Hopefully they're buying a good roof so you won't have to deal with this again soon.
Have you tried calling the company to make them aware that the crew has told you they intend to negate the arrangements you agreed to? This has been effective for me in the past because frequently the person who does the preliminary estimates and sets everything up isn't on site and the information may not have trickled down. Calling them seems to get the information flowing again.

If that doesn't help, I do have six big brothers that I'd be quite happy to send out to supervise them. My sister and I would be ecstatic to let them "brother" someone else for a while. :)

Lilydude may have a point. Whats it worth to you. And if thats a hip roof, the contractors are going to have to redo their estimate(more$$), perhaps to include a barrier or scafolding - sort of like if they were working downtown to prevent falling debris on pedestrians(potato bins). I live in the country so this would never happen to me. If I lived in an urban area where my neighbor had only a 3' side yard?, I would expect him, at some point to need to access my yard to paint his house, clean or replace windows etc. A judge may/will side with landlord/propery owners, but NOT to merely make life easy(cheaper) for contractors/property owners. The judge WOULD have a problem with any kind of intimdation. My advice, is to ask them to reschedule the roof job to the fall - after gardening season. Sounds reasonable to me. Document everything and call the police vs an attorney. Worst case is small claims court. My professional advise - scour your yard for roofing nails!!!

I have a feeling that everyone is getting overwrought for nothing, here. I have a feeling that purplemage misheard something and then began to fear the worst of all possible scenarios. My bet is that at some point purplemage will report that it was all a misunderstanding on her part, and the roofers managed to do their work without turning her life upside down. I cannot imagine professional roofers to be so clueless about a neighbor's property rights. Y'all see.

ligardner - 'hood landlords don't generally use "professional roofers"; they go for cheapest possible. Those folks will walk all over anyone they think they can get by with. Been there, done that; thank goodness we moved from the 'hood to the country.
PM, I hope you don't have any damage; that's a really nice-looking garden you have there. Do call the police and let them know what you were told. The yellow tape idea is good advice. Let us know how things progress, and hang in there - we're all pullin' for you.

Hi all...here's an update:

First off, the person I've been talking to *is* the owner. Secondly, although what he has said seems threatening...he has not been out of line in the way he is expressing himself (in terms of tone of voice, etc..). Thridly (?) apparently he is the only worker on the roof.

lilydude-don't forget, I'm in zone 5...it's getting late to be re-starting a garden. Potatoes would be nearly out of the question...as would most cole crops. Furthermore, I would have to rent a tiller, transport it, do the rework, purchase the plants, etc.. and actually have the time to re-do it...did I mention I work 40+hrs per week and have a two year old child? ;)

I spoke with him directly yesterday and he simply kept repeating to me that "I can guarantee that your garden will be unharmed if you let me move your bin and trellis and drive the trailer over this bed, with the tires in the foot path... without doing that, I will guarantee that your garden will be damaged by roofing material."

I asked him if a structure could be built to protect my garden and he said it would be ineffective under the weight of the roof debris and that he will not guarantee the damage wouldn't result anyway.

He has offered to "buy" my potato bin. My fear is that if I let him on the property at all or agree to any compromise that that's essentially is giving them permission to do what they want in there and any damage caused will then be my fault for allowing them.

My main struggle is that my garden is my therapy...for 7 months out of the year. I have to have that therapy...I spend my entire work week listening to other people's BS, drama, b*$%#es and complaints (I'm a psychotherapist)...and I bring it home and bury it in my garden. Letting my garden go feels like letting a piece of my soul go.

Does that make any sense? Do others feel that way about their garden?

I want to have my garden and be able to allow them to do the roof. I want to be nice and amicable and flexible and open minded, but I don't want to risk losing my plants. I don't believe there is a compromise.

Thanks for letting me vent.
Sincerely,

'purplemage', who is considering selling her soul to a roofer. :(

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You're really being kinda silly - as other posters have told you, it's YOUR land, he CANNOT legally mess with it, he is liable for ANY damages. Just tell him to leave your area alone. Next time you talk to him, keep a tape recorder running in your pocket so you can collect evidence to use if he does eventually mess with your stuff.

Do like the posters have said, call the police, an attorney, etc. Also, the fact that he IS the owner is even better for you - it's not a contractor who could just skip out after the damage is done, never to be found again - you know exactly where this guy lives.

Just tell him straight "do not mess with my garden - no ifs, ands, or buts - this is not a negotiation"

PurpleMage, surely your situation is not unique. Meaning, yours is not the only roofing job whereupon the roofer must be careful not to desturb the ground area below. Roofers have ways to compensate for this situation. This adds an element of complcation to the job and therefore an additional cost. It just sounds to me like the approach that the owner wants to take would be the one which is quick and simple and doesn't add cost. This is expected. But, this approach happens to be the one that will most likely trash your garden.

I'm thinking that if I were you I'd likely phone a few roofers in the phone book and explain the situation to them. Ask them if it is possible to remove a roof without disturbing the area below, albeit at a higher project cost. Some will probably tell you that they don't want to do this. But, I'd bet there are those who would. Finding a roofer or roofers who can handle this situation would be very helpful information to have during your debate with the owner.

its a matter of principle,your garden. you take pride in, for me its not money, you can't buy the love you put into a garden to make it grow. why can he pitch the debris off the front of his house,pull the truck up in front of his house, YOU GO GIRL

I have to agree with goofburger, you are kinda being naive about this. The time for being nice has clearly passed. Nice people get stepped on in situations like this. Take the appropriate action or deal with the fallout.

Believe you me that he (the roofer) is pretty confident that you wont take any action at all after the fact against him EVEN if he destroys or severely damages your garden. And the time it would take for you to get any compensation, well I guarantee you that dealing with a legal issue will take you forever and you may or may not win. Meanwhile he's ruined your garden and gotten away with it.

Perhaps you need to issue a restraining order against the roofer or find some other legal action that is comprable to disallow his company from tresspassing on your property? Posting no tresspassing signs seems pretty obvious.

If this garden is so important to you, why on earth would you be so accomodating. If your children had a play area where your garden is, would you allow him to drive his truck there while risking their safety? It's your property PERIOD. You have ZERO obligation to negotiate with him. Your character is not being judged here.

I would imagine if one of your patients presented with a similiar situation, your advice to them would be identical to all those who have posted advice and suggestions to YOU.... END OF STORY.

This guy is not being honest with you. All they are doing is scraping the shingles off the roof and depositing them in a pile or receptacle somewhere. The idea that this cannot be done without infringing on your property is ridiculous. It is merely the most convenient way to use your property. It's simply less convenient to scrape the shingles, and then move them to the front or other side of the house for collection. This is his problem, not yours. He is attempting to use you and your property to make his job easier.
Your question about building a protective structure is a good one. It is a bald-faced lie to say that it couldn't be built strong enough. They're tossing the shingles off the roof one shovel-full at a time. It's simply a lie saying that a simple structure couldn't do the job. The fact is, building a structure is more inconvenience and expense for *him*, which can be avoided by taking advantage of *you* and your property.
Clearly, this guy wants to make his work easier by using and damaging your property. He is also lying to you at his convenience.

You can be nice and amicable and still say no :-). "Nice" does not equal "pushover".

If the roofer can't do the job without going on your property, then he is just going to have to turn down the job, and the landlord can keep looking until he finds a roofer who CAN do the job without going on your property.

If I were you, I would tell the roofer, nicely :-), that I'm sorry, but from now on, he's not allowed onto my property.

Ok my turn......I was confused at first why someone would think you would just "move your garden" but now I see what he wants to do. And it would probably work well.

He wants to park the truck/trailer over the garden so he can throw the shingles in it. Well it worked when they did it in my driveway and it was only there for about a day and a half. Granted the driveway isn't a garden but it would probably be the best bet. He's gotta get them off the roof and frankly I wouldn't do the bucket thing if I was a contractor. Who knows what he would do if you had a privacy fence but he doesn't have to deal with that.

Good luck and I hope it works out.

They said they will destroy my garden...can they?

Of course they can't. I can't believe you are even asking the question much less letting the issue drag on so long. It is your property and they have no rights to it or on it unless you allow it. End of story.

Your neighbor clearly sees you as a sucker and is playing you for one. And you are letting him. Quit whining, trying to bargain, and trying to negotiate. Just say no to him, no access allowed, no trucks/bins, no damage allowed, no covered structure, no nothing, then plug into the real world and move on.

Dave

"My main struggle is that my garden is my therapy..."

and

"Does that make any sense? Do others feel that way about their garden?"

Yes, it makes perfect sense. When I get home from work I like to do one of two things. If something is in season in my garden, my 6 year old and I head out to the garden to snack on the veggies and see how growth is coming along. If nothing is in season I go out to do some light weeding. Most people hate weeding. Either one is my daily therapy. My release from work and the daily shift of gears from work to home.

Don't let this man infringe on your sanity. You have said it yourself, if you let him have an inch in your yard, he will take it as permission to do as he wishes. He has no rights here and it is your castle! Be polite, but defend it.

Good luck and enjoy the garden...

Steve

My neighbor's garage is one foot off our property line. She had to have the roof on her house and garage replaced a few years ago.

The roofing company employees carefully dropped the old shingles in the back of their truck which was parked in front of the garage and along the side of the house on the drive side...they did not drop debris in her yard on the other sides of the house or garage. I found a few new nails from their nail gun in my flowerbed by her garage but they were easy to spot and pick up. We did not have a fence but not once did I see them come onto my property or walk on my plants.

The roofing company owner is a bully as are some who have posted here. Sad that a new home owner can not come onto this forum and ask advise without being the victim of name calling and treated as the bad guy! Shame on you.

I would visit my local police department and ask their advise...perhaps they could clue the roofing company owner in as to what your rights are and what he is not allowed to do on YOUR property.

Good luck...my garden is much needed therapy for the problems life throws at me. In years passed those weeds didn't stand a chance on the days my boss was being pig-headed!

Peggy

I also live in the 'hood. I am in my early twenties and my husband and I look a LOT younger than we are. I am soft spoken, very pale, brunette, but tiny and the least intimidating person on earth.

But my neighbors fear me.

I am completely polite. I bring everyone cookies and smile a lot. But they do know that the police will get called. I'll feel horrible about it, but I'll call the police. They've stopped coming near my property line. Last year I had trouble keeping the crack heads out of my garden beds. After a few well placed words to the person who runs the crack house, they are afraid to even look at them.

You can intimidate the #*!& out of someone without raising your voice. Just bring over a plate of cookies and mention that you've been talking to the police, and Golly Gosh you just don't want to get your lawyers involved, but if he destroys your garden,you just might have to. Isn't that sad? As a matter of fact you have this little piece of paper from the police that says it's entirely HIS responsibility. He must have been confused, but you know he doesn't want to do anything illegal. *smiles*

Being tiny and feminine makes it a little harder, but trust me, you can make your neighbors treat you with respect.

Let us know how it turns out Purplemage, we are rooting for YOU and YOUR GARDEN.

The neighbor/roofer has no rights to step onto your property, much less damage it.

Two years ago my neighbor sold his 13 acre tobacco field to developers. A zoning board meeting was called and all of the neighboring property owners received letters to attend. That was when we learned of the developer's plan to dig down 20' at the property edge to bulldoze the area and make it relatively level for the 86 duplex/quadplex buildings that they were inserting into the environment. The excavation would happen within 6" of my existing driveway at one point (strange shape to the property line). I voiced concerns about my driveway collapsing in as well as the safety of an unprotected 20' drop-off suddenly occurring at my property line. The developer initially said that the drop off was not going to be that close to my drive...but I had come prepared with the plot drawing of my property and when I matched my property line over his developer's drawing it was clear to see that one point would actually touch my driveway. I petitioned for a fence along the drop off at the developer's expense as well as an offer to buy a triangle of the land to protect my drive. The developer didn't want to put in a fence but the town council ruled against him and so I have the fence. The developer was fine with selling me the triangle of land as it didn't change his overall building lay-out and made for a straighter line in his excavation. Additionally, he had to petition me for permission to bring any equipment onto my property and reimburse me for any damages to my property. His workers were driving in on my driveway and then driving across my lower yard to access the project at one time, without my permission. That got stopped with one phone call and they graded the ruts out of the yard and reseeded.

Here's a view of the construction excavation in process. They said in the town meeting that it would be a 4-20' drop, in truth it ended up to be 30' in some places. I'm glad I got my fence!
{{gwi:58103}}
{{gwi:58104}}

Here's the finished development with the fence, and my veggie garden in my backyard. And yes, my garden is my therapy too. I do PT with patients that have behavioral, psychological, and addiction issues so many days I REALLY need to chop some weeds!
{{gwi:58105}}

No one will stand up for you and your property if you don't start the process. But the LAWS are there to protect you IF you notify the authorities. I stood up to a multi-million dollar developing company and got a fence at no cost to me and an addition to my property at a minimal cost to me.

This thread is a joke!!! Very simple, call the police, tell them the "roofers" story. Sit back & relax, or go out & play in the garden.
Thanks
Ed

INCREDIBLE! Please take everyone's advice and avail yourself of some judicial help. Start with the police, that way there is a paper trail.
Me, I would probably sit in MY GARDEN with a shotgun across my lap, but then again, I probably need therapy!
And speaking of therapy, it hailed 3 times this morning --solid, golf-size hail, and it tore my heart to pieces to watch my vegetables get destroyed. You bet it is therapy. After taking care of people's computer issues at work, I look forward to my vegetable garden. Got some new potatoes out of the ground yesterday in fact and it just gave me that old sense of exhilaration that I get every time my vegetables turn out ok.
Don't give this guy an inch. We are all rooting for you!

Thanks again for all the support. The support and guidance here has allowed me to come to a conclusion that I feel good about.

Eek!

I've never heard of anybody having mass amounts of vegetables stolen around here. On the other side, I would never plan my garden around what I can put along the fence so that no one steals anything. I try not to let paranoia and fear rule my life. If someone wants a vegetable so bad that they need to take it from my garden, they can go right ahead. That's the least of our society's worries. And I would certainly never dream about staking out the garden with a gun. That just seems crazy to me. :)

i'm new here and was just browsing around. I just had the same problem last week!!! My husband and i do not own the property. We rent the above apartment in a duplex. The landlady is very old and gave us the back yard over 2 years ago to use as our own..
We completely fixed it up! i mean the place was in shambles. Either way. There are now beautiful rose bushes, trees etc...we even placed stone patio area for the new patio set we ordered.
WEll here was the problem last week! A neighbour...two neighbours away is having foundation problems. ( 10 years ago he deepened his basement,,,,he probably caused damage...bafoon!) Since our landlady has a driveway along with the other neighbour on our left side which can park 10 cars! This neighbour to the right of us thinks he has right of passage to bring bulldozers, remove the fence and drive his machine through our next door neighbour as well to get to his backyard to fix his darn foundation.
He approached us last saturday. We told him we rent and use the back yard. He willhave to get permission from the land lady. He doesnt bother. He brings his contractor Wednesday, who walks right by us and goes to shake the fence. my husband say, no way buddy! you do not have permission to go through this property. They mubbled a few words . I phoned the police and they confirmed thats its private property. The next time they show up they get thrown off the land. If they cause damage, its criminal charges next!
To top it off, i was completely disgusted in this guys attitude so i spoke with my landlady, explained everything. I phoned the city, they said he has no right of passage. So my landlady sent a registered letter telling him off about his idea that was never brought ot her attention and that if he step foot onher property including her driveway she will press charges.
This is the law. Private property owned by a person is protected. period. They cannot threatened to dump anything while they are working on your neighbours stuff. If the contractors does, he can be legally held accountable for any damages.
Take pictures of your place before work begins. You can send a letter registered stating its your land, any damage causes will be pursued. Contact the police to explain the situation. Find out the date when work will begin. And be there. once they begin damage, they can be arrested for tresspassing.

Unless there is a legal easement for upkeep which is recorded through your county and would show up on your property records map. Check with your local assessors office for further clarification..... Lots of times there are easements for utilities and upkeep recorded - they are in my town so would not hurt to check.If that is the case I'm not sure what your legal standing is. It's a darn shame about this though.

it appears that things like gardening, growing your own food, walking instead of driving, living simply, and not being a whore to corporate america.. are becoming more and more radical acts these days... radical acts that are apparently threatening to the general masses.

hamiltongardener: Please do not misquote me...if you will reread my post...I did not say I carry a gun to my gardens. I said I carry my cell phone so I can summons help if the need arises. The day I have to carry a gun to my garden will be the day I look for another place to live.

What I DID say was: I keep a loaded gun by my bed because of home invasions where people are being killed when they answer a knock on their door. Gangs use this as an initiation for new members. One community not far from our hometown has had a big increase in drive-by shootings by gang members. Several people not involved with the gangs have been killed when the bullets pierced the outsides walls of their homes, some were children in asleep in their beds.

City Tomato...appears you do not want to understand what some folks in the U.S. are dealing with. Appears you are closed-minded and already have an opinion and believe it is the only solution.

Peggy

What?

Is there any easement in favor of your neighbor?

No easement. I will tell the property owner that I will not allow them to alter my property in any way and that if any alteration happens that I will seek reimbursements and repair.

No, in Canada, we actualy learn about other people's probems.

*pats City Tomato*

It's okay, gentle Canadian.

You are reminding me of a friend of mine (German) who thought another friend of mine (Pakistani) was being stupid to worry so much about whether her clothing was modest or not. She shouldn't let herself be concerned with what other people think. Our Pakistani friend wasn't Muslim, so why should she care?

Well, in her country, there were real consequences if you went out and were less than modest. She could get hurt very badly if she acted like she was in Germany when she was really in Pakistan.

And you can get hurt in America by pretending that you are in Canada. The two countries aren't the same.

We have highly diverse populations in a densely settled area. We have people with different cultures and understanding so there is bound to be friction. Sometimes the friction results in violence. There is not much you can do to prevent these clashes. If our country were less diverse they probably wouldn't happen, but most of us are not willing to make that sacrifice.

The guns themselves, without firing anything, act as a sort of boundary enforcement that is necessary here. It might seem unnecessary and cruel to you, but ignoring the basic facts of our culture and demographics will not change them.

But when I lived in the city, I knew someone who didn't mind that gangs broke into her apartment to steal because it was "just stuff". Well the local gang eventually got tired of steeling, and broke into her house with more in mind. She is no longer alive.

I've never shot anyone. I've never had to and I'm pretty sure I will never have to, but the fact that I own a gun has kept my house relatively safe when others around us are broken into. Once, a young man in broad daylight, tried to assault me. I had a handgun in my purse, and I got him to back off, and called the police. No one got hurt because I had a gun. Looking at his other victims, some very nasty things would have happened to me if I hadn't had a gun.

I love my country. I've lived in Europe and America, and I much prefer America. I'm not asking you to prefer it, but you might want to take a step back and look at a different culture rather than passing judgment without learning about it. There is generally a reason different cultures have different ways of doing things.

Criticizing it from the outside can feel incredibly patronizing.

I'm not sure if "patronizing" is the right word, but sure.

You know, Canada also has highly diverse populations in a densely settled area, and people with different cultures and understanding -- and, presumably, ensuing friction. Canada has a lot less gun violence, though, I understand.

I'd also hate for people to use this thread as proof of the stereotype that all USians pack heat.

This thread has gone pretty far afield, but I was thinking the same thing - here in Montreal, I live within walking distance of a more than one Jewish deli, Korean and Indian markets, an Iranian supermarket, 4 sushi places, a mosque, three christian churches, a few synagogues and around 180,000 people, speaking at least 5 different languages - it's rare to go a day and not hear an argument about Israel/Palestine or Mexican or Chinese immigration, and I don't know a single person that was in a single incident in the last 4 or 5 years that was resolved with fatal violence.

Heck, my car locks don't even work - although I did get the change taken from my ashtray once. I love the US, and intend to return one day (I'm here mostly on business), but Canadians do pretty well with the diverse populations, clashing cultures and getting along with each other at the same time. We from "The States" can learn a lot from them. (On the other hand, City Tomato seems to be exceptionally clueless, intentionally argumentative and slightly trollish here.)

hamiltongardener: Please do not misquote me...if you will reread my post...I did not say I carry a gun to my gardens. I said I carry my cell phone so I can summons help if the need arises. The day I have to carry a gun to my garden will be the day I look for another place to live.

Sorry. I didn't mean to attribute that comment to you. I had originally quoted you in reference to the damage and the gang violence you mentioned and to emphasize that I may act differently if things were that bad here.

How does one put an end to a post that is no longer relevant and has sparked such disagreement between GW members.

It's clear what purplemage needs to do and if she does half of what has been recommended, she should fare well in this situation.

Why dont all the controversial ones here take your discussion to another thread and stop bombarding purplemage's email with all the bickering that has nothing to do with her initial post.

GOD bless the USA :)

I'm half canadian but I wouldn't live there.

City_Tomato,
The only time I ever had a gun pointed at me and told to give up my wallet was in Canada. I've lived in Detroit, LA, Phoenix, Albequerque, and Washington DC. You are just way out of bounds..

We have people with different cultures and understanding so there is bound to be friction. Sometimes the friction results in violence. There is not much you can do to prevent these clashes. If our country were less diverse they probably wouldn't happen, but most of us are not willing to make that sacrifice.

The guns themselves, without firing anything, act as a sort of boundary enforcement that is necessary here. It might seem unnecessary and cruel to you, but ignoring the basic facts of our culture and demographics will not change them.

I was thinking the same thing as the other posters.

Canada is also a highly diverse country with different cultures and different understandings. If there is a difference in the way things operate, it's not a necessity due to outside cultures and demographics.

However, I do agree with your statement that there is generally a reason different cultures have different ways of doing things. Although the diversity of ethnic backgrounds are similar in Canada and the USA, there is a large difference between Canadian culture and US culture as a whole.

I also think you are correct that acting like a Canadian in America could get you hurt. I travel in the US a lot and I know there is certainly a difference in how I conduct myself in the name of safety. There is a certain set of "street smarts" that Americans grow up with (even if they grew up in a rural area) that a lot of Canadians don't have.

Posted by queuetue (My Page) on Mon, Jun 2, 08 at 19:56

This thread has gone pretty far afield, but I was thinking the same thing - here in Montreal, I live within walking distance of a more than one Jewish deli, Korean and Indian markets, an Iranian supermarket, 4 sushi places, a mosque, three christian churches, a few synagogues and around 180,000 people, speaking at least 5 different languages - it's rare to go a day and not hear an argument about Israel/Palestine or Mexican or Chinese immigration, and I don't know a single person that was in a single incident in the last 4 or 5 years that was resolved with fatal violence.
Heck, my car locks don't even work - although I did get the change taken from my ashtray once. I love the US, and intend to return one day (I'm here mostly on business), but Canadians do pretty well with the diverse populations, clashing cultures and getting along with each other at the same time. We from "The States" can learn a lot from them. (On the other hand, City Tomato seems to be exceptionally clueless, intentionally argumentative and slightly trollish here.)

This.

You know, the above posts have nothing to do with the original topic.

Let's just "CLOSE" this thread!!! This is so ridiculous!

The above posts have more to do with the original topic than yours does. Don't worry about it.

Believe me, I am not worried about it. This is the least of my worries.

But then again, every is entitled to their opinion. But you also have to consider this is the Vegetable forum, the original poster was talking about workers damaging her garden. Not about guns and crime and bashing each others heritage!

Where do you see the relation between the two?

Ther's an honourable precedent for arguments over vegetables....

'You say tomahto and I say tomayto.....' well you all know how the chorus goes, so how about agreeing....

'Let's call the whole thing off'.

Flora (with my blue helmet on)

*puts on a tomato suit and dances through topic*

As I said back in the very early stages of this thread: I'm expecting soon to see a post by purplemage telling everyone that the roofing job has been finished to everyone's satisfaction and without purplemage's life being turned upside down. Y'all see. Meanwhile, it's been great fun seeing everyone getting so wound up. Peace!

Look what they did to my yard im on housing

I need help

Brianna, you should start your own thread about whatever you need help with instead of using a 15 year old thread. You may get more useful responses that way.