Anytime after frosts are over, New England residency not required to know this.

'Ville de Lyon' also produces overlapping petals. This is some other variety, of which more than one with this same general appearance is on the market.

Thanks! Oh, of course, New Eng location not required.

I'm not understanding, however.

"Anytime after frosts are over ---"

I might not have been clear, but I want to know how late into the fall can I plant a 4" potted clematis (seedling in previous spring, so not a lot of roots, perhaps) in Zn 5a? Are you meaning, once winter has passed and spring frosts have ceased?

But say I have some clems in 4" pots outside on a bench in September, what's the latest date in the fall I can plant it and hope that it has enough root structure to make it through a cold winter?

Babs .. I wish I had you to remind me in September ( still so hot here !) to get my planting done! I was going til October. And now those late planted don't look so good :/. Mine are roses and one butterfly bush . I know better, but I don't learn quick !

Petalique that is a beautiful clematis !!

Thank you, NHBabs. I appreciate the information about the large roots of clematis plants. I have a lot of interests and hobbies in addition to other commitments and I tend to run out of steam or one of my joints needs oiling. I bite off more than I can chew. Oh, and hot humid weather (common here) doesn't agree with me.

Part of the problem was that I intended to put the Clem's and other plants into the ground, but also didn't have the space made ready. If I'd planted them, I would have had to relocate them later. I've transplanted established clematis before, but it's not my favorite thing to do.

In late spring or early summer I picked up three odd-lot box store clems un imaginatively labeled Red, Blue and White -- obviously not first in their class. So that's where that red one is from. It and it's siblings didn't get particularly good attention over the summer.

Next to it on the bench at the window is a VdL. I had to dig that one up to give it _something_ to get it back to health. It was touch and go, but now looks healthy. I've had that (or pieces of that) VdL for about 15 years. I had to relocate it a few times. I like it better than the no name red, but not as well as my lavender or medium purple clems. I vow to be kinder to her. I could use more sunshine, better soil, less hill and tree shade. I have to keep in mind that dark-hued plants tend to get lost here unless they are in full sun and have a light background -- not red cedar, say.

Thanks again for your responses.

I now have another question. When I plant these outside in (April or May), I suppose I should cut them way back, leaving about 8 to 12 inches of vine?

Plant them 3"-6" deeper than they are in the pot to encourage more stems. I typically cut back to 2 sets of leaf nodes and buds per stem. With new little clematis, regardless of typical pruning recommendations, you want to cut them back. Then if you let them bloom without pruning in year 2 or 3, you will know by the bloom time whether they are hard prune (type 3) summer bloomers or light prune after spring bloom (type 2) so you will know how to get the best bloom in future years. Or you can just hard prune everything since this far north IME we often don't have time for more late season blooming on type 2 prune, and they often get pruned down to the snow line by Ma Nature anyway.

If you find yourself in late fall without the bed preppped, just heel in the pots. I have 6 pots of clems buried in my veggie garden right now. They will be planted in spring since DH removed some trees and I started prepping the bed last fall.

Lilyfinch, my timing recommendations were for petalique based on my experience in the same zone as she is in. You could plant later since it is warm until later.

Thanks again, NHBabs. will follow your suggestions. As for heeling in pots, I've had mixed results; perhaps because of a few very cold and dry winters.

The three cheapy clems I got were in rough shape and needed a lot of monitoring. They are the typical type II.

I have planted as late as October and November depending on weather. We are zone 6 but some winters are still zone 5. It may depend on your microclimate, so if you plant it in a corner where its protected on 3 sides from cold winds and gets sun or something you can get away with more than out in a north location unprotected at all. I did transplant bareroot trees in freezing rain in November bc I had no choice. They are in the middle of a pasture with no protection at all. We had lots of cold winds but they all look fine. I pegged them down well, and bent the branches down so they were more horizontal to prepare for fruiting in the future. So it depends on where you are planting it.

Thanks, Starchild.

Here are a couple more blooming indoors.

They are both UN-named cheapies. The lilac-tinged 'white' one I've had for a few years. Not sure why I brought it indoors. I guess I was going to relocate it, but got busy with other things. I may put it with or close to a purple Clem.

The purple one was a $3 Lots store one in a paperboard/poly bag, dried up. For the few bucks I took a chance. Labelled "blue." I like it.

Thanks again to NHBabs for pointing out that these clematis can get large roots rather quickly and need bigger pots. Here are the roots less than a year later from one near-dead Lots store clematis in on of those box bag packages, then transpotted to a 4" pot.

It was labeled white. A stunted white flower bloomed 5 weeks ago & had maroon stamens. The vines are longish 4' and the leaves small. Probably because the plant was stunted half bonsai-d.

I teased out the thick roots and repotted into a 7" pot.

MI guessI must have found time to plant my Ville de Lyon last fall after all.

edit - typo

one of the comments listed here brings up going into a big box store and buying clems labeled red, blue and white or whatever. i have also run into that with succulents with no label - or it says succulent. really? there's actually a law that says you have to label your plants and we put labels on ours but its really slack in some places and big box stores really surprise me. wow. blue and red? no plant species or genus, way to go big box stores. that's why i don't like buying stuff there, last year we found a rhodie that was covered in spider mites and aphids in 3 gallon pots right next to the 5 gallon peonies, also covered in bugs. i pointed it out to the manager who said "we're not allowed to spray our plants the customers complained". i thought that was hilarious and i looked at all the customers in line and said i doubt any person in this line would complain if you took care of rhodies and peonies. we all know how beautiful they are and you should at least spray them with Neem oil. really? that's why i order online or go to a nursery. off topic i know i just can't wrap my head around it. how do you know if its patented? or not.

Star child, you bring up some good points. We all need to be aware of the potential for mis-labeling and plant pests and condition.

The clematis plants were in attractive paperboard packaging with photo illustrations, label "Clematis" and with care and planting instructions. No species was given, just the approximate colors. I didn't expect to get a high quality patented plant for $3. The plant packages were not fresh, in fact I didn't know if they'd make it. But I took a chance, potted and watered them and set them in dappled sunlight on an outdoor potting bench. I won't be entering shows with any of them, buy I'm already enjoying them.

Yes, in general, you get good value and clean product in good condition when ordering from a reputable nursery. I have done that, and particularly when giving a plant for a special gift.

However, I think if one is careful and aware, it's possible to do pretty well at discount stores. I always look over the stock and nearby merchandise. A lot of (most) discount stores keep costs down by hiring uninformed workers and not enough for watering and care. They buy and sell in bulk. They toss what they don't sell.

Years ago I bought many named rhododendron varieties to put in a holding area for later landscaping a dappled area. I learned which ones were hardy for my area and took good care of them. They were $5 gallon pots of 8" tall plants. Years later, I have a pleasant Rhodi grove where cardinals nest. Looks great in June along with other plantings.

I just spotted a group of grackles. Despite the approaching nor'easter, spring is due soon.