After lots of trying, I finally managed to bring up some early stuff from Michael's wonderful Way Back Machine link. I copied and pasted to WordPerfect and now repaste it here just for fun. What we talked about then... My husband is going crazy ... Posted by: Bev (Ont6b) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 23:24 41 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:55 Oh, the Weather Outside is Frightful! Posted by: Sara (MI/z5) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 15:00 22 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:34 I Trod On Alex Again! Posted by: Janet OH/Z6 on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 14:57 4 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:30 If I won the Lottery Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) on Thursday, November 21, 1996 at 17:27 13 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:21 What is it about Martha? Posted by: judi z./(RI/Z6) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 21:42 25 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:01 A Thanksgiving success! Posted by: Fran on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 16:01 2 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 16:31 'Tomorrow is 'Buy Nothing Day'' Posted by: Bev (Ont6b) on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 13:01 8 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 16:12 Nursery Food Posted by: Andie Rathbone Mo/Zone 6A on Saturday, November 23, 1996 at 23:06 51 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:47 Where to meet Posted by: Clare B (MO zone 6) on Saturday, November 23, 1996 at 00:32 8 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:32 Thankful For YOU! Posted by: Cora Lea (Iowa Z5) on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 21:17 9 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:21 Zinfandel Grape BONSAI by--Z- Posted by: Z CA z/9 on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 19:16 7 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:04 Town Celebrations Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 08:47 2 follow-ups, last one posted on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 11:52 Garden Webring Starting up Posted by: Teresa on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 08:17 Look at Kirk's Place! Posted by: Clare B (MO zone 6) on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 23:25 Too cute for words Posted by: Fran on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 01:32 11 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 22:00 Grocery Store Hell Posted by: Andie Rathbone Mo/Zone 6A on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 20:36 22 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 21:09 Chickens Posted by: Becky GA*z7B on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 07:29 21 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 21:05 Essential Thanksgiving Foodstuffs Posted by: Tia (MI 5) on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 09:15 12 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 20:32 Object in the Sky Posted by: Skip MNZ4 on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 21:24 5 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 19:17 Dogs in the garden Posted by: Jean (IN Zone 5) on Wednesday, November 20, 1996 at 18:24 25 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 18:46 Too Much Party Posted by: Eduardo (LA/Z8b) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 02:48 13 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 14:03 Canadian Thanksgiving Posted by: Kim Fisher on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 21:59 10 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 13:05 HAPPY THANKSGIVING NEIGHBORS Posted by: Doug ONT/Z5 on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 22:00 5 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 12:31 Black Friday Posted by: Kim Fisher on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 22:50 14 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 12:29 Happy Thanksgiving, One and All Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 19:04 3 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 12:25 What's *always* in your fridge? Posted by: Kate Lykins on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 19:34 28 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 02:26 Garden Party Trivia Posted by: Janet Menke MD/Z6 on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 18:48 4 follow-ups, last one posted on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 01:36 Mint Capitol of the World? Posted by: Janet Menke MD/Z6 on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 21:58 4 follow-ups, last one posted on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 18:46 How many workers? Posted by: Andie Rathbone Mo/Zone 6A on Saturday, November 16, 1996 at 15:21 73 follow-ups, last one posted on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 18:33 Future Telling Posted by: Doug ONT/Z5 on Wednesday, November 20, 1996 at 13:21 39 follow-ups, last one posted on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 18:23 Next 30 messages... And some early Martha bashing... What is it about Martha? 1. Posted by judi z./(RI/Z6) (ezimm@ids.net) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 21:42 On several of the sites I visit regularly, Martha is the woman we love to hate, yet we can't wait to try some of her suggestions. We make fun of them, but wouldn't miss a show or an issue. I am this way myself, but I have yet to figure out what it is that inspires such opposite responses. Call me whimsical, but I am just curious--what is it? Follow-Up Postings: What is it about Martha? Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) (drrj@snd.softfarm.com) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 22:24 Judi - I confess, too. She bugs the bejeebers out of me, yet I wouldn't mind having a 'summer kitchen' and the time and money to experiment with new ideas like she does. It's probably alot of things - a bit of envy, a bit of annoyance, mix in a dash of suspicion that she doesn't really do all that stuff on her own and she'd like us to think that she does, and you've got the recipe for the 'Martha Dilema'. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Fran (buckwold@cyberhighway.net) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 22:59 In the beginning I really enjoyed all her fun ideas but as of late she has become too darn much of a "good thing" - I don't think anyone can buy off on the idea that she does all this stuff she keeps claiming she does because there aren't 40 hours in a day, nor is there 20 days in a week....but if that could be changed I'm sure Martha is the person most capable of arranging it ;) What is it about Martha? Posted by: Janet Menke MD/Z6 (menkesjg@erols.com) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 23:03 Don't know but she has the same effect on me. I'm embarassed to admit this because I've bashed her here quite a bit myself but I have two of her books sitting on my coffee table! Worse yet when I got married the color of the bridesmaids dresses were from inspired by one of the weddings in her weddings book. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Bev (Ont6b) (waverley@hookup.net) on Monday, November 25, 1996 at 23:35 I only saw Martha for the first time earlier this year. I don't think she's been in Canada all that long but I could be wrong on that. At first I thought that she was OK. I liked her show on Oriental Poppies and that basket to die for! Now I find that she mugs for the camera too much and really gets on my nerves. I can only watch her when noone else is home as they all hate her. My daughter really dislikes Lynette Jennings, especially her voice. Really, who would be having a dinner party, go to their garden to pick nice flowers and then not have a vase/jar or some kind of vessel so have to use potatoes to put them in? Please. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Kate Lykins (klykins@roman.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 00:56 Strange as it may seem, I've only seen her show once. I have her Christmas book because it was easier to pay for it than send it back - it was sent to me unsolicited. It's a pretty book and has some things worth doing, I think. The one show I saw was fine, too. But I have read about her overdone style, seen parodies, etc. I think we want to bash her because she's overexposed. She should lay low for a while. (It wouldn't hurt if she could be a little less perfect, either.) What is it about Martha? Posted by: Fran (buckwold@cyberhighway.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 01:04 Like Martha, I think Lynette Jennings was much better in the early days, I wonder if they ran out of good ideas on a reasonable level and thats the real problem. What is it about Martha? Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) (drrj@snd.softfarm.com) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 01:12 Check out 'Interior Motives'. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Kathy PA/Z6 (markathy@epix.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 07:14 Fran, I changed that to 40 hours in a day 8 years ago when I opened my own flower shop! Please....I know Martha will get the credit somehow! Kathy What is it about Martha? Posted by: Kim Fisher (ckfisher@redrose.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 08:31 Kate, if MS or anyone else sends you any more unsolicited stuff in the mail, DON'T PAY FOR IT!! Unsolicited merchandise is considered a gift, and you cannot be made to pay for anything you didn't order. Contact your local postal authorities if a company starts giving you any bull to the contrary. What is it about Martha? Posted by: judi z./(RI/Z6) (ezimm@ids.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 09:48 Ruthanne--is Interior Motives the one with the guy who is "way over the top?" I think he is really playing up that awful stereotype of the swishy decorator, and doing a dis-service to all people in the field--he's going to give himself an aneurysm with that gushing. I asked the int. designer who helps me what he thinks, and he was very offended. My designer, David is gay, but recoiled from this show, saying it was almost as homophobic as true bashing. What is it about Martha? Posted by: ruth anne (IL. zone 5a) (drrj@snd.softfarm.com) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 10:23 Judi - you nailed that one on the head! What is it about Martha? Posted by: Grace (PA/Zone 6) (kfmartin@epix.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 13:53 I'm of German/Austrian background and enjoy making stollen at Christmas. I've tried several different recipes. Martha was making it on her show one day, I believe with her mom. Her recipe used ELEVEN cups of flour! Do I have a bowl large enough in my kitchen to hold that mess? It was such a massive undertaking for a regular person with standard size utensils and counter space. Now I have my recipe that I got from Good Housekeeping and have success every year. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Andie Rathbone Mo/Zone 6A (andier@cybergate.org) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 19:54 Like I said before. Martha Stewart is the anti-Christ, sent down to earth to make all normal women (especially those who work full time) feel like worthless slobs. It's not that she doesn't have good idesas sometimes, but she always does things the hard way. She can't just go to Michaels and buy a grapevine wreath like normal people, she has to cut the twigs, soak them, and make the damn thing herself. She also is into really, REALLY expensive stuff. Check out what she charges for her paint. I like to take some of her ideas and recreate them for 1/10th the cost. By the way, have I been under a rock? Who is this Jennings woman? What is it about Martha? Posted by: Janet Menke MD/Z6 (menkesjg@erols.com) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 22:03 Yes do tell, who is this Jennings person? Finally figure out that Englebrecht person is (have one of her nifty cannisters just didn't realize it) and now a new MS wannabee to learn about! What is it about Martha? Posted by: Kim Fisher (ckfisher@redrose.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 22:08 Lynnette Jennings has a show on The Discovery Channel, daytime on weekdays. I really can't comment on her. I caught about half of one show once, decided she was too much for me, and reached for the remote. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Kathy PA/Z6 (markathy@epix.net) on Tuesday, November 26, 1996 at 22:48 I told my husband that Martha was the Anti-Christ! I wonder if her birthday is on Feburary 4TH????? The Anti-Christ was to be born on this day! I wish Martha had a web site, I would LOVE to e-mail her. Kathy What is it about Martha? Posted by: Glenda (IN/Z5) (fletch@tctc.com) on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 08:30 Poor Martha, I admit I have said it all myself, but we should proably be ashamed of ourselves. We should applaud & be inspired when one of us manages to build an empire. If a man had done it, people would be praising his abilities to delegate not saying don't forget he has a staff. I have her old house book, and she gives full credit to all the artisans who painstakingly renovated her home. And described the process for those of us who can't afford the artisans and would like to believe that we are talented enough to do it ourselves. I wonder if the criticizims (sp?) of her poor treatment of her staff are deserved, or if they would exist if she were male. Sound like a raving feminist don't I. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Bev (Ont6b) (waverley@hookup.net) on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 14:02 Glenda, in all seriousness I think that you might have something there about us knocking a woman for being successful. I have tried to think of a man who would be like her, sort of set himself up as the epitome of good taste and as a representative of the western version of masculinity, but I couldn't come up with one so it's hard to know if we would knock him too. I think that what frustrates us so much is the very mixed messages we get, that we should be modern women who don't have to stay at home in the kitchen like June Cleaver but that our families should be well looked after. It all comes back to mom. Martha makes us feel inadequate because she seems to do it all: have a growing, successful business and career and do all of the home warming stuff that looks so fuzzy and cozy and perfect. We can never be like her, nor, I suspect, would we want to be. Hovever, we still feel uneasy and ambivalent about her and what she represents. We criticize her but when you read the postings about all the wonderful dinners, handmade decorations and Christmas gifts that we are capable of handling we're more like her than we realize. Martha just goes WAY over the top. She's a lot like us but out of control. On another note, I think, although I haven't had it confirmed, that Martha-wannabe Lynette Jennings is Canadian. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Andie Rathbone Mo/Zone 6A (andier@cybergate.org) on Wednesday, November 27, 1996 at 18:48 Maybe I should take a day off work and try to catch Lynette, just to check her out. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Becky GA*z7B (aesculus@ix.netcom.com) on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 21:09 If Ralph Lauren (who's clothes etc. I can not afford) can make the coolest paint I've ever seen for $29/gal. why is Martha's araucana series over $100/gal? And I've heard it can be toxic to pets & kids. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Janet Menke MD/Z6 (menkesjg@erols.com) on Thursday, November 28, 1996 at 22:37 Are you guys serious? Does Queen Martha actually have her own line of PAINT? How have I missed this? Where do they sell it- Saks Fifth Avenue, Tiffany's, and the like? What is it about Martha? Posted by: judi z./(RI/Z6) (ezimm@ids.net) on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 11:58 And get ready for this one--CNBC has announced that Martha is going public!! We can all own a little bit of Martha! I'd love to go to the shareholders meetings--will we have to decorate the room? Serve whimsical little tidbits? Instead of a printed annual report, will it be festively stencilled, decoupaged and adorned with ribbon? What is it about Martha? Posted by: donna PA 5 (pwaldron@sgi.net) on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:40 I'm an old "fan" or enemy of Lynnette Jennings--because she is my style of sit-com. We used to get her show on satelite when I lived in Japan and we were all so hungry for any English television that the Americans watched her religiously. My favorite Lynnette tip--she reassuringly told us in one episode that beige and brown go together! (sorry, I think I may have mentioned this before somewhere). She also made a vase one day from houseplant leaves and an empty peanut butter jar that sent us rolling in laughter. And just think--her show has been expanded to 1 hour! What is it about Martha? Posted by: Janet OH/Z6 (jkp@one.net) on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 15:44 MS is genuinely insincere! Her smile rarely reaches her eye's. What is it about Martha? Posted by: Becky GA*z7B (aesculus@ix.netcom.com) on Friday, November 29, 1996 at 17:01 Glenda - I met someone in NYC that worked on the food section of MSLiving and loved her job, so rumors of employee abuse are probably just that. Perhaps confused with Leona Helmsley. Has anyone seen the cartoon Sylvia? She has one she does called "The Woman Does Everything More Beautifully Than You" that has to be based on Martha.

I have more fun with petunias. They're easy to grow from seed and the seedlings are easy to separate - just sprinkle however many seeds on the surface of a container, and keep moist - I use a mist thing several times a day. They germinate in a few days, tiny little things. let them grow until their first two leaves are the size of your thumb nail, and then they're very easy to transplant out into 2" six packs. I've mentioned here before about using my own cuttings of some off-spring of the Purple Wave series, and this past year, I let the plants die. So I took all the dried, dead plants and crumbled them over a tray, knocking out the seeds, and then watered that. I had a bazillion of the things. Personally, what I find most fun, if you have a large enough bed, is put in a few hundred of them of one color, which just makes a solid, show stopping bed contrasting with the roses or other perennials in that bed. I did that once with plain old red ones, and another year with purple ones. Linked is the HPS website for petunias, who have a great selection and in bulk. Holy cow, prices have gone up this year.

Peony season is over for me as well now--the hot weather this last week put the kibosh on my latest bloomers. Here are pics of the last to open this year. Athelstane--very fragrant! Casablanca Cheddar Surprise, also fragrant, roselike Dr FG Brethour, fragrant but very floppy. Had to hold the flower up to photograph. You can see where the heat damaged the edges of this one... Elk Grove--a bit disappointed in this one, expected it to be a bigger bloom. Tall but otherwise fairly insignificant. Also floppier than you'd expect for a smallish flower. Gay Cavalier La France--you can see heat damage on several of these last flowers...Lord Calvin this one is probably a mis-id, supposed to be bi-colored. Lottie Dawson Rae Mandaleen--my new favorite herbaceous!! HUGE bloom on a 1st year plant, can't wait to see what it does next year!

I don't usually go for single purpose containers, but this avocado keeper really works well! You place the cut side down, without pit so that it's flat against the bottom, then the top goes on and the silicone top stretches to seal over the avocado keeping the cut part tight against the bottom so that air doesn't get to the cut side. I took a picture of an avocado half that had been in the refrigerator for 3 days. It has a tiny bit of brown on it that was easily shaved off. It's especially nice that it's easy to clean, and stores flat. I found mine at TJMaxx, but they are for sale on the A store.