LB - maybe I would have been in different position if it was 10 years, as these things conk out in always for me right after warranty. Now DW on order with 10 year warranty (USA based here). I know appliance warranty is subjective, but my appliance guy who's insc. company he reps, I've always had a factory appliance rep come out for my repairs not Joe the Appliance Guy

I got a free 10 year with my washer/dryer. It’s been 8 and I have issues so glad for the warranty. My dishwasher I didn’t have a long warranty and I’ve had it serviced 3 times by Miele for faulty intake valve.

LB. Hit me up if you intend to keep your DW and you are up for DIY on your intake valve. There is a redneck fix with a combulation of the parts in that expensive valve.

Personally, if I can't fix it myself outside of warranty, it's just not worth me keepin it. I know, not exactly being eco green. Hence, the 10 year on these $$ bavarian machines is the only option I would consider. 5 is too short and just pouring money down the drain

What were we supposed to watch for or see happen after Jan 1st?

I posted it Future_Retiree. Miele concierge program was discontinued-disbanded in all the states they were in except for California. I can't recall if they are leaving CA a concierge state & or if it was being cancelled as well in March 2018. I remember something like that. Anyhow, it's a huge WIN imo for both retailers and consumers.

Where exactly are you seeing or hearing this? I'm sort of close to this, and have not heard anything at all about what you claim.

a1an, after three repairs I’ll be replacing it if it goes again. Miele will be here Monday to repair my washing machine.

livebetter - oh noes! I'm with you...three strikes and it's out. Our W4842 will be seven years old in April. So far (knock on wood!) all is going well. I talk very nicely to it.

It’s my dishwasher that’s the offender. Optima Series. My w4842 has been pretty good although a little touchy (odd issues like stopping mid cycle and draining and beeping). Lately though it’s not properly spinning every few loads. Leaving maybe every fifth load still very wet.

Future Retiree . Program has been done. I think when my dealer told me this when the OP was posted, I think all the sales guys broke out the champagne bottles and was celebrating New years early, For sure, the program is dunzo as I have ordered my DW last week.

Prior to that ,when the concierge program was in enforcement.....well, that's a whole nuther story that won't need to be revisited, since it's over. Yay.

The biggest thing for me, me, being the keyword, is I am able to get a 10 yr warranty on it. German things, like my cars, are great when in warranty. When out, forget it. The parts price alone is worth the warranty. ---- I know warranty is like insurance. Some thing it's not worth it. IME, high end deeeziner appliances seem to be more finicky. I can't ever recall having service calls when I was a simple joe with simple consumer branded appliances

LiveBetter -

What's stopping you from setting up a service call ? I would. On one repair I had with MC, from the initial visit, I had 2 subsequent visits to rectify the original repair

a1an,

I just ordered something on Friday and it concierge service here in Maryland/DC. I am not aware that any ordering can be done without going through Miele directly.

Local appliance shop.

Maybe they sold it to you via concierge as they did not have item in stock and did not want to pick it up ? Did you get snow on Thursday and maybe he was looking at the Snow and said it ain't worth the pickup from Miele?

Bear in mind the program ended recently - as in 11 days ago. Most dealers won’t have much stock in their warehouses yet . My dealer is actually picking it up from Miele tomorrow afaik.

HomePro -

Per your other reply way back, you mentioned you did not mind the Miele Concierge program. I just called my rep....he confirmed, it's only Cali that's under the Concierge program. Dunno why you got what you got . YMMV, and it's subjective, but I for sure am one happy camper that I've not being forced to use Miele Concierge

a1an, this would be a significant change. In the mid atlantic region, for the past two years Miele has been hiring installers away from local dealers. From what I've heard it's been the most experienced folks.

I don't know what applicable locations were in 2017 but the MAP I was looking at during this debacle of research for 2016 showed CA, AZ, NV, Some parts of TX, FL, Chicago and NY/NE (maryland, philly, NJ, NY, CT)

Future Retiree per your other post in this thread, are you a dealer, tech, etc.

"Where exactly are you seeing or hearing this? I'm sort of close to this, and have not heard anything at all about what you claim."

OT. New DW up and running. This has the newer pump that allows it to do a run 1 hr cycle instead of the usual 2+ hrs from what I've read in the matrix. I have not tinkered with it much to see each cycle times, but some cycles are 3 1/2 hrs long.

Only ran 2 cycles just to test and make sure it's good. I've yet to install the toekick trim back on it, but it does seem a ~tad~ noiser.

a1an, not a dealer. I do work with installers on occasion. Unless updates have not worked their way through the system yet (and I do not think this is the case), I believe what you are claiming is not correct.

" I believe what you are claiming is not correct."

I would not have gone out of my way to share the elated news with fellow GW if it was what it is.....nor would my latest update prior to your thread...

I know there's quite a bit of Miele fans on the GW Laundry forum. Most likely Miele DW owners as well. About 2 years ago, I had the PG line installed in my other home, as I needed/wanted a fast wash cycle - which it does @25 minutes.

Fast forward to their current lineup in the consumer format that has the QuickIntensive Wash Cycle. I've been using it for a couple days not on the Normal Cycle but the Quick Intensive Wash Cycle. I have not timed it myself for consistency, but the program timer says 51 minutes. Anyhow, in testing with just tabs or powder, Day2Day dishes come out just as clean. So for anyone over the fence on whether to upgrade to a new DW or not, the Quick Intensive Wash does work well and might give you that extra push to upgrade !

One Ancedote. Sofar, I've only used P&P, Hoods and Grates, and QuickIntensive. I don't know if the 1st and 2nd use Intensive Wash as well, but the unit is somewhat noiser than all my former models. Louder enough that I notice it..Maybe it's due to the stronger pump ? I'm going to have to run a Normal Cycle for metric comparison.

@a1an Thanks for the feedback on the dishwasher, that's great. On your new model, did they also change/update the water inlet hose connection to remove that large box that had a valve in it? The install guide seems to show a standard size 3/8" hose now, but the specs still say it's double waterproof somehow.

I was told that the water intake valve is located under the machine now.

Cal -

I might have posted this in another thread. The valve body has been gone on the last 2, maybe even 3 models. For sure on this unit, and the one that it replaced. Too bad I have that moonsoon sized gaping hole in our custom cabs we had to make for the valve body when Miele's had that.

Sidenote. Granted, there is a checkvalve mechanisim, and miele doe's not call for a high loop, I actually ended up adding a slight extension to the OE drain hose to create a proper high loop - as the stock was not long enough to create a high loop.

Perfect example. Take the drain hose off your sink tailpiece. I suggest you put a large bucket or something underneath. Now just use your sink normally. See all that water that is coming out of the tailpiece. Checkvalve or not, image rinsing poultry , etc and having the stagnent water in the drain hose. Blech. Ehhh, maybe it's the OCD in me.

@a1an - Thanks for confirming, that was my worry too was having to create a giant hole in the side of the cabinet to accommodate the mechanism. Plus it also required a 3/4 to 3/8 adapter. The new assembly guide mentions the hole to the adjacent cabinet must now be a minimum of 1-3/8"x1-3/4"

Also good point about the high loop on the drain hose.

This makes sense now why the W1 coming to the US does not have that WPS mechanism on the inlet hose like some in EU have. I assume it was to reduce service calls on them.

Cal. Skip the instructions. Sometimes it doesn't make sense to me on what they call for....

Route a OVAL hole just big enough for the drain hose, standard water feed and power plug. Or make a big honking one if you please ;) Depending on the route you take, you can make a smaller hole, feed power and water and lastly the drain.

When they had the valve body, the instuctions called for a much larger hole than needed . I went with the smallest one within reason to shove the valve body through

Good idea. Did you ever get your Miele app to register and work?

I did. It's nifty I suppose but I have to redo my network - create a seperate network VLAN, for IOT. Last thing I need is a backdoor ....

Anyhow, it's nifty - have not played around with it much. It will do a standard iPhone app alert when the cycle was done. It will show the countdown of the cycle, as well once done, how much water and energy it used. The last cycle, showed it only used 3 gallons of water, which seemed awfully little ??

There was a function called ~open door~ but that did not seem to respond via app...

I think the app is more for $$$ consumables. You can add how many tabs , etc you have on inventory, and it will countdown and probably link you to the MieleStore to checkout.

Sounds interesting. I've been wondering with these latest generation appliances being connected to Miele if they will have the ability to push out software updates for any fixes. For example, how the open door button does not work for you, maybe there is a software fix. Or with the W1, if they introduce new detergents that require a new cycle or other changes to auto dosing.

That open door button would really come in handy on the knock2open models if you don't feel like knocking.

K2O - the dry open door latch is built on the same principal. AKA, the door auto ejects once a dry cycle is note.

EDIT. I just tested the door open via app. It does work. I suppose you cannot force it depending if it's still in a program cycle.

The door auto ejects on most programs on the final cycle. On the QuickIntensive, for whatever reason on the program algorithim, it keeps the door closed with the fan running. I observed this yesterday and knew under QI, the programming keeps the door closed after the final cycle for whatever reason. That was when I tested it, as the app said cycle ~finished~ so open door should have worked. I guess left hand ain't talking to the right hand.

FYI, the app does show firmware level and it also shows ~up to date~. Firmware fixes are nice but only if it's done on a good level where it won't break the machine if the firmware update process runs askew.

Cal, just be careful when you put your devices - appliances to a ~connected~ state. Anything you do re: internet connectivity, think 6 times, before you commit....the internet is a very dangerous place.....just saying...from one who sees this dayindayout. ahh, the pesky ruskies . And I know this yibber yabber I'm speaking is beyond the typical homeowner. But it's relative in scope in the discussion sake of connected appliances...

Cal- Do you live in Canada and or whatever you end up getting, will it be on a warranty longer than 5 years. Not to be a nanny-naysayer, but love the stuff, hate the reliability. Hate to dissuade your purchase, but if you cannot get a 10 year warranty on it or have a family/friend who's versatile with Miele repairs, in all fairness, skip the brand.......

See live-betters gripes about the intake issue. She's not the only only...I replaced mine with a new one due to it. Yeah, I picked my poison and stuck with Miele.

a1an - Absolutely, you really don't want IoT devices on the same network as the rest of your home or even together with other IoT devices. VLAN separation should be the minimum and also for consideration are some of the new firewall offerings lately (albeit slowly) to address this issue.

As for Miele, love love their products and have been a long time user. What I find is it's usually something small that may go bad but disables the entire appliance and it gets costly for a small repair, that most just decide to go with new.

Having worked on a many Fisher/Paykel dishdrawer and replaced practically every part over time, I'll stick with my Miele!

ha. we speak similar languages.scary stuff when I think of the 99.9099 of the cosumer/resi market !

quick intensive may not be the cats paw....a load I controlled soapwise (powder) with a complete middle basket of our breakfast/drinkware glass cups (duralux), glasses are not etched but I did noticed some scratching here and there that I don't recall seeing. And or I'm looking for flaws whereas prior, I did not have such a critical analysis eye for. I suppose maybe due to higher temps/higher intensive water/pump pressure....

Methinks Normal - slow cycle wash is the ideal setting to err on the safe side.

Today I noticed that on the Concierge site, it's only accepting zip codes in California. So if they did move back to using local dealers for delivery/install, I wonder if the local Miele experience centers will continue to be Miele direct for delivery/install.

Hi Cal. Bottom line for me aside from not being too craze about MieleCare repairs, is the 10 year I have on the unit living in the usa....

FWIW, I've been eyeballing the app. Posted on another thread. I sorta blown away at how much/little water it uses per cleaning cycle. Unless, the app is wrong, it uses anywhere from 2.7 to 3.3 gallons for a full clean cycle. I can easily see myself using 6X as much during HW. I'm a full flow rinse maniac...

As of Jan 1, 2019, Miele discontinued it’s Miele Concierge program in California. If you want to buy Miele , you need to buy from a dealer. Miele does not sell direct to consumer any more. The large dealers like Pirch have their own Miele authorized installers, and no longer use Miele Concierge to install. This can potentially mean a long wait for consumers (I was quoted a 3 week wait on a new dishwasher through Pirch).

Miele repair crew were always different from their install crew (at least in California, so I supposed they have disbanded their installation group and kept their repair people.

CJ -

OP. Did not brief past threads to see if you replied. IMO it's a godsend to not being f0rcEd into the concierge program.....IMO. I suppose others may vary

I wish I had the skills to install myself, but I don’t.

i know some people have had terrific experiences with the Concierge program. My experiences over the years were far more mixed. They installed 3 washers for me. They came with the wrong machine the first time, a damaged machine the next time, forgot their tools (apparently on a different truck) another time, and cancelled an appointment because they shipped the incorrect machine to their warehouse. So I figure it’s worth trying a different approach. The part I don’t like is the long wait from the dealer from order time to install time.

Hey Cal -

Not sure if you see this, but my hunch on consumables was right----re: the Miele app. Their new DW will be using a similar DOS style type soap dispenser.

IME, the app is more to monitor, alert and then *easy app shopping cart* to buy consumables

Hey a1an -- Exactly! And now they are doing it with Coffee too. Agree on the app, it's very handy to be notified when cycles complete especially on the washer/dryer. Starting cycles not so much because you have to be in front of the machine anyway. Hope they can further improve on the reporting of consumable levels, it seems like they have been making some adjustments with app updates to help with more accurate reporting.

I hope they do not lose focus on the core as they try to capitalize on the consumables....

update on Miele dishwasher installation via Pirch: they missed their first scheduled installed date as they ran over on a prior job. I waited all day for them to arrive and dispatch was still claiming they were on their way at 6 pm, which of course they were not. They came back the following day for the install.

Fast forward several months later - the dishwasher has come completely lose from its surrounding wood cabinet. Screws have detached and there is movement from side to side. Also, they did not secure the dishwasher to the cabinet top so the entire dishwasher tilts forward about 1.5 inches when the door is opened. Fortunately, Pirch has agreed to come back and reinstall it securely.

i am wondering if I should insist they install a high loop in the drain hose, which was not done the first time. Any opinions?

High Loop Yes. Not sure how they can 'f up the install. It's realatively straight forward. Level DW. Slide it in. If you have a false front cabinet door, put it on DW. Check levelness. There is a seperate adjust for the door panel.

It's only 4 screws for the DW. 2 on each side.....Once everything looks flush and level correct, put the sidescrews in and install the *cover caps*.

I’m not sure either. as far as I can tell, the side screws were not long enough, and came unscrewed. No cover caps on screws.. I can’t visually confirm that both sides were put in, only one side which I see detached. There are places for top screws, but they were not put in.

California went from a Miele Concierge state to a dealer install state at the turn of the year, so many dealers had to start installing Mieles at that point. However, I know they were already installing other brands, so I’m not sure that it should have been an enormous challenge to install Miele as well. But I guess it was.

What DW did the new Miele replaced. For example, on the other former 2 Mieles's in the same cavity, the holes were exactly the same spot on it's new replacement. On the new Miele replacement, the holes were smidge off. I can't recall if I ended up scewing into `new holes~ or did I tweak the angle and uses some toothpicks in the old holes to make it work...

At the end of the day, as long as the machine is level , and with door on the correct plane both in Hortizonal/Vertical and Flush, those screws we speak about are just retainers, per-se

The screws are not that long. I would say around 3/4 or 1" in length. It's not rocket scientist. With the DW level and flush, it should not move already with it's weight. The screws are there just to help keep the unit from ~walking~ due to vibration/in use, etc.

CJ. Are you DIY handy ? If so, I would attempt to *reinstall* it yourself if a option. More attention to details than a installer possibly. It's really that simple. Level it out. Make sure front panel dool looks level against the 2 sides of te adjacent cabinetry. Open DW door to test level height. Then put the sidescrews in..

You're experience sounds similar to mine. I also didn't have any caps for the side screws, maybe I'll call Miele and see if they were actually supposed to be there.

Re: The Loop, same issue for me. I just readjusted it myself using a DW high loop bracket.

I would have them fix it and reference the section in the manual where it states that it's required.

Even though the machine does have a back-flow preventer, I'd still have the loop.

"Take the drain line of the dishwasher and attach the drain line as high as possible under the counter rim of the kitchen sink before connecting the end to the drain. The loop will serve to prevent a backed up drain or large volume of water in the sink from si- phoning back into the dishwasher."

The caps don't go on the screws....fwiw. The side screws go *inside the channel* of the frame. The opening of where the screws go in the channel, is 4 gray cover caps that seal the hole where the screws go in.

So weird you don't have it. This is probably the reason why I DIY like 90% of my stuff....it get's done right the 1st time around.

Ha, I remember one year, I was on the rooftop doing some work. I had contractors coming to bid on some work. I told them to just come on up the roof when they arrived while I was working...heh, the contractor see's me doing my thing, and he says, I guess perfection is not a option ;-)