauca procumbens' or 'Glauca Prostrata'

'Hoopsii'

'Iseli Fastigiata'

'Iseli Foxtail'

'Koster' AKA 'Kosteri'

'Moerheim' AKA 'Moerheimii'

'Montgomery'

'Pendula'

'Thompsenii' AKA 'Thompsen' or 'Thomsen'

How they were raised can certainly have something to do with what they look like now.
soniaswang
Original Author
12 years ago
can you see the picture of the second tree?
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sandigodude, The first thing I noticed from your pictures was the extremely steep angle of your planting area - what is that, at least a 30 degree slope?!! Then, couple that with the fact that you have very infrequent rains, plus have a clay underlayer that turns to something akin to brick in SoCal's dessert conditions - I definitely think watering issues are your main problem here! I can actually picture in my mind the minimal water you're giving each week just sheeting down that slope. And don't think that running the water longer will help, either - it'll just continue to flow downhill. Also, applying mulch (on that degree of slope) will be useless, since the water that seeps below the mulch will only sheet once it hits that dry clay layer. I know this, since I too live on a hill (though mine is probably closer to only a 20 degree slope) and I have a clay soil as well! Only difference is, here in the Bay Area, we get a little more rain than you (and I was still getting the sheeting problem I mentioned using MY drip system!). You mention that you have a neighbor that can grow citrus. Are they similarly situated on a steep incline/decline? How old are their trees? I don't think clay is the issue here (you can be certain that if you have clay, they have it too!). If theirs are more established/older trees on the same/similar grade yard, I suspect they were planted correctly to begin with. How do you do this? If you look towards the end of the Sunset Western Gardening book, there's an illustration/instructions on planting on steep slopes. As a few people above have alluded, you'll want to create a horizontal/level terrace on which to plant each citrus tree (I would actually recommend digging up the ones you have in the ground now and start over). From looking at your pictures, you can either dig back into the hill or place soil on the down-slope side of the planting - just make sure it's big enough. I'd say a 4 ft. LEVEL/horizontal diameter should do. Also, don't forget to mound up the edges so as to create a basin that can hold the water, slow it down, and allow it to seep downwards into the roots (as opposed to down the slope!). If you're worried about the clay being too slow to drain water, when digging your level terrace, you can amend the clay with compost that's mounded just a bit higher than the clay underlayer, and this should help very well with any draining issues you might have. Finally, you'll want to heavily mulch (at least a 2-3 inch layer) the entire basin you've created up to about 6-12 inches from the tree's trunk to additionally help hold water (this is what I've done for my trees). Remember, the key is that citrus like periodic deep watering (and they obtain water/nutrients from the first 18 inches of soil), so you'll have to guage how much that is based on your local environment (I previously watered my new trees 2x/week at 5 gal/watering for the first year, for example) - I like Susan's dowel idea! Best of luck, and let us know how it goes! Tim
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Wow - you dug up a seriously old post! So I did end up planting a very long screen -- basically the entire length of the property line -- and I'm actually really happy with how it turned out. We used Thuja Green Giant arborvitae in the center where the tallest part of the house we are trying to block out is -- we planted them a decent distance apart, not all jammed up like I see people do for a property line screen. They have grown fast, widened out, and are basically almost up to the roof of the house we are trying to hide. I think they should cap out right about 35 feet or so, which won't block the view. We planted a few during our initial planting then filled in with a few more a couple years later -- those later plantings are a bit stunted - not sure if it's because we squeezed them into less space or they were just inferior to begin with (originals came from a nursery and were planted by a landscaper, later ones from Home Depot and we DIYed them). But they are all growing well and healthy, and seem impervious to deer, wind, cold, snow, etc. To the sides of the arborvitate, we used Nellie Stevens hollies. They too have grown fast. They don't much care for the wind -- they ended up looking pretty bad by the end of the last two winters (which were brutally cold and windy) but they filled in with new leaves in the spring. The deer don't seem to eat them either. And again, I think they cap out at 20 feet or so. To the sides of that (which is getting away from blocking the house and now just screening their yard from ours) we used forsythias planted very close together that we let grow wild into a thick hedge -- mainly because I love forsythia. It's not evergreeen but the hedge is so thick and branches are so close together that it does a decent job of screening even in winter. And in spring when it is in bloom, it is an absolutely stunning wall of yellow. Again the deer don't bother them and they seem to grow well without much care. And finally at the very end of the property lines, we used sea green junipers -- again, we were looking for something evergreen but it didn't need to be tall - we were only trying to hide the neighbor's "junk pile" which was unfortunately located so that it was the first thing you saw when you pulled into our driveway. Those are the plants that look the sickliest -- there's always big brown patches in them and the snow breaks the branches. But they are farthest from the house and from far away they look ok, so I don't mind them. I think if I had to do it over again, I'd have used all forsythia instead of also using juniper -- the forsythia are just so amazingly gorgeous when they are in bloom. I would take a picture for you but we are in the middle of a storm right now -- if I remember, I will get one tomorrow. Here's a link to a pic of what it looked like when we first planted itin 2009: Newly planted And here's a shot from the summer of 2012 (sorry for lousy pic -- best I could find): Three years old I would say that this year it really started to look good since the green giants are basically touching now.
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donn_
12 years ago
I see a picture of a Blue Spruce with two stakes. It's a very even and well-balanced tree, but if the fence is plumb, the Spruce isn't.
soniaswang
Original Author
12 years ago
Could you tell from my above picture which cultivar I have?
soniaswang
Original Author
12 years ago
the tree is plumb. I am more concerned about the lower half of the tree with so little new growth. It's not shown on the picture...on the other side, a big portion of it doesn't have any new growth.
donn_
12 years ago
I can't tell which cultivar it is.
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
12 years ago
picea pungens are seed grown ...

of every 100 seeds.. you might get 60 green ones ... 39 blue ones ... and one super blue ... in theory.. they are all different based on genetics ... its all in the seeds

most super blues have been named ... and if you want that super blue one.. you buy that named variety .... and they are all exactly the same.. because they have been grafted ... vs seed grown ...

so that is why they are different. ...

now.. if we presume.. that a tree is twice as big underground as above ... then you can understand that 90% of the roots were cut off your 6 footer ... it should be rather understandable.. that it may not flush out new growth as heartily as it might otherwise ...

and i smaller transplant ... will be proportionally less effected ..

i would give them about 2 to 3 years to re-establish their root mass.. before i would start worrying about them.. your only goal.. is to get them to live...

so.. its possible they may never look exactly the same ...

if you care to post a pic of the other... then maybe they can compare ..

below is a specimen of picea pungen Hoopsi .... planted from one foot tall .. allowed to grow naturally.. rather than shearing it into a xmas tree form ... i would suggest you forget about them being twins of each other as to form.. and just let them do their own things ....

ken

{{gwi:205545}}
dcsteg
12 years ago
It will take 2 years to reestablish itself. By the third year you can expect it to push normal growth or close to it depending on how well it was cared for.

For now most of its energy will be directed to the top half of the plant with little or weak candle extension down low.

Dave
soniaswang
Original Author
12 years ago
Ken, the 'chubby' branches on the small blue spruce that I talked about in my initial post look just like those on the hoopsi that you posted. See how plump they are!

but the new growth on the second blue spruce of mine are so thin. of course the second one's older branches are also thinner. That was why I thought this is a different kind of blue spruce. I guess there isn't much I can do at this point.

Thanks so much for all your info and advice!
Toronado3800 Zone 6 St Louis
12 years ago
I think it is a pretty darned decent looking tree you have.

One thing Ken usually says is don't worry too much, or is it kill it with love.

BTW. I only see one picture.
ken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
12 years ago
my pic.. 2 to 4 weeks from bud extension ...

your pic.. a day or two ...

give it time.. see how it flushes out

ken

Why do my two blue spruce trees look different?

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Why do my two blue spruce trees look different?

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