i am partial to the variegated one.. sorry.. dont have a name ... [V lantana Variegata]

and Mohawk.. the fragrant one ... though i think there are other fragrant ones under different names ...

i bet you will be hard pressed to keep any of them below 6 feet.. over the years.. unless you learn and use rejuvenation pruning ...

though it would not surprise me that there are dwarf versions.. that i am not aware of ...

i am down in adrain MI ... so both are hardy

ken

Here is a link that might be useful: who needs plain old green

Thanks Ken, I dont mind if they are over 6 ft, I just didn't want anything under 6 ft. 12 ft would be about the max height I want.

I would go to the main page of the shrubs forum and do a search (down below the list of threads) for Viburnum. There have been some quite extensive discussions of which Viburnums will successfully pollenate each other for berry production from experts, some of whom aren't too active on this forum now, though the threads are still there. You will find lots more info than you can probably absorb.

but are you understanding.. that frankly.. they never stop growing..

most size estimates are at 10 years ... and at 20.. they have the potential to be twice as big ...

my first house was next to a funeral home ... nice quiet neighbor [except for the police man funeral that involved a bagpipe tuning at 7am in the morning .. the playing brought chills.. the tuning sounded like someone was out there strangling a goose ... not that i ever heard that ]... they had some V that were 20 feet tall.. and 30 feet wide.. probably been there 30 plus years ...

on just about any shrub... you 'maintain' them.. at the size you want .. or need ... they do not mysteriously stop growing at some magical height ... and that maintenance is called REJUVENATION PRUNING OF SHRUBS ... and is not necessarily simply giving them a haircut ... aka shearing ....

ken

For summer fruiting viburnums, the Arrowwood Viburnum clan (Viburnum dentatum) can be an excellent choice. These plants reach 8-12' easily (and they don't grow on to 25-50', no matter how old they get), flower prolifically with white flowers, and set heavy crops of dark blue fruit.

Your important consideration will be selecting two differing clones of the species, so that you have adequate cross-pollination opportunities.

Check for older threads on this subject, as suggested before. There are several. I'd suggest a couple selections from choices like Red Regal, Cardinal, Indian Summer, Red Feather, and Raspberry Tart for reliable fall color in the reds/oranges range.

Another excellent species (highly underused...) is Viburnum cassinoides. There are a handful of fine selections in this species: Buccaneer, Challenger, Defender, Endeavor, Freedom - and maybe more by now. This species has sturdy foliage which generates a range of fall colors with red, burgundy, orange, and yellow highlights. Fruit clusters mature from green through cream, pink, reddish, to blue.

Other species likely to perform well in Michigan include Viburnum nudum and Viburnum trilobum, comfortably in the size range you mention. I also really like Viburnum sargentii and Viburnum sieboldii, which can get quite a bit larger.

All the fragrant forms are very nice plants, too, but are not often grown for fruit display. Doesn't mean you can't, however. Select a nice Viburnum carlesii, and pair it with Viburnum x juddii or Viburnum x 'Cayuga', and you should have a durable show of reddish fruit that will mature to black by fall.

If you gave more information about your site conditions (exposure, soils, moisture, etc.), the list could be tailored more closely to suit. I don't personally think you could go wrong with anything you choose - the genus is THAT good.

VV said: All the fragrant forms are very nice plants, too, but are not often grown for fruit display.

==>>> but see .. in my variegated world ... V are a bunch of green plants ... and i want something more than green all season ...

so a variegated one does that.. season long interest.. but really Gawd awful flower stink ... and berries ...

whereas.. comparatively.. the berry thing.. is ONLY fall/early winter ... and green the rest of the season ...

of course.. this is what defines me as a collector of various things ...

dont forget to look to the entirety of the season.. rather than one characteristic ...

so i guess what i am saying.. is i only own two V .. and that is for a most glorious spring scented flower ... and an all summer cool variegated plant ...

and the birds are on their own.. lol ... like they really need me to feed them.. darn rats with feathers and wings.. lol ...

ken

You have to accept the premise that green foliage is unattractive and uninteresting, versus finding attractive foliage that looks like it is infected with some viral disease. Which said: the "variegated" foliage does NOT change with the season either, rather it just looks bicolor (and unhealthy at that) all season.

Stipulating that - one can camp with ken.

I believe that various plants (in this case, Viburnum species) have plenty of variety for the eye over the multiple seasons. The time of flowering, fruiting, foliage, fall color, form - all these things are a joy in the landscape. None are exactly the same shade of green. All produce new growth at differing times. Flowering times vary. Fruiting occurs, and matures, over a very long time.

Thou dost protesteth too much, methinks...

Thanks for all the ideas, I think I will check local nursery's for a combination of Viburnum dentatum. Now the hard part, removing the grass!!

I grew Viburnum dentatum 'Blue Muffin' for about 5 years and didn't like it at all. No fall color, berries not all that visible, and then the Viburnum beetles decimated it, so last fall it was cut to the ground and burned. None of my other Viburnums have had any of these issues, so just letting you know that IME there are better choices than this particular variety.

I have an old carlesii that needs rejuvenating-I think it's at least 40 years old. Could I cut it down to about a foot this fall? do you think it would kill it?

I have an old carlesii that needs rejuvenating-I think it's at least 40 years old. Could I cut it down to about a foot this fall? do you think it would kill it?

If you want an eye-popping viburnum, try hobblebush (V. lantanoides). It is fairly slow-growing and hard to find, but WHAT a plant! It has huge, round, puckered, 9-inch leaves held in pairs along slender stems, with beautiful flower clusters held upright along the stems. The flowers are similar to Cranberry bush (V. trilobum), with a disc of fertile flowers surrounded by a ring of showy sterile flowers. As for "plain green", I think variegation is overdone - The leaves on Hobblebush are interesting enough on their own. The leaves have an incredible fall color, changing early in September (I've seen them in full color in Late August in the southern Appalachians), with clusters of bright-red, large berries.

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Of course, every plant has its drawbacks - Hobblebush doesn't do too well in direct sun in warmer zones, preferring deep shade. It isn't too demanding of soil conditions, as long as the soil is moist and somewhat well-drained. Besides that, it is next to imposible to locate in the nursery trade. I've found only one site (Eastern Plant Specialties) that sells small plants for $38 - Ridiculous, if you ask me. There is also Native Haunts Nursery in Maine, but they're out of stock for now. I haven't had much luck with seed so far.

The plants take on a much neater presence in cultivation.

My Viburnum nudum 'Bulk' has draw dropping fruit color right now. I have to get a picture soon.

Viburnum x pragense is another awesome plant. The texture and color is quite a amazing.

In general I'm a sucker for the thick leaved varieties like Viburnum x rhytidophylloides Alleghany.

Viburnum prunifolium 'Forest Rouge' is another great one. Closer to the 12' mark, but will take some time to get there.

The only species that I'm not a huge fan of that I can grow are V. dentatum and trilobum, just because their foilage isn't as interesting to me as others.