There Needs To Be a Comprehensive Conifer Bible
Agathis Adeamus
3 years ago
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Embothrium
3 years agolast modified: 3 years agodavidrt28 (zone 7)
3 years agolast modified: 3 years agoRelated Discussions
2011 conifer photo galleries & opinions...
Comments (2)The 2010 Figherfighter galleries are already a bible of lush images and introductions of cultivars which I pore over still. Your idea to link back to show change is a great enhancement. I simply wait now for the 'Galleries' and of course 'Parades' of 2011, onward!...See MoreConifers and our US weather variability
Comments (34)The person who criticized my posts for being too complicated, better just stop now. I guess it helps to remember the zones are 'USDA', which is the US department of agriculture and really has nothing to do with ornamental plants. Nein. Ornamental plants ARE part of the USDA's mission. That's why the National Arboretum is under their aegis. Remember wholesale nurseries definitely are a form of agriculture. The USDA zone system gives the barest measure of whether a plant can survive in a given area. Obviously, something hardy only in zone 10 cannot survive in zone 6. Beyond that, there are many other factors. The latest revised USDA zone map seems very accurate to me. I know of gardens along the Delaware river in NJ that really do seem like zn 7b. But it took a ridiculously long time to come out...considering the overall crunching of data probably took a few hours on a high perf. workstation or server. (in case you don't know, it's based on a climate model developed at U Oregon called "Prism") This was not some advanced climate simulation going on like trying to predict hurricanes. And given that computer technology has advanced so much including the algorithm development one would have to say the current USDA map reflects a certain lack of vision, though, again, at least they finally got it correct. By this I mean something like the Sunset system could have been developed, although there were problems with that approach if you try to extend it over the country. Rather than discrete numbers that could get ridiculously long for certain plants (i.e., this grows in 21, 33,34,35,36,37,38,40,52,61,62,63,64,75,78 etc) it could have used a series of vectors that graph a space representing the plant's preferences. Zones 1 to 10 would still be the first dimension of this system so you don't "break compatibility" with what we already have. The two main additional factors I would propose would be aridity, and summer temperature. There are several reasons for this; namely, there are already 2 factors certain nurseries use when selling plants. The AHS "heat zone" map exists, and is used by a few nurseries to show warning on certain species, and aridity scales have been adopted by Desert Northwest and High Country Gardens. Mind you these scales would not necessarily be linear and could code a sub-dimension, or even be matrixed to code an additional factor. For example it might make more sense for moisture to go: part of year arid - sporadic/none of year - all year - part of year but high atmospheric moisture. Because there are non-linearities in the way plants behave with respect to that, and with summer temperature. Some cool summer seasonal plants are actually known to grow in all year rainfall climates like England, but only with cool summers. The point is the arrange things in the way that leads to the most chances of solid groupings. Such mathematical shenanigans might make it hard for people to understand how to derive their own zone, but the point is it doesn't matter. They will get their zone off a map. Also different from the Sunset zones, there no need for a comprehensive, singular map because everyone will use some kind of smart device in the future that can easily click one location between 3 or more different maps. So a zone like mine would go from 7a (I think the a/b is of more limited usefulness than most people realize, though I have and will continue to reference the subzones) to something like 7J6. 7 being 0 to 10f min annual temp, J being a climate with rain all year but some expectation of brief droughts, and 6 being heat zone 6. Let's call it the Comprehensive Plant Zone. A _PLANT_ ranges, versus a gardening location, would go from "USDA zone 7-10" for a maritime climate plant like Eucryphia, to "CPZ (comprehensive plant zoning) zone "7H2-10M4" meaning that range of minimum winter temps, and a generally moist climate though accepting somewhat dry summers, as long as 3) the summers are cool. I would instantly recognize that I can't grow the plant because I'm off on one of the codes. Of course, this will never happen and there will be howls of "it's too complicated" but you can be sure in the early 1960s some hayseeds saw the first Harvard zone map and said "oh them fancy professors and their durn maps, I know what grows here and uh don't need some map." Also let's face that other than the big midwestern cities the net migration in the country is towards the SE, S & W where the USDA zone system is least useful. USDA system is most useful for telling people in Iowa there are many, many plants that they are far too cold to grow (sorry Iowans, someone had to be an example) than answering the question for someone in Phoenix, Arizona of whether a certain species of Protea could grow there. (and I reckon a couple of the most heat tolerant ones could) That a sunset zone map was made for the whole country is something I applaud, my idea just tries to make their system easier to use when dealing with a lot of customers and plants. Instead of saying "that only grows in 31, not 42" it's more helpful to say "your moisture factor of J is too much for an A-E plant, it will rot"....See MoreShameless conifer-recruiting plug!
Comments (24)You're all very welcome. I find gardens with all three genres(hostas, Japanese maples, conifers) to be splendid combination of three long lived plants. A little more effort on my behalf to encourage some hostaholics become a little more conifer orientated: Much like hostas, some conifers are VERY VERY small. Many big-box stores sell 'dwarves' that may eventually get quite large. It's better to focus on miniatures if you're really in it for the long-haul. And so... Five conifers that will never outgrow your landscape: Abies lasiocarpa 'Lopalpun'. An alpine fir that grows about 1/2 an inch a year. This specimen is about 6-8 years old and roughly the size of a grapefruit. Pseudotsuga menziesii(douglas-fir) 'Happy Camper'. Grows maybe an inch a year so it can be nestled amongst the rocks here for a few decades. Picea sitchensis 'Renken'. A miniature sitka spruce, this little guy shows year-round great color and grows about an inch a year. Picea abies 'Pusch'. Just because you grow minaitures doesn't mean you can't have cones. This selection cones heavily every year and even the cones are miniature. Grows a couple inches a year into a beach-ball sized shrub in about fifteen years. Cedrus atlantica 'Home Park'. A miniature cedar, this little fellow has an almost bonsai'd appearance, also grows an inch or two a year. Hope I helped introduce some new folks to the great world of conifers - I owed you all that much at least for helping me into the hosta genre. -Will...See MoreSadly, I need a new tree...
Comments (8)Harry Lauder's walking stick generally needs water lavished on it to keep it alive, esp over there, and lavished upon it while it sits in a protected location. The wife of a couple who are good friends of mine in almost your same climate still clings to her wanting one, so she has two and spends much time trying to keep them alive. The DH has let it go and releases and transcends, flows like a river... There are a trillion incense cedars on the west slope of the Sierra, so am interested in them on Colo's west slope; where they grow they get about 20-30" of precip a year, mainly in winter, and are not generally tolerant of wind, so would like to see if/how people keep them alive. Sunset, the bible, sez they need moderate water there, so you are part of an experiment! Good luck. Take your time on the planting hole and baby it well even into 2011. They have this wonderfully distinctive, strong smell in summer and when you smell them you know its hot. Dan...See MoreEmbothrium
3 years agolast modified: 3 years agoAgathis Adeamus
3 years agoDeanW45
3 years agoEmbothrium
3 years agoAgathis Adeamus
3 years agoken_adrian Adrian MI cold Z5
3 years agoplantkiller_il_5
3 years agolast modified: 3 years ago
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