I like most of the plan except the pantry. This configuration is just wasted space.

Open up the wall between kitchen and dining. With this you should only have 1 door leading to outside, make the current door your french doors (extend toward kitchen about 3') and leave a window on the kitchen side.

I would install the coffee bar in the dining room. You could even make it 10' long along the "north" wall that is 19'9". This still provides plenty of circulation space for the table if using a rectangular table. In addition to being a coffee bar it could also be used as a serving buffet and can store a lot to allow for a smaller pantry.

I would install the pantry on the "north side of your kitchen to the right of where you place the range. Place refrigerator next to a small broom closet in the 54" wall space before the window and your kitchen sink. This allow the range section to slide down and be more in the kitchen.

Have the peninsula cabinets end flush with the now window (your french doors) and the overhang/seating will have about 2' left before you get to the door.

I'd keep the cooktop in the current location, so that it's on the same run as the sink and prep area. It's more protected from through traffic, and fewer steps from the sink. (Pantry widths can be adjusted--see 2nd plan.)

Thank you both! @mama goose_gw zn6OH The only problem with leaving the range where it is is that it doesn't provide a great setup for storage. Currently there is a 12" cabinet to the left of it which is where we store our baking sheets, etc. and pots and pans have to be stored in the opposite wall, which I'm not crazy about. This particular cabinet is one that was not anchored well so it has started shifting (obviously we'd make sure a better job was done in the new kitchen). What do you think about getting a pullout corner cabinet instead so that the range shifts right and a wider cabinet could go on the left?

I did this for your original thread but never posted it (it was a week later when I finished it and figured it was too late.) I'll look at the details of this post and come up with a new one based on additional information in this thread tonight (busy day today at work!)

Optionally: Switch the Snack Center with the top Prep Zone, including moving the sink there.

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Work Zones:

IMO a range belongs on an outside wall so I would start there with the new plan. If you want water at the beverage center thats good but a poor place for prep.Corner pantries are ahuge waste of space I would suggest you get a KD to help with this and not a cabinet salesperson but an actual designer. Be aware that the Ikea kitchen planner has some issues . pullout pantries each 18” wide will give you a huge amount of storage I always start my designs with centering the sink under the window if it is important to you to have a sink there. Your lower cabinets should be as many drawers as possible and nice wide ones on either side of the stove for pots . Store oils in an undercounter pullot and spices in a drawer a nice wide one but shallow. Think about all you need to store the reason for lower drawers is that everything stored is reachable while standing. If you and your husband cook together make sure how you work is though through my husband does the prep and I do the actual cooking some make if that is how you cook that you are not crossing paths all the time

@Patricia Colwell Consulting, thank you! We definitely need to improve the venting for the range, and putting it on the outside wall would certainly make this easier. We thought about doing a range with a downdraft vent, but we'll have a gas cooktop so that's less than ideal. @Buehl, thank you so much! You're always so helpful. What software are you using for design? I am seriously considering biting the bullet and purchasing some legit software because we will be reno-ing the master bath, too, eventually.

Added a note above that you could switch the Snack Center with the top Prep Zone, including moving the sink there.

I use Microsoft PowerPoint...so no design software. I created a template with all sorts of scaled items and and use them to create the layouts. That's why I don't do elevations, PPT doesn't have that. If you'd like my template, email me at EverCurious2009 at gmail dot com. (Anyone else as well.)

If you're doing this extensive work why are you unwilling to move load bearing walls?

Are you on a slab or is there a basement below?

I like buehl's plan with the cooktop on the outside wall for easy venting, but I'd think about switching the oven to the top wall, and put the extra prep counter on the short wall to the left of the sink. Only one sink would be necessary, and the whole prep/clean-up area would seem more open.

I would:

• Place fridge on far right of wall to eliminate traffic jam near the peninsula. Then, shift the entire stove wall configuration to the left.
• Remove pantry build-out and place pantry at proposed "beverage center" location.
• Center sink to window.

This will create loads more countertop space, same amount of storage, better working triangle and more balance aesthetically.

**I would also suggest a pantry with roll-out shelves so nothing gets lost in the dark abyss.

Hope this helps!

@cpartist I think the moving of load-bearing walls blows the budget. I think eventually we'll want to open the walls between the dining and living rooms, but otherwise even if I moved say, the wall between the future office and the kitchen, I don't know that it would be worth it and it would shrink that room down too much.

I think I'd take Buehl's design but move the clean-up sink and DW to the upper wall, and have the prep sink and stove along the bottom wall, shifting the sink to the right so prep space is in front of the window. I find myself wanting to prep where there aren't upper cabinets, so I'm not fond of the prepping on the side counter/corner. Double ovens could come down to the side wall, to allow plenty of clean-up space up top.

I've been struggling to give you everything you want in a functional layout. The primary issue is those windows in the dining area. I'd like to ask you to do a couple of things:

* First, think about raising the windows to 36" off the floor (before you take down the wall b/w the Dining Room and the Kitchen space) -- that would make a big difference. We replaced a 7' wide x 18" deep bay window that was 22" off the floor with the same that was 36" off the floor. It cost us around $1,200. Granted that was 10 years ago, but our window was wider and a more expensive configuration than yours. Your windows are 62" wide and "straight", so only one or two windows instead of three and no angles to deal with. To me, 2K or so would be well worth it to get a better layout. Maybe use your existing refrigerator or wait on the backsplash to come up with the funds for the window. We waited on the backsplash to fit the window in our budget. BEFORE vetoing the idea, get a couple of estimates, You may be pleasantly surprised at the cost.

BTW...are the windows 30" or 20" off the finished floor? (Your original thread said 20" but this thread says 30".) If 30" off the floor, are either of you short? Do you bake a lot? 30" is table-height and is considered by many to be a better height for rolling out dough. If either of you are short, it might also be a better work height for you.

What is your exterior made of? Siding? Brick? Other?

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* Second, if changing the windows is out of the question, would you consider a range instead of wall oven? The placement of the doorways and the fact that the one on the far right is probably busy b/c it leads to the Game Room, Garage, and Powder Room are limiting where things can be functionally/safely placed without using the window space below. Eliminating a tall oven cabinet frees up 31" or so of space for counters.

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What am I trying to fit?

• Two separate Prep Zones, both with their own adequate workspace and a water source
• Pantry space -- usable/functional and efficient pantry for both food and, possibly larger items
• Double Ovens, 30"
• Built-in MW
• Refrigerator (36" wide b/c that's the most common width and what most manufacturers are standardizing on)
• Cooktop, 30" + Hood, 36"
• DW, 24"

FYI regarding cost of window replacement. I don't know where you live, but we live in the DC-Metro area and it's high cost of living area (HCOLA), so costs reflect that.

@Buehl, as ever, you are amazing, thank you for your input! I see a lot of really great ideas here. We aren't opposed to changing those windows at all, though we were thinking of replacing them with a sliding door because currently the entrance to and from the backyard is through the dining room which is just...weird to me. Not to mention, we have original hardwood floor currently in the dining room and even with the rug at the door and an oversized one under the table, I fear for the damage the dogs are doing bringing in the wet.

I love love LOVE the step-in pantry suggestion and your placement of the fridge means we don't have to worry about the slanted ceiling from the stairs affecting a cabinet or storage going above it, which putting it where the existing pantry is would've done. We're not ready to start tearing things out yet, but this is definitely a better start than where I was a couple of weeks ago! Thank you again for all your help!

"...even with the rug at the door and an oversized one under the table, I fear for the damage the dogs are doing bringing in the wet."

Which is why we use the Garage for our dogs -- in & out from there. It brings them inside to be wiped down (feet and/or body -- wet or dirty) before letting them into the house itself. Just a thought!