My house is tidy and clean. My husband thinks that the house is clean if it is tidy, so sometimes does not see the need for cleaning. As for beds, i cannot sleep in an unmade bed. I make the bed first thing in the morning and I am a fussy bed maker, so I think it might take me longer than 2 minutes 20 seconds. My retired husband was still in bed when I left for work before I retired. it took him several years of my preaching before he made the bed before I came home. I suspect that he, like Anglophilia's SIL, made the bed and tidied the kitchen minutes before I walked in the door. Sometimes I would call to say I was on my home.

I cannot understand throwing clothes on the floor, but I can tolerate heaps and mounds of clothes on a bench or chair. Now that my daughters are grown I do not have to live with that anymore.

My daughters keep a tidy home but you definitely know that husbands, kids and dogs share the house. The grandchildren keep their rooms okay although the 17 year boy has clothes and laundry everywhere and bed is unmade on weekdays mostly. Not unusual for a teenager. Sometimes but not often, I go in and straighten up for him. He is a good kid. I also gave him some nice hangers which minimally helped him keep his closet organized.

I think people have a range of tolerance of neat and clean. This is developed by upbringing, personality, and time. There is a difference between laziness and leading full busy lives accounting for neatness.

My girl’s rooms were their own early on. I just asked the floor to be empty enough to come through with the vacuum cleaner. Laundry always in the laundry room. I do make the bed every day. And I have to vacuum every day. That’s a must. I do not worry about a couple of books piled on the table or stuff like that. I always hated my Dyson vacuum cleaner, but didn’t want to unpack the new one my husband gave to me before it broke. It didn’t really break, but lost a little wheel, so I got the new one out (a shark). It has a really bright light and it was absolutely scary what I saw with that thing! Luckily it also had a bag full of weird attachments to go under the bookshelves and such. I spent hours getting into all these tiny spaces.

I prefer a neat and clean home. Beds made, dusted, clean floors and everything in its place. I hate dust, and clutter in my home but it doesn't bother me in someone elses. The boys make their beds in the morning and on bed washing day they strip them. How are they to learn how to do household chores if I don't teach them. Kids reach a certain age and it's time to assign chores. Their room is clean but if they are involved in Legos or some other building tool there will be that out but always cleaned up before moving onto something else.

I am a stay at home so I have the time to keep a clean home AND spend time with the boys or let them do crafts ect. I understand if both parents work and the house may not be tidy because they want to spend time with the kids but I know people who stay at home..don't work and use the excuse their house is a mess because the kids are more important. ..I don't buy that excuse...no reason a stay at home can't keep a clean house and happy kids.

I also agree that a dirty home is different from a home with a few things cluttering..such as toys on the family room floor..but true clutter...how does one clean around the clutter without first putting it away. Oh well..I'm just rambling.

Studies have shown that venting/complaining, etc. (even if it's in your own head), can increase unhappiness. Voicing gratitude (even if it's in your own head) as little as three times a day, increases happiness and feelings of well being.

I imagine that if you've moved in with family, you've had some upheaval in your life recently and may be feeling stress from a variety of factors. Take time for yourself and research some relaxation and happiness inducing strategies. They really do work.

My DH talked me thru the strategy of "adjustment of expectations". It saved my sanity when dealing with family. I was always expecting them to react or act a certain way and then when they didn't, I was stressed and unhappy. I found that by just adjusting my expectations, I saved myself much pain.

For example, I used to call and tell my mom of this or that achievement expecting congratulations, but that is not my mom. She isn't motivated by rewards or congratulations, so she doesn't get that it may be important for others. I used to get off the phone in tears, until I stopped expecting her to act in a certain way. I still share with her - I just don't expect her to act in a way in which she is not able.

Also, try using "I" messages when talking to your family about the mess. Try saying, "When things are messy, I feel stressed" rather than "Why can't you pick up after yourself?" or "You are so messy".

I hope these strategies help and you are able to feel less stress in your life.

Sometimes I think I don't share enough. Sometimes I think I share too much. I truly don't know why I can't tell where the line is. But here goes about my as usual lengthy and probably oversharing story of cleaning.

As a child I was whirling dervish of mess. My parents were not good at cleaning as my mother was sick with heart disease and was constantly in and out of hospitals. But according to our first cousins family stories everyone in the family was messy anyway. She had kinds of emotional problems as well and so couldn't pull herself together enough to even get us five girls to cook and clean. She had a real dislike of our doing anything as if it would make her look bad. Her solution was to do it all which she really couldn't do and not share anything with us particularly about cooking or her secret recipes. They died with her. My upbringing=Quell disaster.

I tried as a young adult to consciously keep my own area clean all the time. I did succeed until I became chronically ill.

When I had my chronic migraines for those 30 years I was a disaster of a cleaner. Or even a tidy-er.

Now I can clean and do but it doesn't take long as there's only the two of us and the dogs on this floor. I could dust more than I do.

DS and DN take care of their stuff as there is a second dishwasher in the complete kitchen downstairs. They make their own beds and once a week do their own sheets. Probably their beds aren't made every night though.

DH and I fold our duvet back or hang it on the foot board to air out. We do it as that's the way I've always done it with my family, plus it's supposed to dry natural body sweat odors Etc. Apparently the buildup of dust mites isn't too bad when you do that. Then at the end of the day we shake out the sheets including the fitted sheet and get the bed ready for bedtime. I guess you could say we make the bed at bedtime.

I will admit it...I am an OCD person...a place for everything and everything in its place. My bed is made as soon as I get out of it...clothes in hamper... towels hung up...as soon as a meal is over, the dishes are in the dishwasher...etc. A picture that is not hanging straight just drives me nuts...but I do refrain straightening it in someone else’s home.

My first DH was killed when our kids were small and I worked full time...Saturday was cleaning and doing laundry...and the kids 7, 10, 13...all had their jobs to do. My children still follow this practice to this day. My DDIL is not a tidy person, so DS does the laundry and hires a housekeeper .... he also is OCD, as is one of my DDs. The other one is not a slob, but much more relaxed...but also has the luxury of a housekeeper and takes her DH’s clothes to the cleaners.

My parents were very poor so my DM always told me that even though we did not have much money, we could be clean....guess it was passed on from generation to generation.

As long as the kitchen and bathroom are clean I am not bothered by dust bunnies and such. I try to keep the clutter reasonably picked up but try to be flexible with the people around me.

When my daughter was a young teenager, I told her I was not picking up her room anymore or doing her laundry. She managed to keep her room clean enough, but the door was usually closed. She did OK on her laundry too. Now that she is 40, not married and lives by herself, her house is still clean enough.

Phoggie, I remember my mom used to say..soap and water are cheap enough so there's no excuse to walk past someone in public that reeks. I used to tell her that not everyone grew up the way she raised me.

So do you all think that people you see in public that are dirty, and I don't mean someone that just got off duty doing labor, but really dirty also has a dirty home? And do you think it's part of how one is raised. Circle?

I'm not that tidy but clothes always were in the closet or the hamper. I'm so pleased that when I visit my son's apartment (shared with two roommates) it is certainly habitable (although, I almost gave him a can of Easy Off for Christmas, then decided that was NOT in the spirit. Did give him a mini fire extinguisher, though.) Even his room is fairly tidy. He does suffer, as I do, from an abundance of books. Hmm, suffer, or thrive? Well, anyway, we have a lot of books.

I was interested in this thread when I read the title and thought it was written by a person who prefers things a bit unkept, messy and was curious to hear about a relaxed, devil may care type way of life. Pointing fingers isn't as interesting. I will say when my offspring were young they experienced the work of picking up daily before naps, before bedtime. They always contributed. Not much was done for them. As they became teens and at a time of life when they need to feel control of SOMETHING I learned to shut their doors. Beds often went unmade after 12 years of ALWAYS making their beds or helping with the process....training isn't ALL OF IT. When they went off to college pay back was a *itch. They all lived with people MUCH MUCH MUCH messier than they and it was irritating for them. Now they all have their own apartments and do dishes nightly, pick up before they leave for work keep things ready for visitors, but don't make beds to this day. My son is the clean FREAK of the three. People pick their battles. Lives are busier than "back in the day". Something is bound to give.

If it's any consolation for you, when I was a teen, my room was always a terrible mess...not dirty, but messy with clothes and stuff strewn all over the place and an unmade bed.

My house now is always very neat, bed made every morning and other than an occasional pair of shoes by the sofa or a mail pile that's a little tall, the place looks pretty decent.

It was a phase and I was glad to have one area of my life that was unordered and unmanaged by adults. My small personal rebellion.

I loved reading all the different perspectives. Of all the possible choices of ways to live, I choose/chose the one that made the most sense to me. The agreements I made with my children were that their clothes/shoes could not be left in the common areas, food was only okay in rooms if dirty dishes were brought back downstairs, dirty clothes were cleaned if they were brought to the laundry area (they were responsible for washing their own clothes at 14 or so) and they were responsible for getting themselves up and out the door at a reasonable age.

I did not care if they put their clothes away or make their beds nor did I help them clean their rooms after they were old enough to do it themselves. I did care if they understood that actions had consequences as in if you miss the bus you'll be late to school and have to answer to your teachers. If you don't clean your clothes, you may have nothing clean to wear when you want it.

We are all different and our approach to the problems of the world are different, but as daisy chain said above "Studies have shown that venting/complaining, etc. (even if it's in your own head), can increase unhappiness." I believe that we are responsible for how we live and interact with those around us.

"Studies have shown that venting/complaining, etc. (even if it's in your own head), can increase unhappiness."

Many of us start threads here to vent about issues in our lives. I'm sure we hope for some sympathy and support. I have always thought that talking about one's troubles is the first step in managing and solving them- it helps identify exactly what the problem is.

I'd be interested in seeing the particulars of these studies.

Lucille, just rushing off to work, but wanted to clarify that, in my mind, there is a difference b/w venting to let off steam and clarify a problem (I've vented here myself with wonderful results:) and restating the problem over and over again and not going anywhere. Not saying the OP is doing that, but we often get caught up in cycles of looking at what is going wrong and forgetting to be grateful. There are some great Ted talks on this and how just stating what we are grateful for can change how we are feeling. I've been thru some stressful times in my life and wanted to share with the OP what worked for me as it sounds like she is having a tough time. I hope I didn't come off as chastising? I'll try to come back tonight and post some of the videos if you are interested.

Mamap

So do you all think that people you see in public that are dirty, and I
don't mean someone that just got off duty doing labor, but really dirty
also has a dirty home?

No I don't think that......often, they do not have a home.

I have been thinking about the "raising" concern/comments. What happens when a child lives with one who is neat and one who is messy? That's my son. He must've hated it as a kid because the day his dad left, I cleaned the house from top to bottom, spic and span clean (I'm a cleaner, not a tidy-ier). He spent the next week off/on gleefully commenting, sometimes to total strangers!?!, his dad left and the house was clean. Oy. Third time I put the kibosh on it. He has his dad's messy marvin (I loved everyone's contributions on this thread) tendencies now. Will he end up like me and clean once he has his own place? It'll be interesting to see. I'm less certain on the raising thing. I know my son often comments he'll never this or that and goes the opposite way of the habits of the parent he wants to avoid being like in other areas of life. Some here have commented their parents "influenced them in reverse" like my son. And others still, commented on rearing being the roots they returned to. So influence can go either way. Just my rambling thoughts today.

Lucille, I think the study that may be being referenced is at the bottom of this article in Psychology Today:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/significant-results/201706/the-three-types-complaining

My house can be very messy at times. If anyone understands depression ,sometimes just getting up off the couch seems like a mountain to climb. Simple housework can be overwhelming some days. I wish I had the strength to be neat !

Lives are busier than "back in the day".

I disagree. Lives are more distracted today than back in my day, yes, but not any busier than it was when I was raising two children. My children were busy 7 days a week while in school. Track, music, art, swimming, gymnastics, baseball, volleyball, tennis, and more. We still did housekeeping chores, together.

I take my grands to the park many times a week and observe that I'm usually the only person without a phone to my face. Most of the time, when a young mom/dad is on the playground with kids, they're browsing social media, not playing or interacting with their kids. At dinner in a restaurant, it's usually the same routine, kids on screens, mom/dad on social media.

Busier or distracted? I say distracted.

Something upthread made me remember an old tenant of mine. Her place was always a mess. She was a single mom working two jobs. She told me once that she had OCD tendancies. Her brain said that if she was to clean up, she had to clean 100%. Everything, before she could stop. She didn't have time to do the entire house at once, so she didn't start.

I know she had other OCD tendancies, like the light switch and door lock things. So this may have been true. Or she was just a slob.

I've said this before, 30 minutes of cleaning each day will keep a fairly clean house. I'm in the camp of no eating anywhere in the house other than the dining room, food encourages messes.

For the OP, I would select a particular area of the house that you will spend the most time in and clean/pickup that area daily. Maybe the "messies" will see that it's easier to live & find things in the neat area.

If I were rich, the absolute first thing I would do is hire a full time housekeeper to clean up after me! I really, really hate tidying and cleaning but I do enjoy a nice clean space. One of my favorite things about traveling and cruising is how all my dirty tea mugs, trash and towels mysteriously disappear while I'm out doing fun stuff! :)

This is a very interesting thread! And the term "OCD" comes to mind often.

I have to admit, I am a lousy housekeeper! I really dislike doing housework. I also really dislike a show place, not a thing out of place, house. I am very uncomfortable in such an atmosphere. And if I have to take my shoes off to come in your door, chances are pretty durned good, I won't be coming in your door. Nor do I care whether your bed is made or not. Mine isn't. I throw the covers back when I get up in the morning, and I straighten them at night before I get in. I do like a home that is lived in and shows it. Some disarray is necessary, IMHO, to give that warm, welcoming, comfy feeling.

My mother once said she blamed herself for my poor housekeeping habits. I very rarely had to help with anything inside the house. She said she always felt my dad needed my help in the fields and barn more than she needed it in the house. And she was probably right. We farmed, had some dairy cows, a few hogs, and he almost always worked an outside job, too. So yes, I had pretty good training in taking care of calves, knowing when the wheat and oats were ready for the combine, when it was time to cut silage, etc.

My sister once commented she could write her name in the dust on my TV. I told her it's very nice to be educated.

Keeping things neat and orderly isn't 'painful' for me, it just isn't very high on my list of priorities.

Rusty

My use of the word "messy" defines clutter and actually has little to do with cleanliness. It is clutter that bugs me - articles crowding by being where they should not be instead of being in their special place. I guess if I also had to worry about cleanliness, I would really go bonkers! P,S, - I do not make my bed immediately as I prefer that it has time for some fresh air.

Chi's comment about cruising reminds me: Living in very small space (a ship's cabin) forces order. Perhaps nature abhors a vacuum indoors as well as outdoors, and more space engenders more mess -- especially if too little space is in the form of easily accessed storage.

I'm 'neat' with a 'neat' DH. One of the reasons I don't enjoy cooking is the mess it makes. Our 'messy' DS found his 'messy' DW, and they love to cook. We're all happy in our 'spaces'.

When we moved from our starter house the movers had to bring in an extra truck when they started to pack. The estimator had coolly surveyed a small, uncluttered home without allowing for all the closet space! (I could easily keep that small house neat because of the storage space.)

Then there is 'time'. I find it easy to keep neat and clean by constantly 'keeping up'. Because I like 'neat', my sense of orderliness pushes me to tidy as I go. If things get out of hand, it's much harder to get started -- maybe time to hire help and start afresh. (We've talked about Cleaning Help on the KT.)

I was pressed for time as I got dressed (bed lying with covers thrown back as on my departure), including installing pressure stockings and other health-related issues, got breakfast (coffee could wait till the old guys' meeting), gathered stuff, headed for the door and stashed stuff in car.

Car wouldn't start ... only that series of rapid clicks telling you that your battery wasn't strong enough to turn the starter. Remember my story of the young folks who not only helped me at night on the sideroad near home, but gave me a fine flashlight? After that, my garage guy had confirmed my suspicion, a week or so ago, that my battery might be on its last legs.

My house is cluttered, messy and she'd (NO! "shed") suffers from similar lack of attention as referred to in earlier posts.

I have a battery charger that would get me going, that I'd seen a week or so ago when I took it out of the car trunk to make room for carting a friend's stuff.

Looked high and low in the shed and basement - it was nowhere to be found!

Where is it? Did someone come into the unlocked she'd (NO! didn"t you hear me? oh, right - may be a memory problem) ...

... and steal it?

So ... in to the house, some more breakfast (including coffee) and regroup.

1. Call landlord - does he expect to come to shop today, if so, give me a shout, as I need a boost.

2. Search for battery charger/booster.

3.Call CAA (prefer to not, as it's early in the year and I may have greater need of service call, later).

Need to plan to replace battery soon after first boost, as it may restart shortly after stopping that day, but after overnight: same bind as now!

ole (stranded) joyful

Not my house = I don't care. The only thing driving me crazy (kind of) right now is my husband putting his coats on the end of the dining room chair instead of the coat rack. He puts them there, I hang up, repeat. I don't say anything, I just hang up. Sometimes he gives an excuse, I just put where they belong.

I showed pics of my brother's condo recently. Those weren't staged, that is how he lives 100% of the time.

I'm more laid-back, as I also mentioned. Not a slob, but there are generally papers/recipes, the calendar, shopping list, etc on the kitchen table. There are cat toys on the floor, often something on the couch, a book or something I'm doing (looking thru my recipe binders).

My bed is made every day, the dusting gets done once/week, but could be done more often. My laundry piles up, just because I want to have enough for a full load, and it's harder with one person than two. I had no shortage of laundry to do with 2 of us.

"My sister once commented she could write her name in the dust on my TV. I told her it's very nice to be educated."

Ha! You could write and entire series on mine sometimes! I hate housework. The kitchen stays clean and safe, but the rest,,,,,,pfffffffffft. The only time it bothered my husband was when his mother was coming to visit, and then he helped clean.

I asked my DGS1 when he was home at Christmas, how he kept his room. He did not make his bed at home once his mother gave up fussing about that or wasn't home. But he said he DOES do so in his dorm room. Is he doing this to please a roommate or a girlfriend? No - he has a single and his girlfriend is home and still in high school and he is faithful.

He said he does since he prefers to do homework in his room. He works at his desk as he needs both the monitor on his laptop and a 2nd freestanding large one, for all his engineering problem sets. But he said it's "distracting" to him for his bed to be messy.

Now I'm sure his idea of "making his bed" is to straighten the covers and be sure they are up to the top of the bed and to fluff his pillows, but hey, it's a start! He said he cleans his room every Sun as that is the only day he does not have practice for his varsity sport. He does his laundry then, as well. He will not wear dirty clothes (unlike his younger brother!). I assume the athletic dept launders the uniforms but doubt they do the practice gear.

To me, keeping an orderly house (that is reasonably clean) is a sign of respect; respect for oneself and respect for others. Dressing in clean and neat clothes is the same. And wearing ones best to church and other places for special events is again, a show of respect, for God and for others.

I'm not obsessive about dust. If I were, I would not have two dogs! I have cleaning help that comes every other week, but I don't dust in between. I do sweep up the dust bunnies that collect in my kitchen, every couple of days - they really are disgusting.

I just plain can't think well in disorder.

I think back to pioneer days and the fact that most pioneer women felt that keeping an orderly house was a very good thing. They might have had a dirt floor in that sod cabin, but they swept it daily. Beds were aired and then made. Women who didn't do this experienced the peer pressure of the rest and were labeled "slatternly". Keeping a house clean, washing clothes was not easy then. Heck, it was not easy for my mother to run a load of wash in the basement, and then carry that heavy basket full of wet clothes up the basement steps and out into the back yard to hang to dry. She did this unless there was precipitation of some sort, or it was below freezing. Even hanging it all on the line to dry, was hard. And there was also the 3-times daily dishwashing. She got her first dishwasher when we moved to St Louis in 1962. She was 54 years old. No "respectable" woman left a sink full of dirty dishes all day or over night! And the ironing. Nothing was "no-iron" - it all had to be ironed. And due to the expense of dry cleaning, usually only one's best clothes were wool - everything else was cotton. Even wool sweaters were hand washed and blocked and dried flat. Laundry day was on Monday; what ironing that didn't get done on Monday was finished on Tues.

I am aware that most women work outside the home these days, but believe me, when that was not the norm, most women were not sitting around popping bon bons.

I was reading in the Wall Street Journal today that in super high end houses, having at least 10 bathrooms is now the norm and some have as many as 20. My gawd, that would be like cleaning the restrooms in an airport! I can't but wonder where on earth they get all the help they must need to clean all those bathrooms. It's hard here finding a cleaning woman for once every other week. I have 3 full baths, one 1/2 bath, and a toilet in the basement. So, 5 toilets to clean. And my house is not large - about 2800 sq feet!

Since we have started talking about how neat or messy WE are, I'll add that I once was very an*l about how clean my house was...everything cleaned and dusted and orderly. But I have become a lot more relaxed in my older age. For some unknown reason, our house is very dusty and I have given up fighting the dust battle at my house. I would have to dust every other day to keep it clean and I'm just not going to do that. So if you came to my house, you could write all sorts of things in the dust on the furniture...HA! I've also become more about convenience than orderly...I want my stuff at hand and if I am using something on a daily basis, I am likely to leave it sitting on the counter in the bathroom or bedroom etc rather than put it away each time I use it. I do try to have a place for everything and everything in its place but it seems if I buy something new that has no place, I may forget where it's been put which is really pi$$ing me off!

This afternoon, dressed a little more warmly- as in ready to do garden/farm chores, not to travel in (more or less) warm car to town.

Found my battery charger, hooked it up, ran it on high charge for a half hour, started the car, stopped it.

It'll charge for around another hour, then I'm to visit landlord to pay rent (and collect part of last year's electric bill, as his shop is on the same line: they told him when he set it up that a separate line would cost about $40./more. more. (($40./mo. more)).)

To town tomorrow, to pay util. bills and buy a new battery.

Looks like winter's for ...

... (some, at least) decluttering of house (& shed?) ...

... along with patching garden clothing.

ole joyful

My take on all this is follow your OWN bliss. Don't try to make your bliss someone elses. If you love to tidy or clean then do. If you don't love it don't. You love a perfectly ordered home then enjoy yours. That not your thing? don't. Life is short and even five minutes can be too much time wasted. I am not saying that cleaning is a waste of time because it isn't for those who enjoy either the cleaning and or the results. But if it doesn't feed your soul don't do it.

I read a very funny short story once that is appropriate here. A guy broke into a house to hide for some reason. The house was a total wreck. He thought the house had been robbed with drawers open and stuff pulled out of everything and all over the floor everywhere, books and papers scattered and food all over the kitchen. He stayed in the house several days and then just before he left he cleaned the whole house up because he didn't want the people to call the police to report the robbery and have his occupation of the house show up in fingerprints or something. While he was upstairs finishing up a couple of relatives of the owners walked in the front door, looked around at the spotless house, left at once and called the police! The intruder was found and arrested. As it turns out the family was on vacation which they did every years and their family members would come in while they were gone and clean because this family lived like pigs. Walking in and seeing a clean house set off all their alarms!

" . . . excessively neat or disgustingly messy"? How about "excessively messy or disgustingly neat"? Either one sounds rather judgmental depending on which side of the fence you're on.

I'm on the messy side. I'm not sure how I got this way, since my parents were inherently neat (to a reasonable degree), and my aunts and first cousins were all wonderful housekeepers along with being creative. I inherited only the creative part. I can't say I'm happy about my ability to make messes, but I wouldn't want to be judged for it.

Arkansas girl, your comment reminded me of something I thought at one time. As much as I would love for my home to be spotless so anyone coming to visit would envy me, the odds of that happening (the visiting part) are small, that I gave up that dream to just enjoy my home the way it is and not worry about anyone else. It's nice to let go of that unattainable goal.

I don’t keep my house neat and clean so “others would envy me”, I do it as it’s more enjoyable living in order rather than chaos, and clean as opposed to dirty. It’s not an “unattainable goal”. How hard is it to just put things back where they belong after using them, an occasional cleaning, and in the meantime wiping up spills and dirt.

I have always been clean, neat and organized. That has changed some due to health reasons. I just can't do some things ga the same anymore. Takes me over 4 hours to change the sheets on my bed. I'm not kidding, I have to stop and do breathing exercises every few minutes. So vacuuming, dusting, windows etc dont get done everyday anymore. I stay pretty organized. And still have to have things done a certain way. Those things are hard to turn over to someone else. My bed has to be made a certain way, towels, sheets, blankets, and clothing all must be folded a certain way. The clothes in the closet are all on wooden hangers, clothes facing left and color coded. Yes, I have just admitted to being crazy. My doctor hasn't found a cure yet. I might be hopeless.

Avatars · More Info

Anglophilia, you misunderstand me. My house is tidy most of the time. I don't like a lot of clutter, but I do have a lot of stuff. It's just me so I do hang up my coat, do the dishes as used. I don't make my bed everyday. I just don't feel I have to dust and vacuum everyday to suit someone else. I agree about wiping up spills and such. So don't judge me to live up to your standards, ok? And I won't do the same about you.

How hard is it to just put things back where they belong after using them? Well, that depends. A saying that pops into my mind frequently is, "Energy comes from knowing what to do." The converse of that is when we don't know what to do our energy can be drained almost to the point of paralysis. In a house with no closets on the first floor, no closet in my bedroom, and only a small closet in each of the other two bedrooms, I often don't know where to put things.

I'm feeling energized at the moment because I've been going through decades worth of files and getting rid of lots of them. My back hurts from bending over the shredder, but it feels good to have a plan.

When I was in my early 30's I had a close friend who was in her late 80's. She had raised 7 sons, and when she was widowed she decided to do only pleasant things from then on and give up the rest--so she abandoned housework. Her 7 daughters-in-law came over from time to time to "muck out" (her words). I haven't given up housework, but I've often thought it would be fun to have 7 daughters-in-law. :-)

Going though decades worth of paper is SO satisfying. I did this a few years ago and addressed every single piece of paper in my house. I got rid of 90% of it. I had no idea what a burden all that paper was. Then I organized my office to neatly file only the necessary documents. It was a thing of beauty! I have continued to keep it this way.

I like what you wrote, Alisande. You are so right about the storage situation; If you don't have enough storage or a good set-up, it's verrrry hard to keep things stowed away. When our kids were young and we had a new-to-us house we were very careful with money, rarely buying any furniture, and then only inexpensive stuff. These older homes are built with minimal storage as people did not have nearly the number of possessions we have today.

By the same token, it's difficult to keep a neat house when you have a medical problem and I cannot underscore that enough. My situation is a dicey back; you'd be amazed how many movements can irritate that or make it much worse--even picking something off of a table can be tough. (I am lucky in that I've finally found a fabulous physical therapist who has already helped my particular condition beautifully.)

In my soul I'm a neatnik but in reality not so much. However, I too derive great pleasure in going through a pile of papers and getting rid of the vast majority. I'm also terrible satisfied when I am able to get odds and ends put away and especially when I'm able to dust and vacuum. I hope to clean my fridge today!

I, too, live in a house with next to no closet space. My bedroom has a small one. My second bedroom no longer has a closet because the former owners took that space to enlarge the bathroom by a couple of feet. Since it's just me, no one else is inconvenienced. I grew up having large pots and pans and such stowed under my parents bed. So I do likewise. I also keep some pans and cookie sheets inside my oven. No storage is a bummer, but I can live with it.

I also love going through a pile of papers and recycling 95% of them. Very satisfying. I think I will make a late New Years resolution to go through some of the stowed paperwork I have around here. Thanks for the inspiration.

As some of you are speaking of (mostly dated) paperwork, it set me to thinking ...

... I have some (routine) paperwork here in my file cabinet from a church where I was minister almost 40 years ago, and supported some in recent years ...

... which closed about three years ago.

Anyone think that it might be about time to recycle some? (most?) ((almost all??) of that filed paperwork?

ole joyful

There is no doubt that I am very fortunate that I can afford cleaning help every other week as I could not possibly clean my house anymore due to my health problems. Even helping my cleaner put the sheets on the bed is exhausting and I use oxygen while doing so (yes, same cleaner who could not do the sheets right and 2 1/2 yrs later, still can't, so I "help"). I'm also blessed to have a wonderful yard man who keeps the outside looking very nice and will help with the inside if I need him to do so.

If I could not afford this help, I would sell my house and move into assisted living where these services would be provided for me. Yes, I know - some cannot afford that either. I'm not talking about these people at all.

My husband's family has a saying. "A good spouse needs to be good keeping house, good in the bedroom, and good in the kitchen. However, two out of three ain't bad!

Joyful, can you digitize those sermons? Know we know your source of joy :)

Joyful, if any of the closed church's paperwork has data on former members that might be interesting to genealogists sometime in the future (like membership lists, family records, special projects that mention names) could you see if a local historical society would accept them? I am in the process of hunting the records of my ancestor's church as he was very active in it -- but the church is gone and so seem to be all of its records.

I wish I could be a super neat freak.

Joyful,

I agree, you should take the best of what is in those papers and save it as digital files. You are a natural storyteller. The joyful guide to living ( attitude toward life ) book would be fun to read.

Extra things always makes cleaning more difficult. I find enclosed glass cases help if you don't like to dust objects. I have a large silver collection which requires attention but we do it every month one one weekend. If I got tired of that, I would sell the majority of the pieces. I don't think anyone wants to care for them so one day I will sell the collection. Fine furniture is the same. It requires regular care. I used to have more antiques but now I have fewer and it allows me to put my energy into the flower garden.

For a time, I had too many clothes and the decision to let go of half of them has made a big difference. The dry cleaner babies, as beautiful as they were, went to new homes. Having an orderly closet is much better than clinging on to some fantastic stuff that was rarely ever worn.

I clean all my own clothes and linens and care for the antiques. I like ironing and I put on music and use scented water and it doesn't seem like work.

I have help for the baths, the floors and the kitchen. I like to air my duvet in the morning outside and clean the rugs in the bedroom, then after breakfast, I make the bed. I don't use a dishwasher. I use fine china and silver because I have several sets and that's what I like using. It gets hand washed. I now have storage where the dishwasher used to be. Also, I got rid of the microwave ( never used it ) and I gained space there. I learned that I'd rather have fewer nicer things. There is always pressure to get more but now I save those impulses for garden flowers.

It wasn't always this way. I used to be swimming in objects. What i learned was if i could get the same feeling from looking at a picture of it as the real thing, I would photograph it and let it go. I do like good kitchen tools but my kitchen had limited storage. Trading the dishwasher for storage space made a big difference for me.