Hah! Ricky, I don't want leftovers! I mean enough to prove everybody had enough, but not a fridge or freezer full. I have to make a huge party a couple of weeks later, for which I've already started filling the freezer.

You do remind me, though, that there's a big difference in the amount of meat on a 17-18 lb. bird vs. 19-20 lb. Like in between them is where the bones stay the same but the meat starts to pack on or something.

Right now it's four people eating turkey plus the picky eater, but I do need enough for stragglers. Do you think 15-16 lb. is big enough and small enough?

I almost choked when I saw the heading. First thought was Thanksgiving is the day after tomorrow, that's not much time. Then I realized you are talking about November.

14 lb turkey is plenty. Do it in your combi steam oven,

Can't they confirm if they will attend? I once tried to plan one for 4-5 and it grew to six or seven, and I had bought turkey pieces and had to run out and get more. What a pain. I did not want to deal with the carcass either. If your store carries the turkey parts it may be easier and quicker to cook for you. Then you can just freeze the already cooked pieces when you're too tired to worry about them.

Gosh, I've never had trouble giving the turkey carcass to one of the guests afterwards. Everyone thinks they're going to make homemade soup or stock from it. I don't think they mostly ever do, but it gets the leftovers out of my house.

Yes, I'm talking about the US Thanksgiving at the end of November--sorry about the panic! If it were for Sunday, they'd eat chicken, green salad and potatoes and like it or else. :)

Re the number of guests, I'm sure I'll have a final count more or less (who knows when someone will get sick or something), but I need to do the planning and organizing now because of everything else I have going on.

I'm not worried about the carcass. I won't have time to deal with it, but I know whom I can give it to. I just don't want a whole bunch of leftovers. I have made stock from the carcass--and then learned that I don't like turkey stock. :) It's mostly very elderly, which is why I've been elected. They don't want the hour ride to the family dinner.

I've done parts in the combi-steam before, and often encourage others to do so, but I may end up having to do the final cook and serve there, so I need to plan for possibly cooking in a simpler kitchen. (Where the leftovers are also not welcome.) Unfortunately, I won't have freezer space for leftover parts either, with the big party coming up. Maybe for a flat packet of sliced turkey for sandwiches, but that's about it. :(

Sigh.

At least there are no GFs, low FODMAPs, dairy frees, vegans, koshers or other such special needs. :) That's half a dozen blessings counted! :)

So...how many green beans for half dozen?

A pound of green beans, 3 pounds of potatoes....here the most common size of small turkey is between 14.5 and 15.5 pounds....any smaller and it's all bones.
One pound of cranberries made into sauce,a 2 1/2 pound butternut squash cut up and roasted, stuffing made from 3 cups of bread crumbs.....and buy some take home containers.
Really not any sort of problem that I see.

Does it have to be a whole turkey? Why not just a turkey breast, most folks like the white meat and there's little waste.

You'd be surprised how many people don't like turkey breast. We have to pretend, though, so you'd be okay doing that because most of us wouldn't say.

Most turkey breast is waaaay over cooked, that's why people don't like it.

Nah, I've had plenty of perfectly cooked turkey breast and I still prefer the dark meat, except maybe for a sandwich. I'd say that's true of any fowl, except maybe pheasant, but it's been many years since that has come my way.

Thank-you, Linda! That's exactly what I needed to know. I've only just started to master cooking for four with no leftovers, but different kinds of foods and where if I have too much, I don't mind making up a meal for the freezer rather than jealously guarding my freezer space. The "problem" was just not having a starting point for shopping. Solved!

I have takers for both light and dark meat, and I think the folks are more interested in a proper roast turkey for the festive value. That's not an issue for me, other than thinking through the timing since I can't just put it in at 2 pm and forget it like I do for Passover. That's just math, however, and that's no problem. Roasting a whole turkey, as far as I'm concerned, is dead easy. Easier than parts because it's just one thing.

Thanks, everybody! I'm feeling better about this now.

(Writersblock, we're a good pair. I don't mind on a chicken or duck, but I don't care for dark turkey at all...)

plog, forget the small quantities, cook the way you feel most comfortable. I can tell you whether I have had few or many.....it's just a matter of who gets the leftovers.......which apparently according to my family are better than the main event.

Which makes me think I should cook everything the day before , at my leisure, and just serve leftovers the next day !!!! I think I'm on to something!!!!

LOL! I like the idea behind it, but it's just knowledge, not cooking discomfort. Linda gave me the knowledge I needed. I know I don't need to make T-day for 30, but that's the quantity I know how to buy by eye! The problem is there's no one to give the leftovers to, and I won't have room for them. Next day for two is fine, and fits with the rule of you always want one and a half portions left, minimum, to be sure everyone has had their fill, but otherwise, no.

Your make ahead and serve leftovers plan sounds fab! I hope you try it!

Actually I may for next year. It's always a bit nuts because the guys are so busy with boats and docks and stuff . We have three separate cottages to put to bed.

The idea of cold and hot sammies with all the other stuff has it's appeal....except knowing me I'd make that a production too !!!!

LOL, Sharon, I'd be right next to you, making a production out of sandwiches!

You're having elderly guests and no one will take the leftovers? In my family, they fight over them...

Anyway, I think the 14-15 pound turkey is going to give you some leftovers, given that it's a big meal and elderly guests, but here they don't come much smaller either. I'd be likely to go 1 1/2 pounds on the green beans, but everyone in my family likes them a lot, so they gobble them down. 3 pounds of potatoes is plenty for 6 people, I agree, especially with stuffing/dressing. I'm also betting that the pound of cranberries will net you leftovers, but they don't come in lesser amounts here, so you're going to be stuck, I think.

If you have pie already, then I'd serve the blueberry and get it out of the freezer while it's still good. Baked potatoes? So gravy is just for the turkey and stuffing?

Annie

The gravy is for whatever someone wants to put it on! Everyone will eat baked potatoes and I like it when the picky eater doesn't have something different (i.e., doesn't get singled out). The old folks don't make meals and the cooks don't use leftovers when others of us leave them. Since they want turkey, and 15 lbs.-ish is the smallest, I'll deal with it. If I can get the whole thing sliced up, maybe I can make up sandwich kits for the freezer. I don't usually freeze sliced because it keeps better in a chunk, but it also takes up more room...

Thanks, Annie, for the alternative numbers. The more opinions I have the easier the task becomes. I'll check the yields and maybe cut the amount of cranberry sauce. I can use the rest of the bag of cranberries in my holiday cooking.

For me, Thanksgiving is more apple or pumpkin pie, but, yes, from the freezer if they're still there. The other pie is fig-date. It's more Thanksgiving-ish, but sweet, and maybe too much after the meal. They might like blueberry better, too.

I agree to roast a whole turkey, and the 14 pound area ought to work for you. We have those who like light or dark meat, and then many who want both. I would do only one side vegetable as you have potatoes and dressing as well as veggies and dip as appetizers. I always bake pumpkin tea bread to fill out the meal, or something picky eater will eat.

Edited to add--the seniors I have known who do not cook usually LOVE left overs to take home. And my sister's cat gets a plate of scraps too.

Thanks, Sheilajoyce, but these are vegetable eaters. Must have vegetables with our vegetables. My picky eater will eat potatoes or I wouldn't bother with a second starch. Pumpkin tea bread sounds good but he'd screw up his face if you suggested he eat it. :) I'm thinking some kind of baked squash, but not a casserole. Or maybe something carroty.

MMMM, love baked acorn squash.

Plllog, I agree with your picky eater, I'll ALWAYS eat potatoes. I'd eat the pumpkin bread too, though.

Squash could be roasted butternut chunks or maybe stuffed acorn types, but that will give you even more food because you have to stuff it with something. I just saw a recipe somewhere for parmesan roasted squash, basically slices of squash with parmesan and some herbs and baked, it looked really easy and fast and no additional stuffing ingredients. Of course, if you'd rather have them sweet, we always just sprinkled the unbaked halves with brown sugar, added a pat of butter and then that all got mixed in together after the squash baked.

Since Ashley puts A1 sauce on baked potatoes and my mother tops them with broccoli and cheese, I guess gravy doesn't surprise me. Grandma never mashed potatoes, she just boiled them. We mashed them with our forks on our plates if we wanted them mashed, and then added the gravy or butter. I didn't even know people put sour cream on baked potatoes until I was a teenager and went to a steak house, LOL.

Happy Thanksgiving in any event. People are most important, food is secondary anyway. If no one wanted to take my leftover turkey home, I'd be ecstatic, I have trouble keeping enough for a couple of sandwiches between the girls, my mother and Elery giving bits to the dogs.

Annie

I was thinking more along the lines of steamed pattipan, if there are any. It's such a weird time of year here. Sometimes there are still plenty of summer squash, sometimes not even zucchini (which we get year round). It doesn't have to be a "dish", just vegetables. Baked acorn squash sounds good, though. It doesn't need stuffing. With spices, a little butter and a tiny bit of brown sugar it could be "special". Or I could do a pie pumpkin the same way. That would be a good way to have some pumpkin at the table since no pumpkin pie. Or I could grill pumpkin strips and forego the extra butter and sugar. But winter squash is so sweet. even without a touch of sugar, I think of it more as a starch. There are plenty of vegetables to choose from. Now that I have a idea of quantities, I'll just get what looks good.

I would bone a couple of chickens, stuff and roast them and add your traditional side dishes. I'm always astounded by the size of your turkeys. Makes me think of when Mr Bean got his head stuck up the turkey looking for his watch. Lol No one needs that much meat for 4 to 8 people!

I love Vichy carrots, roast parsnips and glazed sprouts. Roast potatoes and chestnuts.

IC, I hear you! If it weren't Thanksgiving, I'd do it, but for Thanksgiving it has to be a turkey to feel like Thanksgiving. Any other holiday it could even be enchiladas or lasagna or mezzas rather than anything traditional to that holiday.

I'm going to go with Linda and Annie's recommendation for a 14-15 lb. smallest turkey that won't be all bones and no meat, and just deal with it if I have too many leftovers.

Your vegetables sound interesting. Maybe if there's no summer squash I'll do roasted parsnips.

a 14-15 lb. smallest turkey that won't be all bones and no meat

FWIW, although it's been a couple of years since I hosted Thanksgiving, I've never had a problem finding a 9-11 lb fresh turkey that wasn't all bones, although they do run to a disproportionate amount of breast. But then they all do these days, no matter the size.

Cool! I'll ask the butcher if he can get one.

Summer squash for Thanksgiving? In November?....gotta be winter squash, acorn, butter nut, or a couple of those sweet dumpling or delicata or carnival.
Frankly I would buy a butternut, seed and peel it and cut into 2 inch chunks, toss with olive oil and a bit of "something"...salt and pepper....garlic and parsley....sage and onion powder....cinnamon and a little ginger and roast it in an open pan until it's soft.

Linda, as you know I live in coastal Southern California. We have different seasons than you do and I have no intention of being held hostage by an NorthEast - Midwest notion of foods. Crookneck squash and pattipan are both Thanksgiving classics here. You're most welcome to your butternut. I'm sure your dish is tasty. We get butternut all year long, too. None of my family are particularly fond of it, and it's the last thing they'd look for on Thanksgiving, especially when lovely summer squash are still in season.

Yeah, plllog, if you know your butcher, I'm sure he can get you one. The good small ones go the fastest of any, around here.

Amazing.....orange winter squash are classic for fall meals both in the Mid West, East Coast, New England, Southwest....apparently the whole country but for Southern California.
If you know a bit about raising turkeys, a 9 to 12 pound bird will be a very immature bird....rather like a very young chicken. I at one time knew a grower that would sell "small birds" in that size range when they had been injured and they would be lacking a wing or sometimes a leg ( which I avoided)....they were fine for Turkey tetrazinni for a gang or BBQ shredded turkey for sandwiches for a tail gate....but generally not very flavorful.
I am guessing there are likely breeds of turkeys that mature at a lower weight but I don't know of any commercial grower that breeds them.
Like hogs that are deemed "market ready" at about 260 to 290 pounds and a steer about 1000, turkeys are most marketed about 15 to 18 pounds.

Thanks for the turkey information. I think 17.5 lbs. is the smallest I've ever made, and I really know nothing about turkey breeding.

It's not that we don't ever eat winter squash for Thanksgiving. I was considering the alternatives of acorn and pumpkin up topic, but it's not a particular Thanksgiving staple in my family. At a bigger feast, there would be carrots and sweet potatoes and another sweet orange vegetable isn't needed. I was responding to your insistence that we must not eat summer squash. It will probably be 70° out and sunny, some of the finest of the late season squash are just coming into the store for the holiday, and are traditional for many around here.

I just recalled my Mom used to get a capon when it was just the 4 of us sometimes. I don't think I've seen them lately. I remember they were good!

Well, it depends on the turkey. Is your butcher getting you a heritage breed or the standard Broad Breasted White, which makes up about 200 MILLION turkeys per year. The Toms get to be approximately 10 pounds at 8 weeks, 20 pounds at 12 weeks, and 45 pounds at 20 weeks. Hens are smaller, of course, 8 pounds at 8 weeks, 15 pounds at 12 weeks, and 26 pounds at 20 weeks. It's kind of scary, how fast they grow. They don't live long lives because 70% of the meat is in the breast and they have skeletal problems due to the structual abnormality.

Heritage breeds grow much more slowly, and a Tom will reach 22 pounds, a hen about 12 pounds in 18 MONTHS (not weeks, like the BroadBreasted White). While the BBW gets that 10 pounds in 8 weeks, a heritage bird will weigh closer to 3 pounds.

People argue that the slower growth adds significant flavor to the flesh of the bird, others say they can't tell/don't care. It's all a personal choice, but the BBW are huge birds, and that's why it's rare to find a small one around 10 pounds here. That's only a 2 month old bird and the producer knows that it only takes a month to double that size, so they let them go a bit bigger. I did buy a 12 pounder a couple of years ago, amazed that I found one that "small". It was mostly bones, I was shocked at how little meat there was on that bird. Now if it's a heritage bird, that's a whole different animal altogether.

Annie

I no longer have Thanksgiving here but still fix a lot of our food. We always must have candied sweet potatoes and yeast rolls with our meal. We never serve green bean casserole either, no one likes it. Cook for around 12 or so usually. We love to have leftovers so all can take some home if they like and we won't have to cook for a day or two. Sometimes we have chicken and noodles as well as turkey. Of course mashed potatoes are always on the menu. It sounds like fun. I am sure you will figure it all out and your guests will love it. With all the other food, I would just fix a quart of home canned green beans. We would have those too plus maybe corn and some broccoli or even peas. Love Thanksgiving food!

Sue

Here too for leftovers. When I'm doing Thanksgiving (less and less often as others want to) I make extra so everyone who wants to take leftovers home can have them.

Plllog, you're too experienced a good for this to be a new idea, but we always look forward to after-Thanksgiving turkey, barley, mushroom soup. Yum! Not the same as no leftovers at all, but at least you could dump everything but the cranberry sauce and dessert in one pot. :)

LOL! Thanks Hamamelis! I'm more likely to make dump everything into a casserole than soup, but I like the idea, especially with the addition of the barley and mushrooms. My issue is having nowhere to put any of it, soup included. I'll be busily preparing food for my holiday party that weekend.

I just thought of something cool! Literally. To answer Annie's question, I forgot to ask the butcher on Friday, but I was looking at the signage and all and I think he can get me a "petite", which I think is a smaller breed heirloom bird. If it's small enough, I could triple wrap it and put it in my meat drawer, rather than having to clear a lot of space for it!