Going through his garage was completely out of line, I would have firmly let you know that is NOT okay. But I don't think using screws to truly fix the drawer was out of line at all.

ANYTHING outside of the kitchen sink area that he invited you into his home to fix is OFF LIMITS without permission. After reading so many of your wondering posts, I am surprised you would have done that.

Not communicating with the customer is what made him unhappy. Not the results. Communication is the #1 issue that homeowners have with contractors. It’s almost impossible to overcommunicate.

Take a cue from an OBGYN. They always tell you what to do, because they are in charge. (Scoot further down.) But they always let you know what will happen verbally before they do it. (I’m going to touch you. This will be cold touching you.) And they tell you how to help them do their job better, (Relax. Breath out when I do this.) so it’s easier on you. They also usually have another person present during the interaction, to serve as a witness that everything is done above board. You may have to settle for a tripod for your phone for that.

If you had told him that his crappy tape was an issue that you could improve on for free if he had some touchup paint, that would have gone a long way towards smoothing the interaction. Then he’d have let you rifle through the garage.

You could then have thrown him out of the kitchen while you did the job and asked him to spot the touchup afterwards. People won’t turn down “free” bonuses if you let them know you’re doing them a favor that will improve things.

But, the decision to live with a hslfassery or an improvement was his to make. Your actual job ended with installing the drawer front exactly like he had it installed previously. And if he didn’t want that improved, you just shake your head, mutter, and walk away, tools in hand.

I might have given him a materials list and let him produce the paint can and other things that you had to go looking for. but not a big deal: I wouldn't worry about it. How did you know where to look: I don't keep paint in the garage anyway....

meh, I wouldn't care because I tell people who come into my house to make themselves at home (literally, have a beer or coffee or hop in the shower, I don't care). My view is you hire human beings and they are your guests. I didn't understand why my GC had a porta potty brought in.

But of course, Sophie's right. It is just the communication.

Timmy, this is my second project with my GC, for the first he had included a porta potty for the job. They are a team of 2 that do most of the work and I told him they were welcome to use the powder room. They covered the floor in ram board and I supplied paper towels for hand drying. They regularly put in 10 hour days and I think they deserve a civilized place when nature calls. A porta potty is a terrible place to be when it is 90F outside.

I think Joe should have asked before rummaging through the garage. I don't think he needed to ask to make the best repair for the job.

It was the communication issue. It's all about setting expectations. People don't like surprises. Very laid back people adjust to them, and some REALLY uptight people come unhinged. Most folks are in between. Set expectations appropriately, then communicate throughout. It's not what you do. It's what you (didn't) say.

To clarify, there was no "rummaging through the garage." The homeowner had me park in front of his garage and go through it all day long. The paint cabinet was in plain sight right next to the door.

"But, the decision to live with a hslfassery or an improvement was his to make. Your actual job ended with installing the drawer front exactly like he had it installed previously. And if he didn’t want that improved, you just shake your head, mutter, and walk away, tools in hand."

No, they'll be no hslfassery on any of my jobs, thank you very much. I'll give you your money back and leave, but under no circumstances will you ever get to post a picture of my work online with the caption "Joe Corlett did this!" and have me be ashamed to see it. "How and "who" are not for sale at any price.

All the person wanted was the opportunity to give informed consent. This is something I obtain in my regular job every day.

It doesn't matter if its the right procedure or best procedure for the job and you're doing it for free. The person should know what the options are and have the ability to accept or refuse the options.

Of course it's actually a matter for litigation in my profession, but I don't think it's a bad course to take even for a few nails and touch up paint. What if there hadn't been useable touch up paint?

"The person should know what the options are and have the ability to accept or refuse the options."

This gets at the heart of the matter. There were no options for him; "how" remains mine. The drawer front was getting screwed on because I don't feel like getting a callback to apply more hillbilly sticky tape and/or have him post a picture of the hillbilly taped drawer falling off and saying that I did it. Noggondoit.

"What if there hadn't been useable touch up paint?"

There is useable touch up black gloss nail polish in my adhesive kit in the truck. Remember, this is a hand painted MDF lower drawer front, no where near eye level.

What Alex9179 said hit the nail on the head. Now you are getting ruffled, and debating what people are telling you here, after you've directly asked "was I out of line here? If so, how so?", a problem itself. It doesn't seem that you really wanted opinions on this thread; you wanted nodded heads and agreement. Here, as with your customer, it doesn't always work that way. Have a more open mind Joseph.

There is always the option of No Treatment. That may be inadvisable but it's their option. Or maybe they have a panel laminated with a picture of their mother in law they've been waiting to install. Maybe they want Velcro because it's where they store their stash.

What Sophie said.

I have to agree with the majority of the group. Your job was to replace the sink, and how you do that is your call. It's the homeowner's right to make the call on the drawer front, doesn't matter that your solution was better. If he wants to hold the drawer front in place with bubblegum, that's his prerogative.

No, they'll be no hslfassery on any of my jobs, thank you very much. I'll give you your money back and leave

Feel free to refuse any job at my house. However, if you walk in and "get the sink stretcher installed," and then decide to walk out, feel free to keep that money to pay a portion of the exorbitant amount the next contractor is going to charge to finish your work that day.

The homeowner noticed and offered more double sided tape.

Why didn't you just discuss it right then? You note the homeowner was there, you note that you don't like to leave jobs like this, so wouldn't noting right then that you would prefer to fix it properly been most appropriate?

I suspect that this issue was a lot more about surprising the customer with the big reveal than it was about your integrity or the job. They were surprised you would make holes in their cabinet without discussing it with them, and they were further surprised that you searched through their garage. Not exactly the reveal you were hoping for I am sure.

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I think you overstepped in this case. With good cause, but still you took it upon yourself to make the decision for them.

My GC would have told me that the only other option was to put screws through the front and touch it up, and did I have touch up paint, and was I OK with that. I would not have expected him to do it without getting my take on it first, nor would I expect him to look around in my garage for the paint. Doesn’t matter that it was the only option left, it’s the homeowner’s property and his decision to make. Basic respect for other people’s stuff. I would have been surprised and ticked off if he did it any other way.

Yeah, what if he had moved his stash from under the sink to inside the paint cabinet pending your visit? I'm sorta not kidding, I think a reasonable HO has an "expectation of privacy" for a garage paint cabinet.

I love working with contractors who have pride in their work. I want someone who cares about the results. But, I also want someone who will communicate with me about how to get those best results. I don’t want surprises. Neither do homeowners.

If I am a bonehead who designed a cabinet installation that won’t work with the extra depth of the stove without you doing a lot of extra work to make it work, I expect you to tell me how boneheaded I am, and to offer suggestions about how to make it physically work. Then let me agree with your suggestion before you implement it. I don’t expect you to go and create off the cuff solutions about which I might not agree with the potential consequences. That extra deep range on the job site might be getting replaced with a shallower model. And you will have created a solution to a problem that might not exist.

Your customer might had had plans to re-face the cabinets in a couple of months. The fact that the drawer didn’t adhere well might have been inconsequential if that was going to happen. But you don’t know, because you didn’t ask.

I want a contractor with pride. Too much pride is counter productive in too many situations though. And when communication doesn’t happen, on the front end, because of pride, that’s crossed the line.

I like working with people who are good at what the do and have initiative. That combination always earns my trust and respect.

Let there be no mistake; I appreciate all comments. I don't just share my victories here.

Thanks everyone.

Joseph, if you were working at my house, I would be THRILLED that you were smart enough to think outside the box and fix my cabinet. I could care less where you found the paint.

My house was a little, bitty plain Jane box that we bought 40 years ago back when we thought we could not afford the $18,000 we paid for it that has had lots of remodeling, upgrading, adding-on. For several years, my cousins was my carpenter/plumber/electrician/handy-man who did awesome work. I told him what I wanted and he figured out how to do it. If I asked “can we do XYZ, his answer was usually “we can make it work”. He always gave me better suggestions and ideas than I had.

This is a man who had very little education, but a lot of common sense and skills, who had worked several years for a major building construction company. I just wish he was still healthy enough and young enough to work for me as I still have projects I would love for him to take on.

Would love to have you work on my house.

While I agree that communication and consent are good things, I also appreciate someone who has the initiative and skills to actually finish the job to good conclusion, not to a conclusion of 'here's what you paid for and too bad about the wonky bit because it wasn't part of the job description'.

I recently had a painter and crew working on my front porch. I had included shutter painting in the project but hadn't gotten him a paint color yet, just said that I liked some that were down the block and would look for a similar color. He tried contacting me at work while the crew was there but I was in meetings, so he went with a gizmo to color match the neighbor's shutters (luckily some are on the 1st floor) and went with that color. I didn't have a chance to approve a color but I was grateful he did that because I got the result I wanted.

If I had a false drawer front held on with double-sided tape I'd be grateful if someone fixed it to be sturdier and still look good.

PS - what torreykm said.

So, for *me*, we've had people work on our house a few times. Couple times we were out of town, but we told them "do whatever you need to, here's my dad's number, they'll be at my gramma's around the corner-dad'll probably have coffee on for you". The other times, I've brought them rolls and pop/water, and I figure since I'm not the one doing it, it's not my profession, that means they're the ones that know what to do. I trust their judgement.

It's about the communication, and I get that. Some (or maybe most?) people are not like me and my husband. To find *our* touch up paint, you'd've had to do some huge searching so then I might be like..dude. Especially if I was paying you by the hour and you'd spent a bunch of time doing it, when if you'd asked I could've saved the time/money. Or if you charged me extra for doing something you'd not checked w/me first on, I'd be a little fussy. If you went ahead and rearranged my cupboards then I'd consider that an over step..and if you did a better job at it than I...then I'd probably be ticked..but still appreciative in a disgruntled way.

I would say you're better off checking w/the homeowners. Unless you ever find yourself in Iowa working on our house!

I don't see why you can't do a great job and also speak with the customer about what you are doing. Why keep it a secret?

This story reminds me of the time my husband offered to fix the loose lock mechanism on the hatch of my mom's SUV. He drove a (round head) screw through the outside of the door and called it a day. It didn't go over well.

Your solution is better in two ways: (1) you touched it up; and (2) you didn't anger someone you always have to see around the holidays.

I'm trying to understand myself here. When I say it never even entered my mind to discuss this, I mean it. It just seemed so obvious to me.

I went on a sink replacement sales call this afternoon. I told the prospects that I would offer several alternatives with varying pricing. When I realized that the cheaper alternatives would result in corner radii and reveals being off, I changed my mind. I gave them one beautiful perfect choice. It wasn't cheap, but they sold their business over a decade ago for 47 million dollars.

I'm getting too old (63 in November) and too cantankerous to put up with much these days. You will buy the thing I'm selling, it will be installed the way I say, or no Joe for you. I don't need the work that badly to not do jobs the way I want them done. If this sounds arrogant, my apologies, but that's where I'm at. My phone's ringing off the damn hook. (Colloquial speech explanation: Landline phones used to have to be hung up.)

Definetly would have bothered me if you drilled holes into my drawer front without my permission, and the fact that you went beyond that into my personal property grabbing my paint from a shelf in my garage to then do touch up would be doubly bad. Wouldn’t matter that your solution was better than the two sided tape deal, you are still intruding into someones space and personal belongings (which are not yours to mess with). That to me is definitely out of bounds. Being diligent and having pride in your work is a positive thing, and it’s commendable that you would want to fix and improve on what you discovered there, but to take it upon yourself to go through their personal belongings and make decisions for them turns a positive thing into what I would consider an intrusion. You just don’t do things like that without permission.

nidnay: Considering the particulars of this situation I disagree, but appreciate your perspective just the same.

Joseph,

I read your entire situation to my DH. His response was..."It sounds to me like this repair man was doing the right thing for the homeowner. Painting and repairing the sink. Is it possible the homeowner had something in the garage he didn't want anyone to see?"

Maybe the homeowner is a bit nervous or private and just wanted to be in control and aware of anyone working on his space. Lesson learned. The good news is you got paid and the homeowner will be happy with the good results.

~boxer

I understand your pride in your workmanship, and it IS excellent. But I can tell you that interior designers experience things homeowners do all the time. One works ones tail off to make a room beautiful, carefully coordinating and communicating with the owner. The job is finished and it looks fabulous. Then at some time in the future, the designer gets a phone call to "come see what I've done to "our" room!". The designer goes to see and nearly falls over dead. The owner has bought something absolutely horrendous and it has totally changed the entire room. And now, they will proudly tell their friends that "Mrs Designer" did my room, and their friends will think that the designer choose that awful thing.

In the end, it is the owner's house and they DO have the right to do with it as they please, and totally disregard the advice of a professional they have hired. But it is very irksome.

When I say it never even entered my mind to discuss this, I mean it. It just seemed so obvious to me.

I don't doubt that you had good intentions, but that doesn't really matter. In the end, they were upset by your actions, and they certainly have that right. They have an expectation of privacy, and you absolutely violated that. They have a right to be the King of their castle and that right isn't subjugated by your high standards.

In the end, what you did was wrong. Whether you believed it was reasonable or not is a moot point. Whether it occurred to you or not is a moot point. The road to Hell and all...

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You will buy the thing I'm selling, it will be installed the way I say, or no Joe for you.

It is your business run it any way you want to. Feel free to ask for any fee you want, or even to decline to work at my house. However, for myself, once I buy what you are selling that is what I expect, or no Benjamins for you.

Personally, I had a drawer front attached with two sided tape for a bit. It was in a bureau/bar area and I was using the drawer front for some color matching. So when I heard the story I immediately flashed to that drawer front. Is a flip down drawer front out of the question in that application?

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Finally, I know you typically do good quality work, but the woodworker in me is struggling to accept a hole in a drawer face. In fact, I was scandalized by it, and if you used that solution in my house, I would be way beyond livid. I understand that there was some questionable quality to begin with and maybe you felt justified to cut a corner because of that, but still... You go from the back and when that isn't possible you use false front clips, never put a screw through the face of a drawer front unless you are attaching a handle.

ETA: Anglophilia beat me to the King of their castle reference.

It also makes me laugh b/c the front of one of our drawers came off (there's several on their way to ripping off) and my husband had to get the drill out and stick a screw in each side. Not small head finish screws either, I'm pretty sure..the cabinets are painted (and chipping but that's neither here nor there..) an off white/cream color..the screws are like..black. Meh. I dunno, I guess it seems like such a persnickety fussy thing...I'd rather two screws than double sided tape. Knowing the quality of work that you do..I just couldn't be pissed about it. But again, that's just me..*should* it have been discussed, probably, at the end of the day, is it that big of a deal..to that homeowner, and apparently to many others, it is, but to me, no.

"Is a flip down drawer front out of the question in that application?"

Yes, in the frameless cabinet.

With a wood drawer, I may agree with you about using finish screws; poorly painted MDF, not so much.

"Is a flip down drawer front out of the question in that application?"

Yes, in the frameless cabinet.

What does frameless cabinet have to do with anything? I have flip out drawers in all my frameless cabinets in my rentals.

I should have said “this” frameless cabinet. Plus, the new sink was probably too far forward to allow tip outs.

In the end, I suspect the work was fine, and I expect I wouldn't have been upset. However, I also wouldn't expect others not be upset.

I appreciate your wanting to get the job done right. Although I think you should ask before implementing a change outside the scope of work, I would have liked the change and readily agreed, but would have wanted to be asked. I actually think double-sided tape is kind of hilarious, but maybe the owner was proud of their MacGyver type solution.

The one thing I would not have liked is your going through the paint locker for paint. If you needed to draw a sketch for the owner, you might walk over to the kitchen desk and rummage through the drawer for a pen, showing what to me would be both initiative and an incomprehension of boundaries. You need to ask for a pen. If the homeowner had a headache and your intentions were good, you might go into her bathroom and find Advil in her medicine cabinet, showing both initiative and compassion, but again an incomprehension of boundaries. Ask first. The right to walk past does not give you the right to open.

I understand getting more my-way-or-the-highway as you get older, so that you only do the jobs where people let you do your job the way you want. I think really good tradespeople do get like that when people are essentially auditioning to get them to come to their house, and that's their right. Still, you have to respect people's privacy.

I'm getting too old (63 in November) and too cantankerous to put up with much these days.

Joe, that made me laugh. I once suggested to my mother that she was a bit rude to a salesperson. Mom said "I've been nice for 78 years. I'm tired of being nice."

I think to some extent I have trouble putting myself in the homeowner's place because I obsess over everything, design everything and discuss everything with whoever is doing the work--and I wouldn't have cabinets that I peeled the foil off of, paint drips, or double-sided tape. Nor would I replace a sink in cabinets like that unless it fell down into the cabinet---maybe that's what happened, but I would probably put a top mount sink in and call it done. And the people who do work for me have no particular complaints about my level of participation because I think it's fairly common in their clientele and because I pay whatever they ask on time and without trying to get them to cut deals or get things comped.

So I can see why you would think that's someone who would not care about a screw hole or touch up paint and so forth.

But I have had clients whose houses are a mess when I walk into the project and yet then expect absolute perfection from anything anybody else does. A client whose furniture was literally in the position it was set by the movers years earlier (crooked and off-center, had a wall that was painted a slightly different color because she guessed at the paint store after she took down some old wallpaper (bits and pieces of which were painted over) and had crookedly hung $5.00 panels from K-mart on her windows was extremely picky about the paint job done by someone else, the flooring job (for some reason she wanted it laid the other direction even though it made no sense with the joists) and the fact that the custom drapery fabric was seamed and you could see seams. I think she thought custom fabric meant they had looms ten feet wide if the drapes were ten feet wide. The big problem was that she was actually paying someone instead of doing it herself and was buying things that had not fallen off a truck somewhere and or had not been made by slaves in Malaysia, and deep down that bugged her.

This all would have been no harm, no foul if he hadn't seen the holes before you were finished. If at the reveal you said " I fixed the panel and touched up with the paint I noticed by the garage door" things may have been fine.

I also wonder if he perhaps thought you were belittling him by saying the double sided tape was a janky repair and was offended you felt the need and had the skill to fix it?

I would have been super pleased with the outcome.