Thank you for your effort to educate me but I learned early in my undergraduate years exactly what an abstract is. For those who may not know, reading abstracts and drawing scientific conclusions from them is like reading the dust jacket of a novel and thinking you understand the book's deeper meanings. An abstract, by necessity, ignores the methodology, experimental results, etc and is often wrongly used as a substitute for reading the full article by lazy students and amateur scientists. And while I am not the scientist that Crankyoldman fancies himself, I do have a technical background that requires me to read actual articles in journals, professional magazines and technical manuals (not just abstracts, I can't bluff my way through life on the Cliffs Notes plan,) and I can assure you that a history of actual reading does qualify me to read the directions and warning labels on containers. (I assume you were expressing actual concern about my reading abilities rather than just being boorishly condescending.) The initial post warned about the dire dangers of using Rotenone, yet evidence that Rotenone, used as directed, i.e. applied to plants in a controlled manner, was, sadly, forgotten. All I've seen were lists of Google hits and abstracts that ~may~ contain some evidence that Rotenone, when used as directed, will cause Parkinson's, as Finnbiker implied and you reinforce. I going to have to assume that you've read nothing so far that substantiates this or you would have said something to the effect of "Look at the June, 2006 issue of Journal of Something Or Another, Page 43, in the discussion where Dr. So and So concludes that the field research clearly shows that the occasional garden use of Rotenone, per recommended application rates in a garden setting, will cause such and such disease." But you seem reluctant to divulge this info. If Finnbiker or you believe Rotenone to be dangerous when used as directed, is it too much to expect that you demonstrate it, not imply it while you so vehemently sound the alarm? So, again, posting a link to a list of abstracts does nothing to prove your points. Telling me to read all of the abstracts you've found to find some evidence that may or may not exist, and that you yourself seem to have no clue as to where to find it is just a silly game on your part, one that I am not going to play. However, it may surprise you to know that I actually did read (or, more honestly, skimmed) through some of the complete articles. (You do know that you can limit your search on that site to only articles with free text available, don't you? A useful feature if you plan to actually read an article.) I did find a few notable quotes regarding a link to Parkinson's Disease: "... several other risk factors are associated with an increased risk of developing PD, including rural living, well-water consumption, and farming. We found no studies that have been able to determine whether these risk factors are independent risk factors or correlated with pesticide exposure." "At present, the weight of evidence is sufficient to conclude that a generic association between pesticide exposure and PD exists but is insufficient for concluding that this is a causal relationship or that such a relationship exists for any particular pesticide compound or combined pesticide and other exogenous toxicant exposure." And: "However, Betarbet et al. (2000) also reported that rotenone seems to have little toxicity when administered orally (Sherer TB, Greenamyre JT, unpublished data)." All the data presented does confirm that intraperitoneal injections of Rotenone into rats will cause Parkinson-like symptoms. (I haven't yet had the need to use Rotenone in that manner.) But nothing I've seen there directly links Parkinson’s to occasional use of Rotenone as directed in the garden. It may be there and I haven't found it and, for some reason or another, you refuse to say where it is to be found, preferring to try to send me on a fool's errand. Since no one is pointing to any studies that implicate the occasional use of Rotenone in a garden setting, I'm just going to wait until someone does. If and when that happens, then I'll thank you as you (prematurely) expect us to now. And, I'll stop the occasional use of Rotenone in gardening. (Occasional, in my case being perhaps two or three times over the last 5 years.) I've nothing more to say on the subject. I'll watch for some sign that you have actually have read any of the articles and found something substantive concerning the real-world use of Rotenone that you are willing to reference. Wayne

Using an inefficient pump is also a problem in green house gas generation. Just like with our cars, even though 4 or fewer cylinders will get you there comfortably, six and eights are preferred. There really is no good reason, but people buy them anyway. Pond pumps are also able to do the job more efficiently than utility or sump pumps, and are designed for the job they do. You can get there real fast and spend a lot on the gas to do that, or you can get there fast enough, and spend half as much on gas. Same with water pumps. You can spend a lot of money to move the water, or you can spend less. You can risk polluting your water with oil, or you can get a safe pump. Any of the primary options creates bigger problems for the planet. I try to live efficiently. And hope others will too, as it is less expensive personally, and more healthy for everyone in the long run. Being able to afford to do something wrong, doesn't make it right. If you can't find the right way to spend your money, give it to someone that can. Oh, in the interest of full disclosure, I am not perfect, that is god's business. I am simply trying to be excellent! (Though still FAR from that!) I smoke, I drink, I use weed killer, I use bug killer, I drive a car, I have an OLD septic system, I have some incandescent light bulbs, and I have a chlorinated swimming pool. But, I smoke and drink less than I used to. I follow the directions on the killer cans, and use them now as a LAST resort, I drive a car that gets 38 mi/gal, have compact florescents in my most used fixtures, and want to convert the pool to a pond, just couldn't sell the Mrs. on it. Yes, I have a long way to go, but I am better now than ever, and encourage others to try to improve as well. Little bits here and there from everyone, ad up to big bits that are good for everyone. So please, use the most efficient pump you can. -TT -TT

"Are BSF timid creatures, or am I most likely going to have them crawling on me or flying around when I'm checking out my bin?" Some people really love their BSFL, as much as we love our worms. They too worry about them when they have to leave them for a few days. My understanding is that when BSFL are about 3/4 inch long and smaller they are white. Then as they mature they turn black and hard like little armadillos. Then they hide. The flys that emerge are like large houseflies but they do not land on poop and then on food. They avoid people, poop and food and want to find a bit of rot to lay their eggs on. They fly erratically. Slow when they are just warming up. Then faster. They are black with some of their leg area white. I think you would like the fly and the mature larvae and not be afraid of them. The thing that is cool about the white larvae is if one puts lets say the remains of a fish that the fillets have been harvest from into the bin, the the BSFL boil over the remains so actively that the remains float over the top of the activity and wonder around the container while getting smaller and smaller until they are all gone. Maybe let your helper know that these types of things in the bin are normal so they will not be startled. There is the cutest youtube that shows a little girl with a handful of BSFL feeding then to her chickens. If they knew that even little girls are not afraid of them then they might be more ok with them. Me I do not even touch my worms except with a 10 inch stick. Not even with gloves on. Maybe the scarriest thing to ever happen was I had noticed a few things out of place around the bin lately. Things were a bit mess with the vermicomost. I thought I was just sloppy. One day I put food in the top of the bin and out of the bottom a mouse jumped and darted off of my leg. I screamed like a little girl. Then I laughed a lot because I screamed. Many people love furry mice as pets. Maybe not me. I wonder if he was eating my worms. I move the material around in my bin to learn what is going on. As I am more confident I know what is happening in there and as vermicomposting is not my newest hobby, and I am not possessed with knowing what is going on with the little guys, I am more likely to leave them alone. Then my activity with the bin would more resemble how sbryce advises. Like him I would flip the bottom material over for the same reasons. Or gain interest in flow through bins like I have. I would think the cloth worm inns would work nice for you. Just put the stuff food by the tons and bedding in at the top. Zip it in. Water frequently. Harvest at the bottom. Supposedly no need to separate worms. They do dry out fast but the activity of adding water is pleasant for some. Others may have fish tank change water they want to use. I would think that maybe the condition of the material might be gauged a tiny bit by just squeezing the bag. I do not have one. Some people sew their own. Having a strong enough stand to hold mega weight is important. I guess like not buying the first year of a car I am waiting for them to come out with the new and improved version. I think mine would dry out. That would be ... ... .,. very bad for the worms. A homemade plastic bin is more resilient in that way.

you may want to get the entire building to adopt a change and address this. I agree with you completely on that issue, which is actually why I have liked the current setup in our bin--we are greatly motivated to unplug it. I don't want something that operates with a switch. Extension cords make me & DH antsy, and we won't go upstairs and leave them plugged in. In fact, right now we have to unplug it in order to close and lock the door, which is why I haven't yet just used cord slips to anchor the cord to the wall. And why I may never do that (but I have tried stick-on temporary cord clips, but putting the cord in and out each time we were down there was too much for them, and they were pulled or fell off the wall). I might try the Velcro idea, because it would be so fast to stick the cord up when we're working, and pull it back down when we're done. But you've also got me thinking that maybe I'll bring this issue up to the rest of the building, and ask them to show me their lighting setup for their storage closets/bins. (I'm the director in charge of electrical, which means I would have the authority to address this without seeming like a nosy person. And it explains why I am crabby at having people assume I am so stupid that I'd modify the actual wiring. With lamp cord, no less!!) And I can check to be sure that the other lighting setups are safe. Because at the receptacle the other day, I spotted someone's cord still plugged in. Nobody's bin was open, and nobody's light was on. So I unplugged it. That also gives me an opening to bring this issue up.