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Remodeling Bathrooms

What to do with this grout and tile issue? Contractor remodel

3 years ago

last modified: 3 years ago

I won't get into all the gory details, but suffice to say our GC had to have emergency surgery like halfway through our bathroom remodel and couldn't come to the jobsite to check bathroom remodel progress. I felt bad for the guy and made a Google photo album and took detailed pics daily so he could keep up from home. All the subs he had seems pretty competent except his tile guy. They said I couldn't go in the bathroom until the grout cured since it was floor and shower. Now I got a good look in the daylight and there are holes and uneven pieces. I'm not sure what it will take to fix/save this...

Any advice welcome. I feel bad for the guy, but this was a big ticket bathroom remodel so I'm a bit shocked at this point.

Bathtub edge

Shower Niche

Shower floor. A few of these little holes around the floor perimeter.

Knee wall sharp edge doesn't line up

Shower bench back

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Comments (10)

millworkman
3 years ago
All changes in plane require silicone caulk not grout. That being, tough to get context from closeups. Back up a bit and give us a larger perspective. Do you have progress pics? What did he use for a waterproofing system behind the tile?
Michelle
Original Author
3 years ago
The underlayment portion says USG Durock Cement Board. A couple farther out and the base before the tile started.

Pre grout

Zoomed Out
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The GC told us to go to the showroom where we picked out the tile with the salesperson. The showroom has it's own full-time installers who did the labor. So, I suppose the supplier as the subcontractor "picked up and inspected" the tile. We never saw the tile before it was installed. We did not pick up (installer did), inspect (installer did), nor pay for the tile (GC paid the subcontractor). We complained about this to the GC immediately and said we weren't ready to pay for what we felt was a faulty product after install. He inspected it himself, twice, as did the installer, and they both basically shrugged it off and said it was cheap tile that "likes dirt" (this is not the case). Despite our complaints, the GC paid the subcontractor for the product and install. The tile that was installed was not the tile we picked out. It took over a year of us working directly with the subcontractor with no help from the GC to get the tile in front of a rep from the manufacturer who confirmed that the tile was faulty and should not have been installed. As the GC, I feel that he did not do what we have already paid him to do which was to facilitate the project and manage the renovations to ensure everything was completely properly in a timely fashion. We have paid him for all other subcontractor expenses as well as for his services and profit as the GC. We only withheld payment for this one item, which we knew was not completed properly.
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Ok so, so sorry but here: Master- 1) Lay-out is awful. You shouldn't have that small tile at the inside (a pro balances the lay-out prior to install). Yes your concerns regarding uneven and improper slope are valid. Pretty basic standard for tile installation, especially on a shower floor where proper pitch to drain is imperative. Being concerned about the damage occurring from tearing it out is a mute point as you will have major issues as it is. 2) As others have stated, that should be caulk and always caulk at change of planes, not grout. And no, it isn't common for professionals to install on a surface that isn't plumb and flat. If either the general or the tile contractor do not shim and level to prepare for tile, then standards are being ignored and you have a problem. It's poorly done. 3) That is the very cheapest drain assembly available (if it was speced and this was a very low end build, then maybe that was to be expected but as a customer you should be aware of the quality of the product being used). Very unprofessional job around the drain. It should be cut so nicely around the drain that you don't even notice the grout. It is definitely not an "average job". In the tile world, we would call it a "hack job". Guest - 1) Multiple possibilities for the grout pinholes, all related to skill and craftsmanship. Could you dab grout in those places and hope it looks a little better? If you bought a new car would you ask them to fix the paint or dents before you drove it off the lot? You shouldn't need to do patch work on something new. 2) Caulk but remove grout first. 3) Caulk and color match, not clear. Clear is a bad idea there. Now, I'm sorry if we sound harsh. It's an exciting time to move into a new home. If consumers do not hold the builders to basic standards, there will continue to be builders that take short cuts and perform sub-standard work. ALL builds should adhere to basic standards and there is no excuse for what you are seeing. (I hate to say it but I'd be concerned about the methods used to build and waterproof the wet areas, what you can't see, based on what you can see). One place to start is to ask your contractor to document how all aspects of the tile work conform to TCNA industry standards.
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Do not make final payment. Your concerns are valid. The first thing I noticed was the jagged cut. Go to a professional tile shop and explain your situation. Have them come out and give you a quote for a proper installation in writing. Include waterproofing. Offer to pay them for the quote. You will need this to negotiate the way forward. Contact glass manufacturer for proper installation methods. As for the mosaics it's just poor workmanship.
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The material the GC used is the big question. The second part of that question is: Was it reinforced to the requirements made by the tile manufacturer? The reason I ask is this: many people *think (even GCs get this wrong) cement board is "reinforcement" material. It is NOT. In fact it is ONLY to offer a level surface for the tiles to sit on. A proper plywood (not OSB...please not OSB) is required to achieve a CERTAIN thickness (total thickness of layers 1+2 = "X" amount of inches thick. This thickness is to be determined/calculated by the person doing the installation. To get to the deflection rating required by the tiles (ahem...tile manufacture's requirement needs to be followed) the JOIST SPACING is taken into account. The fact that the bathroom is over a garage might be an issue, it might not. But garage builds are notorious for being 'lower grade' than the build used in the house. That means joist spacing might be quite large. That means you need a VERY THICK subfloor to achieve the same deflection rating as a properly built joist system being made ready to take on tile. Yah. The architect had to make the space READY for tile. Which is where the 'over a garage' might come into play. Anyway, please find out: 1. Total thickness of subfloor BEFORE tiles were installed 2. Material used to reach the total thickness (cement backer board should NOT be part of the equation...if it is, you know where the weakness in the system is) 3. What was the deflection calculation used? 4. Is there a decoupling membrane (like Ditra or Schluter) under the tiles Was there anything else done to this space/area that might have added more WEIGHT to the area? Like a washer/drier pair? Or a water bed in the next room? Weight lifting equipment added to the next room? Or a large tub added to a bathroom expansion project?
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Michelle
Original Author
3 years ago
last modified: 3 years ago
I'm just a bit lost. I feel terrible for the guy. No one plans to have something unpredictable happen. Was supposed to be done by end of March and at this rate it is going to be end of May. I'm trying to coordinate stuff with his wife, but obviously not the same. Just want to make sure I'm not going to have leaks down into my first floor with the way some of the grout is missing. I read a couple blogs that said you should dig it out ASAP and regrout, but would that be whole lines where there are any gaps or holes, or just the area? Trying to figure out what the right remedy is so I know when we discuss next week.
chispa
3 years ago
Grout is not the main problem and isn't waterproof in any case. The waterproofing happens behind the tile. I'm no expert, but it doesn't look like you have correct waterproofing.

What is behind the Durock, any photos of that?
Michelle
Original Author
3 years ago
last modified: 3 years ago
It is just studs on the walls and the sheet liner over the pan/bench. So I would expect the liner keeps it in the liner unless it was some major thing, but I still don't want the Durock to get wet like the niche area above where they literally missed the bottom grout area. I assume that has to get fixed...somehow.
Liz H
3 years ago
Did they tape and mud all the seams in the durorock? I ask this because your 2nd picture appears like there is no tape or mud on the right or left hand side walls and they’ve already put the tile in the back wall. This is concerning.
cat_ky
3 years ago
The durock should have been sealed. By looking at your bathroom, it is going to need to have a lot of it redone, and it will most likely take longer than what you are expecting it to. Sorry. It isnt a good job of tiling either.
Michelle
Original Author
3 years ago
@cat_ky Maybe that is the green stuff around the bottom, but it is basically just on the pan area by the floor and the bench. The green is where it was before the tiling started. Maybe that is sealer? I would think it should have gone up higher if so maybe.
millworkman
3 years ago
The cement board needed to be covered in its entirety. Unfortunately most of your shower has zero waterproofing.
User
3 years ago
Gut and redo. Not salvageable.

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