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Soil, Compost & Mulch

Pine Needles on Veggie Patch?

17 years ago

Hello all-

I scored BIGTIME yesterday in the Pine Needle department; it's yard-waste pickup time here in the business/residental area where I work. Anyway, have 20+ lawn/leaf size bags of needles, and hoping that these will be a good (free) choice to put on my veggie patch to keep the weeds down.

Last year I played mostly in the front yard flower beds, and sadly, neglected the veggie patch til it was too late. It was over-run with weeds, and there was no way I could catch up. I made a lame attempt, but it didn't take priority.

This year I'd like to lay these down THICK so that the weeding effort is reduced.

How much acid (or let me rephrase that)...will the acid cause damage in the veggie patch, or does it not leach into the soil quickly enough to adversely affect things?

Thanks; I searched, but found only the reference in the FAQs for PNs. Google articles say it is a good choice, but they don't have the 'experts' that we do here :D

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Comments (11)

pablo_nh
17 years ago
I wouldn't worry about acid problems. I'd put them down 3-4" thick, and save the rest. They will start composting on the bottom, and if you've saved some- then you can top them up mid summer.

Good score!
mmqchdygg
Original Author
17 years ago
doh! I forgot to check the veggie board (I don't usually go there, but posted this yesterday on a 'weed' thread) for any responses- thank you gonefishin for your post on that.

I was pretty thrilled about the score, plus the DH is currently at the JD store picking up the new RT...how exciting is THIS??!!!!

Guess what I'll be doing this weekend! Funfunfun!!!
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Pine straw makes a kind of unique mulch for veggies in that it does not break down fast and so you can't expect to "dig it in" after a season. So as susan2010 said, you need to move it aside to plant or rake it off and re-apply it if you plan to spade up the soil or add amendments or whatever. OTOH it is easy to do that, as it is both fluffy and matted together and much easier to grab and set aside and then pile back on than other more durable mulches like bark nuggets or something. So, in one of my veggie areas that I turn over several times a year and keep very fertile with amendments for things that like rich soil, I usually use shredded leaves or compost for mulch, and I "save" my pine straw for mulching under shrubs and places I don't disturb much. But that's because I have some of this and some of that. If you have access to a large amount, by all means it is a good mulch.
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Calliope, the pines I mentioned are a windbreak which the owners can just ignore, as they have several acres of them,, so they probably won't be happy for someone taking them, it won't affect them much. They may think I have lost my marbles if I ask for them. It bothers me to have my Chestnut oak mulch ring 2/3 done, and the unfinished area so bare-looking, with a mostly decomposed hardwood mulch pie shaped slice. Well, I made it enourmous. I think I will just rake up from our white pines to finish. I think next fall I will put an add in the paper or a local trade/buy catalog for pine needles and pay $1.00 a garbage bag-ful. I won't have to keep checking the public leaf dumps (2 of em) and I can still use leaves, which are always plentiful at the leaf dumps. I can get my quota of them easy that way. I will of course gather them up if I can find them at the leaf dump. My mom's brother works at the township shed, where they collect leaves at one site, but he is too important to help me with collecting needles and leaves. They burn them instead. Or I need to get there soon after they are dumped. All I asked for is a heads up when there is a good pile of them, Well, I will use ours to finish the chestnut oak circle, and tackle others next spring, if needed. I don't mean to whine, although I have.
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Thanks guys! I looked up on the internet (just for kicks) and I officially live right in the middle of more than 250 square miles of solid pine trees... They have been burning all the underbrush lately so I don't think they will mind if I rake up some pine needles... If I can figure some way to bale it up I could export the stuff....
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Jan, I have exactly the same problem with a neighbour's pine tree. Recognising that the roots of this very large tree could cause a problem, and before planting that part of the garden, I built a low retaining wall 10cm in from the fence and then built the soil up in front of it by about 50-60cm. Hopefully, by the time the roots of my plants are down far enough to compete with the pine tree they will be well on their way. As for the needles, I should point out that I'm a bit of a garden tragic and have been known to pick them up!
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rhizo_1 (North AL) zone 7
17 years ago
Pine straw has proved to prevent the germination of certain weed and veggie seeds, so don't seed your garden into the mulch, but apply it over the top of existing plants.
ediej1209 AL Zn 7
17 years ago
Do the pine needles need to age or can I use them more-or-less right off the tree? DH trimmed some of our huge pine trees a couple of weeks ago. I haven't stripped the needles off the branches he cut off yet and wasn't sure whether I can use them now or if they needed to go into the compost heap first? Thanks!
pablo_nh
17 years ago
Use them now. With smallish branches- I lay them on top- branches and all.
ediej1209 AL Zn 7
17 years ago
Great - more freebies! Thanks, I feel better now. Will get that done this weekend.
jason_2007
17 years ago
speaking of pine needles, check out my pics, not sure what type of pines these are maybe someone can help, but we have about 35 of these large soft needle pines on our property and have a huge amount of pine needles that drop every year,please check out the link to the pics and help me id these pines.ps: our new rotti pup got in the way of some of my shots, it loves digging through these needles some spots are over 5-6 inches thick with pine needles.

Here is a link that might be useful: pine tree and pine needle pics
pablo_nh
17 years ago
White pine- same as I have. White and red look similar. If there's 5 needles in a bunch it's a white pine, if 3 needles- it's a red. (5 letters in white, 3 letters in "red")

The pooch looks like he/she's having fun
donn_
17 years ago
I don't use them whole on veggies any more. I found they were too good a hiding place for Earwigs. I'm using double-shredded pine 'stuff' including needles, cones and other pine leavings for the veggies now. I tried it around Peppers and Tomatoes last year, and it worked great. It's dense enough it seems to displease the 'wigs.

I once figured I'd have to use pine-type mulch for over a hundred years to change the acidity of my acid soil.
Kimmsr
17 years ago
It is not which or how long pine needles are around but the total amount used that would have enough affect on the soil to see a change in pH and that would be tons. Dr. Abigail Maynhard, at the UCONN Ag Research Station in New Haven, Conn has added pine needles to a garden plot for years and reports that she has not seen a significant change in soil pH from that. Numerous other soil scientinst report the same results from all over the world.
mmqchdygg
Original Author
17 years ago
Thanks, everyone...the garden is tilled...ON THEY GO!!! Oh, wait, I guess I should wait for the grassy-stuffs to dry out first, huh? Besides, the robins are having a buffet right now, so I'll give them a few days to fatten up.

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