"I stooped to her level and cussed her out. i used the a,b,c,d AND f words in ONE SENTENCE."

That is verbal assault and leaves you open to legal prosecution.

Usually, verbal assault contains believable implications of threatening actions. Verbal abuse however, can also be prosecuted under certain circumstances. However, ordinarily if both parties are being abusive, as a practical matter successful prosecution is difficult. Abuse does not have to be verbal, for instance, when one lifts one's middle finger, words are unnecessary to complete the idea. Here, the postal worker threw the package on the driveway and told the recipient that it appeared that she needed the exercise (to pick it up). So both sides were being abusive.

Amylou I think that what is going on is unthinkable. That said It makes me feel better about not getting my mail till 7:30 or 8pm. Post office says its because they have a contract with Amazon, and people order on line, that makes to many packages. They also say in a few months we should get back to the 2:30 pm mail (they are training more help) In my county I know of more then one contract drivers have been let go for so very much less then yours . It is much less to fire a contract driver then a postal employe.

What a nightmare! You mentioned this mail carrier before and I was hoping your problem had been solved. I agree about contacting USPS Inspector General as so far, you and others have hit road blocks at every pass. In your letter it is important to keep emotions out of it, only stick to facts. It sounds like you have quite a bit of documentation. I too would have declined the offer of a P.O.box.

Whatever you write, stick to facts, not emotions or outrage, and use paragraphs or bullet points instead of one long paragraph. You want your letter to be easy to read.

There is always a bunch of misunderstandings about mail. And Raye smith is correct.

A few fun facts

Postal routes are managed by individual Post Offices not necessarily the nearest one to you by the way. That Postal supervisor oversees those carriers.

The carriers bid on routes that open up and are selected on the basis of seniority.

The postal system is not in thrall to the Unions which actually have very little power. They cant strike, no leverage.

The US postal service is no longer Governmental, hasn't been for donkeys years and costs you the tax payer nothing. They do have trouble running themselves as a business because they have to get congressional approval to change anything. Hard to run a business that way.

Postal carries get paid way less than you imagine and the work is demanding. Each route is paid differently depending on how many boxes it has, what type they are, how many miles between boxes and so on and so on. It is bizarre and complex.

Carriers frequently have around 700 customers to service. With increased parcel business getting it all done is getting to be impossible.

Believe it or not people aren't lining up for jobs that pay $17.25/ hour where the work is so physical and so mental.

But none of this explains why this carrier is doing such a poor job or how to do something about her. Apparently she changes routes frequently so maybe she will move on to plague someone else? It sounds like more of a supervisor problem than a carrier problem.

patricia, the information I've found (from searching, of course) suggests average postal employee pay is around $50K. That's admittedly not going to make anyone rich but considering these are basically unskilled jobs not requiring a college degree, it's not bad. I don't think USPS has any trouble hiring people, I don't think the jobs are that difficult and USPS has historically been viewed as offering a not-so demanding work environment with job security, features that many people who want to work for the government look for.

That doesn't mean it's something anyone can do. Our regular mail deliverer retired a year ago and the motley crew that have taken his place demonstrate that it's shockingly simple to screw up something that isn't that hard. 8:00 pm deliveries (used to be no later than 3:00pm) , wrong items in the mail box, missed days, have become all too common. Fortunately we get almost nothing of importance in the mail (aside from governmental communications) and so it doesn't bother me. They seem to do Amazon deliveries okay, including on Sundays.

Elmer, the postal service has a whole bunch of jobs and carriers are only one of them. If you work a full career you can work up to $50 K or so but it does depend on the route. And they do have trouble hiring people and the job is skilled in ways you cant imagine. Your understanding of the work is woefully uninformed. It is physically demanding in that mail is very heavy and you have to shift around mass amounts of it with equipment that Noah threw out. You have to have a remarkable memory. Something Amylou's carrier seems to lack. You handle mail worth astonishing sums of money (people who handle diamonds ship them through the mail) and have to get it all correct every single day. Most managers chew on their employees all the time. Going Postal is not a thing because the work place was so pleasant. Your subs mess up because your regular has one route, subs have to cover as many as 5 which if the routes are average size that is 3 to 3,500 customer's details wants, and needs. Sound easy? The work is all timed and every second counts. You think the job is stuffing mail in boxes but the carrier has already been working for hours before he or she gets to your box.

Her substitute, Katrina, is PHENOMENAL. She tells me her hope is to get her own route own day. I hope its mine.

patricia, I've never known anyone who worked for the USPS so I have no inside information about it. But I can comment on what my own eyes have seen.

I go to a post office every month or so, either because I'm mailing something Priority, or overseas or because of having mail of other than standard size or weight that I want to be sure has correct postage. Unlike what amy claims about her area, there are probably a half dozen or more within a 10 minute drive of my house, I go to whichever is convenient that particular day so my experiences involve all of them and others too, not just one. If you wanted to describe the counter people as taking a nap while standing up and talking, that wouldn't be a stretch. They're slow, plodding, and inattentive. I sometimes use manila envelopes that are smaller than the 8.5 x 11, maybe 6 x 9 or so, but they're considered a standard size. Not infrequently, they'll enter it as an oversized envelope - the difference is peanuts, less than a quarter, but they should know what they're doing. I'll mention it indignantly. Some of the scales have an outline of the size stenciled on so it's right in front of them.

The mail carrier? Oh, you mean the guy parked in a cul-de-sac reading the paper for 30-40 minutes? He's there most days. It can't be lunch hour, it's late afternoon. Is he relieving stress and giving his muscles a rest from the heavy lifting?

We have all experienced people who impress us as being REALLY good at what they do. Fewer than half of most occupations I've encountered. It can be a physician or a plumber, a teacher or an auto technician. You know the type. Have you ever encountered a USPS employee you would say that about? I haven't. After repeated experiences thinking "this person must be at the bottom of the performance chart for this job", you come away thinking that they all are. No bell curve.

If your experiences are different. then they're different.

I am corrected (thank you patriciae_gw) about the free post office boxes impacting all us taxpayers ... the post office's operating costs are to be covered by the sale of postage, products, services, not direct tax dollars. But when WalMart looses $1,000 to shoplifters, who bears that cost of that lost revenue? The customer. Who's the post office's customers? Most all of us.

How much revenue is this employee causing the post office to lose? Multiply the number of boxes x cost per box. Even if it's only ten boxes at $100 per year, that's $1,000 lost directly due to one employee's conduct. At what point does this lost revenue turn from a misdemeanor into a felony? (okay maybe it's not outright 'theft' but it's sort of a similar situation. I'm no lawyer, just throwing out ideas, angles to pursue.)

(edited to add: Elmer, I'm sorry you've not be lucky enough to have a good encounter with a post office employee. They exist. Thank you.)

The two post offices I frequent are wonderful as is our carrier. I'd assumed USPS had become more customer friendly and efficient but, hmmm.... perhaps not.

Amy, I feel for you. What a nightmare! We had a carrier a few years ago who carried around a lot of undelivered mail in her trunk, mis-delivered mail, etc. She was replaced within a relatively short amount of time following customer complaints.

Where I live we also have many post offices within a few miles' radius. The post office nearest our old house had people and service just as Elmer describes. However, the one nearest the house we live in now, only 3 miles away from our former home, has absolutely delightful people staffing it, always knowledgeable, efficient, and very friendly. Our letter carrier is also excellent.

I know several postal employees and have had postal experiences of my own just like every one else/ I have been inside because when I was able I used to volunteer during the yearly food bank food collection because I have a small truck and could help haul food. So I can speak from experience. Real experience and I do know how much work they have to do.

The PO is complex. If you are city your carriers not only have a different union but their pay and rules are different. There is Rural and even Contract. Every one of those delivery systems is part of the PO but different. The people who work at the desk in your local PO are NOT carriers and the supervisors have probably never delivered mail to the street. I am not saying all carriers are good hard working people but most of them are. They put up with an amazing lot of garbage doing their jobs. Some of them are lazy scum. So it goes but you don't get to just make up stuff about them based on imaginary stuff and what you believe about people you know nothing about.

Mine is lazy scum.

Others I have had were not.

Hopefully,if she ever goes far far away,perhaps back to Hell where she came from, my next one will be as great as her predecessors.

And that is fair Amylou. Our present carrier leaves a lot to be desired but nothing like yours.

Wow, Elmer, how do you know it wasn't the guy's lunch break? Some of us who work certain jobs have to take lunch when we can. I used to work on a med-surg floor where I had to be at work a 7:30 am...some days didn't get lunch until late afternoon, 2:00 to 4:00 pm. Not everyone works Monday through Friday, 9-5 and at a desk with an hour lunch break right at noon.

kathsgrdn, the houses on the other side of the street get their mail many hours earlier - like 3-5 hours - than we do. If I see the mail truck mid-morning, because I'm out front or if I'm driving in the direction the truck comes from, it's an indication we'll get our mail before 5:00 or so. If the guy passes by mid-morning, he's not having lunch at 4:00 because I suspect his day is almost over. But, I don't know for sure.

patricia, there's nothing in what you said that suggests to me anything is complex at the level of the individual worker. They do the same thing, the same way, day after day. Again, in my experience, you don't need to be the brightest bulb in the community chandelier to get a postal job so I'll assume whatever is required can be learned and done without much difficulty.

Here's some USPS news - on the Good side, I can report that my mail was delivered before sundown the last three days in a row, Friday, Saturday and today. On the bad side, we're leaving town tomorrow and I requested a mail hold online, with last Thursday being the last day for delivery. It's sooo complicated and stressful that a carrier needs to check the hold list before delivering mail.

Your carrier does not handle vacation holds, they aren’t given a list to look at. That is done by the crew at the office that sorts and does the vacation holds before the mail goes into the carriers delivery bins. If mail is being delivered after a hold request, that’s a problem at the office, and not the carriers fault.

A carriers hours can run somewhere between 6AM to 7PM depending on the route and if it’s during a high flow season or off season, and if overtime is approved or not. And of course union contract rules. Though some routs can run shorter, it’s not terribly unusual for a carrier to be on route longer than the average 8 hour work day, sometimes closer to an 11 hour day. In bad weather a route can take longer than usual too.

So seeing a carrier going in one direction mid morning and taking a break later in the shift isn’t odd, it’s more like a dinner break, especially if the carrier still has a couple hours of work left to do. Or maybe just gets hungry at that time of day.

Fine, bees. Remove the word carrier from my sentence, insert office worker. Does that change the comment or the problem with the hold not being held?

As before, it's someone's job and it's the same task day after day.

Oh, and the guy reads the paper, he doesn't eat it. And no bad weather here. What it looks like on those days is that he finished early and is delaying his return back to home base.

They don't get paid by the hour like that. The route has an evaluated time that is paid no matter how long or short it takes to actually do it. There is no advantage in sitting and

Fine. Then why doesn't he drive along and take extra time to be careful that I don't get my neighbors' mail and they mine?

I feel like I'm being picked to death with tweezers, patricia. I think the key thing I said is that I've never gotten a solid impression from any USPS employee that they give a hang about what they do or how customers (and we are customers) are treated. S words - slow, slovenly, sloppy, don't give a snot. It can take two days for mail to travel across town. The performance of the system says it all, unless you think it's terrific. In which case, there's the crux of the disagreement, if any.

Performance is sub par and when you see how they work, it's no surprise. Anyone who can do a bang-up job in less than reasonable allotted time required by peers can enjoy some of the time savings as a reward by enjoying a slower pace for part of their day. But that isn't what's happening, especially not when I'm waiting in line at the PO and I feel like they're moving, thinking and talking in slow motion and doing a crappy job at that. And making the experience take much longer than needed.

What a horrible story. This is the kind of thing that really drives some people over the edge. I think what's even worse than this person's behavior is the fact that nothing is being done about it at USPS. I hope this problem is solved soon for you and your neighbors, if so please give us all an update. I don't know if I could take any news that it's not resolved though - good grief!

This gal must be working her days off in Midland, TX. Same thing playing out there in daughter's neighborhood. : ( No luck there either.

I mailed a letter at 5:05 pm on Friday and it arrived - as in delivered to the other person's house - 104 miles away on Saturday. Pretty good deal for 50 cents.

And now I can't get the Osmonds song out of my head: One bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch, girl. Eeek!

Wow. This makes me want to hug my mail carrier! He is such a nice guy - will always wave (he drives a truck). He turns around in our driveway and if we're out he'll chat for a few minutes.

In this case, I'd start sending all correspondence to whoever is over the head person at this post office. Keep going up the chain of command till someone hopefully listens!

Patricia I have heard the opposite. This is why ours sometimes delivers mail at one time and packages at a different time on the same day.

People who don't have assigned routes or service routes that are only partial ones will fill in elsewhere. The whole system is way complicated. Explaining what I know which is only part of it would take all day and the PO is in major flux at the moment because of increased parcel (their word for packages) service. Combine that with all the automated management of mail flow it is going to have to change. In any case just remember that we don't even notice when it all goes well.

Elmer, if you are so curious why don't you just stop and ask the guy what he is doing and why?

And an interesting factoid. You aren't the customer when you get mail. The customer is the person sending it.

Even postal service workers, I expect, are either legally or by union contract entitled to so much break/rest time per # of hours worked.

I'm not curious at all, it was one of several observations and experiences I described.

patricia, you seem to have a very low threshold of what you think to be complicated and difficult. These are essentially clerical jobs.

Elmer, when you don't know something you don't know. How you can blithely state what it is that postal carriers do I don't know but I am not going to try and convince you because I know that is futile so never mind.

Fine, you've convinced me. The post office hires very clever, hard working people to do complex, demanding jobs. Because of the demands of the job, everyone must have advanced education credentials, meaning at least a high school diploma or GED. Because the job is so challenging and demanding, the pay is high - as much as $45-$50K per year. The work is so hard and demanding, few people want these jobs and many slots go unfilled.

Is that how you see it?

I find looking down upon people because of what they do for a living isn’t right

Degree or no degree.

ETA The woman in question here sounds as if she has a serious personality disorder.

There are lazy people and dedicated, hard working people in all walks of life. This is different.

I think this is a losing battle if the carrier in question is the spouse of the union local president.

I'm not looking down on anyone, I was trying to make sense of not too difficult clerical jobs that the holders of which too often may have trouble performing.

Reading comprehension for some of you could use some work, though it's easy to ignore what you want to ignore.

Some of you are often ready to pounce. Pounce away. Bye.

I guess we should lighten up. At least he didn't accuse them of being iPhone users or Canadians! /end joke.

What is complicated or demanding may vary depending on ones aptitude. Work that can be replicated over and over is different than work that deals with one offs. Someone who is book smart may be terrible at a hands on job. I know I'm explaining this badly but I have met alot of silly people who have degrees out the wingwang and visa-versa.

Well, regarding THIS particular troll, I do not think she is incompetent. I think she is lazy, obnoxious,and I KNOW she enjoys screwing with people. Why else would someone ride around with a tape measure in order to find an excuse to NOT do their job? I actually think she is very shrewd in some if the ways she uses USPS rules and regulations to aid her in her quest to be lazy and annoying.

I should add that she started the mail hostage situation at the end of november/beginning of December, when many many people are ordering gifts and sending cards. She thought nothing of putting all that extra work on an already busy staff at that post office. I myself had to go up there at least 10 times to pick up mail or packages,because my mailbox wasn't high enough. She was holding over 100 people's mail at one time.

Regarding the letter, my sister offered to write it for me. I took her up on it. In this particular matter,I was finding it VERY difficult to not use angry or degrading language. She has a much more level head regarding things like this. (It helps that she has a different mail carrier,and therefore does not have the rage that comes from actually DEALING with this old,bitter,disgusting harpie) She wrote the email and sent it to her union rep. So that's that. As for myself, I really don't think anything will come of it.

I appreciate everyone who does their job well,no matter the job. It is easy for people with degrees and such to look down on those who don't. I experience it all the time. My job only requires a GED. I have a high school education,my supervisor,a GED. A coworker, in the same department,doing the same job as us plebeians who do not, has a college degree,and boy does she think that makes her better than everyone else. She has that degree, but didn't know how to use a manual can opener. I had to teach her. One of our highly paid, college degreed engineers was stranded in the parking lot,because he didn't know how to change a tire. The uneducated grunts had to go rescue him and make sure they didn't get grease on his fancy smarty pants at the same time.

When it was decided, by some donkey with a degree,that it was a smart idea to send someone to remove my feral cats from my workplace for reasons far beyond my minimally educated understanding,imagine my amusement when a week later, the building that his office is in (and the surrounding area) was overrun with mice. And of course, he was unwilling to admit that his decision was the cause of it. (Because he has a degree! All of us stupid, high school educated, overly emotional women were just making up the fact that there is a natural food source for them in an outdoor facility surrounded by farmland) He scuttled off to another building to hide while the company paid men with no degree to take care of his mouse problem. He still, to this day, refuses to admit the correlation between the two. No. Common. Sense.

All that being said, I again reiterate that all levels of skill and education are important. I need a doctor with a medical degree. They need someone to deliver their mail.....

Ouch. Wow....I am really sorry for all the time and desire I wasted on getting

my degree. I sure wish I had asked your opinion first. What an honor to

know someone of your superior intelligence and "Common Sense". Have you a way to get some help with anger management? I do find it hard to believe that not one person here has voiced their concerns. Is there anyone in

your life that you admire? There....now I have given you a new target for

your nastiness, I guess. Although, you obviously have lots and lots of

targets.

I refrained from commenting because first of all, I'm not sure half of what this OP is saying is true, and she definitely has a personality disorder herself. I am also appalled at her verbal attacks, she's looking for "back up", or merely a troll that jumps into forums to stir the pot.

Another bad mail situation. It can happen anywhere....

https://www.wavy.com/news/local-news/virginia-beach/mailman-pleads-guilty-to-keeping-undelivered-mail-in-storage-unit-in-virginia-beach/

Uptown and Schoolhouse, I believe Amy is venting here and asked for help in how to solve a long term problem. She is a frequent poster. You seem to be personally attacking her with your posts.

Uptown Gal, I clearly stated that ALL levels of education are important. And I admire people who have the determination to go through the rigor of getting a degree. The whole of my immediate family,save my mother and myself,have bachelors degrees and some have masters. Their work is important. So is mine. I was responding to a post on which not having a degree or making a ton of money was being equated to not having basic job skills or any pride in one's work. Perhaps you missed that one.

And I was giving examples of personal experience in which people surely thought themselves better than I or others simply because they have a higher education. I say this because THEY SAID THIS. The girl that is in my department says ALL THE TIME that she is overqualified because of her degree. She also says that if our department were ever eliminated (where THAT came from I dont know) she thinks the company would find her another position within the company, because she has a a degree, but she doesn't know what the rest if us will do.

Even the man who needed HELP was spouting about the "slow idiots who don't know how to make a tire." I wonder if he does....

The "no common sense " comment was referring to the man who could not or would not make the connection between an infestion of a rodent and removing it's natural predator. Not you or anyone else except the person I was talking about. I do not know you and so was not talking about you and I am not sure why you think I was. I gave 3 examples of 3 specific people. And I never claimed to be more intelligent than anyone. Not sure I am the one with an anger problem.

Schoolhouse, it really doesn't matter if you believe me. That doesn't change the fact that i have to deal with this headache in a mail jeep. I wish it did. If you think I am a troll then refrain from engaging with me.

Lol, ok - I will refrain! And do hope you are just venting and that all the hate speech is just frustration. Just too intense for me. Good luck.

Amy is a breath of fresh air, an entertaining writer, outgoing, smart, and her floofs bring us together as we talk about common experiences.

That troll comment really bothers me.

I only breeze through here on occasion but Amy is not a troll. She has a unique and entertaining writing style. The style itself may be viewed as somewhat hyperbolic - but that's where at least some of the entertainment value lies.

Anyone who has spent any time here knows Amy is not a troll. To me, that's a pretty mean name to throw around and I think Amy handled it graciously.

I agree that Amy is a well-known and delightful part of the KT. To be fair, though, Amy, you used the word "troll" many times throughout this thread, referring to the letter carrier. I understand that it's a different meaning, but you have spewed such hate for this person that I'm concerned that it's overtaking you,

I hope that it all gets resolved and that you feel much better about a new carrier, should your neighborhood be fortunate enough to get one.

I didn't realize Amy was a long time poster, I guess I only first noticed her from the office Christmas decorating dispute with her co-worker beginning in December. So apparently I was mistaken.

Team Amy!

It is one thing to refer to someone in a story - someone who is not participating here - in a derogatory way. If the Overlords were to stop that, the entire Hot Topics forum would cease to exist. (Ha ha...)

It is another thing entirely to call someone that to their face, and then throw a mental health diagnosis at them for good measure.

Thanks everyone. What a wonderful group here!

I have a small update. As to my missing tax documents I got an email response to my report instructing me to contact the postmaster. I did. She informed me that my w2,and 2 other mail pieces were at the post office. The other 2 were the tax forms from the 2 mortgage companies that held my mortgage last year. Huh. Why are they up there and not in my mailbox? They were supposed to be delivered a week ago. My other mail is being delivered,albeit reluctantly and in an unsatisfactory manner. She just kept repeating that they were up there and I could come pick them up. When I got there there was a looooong line. A lot of people were chatting. It seemed many of us were there for the same reason,to pick up tax stuff. It was ridiculous. I just got my mail and left. The poor people that work the front counter were obviously overwhelmed.