Another +1 for Paul Barden and Kim Rupert roses. I would love to grow Treasure Trail and Annie Laurie McDowell

@alrt zone 10 if you're in the US and want to learn to bud it yourself, I can help you with ALmD. It actually roots rather easily as long as you start with vigorous shoots from a vigorously growing plant and they will grow well, IF you treat it correctly. Tiny pieces from a tiny plant will root but they usually are glacially slow to develop so most give up.

I'm curious about this - when was the last time any of you were actually able to purchase one of my hybrids from Rogue Valley? Were you notified (on a wait list)? Or did you just happen to discover the rose became available.

I ask, because many of my roses - to the best of my knowledge - have not actually been available through the RVR web site in years.

@Paul Barden their site states these are available at this moment: Sugar Jangle, Sanibel, Mel's Heritage, William Grant, Fara Shimbo and Unconditional Love. Oddly, Sugar Jangle, Mel's Heritage, William Grant, and Sanibel appear when I search "Barden", but not when I click on looking for the "Barden roses".

Paul, I just received Mel’s Heritage from them several months ago. As you may recall, the first one I received from them was mislabeled. When I informed them of their mistake they promptly sent me another one. I have yet to verify if this is indeed the correct MH. Other than that, I got Jeri Jennings from them maybe two years ago. Other than that, no. I seldom see any of them listed as in stock.

@roseseek That’s very kind of you, thank you so much. I am in the US but think I’d need more confidence in rooting/budding successes before reaching out

To Paul’s question, I was able to purchase Marianne last year from RVR and am awaiting the first blooms (hopefully) this spring. I wasn’t sure how it’d do in zone 10 but decided to try anyways

I also received Oui last year from RVR, which also does not see to be in stock at the moment. It has bloomed well for me so far

Edited to add: Both were from me visiting the website. The waitlist notification system doesn’t seem to work for me

Paul, I think my Mel's Heritage came from Rogue, though since it's been many years I don't really remember, and I do order from Burlington too (who I believe carries it?) so it could have come from there. It is definitely the right rose (and what a complete love of a rose it is!!) Last spring I got Etienne from Rogue - they did notify me from the waitlist that it was available. Of course, it hasn't bloomed yet, so I don't know if it's the right rose, but at least it has obvious gallica-type foliage. I was also on the wait list for Umbra - they never notified me, but one day just on a whim I went to their site and they listed it in stock, so I immediately ordered it. It is due to come this spring, and I sure hope it's actually Umbra!

Last year I got Marianne and Hettie from RVR. They haven’t bloomed so I can’t confirm I have the correct varieties.

I have gotten Umbra, Paul. So far the early warning system on this forum has worked for me, but the waiting list has worked for me in the past.

I received my Mel's Heritage from Rogue Valley as well, in October 2020. It has done well for me and is the correct variety. I also ordered a Marianne last fall and I am waiting for it to bloom to confirm that it is the right rose.

I cannot remember if I received an email notification that it was in stock, but would not be surprised if I did as I have been receiving notifications for other roses that I signed up to be on the waitlist for.

I would also love to see more Tantau roses being offered. I had an Ascot and Pomponella but lost them both to the combined heat, grasshoppers, and packrats.

This was around three years old from a band that had just been planted into a raised bed last spring.

Paul, I got Nightmoss from RVR last year, and Treasure Trail maybe 3 years ago. I have been very lucky with RVR over the years Ive purchased maybe a dozen plants and all have been true to variety. I’m sorry for those who didn’t get what they wanted.

Treasure Trail

Treasure Trail is still one of the coolest roses in Rosedom. Lucky you Ben.

Paul, I got Jeri Jennings from RVR last fall. I happened to see it was available while browsing the site. It has already produced two precious blooms.

Maras - is that an Ascot? It's truly beautiful!!

Ben - I LOVE your Treasure Trails!! What an incredible rose (Paul looks like one of your best)!!

Thank you all for the information. I was curious about the general availability of my varieties through RVR, as it seems few of those roses are ever actually available. (Six+ years ago I was sent a plant of 'Licorice Tea' which was not the correct rose, and was promised it'd be replaced with the right variety, and I am still waiting. Yes, I've sent reminders)

A couple years back, I had a conversation with Janet and she told me RVR was working on getting those roses tissue cultured at a lab and expected to offer large numbers of roses in the near future. I was expecting to see reliable inventory of my roses appear by now, but it seems nothing has changed. Perhaps it didn't work out, for some reason. (Though tissue culture is a well known process now, so it should have been well within reach)

Anyway.

Do any of you still grow 'Licorice Tea'?

@Carol: I like 'Treasure Trail' a lot, but I wouldn't call it one of my best. It's a smallish plant (never seen it exceed 2.5 feet, which - I suppose - is an asset for many growers) and isn't nearly as Blackspot resistant as I'd like it to be. But the bloom form/color, and the mossy buds are really quite good. I lost mine in the 2015 Big Freeze, but replaced it two years ago (from RVR) and it's slowly building up size. I hope to be able to start propagating it soon(ish).

I was wandering around the garden this morning, and two more roses came to my attention that I'd love to see more widely available: Cerise Bouquet and Parade (climber). As far as I know, CB is ONLY available from Green Mantle, and when I got it, I had to wait two years for her to get a cutting growing. It's a once bloomer, of course, but really beautiful and distinctive. I lost my first one many years ago to RRD, and if anything should befall my current one, who knows if I could replace it. Parade is just a delightful climbing rose - really beautiful flowers and it is really just a tireless bloomer, which isn't always the case with climbers. It is such a good natured plant (though it is thorny), I would think it should be more easily available, particularly in garden centers - it would be a great beginner's rose!

Paul, I have Mel's Heritage and Robert's Wondrous Ruthie on order from RVR, and received Hettie from them two years ago.

Forum friends - Thank you all again for the wealth of information, support, and suggestions! I am compiling a "master list" of roses that people have expressed interest in. I know I will not be able to carry each and every one, but it gives me a very good beginning :)

Paul - yes, I guess you're right. You've created many unique and beautiful roses...this one is charming though...Those flowers have that special quality that shines. :) :)

Frances in NJ The older references gave high praise to Cerise Bouquet and Parade (a wichuriana climber).

Erasmus has a beautiful example of Parade n in flower. I also love the rose. It can put u with a lot and keep blowingbloomingblowingbloomingbloomingblowingbloomingblowingbloomingblooming. It's also quite c hardy.

I'd like to add one Tantau: Soul (2009/14). It really is my dream rose!

I would love to see Chipmunk ( PIXchip ) a mini from Laurie Chaffin. She used to come out to talk to customers in her lovely garden store ( long wooden tables under sun dappling trees) packed full of roses. She recommended Chipmunk as a great rose to learn hybridising on- ( makes lots of hips and seeds) and I got many gorgeous roses from it.

It is a beautiful tan/lavender mix with healthy foliage ( in Calif and Az.) Lost it in a divorce and can't find it anywhere. RVR has had it on the wait list but never seems to get it to available list.

So sad to see all the 'Pixie Treasures' vanishing into the mists.

I've been thinking about this subject for days and going over the long list of obscure/rare roses I still have. But the problem is that if I recommend any of them to consider adding to a nursery's catalog, I'm recommending varieties that a nursery may sell only 2 or 3 plants of each year - maybe there will be years where they don't sell a single copy. IMO that's not an ideal recipe for success. (Although for a small "backyard" nursery, it might be less of an issue, since every plant sold is a win.)

You want these two things to be part of your recipe for a nursery's success: Sufficient turnover of inventory (you don't want plants hanging around for years, unsold) and a percentage of "bread and butter" varieties - selections that you can be sure to sell lots of every year. So I guess my message is: be careful not to load up your catalog with roses that you may only sell occasionally. It's great to offer varieties that are not currently in commerce (here in the USA) but you don't want to be maintaining an extensive archive of roses that just never leave your nursery.

I've got a lot of curious/obscure roses here - 'Wichmoss' comes to mind, and 'Garisenda' and 'Golden Moss', "Prairie Magic/J-5" and 'Pteragonis', 'Pelison', 'Robert Leopold', 'James Mason' and dozens more. But would a nursery sell more than one or two of any of them, ever? Something to think about.

Paul

Paul, I couldn't agree more. It's surprising how many of the roses suggested here are completely unfamiliar to me. That's precisely why I proposed only those roses that are ubiquitous in European gardens for their beauty and reliability, yet regrettably aren't readily available in the US.

i think a reputable, informative source of the japanese roses with accurate zone and size ratings would be very successful.

Paul, I really appreciate your advice. That is excellent wisdom, and I thank you for it.

We intend on having quite a few bread and butter varieties, at least we hope to, assuming we select the right varieties. Ha ha. And I am fairly confident in our ability to sell things locally. We've had a fair amount of success with that already.

As far as the more obscure varieties that only one or two people have ever even heard of, I will definitely be keeping that in mind not to base our business around. As appealing as it might be to stock a wide variety of "rare" varieties, you are right; that's not a great business model. For some of them, they might just be something that we enjoy in our personal collection and custom propagate if there is a request. Perhaps that might work.

@Josg Maggsib, Many of the Japanese roses that I've seen are very lovely! I am excited about trying to explore the possibility. We shall see if anything comes of it :) they do not seem to be many available here in the US, and very little information about them. You are right; having a better knowledge of how they perform here, what zones they are hardy in, etc. would be very valuable.

Wise words, Paul.

I also recommend a book by Tony Avent, the owner of Plant Delights Nursery. It's "So You Want to Start a Nursery", 2003, Timber Press. Tony is one of the most successful nursery entrepreneurs of the past 50 years, and he mostly sells the rare, unique and impossible to find, lol. Yet, somehow he makes it work. He's also hilarious, and it's a good read even if you DON'T want to start a nursery.

FYI - I got Mel’s Heritage from Burling, as my RVR died as small band. Burling gave me a reduced price on her tiny little plant b/c it was so small, and it’s going strong!

She also does her own Connie’s Sandstorm - lovely rose.

And a word for climber High Hopes (Harkness). Very pretty, super healthy, vigorous!

What a great question! how about the beautiful deep red Prince Camille de Rohan? i killed one years ago and have looked in vain for another

https://garden.org/plants/photo/666777/

I thought of another one: The Alexandra Rose, a mannerly David Austin shrub rose, Austin, which is more beautiful than photographs suggest. It is bred from an alba rose, from which its foliage inherits a beautiful glaucous tinge. I always admire it in the Brooklyn Botanic Garden Rose Garden, and it looks beautiful with other garden plants, as well.

Won't let me edit.

I have been trying to propagate my Paradise Found for several years now, and it never roots. It also doesn't seem to want to grow from graft, but this year it looks like mine just might take!

I decided earlier this year just to buy one and it doesn't seem to be sold anywhere, so I hope my grafted one grows

Carla in Sac

Carla - I loved Paradise Found when I grew it. My avatar picture is Paradise Found. I'd buy it in a heartbeat if I could find it. I'm glad your cutting is doing well. :)

Wishing you well. ( I miss Pickering Nsy.) But as for great roses which deserve wider commerce: Ghislaine de Feligone; Phyllis Bide and above all: Prince Camille de Rohan.

@julieotoole Annie's Annuals seems to have Phyllis Bide in stock every year. They really love it, Grandmother's Hat, Golden Celebration and Carefree Delight. https://www.anniesannuals.com/rosa-phyllis-bide-climbing-rose.html

I got Grandmother's Hat and Golden Celebration and Duchesse de Brabant and Felicia and Veilchenblau from Annie's. My only complaint is that they come in 4" pots, so are really tiny cuttings that have rooted, so they have taken FOREVER! But they are all healthy plants.

I just posted these images of Mel's Heritage (purchased 2021 from Rogue Valley), but the whole post seems to have disappeared, apologies if it suddenly reappears. I am in Houston TX and my plant is doing terrifically well though this is the first year it has bloomed as profusely as this; I got enough bloom in past years to verify it was the correct rose however. I also have a Marianne that is healthy but has never bloomed at all; there may not be enough winter chill, but I have not given up on it. I do check for Barden roses every spring and fall. I also check for Rupert roses and have got a very lively specimen of Lauren this year. My Mel's heritage:

Starmade - what a bloomer!!! Mel's Heritage is a rose to make a person's heart sing!

So fluffy and delicate....

Mmmmm :) :)

Marianne blooms beautifully here. What zone are you Starmade?

Houston is zone 9a. We get a freeze about every three years. A few once blooming European roses are recommended for here and apparently do manage to bloom, at least for other people (Antique Rose Emporium sells a few), only I have not succeeded in growing any of them yet. Either they dwindle and die, or they just sit there and do nothing. But this game is all about patience. Marianne at least has consented to stay alive and is not dwindling. Foliage is nice. It may happen yet.

Fig Insanity, Have you ever got a Plant Delights Nursery Catalog? Omg its hysterical. A little perverted in a planty type of way too lol. Times have changed so I dont know how the catalogs are now but I used to order them maybe 5 yrs ago and they were pretty weird and funny.

@sultry_jasmine_nights (Florida-9a-ish) they don't have a very good reputation on the old Dave's Garden site. A good catalog is a great thing. Monterey Bay Nursery had one of the most wonderful catalogs I've ever read. The author was a REAL "plant geek" and seemed to know just about any and everything about every plant you could think of. One year, a new plant type was renamed a rather absurd made-up name which was completely unpronounceable. His rant about why someone should do such a thing simply because they COULD was a marvel. https://montereybaynsy.com/plants.php 

Roseseek

Was the rant on that page? I didn't see it

No ma'am, the rant was in one of their catalogs nearly 18 years ago. I had it for the longest time as it was just SO good. I linked the nursery so anyone who wished to read a great catalog, could. Monterey Bay makes great plants. I've always loved reading their catalogs. I'm delighted they're still around when so many others who were in their class, aren't. Go to the R page and look at their roses, clicking on the links for photos. I particularly loved the Iceberg photo. Yup, THAT'S why we grow it out here!

On my way to checking out Roses in the R section and stopped at Raspberry to see their thoughts on some I had just picked up. The Raspberry Shortcake entry made me laugh, what a nice pick me up!