Jackson and Perkins, IMHO, is a model for what went wrong with the rose industry. I don't blame only them for this, but they were the "face" of roses for decades in this nation, and they were responsible for leadership (or a lack of it.) The public perception that "roses are hard to grow" (at least any rose aside from Knockouts) is a direct result of years of trading research and honest effort in for marketing and making a quick buck. There is no excuse for the endless parade of hybrid teas that fall victim to blackspot, the claims of "hardiness" from roses that are not at all hardy in cold climates, or even the lack of own-root roses or alternate root stocks. I can forgive a company for trying to introduce new products vs. just selling classic, unpatented rose varieties, but when the new roses have the same problems year after year for decades, that just points to a complete failure on the part of the company. People have put up with much more nonsense from rose sellers than they have with almost any other garden product: "hardy" roses that are not, "disease resistant roses" that fail to resist any real disease, and so on. Is it really any wonder that the Knockout roses have so effectively replaced all other roses? Why? Because they actually deliver what is promised, and most folks are so shocked by that concept - a rose that actually grows as advertised - that they will only buy that variety for fear of being lied to yet again. While Jackson and Perkins may have at one time been a boon to the industry, they ended up being a perfect example of what went wrong: marketing trumped quality, and we were all left with dead, black-spot covered roses as the result.

Boy, you guys are really tough! I don't think DA's roses are any more or less disease prone or hardy than anyone else's. And for my money I certainly don't think Kordes roses are bullet proof either! And even if both these fine breeders bred a rose that was hardy and absolutely spot free in their test gardens there is no guarantee that it would be in yours or mine. It's all about location and finding the ones that work in your garden. And really now, isn't that half the fun? Part of the enjoyment I get out of my roses is trying out new ones (not necessarily new varieties but new to my garden) and seeing how they do here. I even push the zone envelope to see what will and will not take my Michigan winters. That's how I ended up with all those roses in pots. It was a lark experiment that everyone told me wouldn't work here because it was too cold. Well it did and I have a lovely patio of potted roses because I wasn't afraid to try it out for myself and see. Yes, occasionally I've bought dogs and some of them didn't make it but a lot of the ones I was told would be awful weren't and some of the ones that came SO highly recommended were disease riddled and up a croaked their first winter. Roses are a crap shoot and no breeder can give you guarantees. Except maybe the ones selling "blue rose seeds" on ebay, lol!

Thanks again, Beachplant and pcput. Printmaster - I'm meeting John Tarvin Sunday, looking forward to a tour of his yard. Bud Guillot (Guillot's Sunset, etc.) is his neighbor not too far away. Plumeria folk: Question about etiquette - would it be rude to show up at Bud's door with a chainsaw and a pickup and ask if it's okay to take "a few cuttings" - or might that seem excessive? Just asking. moonie 57 - I'm a pretty bad enabler myself, so I know a bad example when I see it! It still works (me succumbing to the bad example), but I see it!! Thank you, too, Laura and no-Clue and jperilloux and Big Wave Dave and Bill. Jen, I may open a thread on plumeria mysteries, see if I can get help in identifying some of the tough ones. Taking pics now! Thanks for all the tips. I plan on taking pics of my yard this weekend and putting them up very soon. Don't expect too much - I've lived here less than 2 years and it's all a work in progress. But I have some interesting trees and ideas I'd love to share with you guys. So pics are coming, I promise. Bill - thanks for the info on Wildfire. I was going to put her in the ground (once I found one). Now I'll keep it in a pot in the ground, and move it when necessary. I'm starting to put together my winter plan. My previous winter plan was very light, as I didn't know we were having two extremely mild winters (I've only experience two). This year I'm getting the blankets and Christmas lights, and moving into the sunroom, and maybe building a greenhouse - it's serious. Not that I expect it to get too cold - but I rather be prepared. I almost break down when I accidentally damage an inflo - imagine what would happen if I lost a whole plant! There would be a funeral and procession. One bit of bad news: I have a spectacular 4 foot Jeannie Moragne that's been blooming like crazy. I also have a 6.5' foot one that I've been waiting to bloom. I like the Jeannie so much that I put the big one right in the middle of the yards as a centerpiece, between two Cuban Royal Palms. Today it finally opened!... Not a Jeannie. I kind of feel like Charlton Heston at the end of Planet of the Apes. So I may be looking for a big Jeannie, too. Thanks to Bill and his info, though, I may only need a small Wildfire to keep in a pot, instead of the large one I initially intended to get. I'll post a pic of my Jeannie imposter in a mysteries thread. It's rounder and more of a deep rose color and very beautiful.... wait, I can't fall in love again. Not so soon! I need a large Jeanne Moragne! And Wildfire - quick! Thanks all for making me feel welcome. Pics coming soon.

Moved the master bath shower to make the closet bigger , and move the water closet to the back of the bathroom . Since I am recently divorced I don’t need the two closets or two vanity sinks . I’m a hairdresser so I had them use the study as a utility room so I could put my hair station in the same room as the washer and dryer and made a storage closet in the hall that I will use as a workout room . i’m Not sure about the design to make the dining room a guest room , I’m afraid it will make the living space look smaller when you walk in . What do you all think ?