lighting has two aspects: the plan formulated by a pro. Kitchen lighting is essential....should not be a random task by those not qualified to understand lighting for this space in the home. Second of course is the technical aspects of the install. It sounds like you have a bit of a problem that has occurred in both aspects..plan and execution. I would really consider backing up and looking at a plan..has there been one? or get a plan by a pro now ....and use a recommended lighting installer[provided by the pro]. An electrician doesn't necessarily have the background to understand good kitchen lighting schemes. This is something you will want done right. A patch in the back of a pantry cabinet can be done. It's hard to picture this but carpenters repair and patch all the time if that's what needs to occur. You can probably get to it later.

A major remodel and you're complaining about a few misplaced cans and a receptacle patch in the back of a cabinet? Please.

except poor lighting has a lot of ramifications.

I would have loved having put the cans in after cabinets. That would have been a great idea to have the wire ready. We did have a design from the designer in the electrician said he thought his idea was better. I agree that he did have some better ideas but in the end he missed measuring and the fact that if you would have looked at the design the pantries come out 24 in. He was saying he put them where the design said but he put them a couple of feet over from where she said. Interested Lee, one of the reasons I chose the general contractor was on their website they had talked about how they were always trying to learn more about lighting. In the end she said I could save a lot of money by using my

electrician so at that point I don't think it was her responsibility to be on site to tell him where to move things. It would have been nice if he would have followed the plan. We're also happened to move some other outlets and Hood vent wires and re-patch that will cost me more money. This could have been avoided if he would have measured.

In general though I'm still wondering how people tend to handle things like this. Just roll with the punches and do the best that you can? There's an issue I'm concerned about and hoping will turn out correctly with an 8-foot window they installed. I told them from the beginning I want to make sure to go to take the sash out anytime I need to replace it and the countertop should be below the sash. Now that they're seeing my floor is not level the countertop might go to the top of the frame, still allowing sash to come out I hope. Not ideal and if countertop get wet up to the window it will run into the window. Contractor said no problem it would just run outside. Not ideal but that took a lot of effort to get that 8 foot window in. Hired an engineer and everything. Designer had said I could get a larger window. Contractor said we would have had a problem if I would have gotten a larger window. They asked me to buy the window myself, maybe to save me money, maybe to avoid responsibility? Ironically, I got a half inch smaller window because of Home Depot guys recommendation. If I would have went with what the designer said we would have had a big problem potentially.

Again, I understand there's a lot that goes into this and I think everyone is doing their best, I just wonder how scenarios are dealt with typically. Sounds like I should continue doing what I'm doing which is just work with people and make the best of each thing that may come up.

Thx

"Not ideal and if countertop get wet up to the window it will run into the window. Contractor said no problem it would just run outside. "

This guy sounds like a top notch GC. With everything you have said he has done incorrectly or just not done he would have been tossed off my property long ago. I realize you are in an area where finding good contractors is tough but maybe you need to rethink your hiring/vetting process. I cannot even imagine still having him onsite with all the posts you have had to make. And sorry to say but if I were him I would have left long ago on my own as from the sounds of it your level of involvement would be a major issue for me.

Thank you for your different perspectives! It's always hard to know if the person telling the story is how I accurately along with the reader's understanding well and then I have people saying I said expect a few things going wrong and then those saying I should pick them off my property. Then there is dealing with the spouse who has no understanding, very little involvement, and is rushing me to get job done. I'm ready to take a break no matter starting to look for a new contractor. Countertop guys came to measure the other day in the first guy said that the countertop would be above the window frame, then he brought his associate and who said it would not be above the window frame. They were both counting the 3cm quartz differently. 1.25" + 1/8" glue contractor assured me that the countertop will sit underneath the frame of the window. My idea of but I think it will work. Again, in these situations where are ideal enough to deal with the stress of kicking out a contractor do people ever ask for something in return like they throwing something for free? I'm still thinking about asking electrician to put in a fan for my daughter's room for free until the him it's caused me a lot of stress. It's time painting and priming on hold while I think about this patchwork. Thx

I wouldn't ask for something else for free. If they do something wrong and have to redo it on their time and dime, that is their consequence. Having to redo something PLUS throw more work in for free is not fair to them. In my opinion. You can ask how much they would charge to put a fan in your daughter's room, giving them more work. And maybe they will give you a good price if they feel bad about the mistakes. But if they make mistakes......they may make more. That is not completely fair for me to say. What seems like a mistake is at times them making the most of what they have in front of them such as beams or studs where you wanted the light or outlet, that they had to work around. So they had to choose one side or the other. Is the contractor really so bad you need to replace them?

If something is done to plan, they did it correctly. If not done to plan, they should fix on their time. I have found things I was frustrated with, but when I looked, it was done to plan. I just did not understand what the plan would actually look like when done, until done.

"If something is done to plan, they did it correctly."

Not always. Architects and designers can draw anything on paper. An experienced tradesperson knows the difference between what is right, what is drawn, and what will pass inspection.

But if done to a plan that is what was approved by the city and the homeowner.................the person who did the work can fall back on that excuse that they built it to the plans. Ideally the tradespeople will speak up if there are issues building to the plan.

lafdr:

I would throw my tools off the Sunshine Skyway Bridge and follow them in if I ever fell back on the excuse that I followed the plan. I can live with "Oops, I screwed up."

My contractor is not so bad. I think they just made a few mistakes. My electrician is a nice guy and does a good job I think generally but on the lights he thought he had a better idea seeing says he always puts the lights 18in from cabinets to take the time to look at the pantries that are 24 inches out from the wall. He tells me he did it to the designers plan and I pulled it out and showed him that he did not but it did not even seem to work the conversation because it just has to be happy. To him it's not a big deal to me I will see patch-work evened he wants to get it done. It's paralyzing me a bit and throwing a wrench in. I'm having to decide where I want to place them and I'm not particularly happy with any of the options because it takes me back to the plan designer had was better although he added can lights so I think a mixture iof both plans would have been great. His main problem is he did not look at the plan through the process and did not measure very well at all. He agrees that they are too close and need to be moved and he says it's not a big deal.

I'm also too nice. I saw some damage that was done to The Pantry skin and I didn't say anything because the cabinet guy was admiring the spice rack in the damage was right before both of our eyes so I figured maybe it was a sticker or a moth or something but sure enough there is some damage about 1 inch by 1 inch on my white cabinet that is brown particle board or whatever it is under the skin that was peeled off. It is only seen when you open the spice rack so it doesn't seem worth having them take cabinets off and putting more holes and my walls and things like that. They will probably paint it but I should have said something right away. I wish you would have said something instead of waiting for me to see it but maybe it's not a big deal because when I was talking about the little nails that he was going to use to install the skin she said that they paint those. This is all new to me so I'm mostly ting them in the process and not knowing what to look for always. Not every single detail is on the design.

I live in a new construction tract home and upon walk through we noticed that the pendant lights were not centered over island. I was worried that the patching would show when they moved it and debated keeping them slightly off center. I decided that would irritate me more in the long run as having the lights in the incorrect position would be more obvious than a patch.

I worried needlessly, they moved them and the patch work is inconspicuous. Even if I stare at the ceiling, I can't really see the patch work. And I'm really picky but had told myself I'd let it go. Plus, this is a tract home and I don't think the builder's subs are nearly as good as the subs that were used for our previous home remodel.

I agree with the other comments, if it is determined to be the electrician's fault, then I'd ask him to re-do the work, but if you add a ceiling fan on, that's on your dime. Where was your GC during this discussion? Does the electrician work for him? Assuming the electrician works for the GC, then you probably should be having this discussion with the GC and not the electrician, at least that's how I've handled these types of situations in the past. Regardless, if both you and your electrician were looking at the plans and decided to change the position of the lights from the designer's plan, it seems to me that you both are equally responsible. Both of you should have noticed the depth of the cabinets before changing the lighting plan. The electrician's failure to notice is no different than your failure to notice, at least in my opinion. When you agreed to change the light position, then that responsibility becomes yours. That said, the cost of changing the recessed lighting, regardless of who pays for the change, is the tiniest fraction of the entire remodel cost. I've always assumed at least 10% overage because of changes and this certainly falls into that area. Actually, I assume more than 10% because I tend to upgrade selections and make more changes than the average person, but I know that about myself and can live with the consequences. I've been using the same contractor for years and we get along well, so I guess he can live with that as well. We also communicate frequently and neither of us is quick to "blame" the other person, we try to figure out an appropriate path forward when we need to change something already done.

Good luck, remodeling is frustrating and this is the hardest time in the process. There is always a punch list after construction, that is expected and totally normal. This board is a great sounding board for those questions.

The window sounds challenging. Once the countertop is in, would you be able to replace the window if necessary without removing the countertop?