Bumblebeez, that is a great question. I appreciate "real" but also look very hard at "fake". Sometimes fake has great advantages--like faux marble counters which perhaps don't etch or stain--and in some cases, faux things cost a lot less. I've wondered a lot about real v. fake diamonds, and don't tell my dh, but if I found out my diamond wasn't real, I don't think I would care much. On the other hand, for certain types of items, nothing but absolutely real will do. The feel of top quality soft leather for a dressage bridle, for example, hasn't yet been duplicated that I know of. So, I guess it's just dependent on which "things" you care the most about. For me, it's function over form.

There are two questions here.

Real vs. Fake - Materials and Brands

When it comes to materials, I prefer natural, so I like real. I am not vegan, so real leather is not an issue. I don't love jewelry, but have a few pieces of real stuff and that's enough. I have Corian counters and I like them, but would have preferred natural.

i generally don't like things that are TRYING TO APPEAR as something they aren't. Either I like the "thing" or I don't.

Brands are a whole different thing. Fake brands are a crime. I have no interest in owning something that is SAYING it's something else. If I like a brand I can't afford, I buy used or very discounted from a reputable retailer.

For me it depends on the thing. I'd rather have a fake diamond than a real one given the ethical issues in mining diamonds. I think real leather lasts longer than fake leather so I'd rather have real.

Truly, this is not a judgemental query, but a way to understand myself better and make better decisions.

How is anyone else's personal choice going to help you understand yourself better and make better decisions?

Thank you all, it's an interesting discussion to me and helps determine value and substance.

Well I do prefer real friends - you know the ones who stick with you through thick and thin over fake ones which are the ones who only want something from you.

And I do prefer real butter over fake butter.

I prefer solid wood furniture over MDF or veneer simply because I like the warmth of it. I prefer leather shoes in the winter simply because they're more comfortable.

Brands mean little to me. We just reupholstered some furniture and the only caveat I had in my choice was that the fabric had to be made in US or Canada but that's an ethical choice.

Real leather and wood look better beat up than fake leather and mdf/particleboard. You can wash and condition real leather and it comes up with an amazing patina, fake stuff has to go in the trash unless you like looking at the backing after the plastic peels off. Same with real wood furniture. You can take good care of the fake wood stuff and it will last well but once damaged it isn't easily fixed.

Interesting question. makes one think. Leaving aside quality, length of use and all (all true)..strangely, I think:

-real feeds imagination. fake doesn't

why? i don't know yet how to explain

now, there's different kinds of fake. say I have enamel flowers very intricately made..these I don't consider fake since they don't pretend to be real flowers. they're inspired by real flowers. that's something else

I'm very much fine with not owning something if I can't afford it or owning it in very small numbers(but for much longer time), or waiting for years without it. So, diamonds-easy. lol. I just don't have them. Shoes and bags-well there was time when I had only one bag for example, and very few shoes. But I'd love them and they'd be the best I could afford. I'd save for them and all. then I'd wear them for a loooong time. Not much changed by the way..

I also have no problem with second hand for example

For me it comes down to VALUE. The diamond posts are interesting and very true. Diamond is a tradition and thus their value has been over inflated..but if mine were fake who would know and if I don't care why would I spend $10,000 when I could spend $1,000? For me it comes down to why would I spend money just to. Save/cut corners where you can is always my go to.

This is so interesting, but too complex for me to see it all as either or, or all or nothing. Value is so subjective and can change over time, including by societal pressure, improvements/ technology and/or be different within cultures or locations. As a general rule I would say it depends. I prefer 'real', but not a real fur coat, new ivory, certain exotic hardwoods, etc., but I would not want a fake fur coat or a resin product. I avoid some faux products over how they may perform or the chemicals they may release, including in a fire, so for me yes to leather, wool, cotton, hardwood floors and furniture, but I'm not removing the vinyl siding on the house I bought. OTOH, although I prefer the beauty of real flowers, and will purchase and enjoy an occasional bouquet, I no longer will bring garden flowers into my home since I have had too many encounters with hidden spiders, and suffer reactions to spider bites. I thoroughly enjoy my few faux ones.

It's tough for me with things like art. Authenticity has so many dimensions and I feel like I gravitate toward the "real" almost out of insecurity because I don't trust my own taste. So it's hard for me to objectively determine what's quality or not, "Real" seems like one good clue as would demand.

Just for example if I heard the exact same piece of music, if it was produced by a band who really clawed their way up from the bottom and built a fan base organically, I would feel more kindly toward that piece of music than if it came out of a big pop machine. But objectively there would be no difference!

on the other hand I'm pretty cheap when it comes to things like name brands so I wouldn't care what name was on my purse or shoes as long as they seemed reliable and suited my needs.

Other music examples:

Buying/streaming the music (or movie for that matter) from a legitimate source vs pirated copy so that the artist gets the minimal royalties they get. When it comes to concerts like YouTube concerts, most artists have given up on that and phone recording, but it does get people more interested in their music, so I understand where they are coming from.

A big thing going on in bands right now is who owns the name of the band. At some points there were two different versions of certain bands because the naming was in dispute. Not that any of you likely listen to LA Guns or Ratt, but those are prime examples.

But the craziest thing we saw was the Foreigner/Cheap Trick, and Jason Bonham show. Foreigner was the headline act, and there were NO original members in the band! Mick Jones owns the name, and he often does not play shows because of health issues, so what you are basically seeing is a tribute band. The guy who has been the singer for well over 10 years now, Kelly Hansen, is incredible and not to take that away from him, but to bill themselves as Foreigner when no one original to the band is there, just felt very wrong to us. Since it is their 40th anniversary tour, they actually did some songs with Lou Gramm on selected dates. But none of the other guys in the band, who are middle-age, are old enough to be original members.

Now granted, by buying the ticket to see Cheap Trick (who now tour without one original member for awhile now) we are essentially supporting this. And we heard a Sirius interview with Cheap Trick that they agreed to do the tour based on the agreement Mick Jones would play. But DH and I are in the *tiny minority* who care. There were a lot of people with Foreigner VIP packages near us, and there was even a VIP group sitting on bleachers on the side of the stage, so clearly people do not care. So, we left mid-way through Foreigner's set. We have NEVER done that for a headlining act, and we never even leave during the encores.

Well, when it comes to food, the answer is obvious...because it's better for you. Other than that, I really feel it depends on the persons lifestyle & preferences. For example, I adore real leather, the smell is divine IMO but if I see a bag I love & it's not real leather, I will buy it. Ninety-nine percent of my jewelry is fake, I love good costume jewelry & couldn't care less about diamonds.

One of my dear friends recently got 2ct (I think) diamond studs for her anniversary and becasue she was so thrilled, I was for her. In my mind tho, I was thinking "who would know if they were real or not?" I would rather spend that kind of money on a new snowmobile or side by side. To each his own....

Sometimes real isn't significantly better than fake. Sometime the fake is better or more practical than real. And some fakes are just awful.

It all depends.

When good substitutes are available, the allure of real is primarily psychological. If you own/use/wear something "special", does that make you "special"?

I used to come across a lot of fakes when I lived in the city. Now I'm not even sure where you buy "good fakes". We actually had a lot of fun when travelling buying fakes in the medina. We told our guide "no shopping" and he actually stuck to that very well (typically they get kickbacks and so it can be a problem). But the vendors are everywhere and persistent; we girls relented. We bought fake handbags, incredibly cheap. We would never try to "pass them off", instead they are our "fake bags from our time in Morocco". That is part of the story. I feel no moral obligation to protect anyone's brand; I am not even sure they hurt the brand because most fake buyers you can bet are still lusting after the "real"; it may reinforce the goal. While DH was waiting for us to select our bags, a guy was selling fake men's watches. DH doesn't wear a watch, but he likes haggling with vendors, especially in a foreign language ....he thinks it is fun. So he bought some great big ostentatious fake watch for, IDK, $10 or something! He has actually worn it once or twice. It is so out of character for him, probably making it seem all the more real.

I think there is a difference between fake and synthetic. I don't have any problems with synthetic materials but I prefer materials look like what they are. Even if something is a wood look or stone look material, I would rather it still somehow indicate that it's not the genuine article.

I would never buy a counterfeit item that attempts to deceive or a knockoff that attempts to deceive. Inspired by maybe, but again I would want there to be clear differences.

I don't have any gemstones but I guess the same thing would apply. I am not against costume jewelry, but I would not want a fake diamond to stand in as an imposter for a genuine one. If I had ethical issues regarding the mining of diamonds or the harvesting of fur or things like that, I don't think I would want something that looked like diamonds or mink/seal/ etc. either, if that makes sense.

I can see that, if you have ethical issues why would you celebrate the product in any form.

Here's my perspective: I grew up very very poor. So poor that we only ever drank fake (powdered) milk and I never had a real Kellogg's cornflake till after I was married.

Now I will not knowingly buy anything fake. Because I can afford real. Shallow of me? Oh well. Try walking in my shoes (er, the broken down used shoes I wore to grade school).

No, it's not shallow. It sounds like the early experiences made you feel,maybe, unworthy somehow. I can see how it would become important, especially to a child.

I can also see the opposite. Because I can afford real, I'm not embarrassed to buy fake. If I could only buy fake I might feel sheepish about it.

As they say, sex and money are where all our neuroses are revealed.

How we spend our money is a funny thing. I've been thinking about this after reading the purse thread. I can't imagine any scenario where I would spend, say, $1K on a purse, and yet I would (and do) give my daughter the same amount for no reason other than that I love her. I guess I just revealed a neurosis. :)

You are blessed to be able to do that for your daughter Linelle!

Lisa, I am. But I'm not rolling in dough. :) I guess what I was trying to say is that if I had an amount (e.g., $1K) to spend on anything, it most likely wouldn't be a purse. And that's not to say it isn't okay to do that if you have a passion for purses.

Bumble: I'm sorry for going OT.

I have all fake rings that mimic my real rings. I travel often and, during my journeys, two items were missing so I had a Boston jeweler (family) make up fakes for me that pass for real and I wear those more than I've ever worn the real deal. If you wear a 20K ring you are nervous about swimming etc. so now I'm free as a bird. Same with bags, I've paid very high money for some and very low for others. My daughter buys me outrageously expensive gifts because she gets pleasure from doing so, I wish she didn't and have said so but she still does it. I came up with no money and my DH and I have been very successful as well as all my children so it's our lifestyle, they have no idea I wear the fake ones most of the time. My little secret. I actually get more pleasure from finding something at an estate sale and saving money. I don't like having lots of clothing. When I buy one thing, I give away one I have. I hate shopping. I'm more of a simple person who just loves to be a gypsy and go wherever and go to museums, that's my passion.

Littlebug, have you read The Glass Castle? I did recently and it certainly helped me understand those without much.

Linelle, I love when threads take tangents!

Bumble, you know it's a movie? I read the book and was not really crazy about it. Been meaning to see the movie.

I am still struck by the Mom hiding the chocolate bar. I cannot imagine that. (my own neuroses ... I remember the candy bar scene!) lol

Giving is something else

Whatever I can't imagine spending buying, I can triple that and give when needed, and I won't look back

The feeling of helplessness when you can't give to people is much worse than feeling of helplessness when you know they can't help you

Of course there are many ways to help or to give. I just can't do lots of stuff I could before. I can mostly listen to them, or,as they say, be there for them(and very often not physically since almost everybody's so damn far away) or give them money(if I have it myself at this point lol) or buy them presents.

There's simply the whatever remains for me to somehow put how I care about them into actions.

And sometimes money is the easiest, I realize that very well..yet it does help to solve some problems, and I'd be useless otherwise. And I hate being useless.

And presents..well it's how I know I love somebody:) I start thinking "oh, he/she would love it". I was like that since I remember myself..I would start telling all sorts of fairy tales what exactly I'll do for somebody when I grow up. Complete fairy tales, with palaces and ball gowns. With very detailed descriptions of these palaces and ball gowns:) I was maybe three years old or something.

Then a bit later I was obssessed with idea to give home to somebody very poor, like a black kid from United States or something. In my head I was convincing my family (we were 6 people in 2 bedrooms) to agree and adopt that yet-unknown-to-me child. I had no idea how that child even would find himself anywhere near our place, since I never saw poor kids from US unless on TV..usually just some grown up tourists, that seemed like they didn't need me to give them a nice home. On the opposite, they had bubble gum. which we had not..:)

It took me many years and actual traveling abroad to realize I wouldn't be doing this poor kid from US any favors lol

I'm sorry, it's totally not what was asked..:)

Mtn, I watched the movie right after reading the book and thought they did a good job staying true to the book. I like the ending with the real family.

I generally despise family drama genre books, but because the author took a lighthearted, matter-of-fact approach to much of the heartbreak, it came off as interesting and funny.

Bumble, no I haven't. But I did read Frank McCourt's Angela's Ashes. I found it haunting and depressing. I have been where he was - literally - and don't want to go back. As a young child, I observed as my dad's sister had to give her children up for adoption because she could not feed them. I do not wish to be reminded of such circumstances. (But thanks anyway. Sorry, I did not mean to be such a Debbie Downer. Bowing out of this thread now.)

..real is stronger than fake, that's why

it hits you more

it hits you when you're a kid, and if you're a kid of somebody who went through something, or even if you're their grandkid. it shapes you..then you either try to leave your mould or stay within it, yet the mould is always there.

sometimes a bit fake is better. say when I'm in a not so great mood so-so should-be-chilling thriller will be better than a really well done drama. and especially better than real news.

When I was in China, the guides told us if we see anything that has a name brand on it for sale, especially at a street vendor, it is a fake. And they told us not to buy any electronics such as iPhones, iPads, etc. Since I did not want to get caught at customs with anything resembling counterfeit goods, it was no temptation at all.

I just like real things. :) When we built our house...I made sure all of the finishes were "real." Real oak HW floors sanded in place, real marble to age & patina, cabinets made from real maple rather than MDF, wool and natural fiber area rugs...real feels different to me. It's like in clothing...I can appreciate all of the technology that goes into the athletic wear I buy, but nothing feels as good on my skin as an old, soft cotton tee or a silk shirt.

And I love the craftsmanship that goes into fine brands of luxury goods. That's why I don't have a ton of bags...just several ones that were quite a splurge but I love them madly. And jewelry...I do have some costume pieces, but they don't bring me the joy that my real things do, although that is probably bc my real stuff is all either gifts from people who love me or was bequeathed to me by people I loved. Anyway, I certainly don't think fake anything is a bad choice for other people...I just don't see the point in fakes for me bc they wouldn't bring ME joy, and I certainly am not trying to impress others.

I like fake gems for my costumes, especially all the glass pearls on the golden Italian renaissance gown. They look very real indeed. I wear a real cameo and garnets or pearls with my Victorian gowns. People just assume they are fakes because I'm in costume. Some fake jewelry looks terrible, especially historical styles.

Some of the copycat China and silver is really bad. Many times, even if it looks good, it's poorly made. I saw a copycat Monet painting that was so beautiful but it was already sold. I would have bought that. I like really good reproductions of things in museums.

I agree with avoiding fake food whenever you can.

I like real people much better than fake ones :-)

Well, my definition of real or fake might be different than yours. If I like it it's real. There are so many beautiful things in the world that can't really be put in a category of real or fake. I mean, ok, there are fake designer purses, electronics, jewlely and stuff like that but there is also so many things that never had an important label, signature or kind word written or otherwise that can also be beautiful.

Quality is what matters to me not whether something is real, fake, faux or imitation. I am unimpressed by 'designer' names and frankly don't care if my purse is a copycat or "fake," so long as the quality is good. DD is different and loves her LV I gave her last Christmas and she wouldn't have been happy with a knock off.

i think my bottom line, is real or fake/imitation really doesn't matter, so long as it is quality, attractive, and functional. The quality of the difference between real and fake often pushes me towards real, but not always.

I wear my engagement ring, another dinner ring with a nice sized real diamond along with a gold choker with a nice diamond pendant every day -- just my uniform jewelry, but if I am wearing studs, they are going to be fake because I am always losing earrings.

100% Cotton is great (and we grow some cotton on our family farm so I wish more people would buy it to drive up cotton prices) but I recognize IRL, sometimes synthetics just work better or hold up better.

For various practical reasons, we are putting Luxury Vinyl Olank in our new house instead of real wood. I'm fine with that and they look great.

As an animal lover, I prefer faux fur over real. (I do have a couple of minks from my pre-semi-enlightened younger days that I never wear, but should resell or give away -- they are warm and maybe if those of us who have them and don't wear them for ethical reasons gave them away fewer new animals will be raised for their pelts. But ironically and probably disingenuously, I don't have the same issues with leather or meats to eat. I feel bad about that.

And I love Rita's comment above! I also like real people rather than fake ones too!

I just came across this piece in the NYT about a Harlem man who was shut down by Gucci for making fakes many moons ago and is now collaborating with the fashion house- but only after Gucci began appropriating his designs without permission! It's a fantastic story about fakes, artistry and authenticity- none of it my personal style- but I love the concept and the designer behind the clothes, Dapper Dan, as he is known, is quite a formidable man.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/10/fashion/dapper-dan-gucci-partnership.html

..have you seen that amazing movie, "The Best Offer"? suddenly was reminded of it..yet again..

My mother always joked that I was "to the manor born" but to be honest, it's not that I have expensive taste, it's just that I like quality, classic items. I'm willing to spend more for something that will last me many years and still look great. While some fake items are certainly well crafted, I would imagine the majority will not stand up to the test of time. And that's my line in the sand.

Jo

In Vegas last September.....I think I drove a real Ferrari?!!??! ;-)

To the point tho'. Sometimes fake can be deadly, or just worthless very quickly. Case in point, the Stihl brand. It's obviously a very copied brand. We sell Stihl, & have for 20 years. Sometimes people come in with an internet ad or something, wondering why we're more expensive. We have a quick answer......Stihl doesn't sell REAL products on the web. ONLY in real-life stores. It's sometimes hard to convince people of that, but it's true. We ask them what site it is, & Stihl goes after them. Stihl does random tests on the fake crap, & it usually fails.....QUICKLY!

I shudder when I think of a fake chainsaw, passed off as real, and then something bad happening......

Faron

Depends. Real people and real food, yes. Knock off designer purses, no. But I wouldn't buy a pricy designer purse, anyway. If I were to buy diamond jewelry, I'd go for the man-made for ethical reasons - and after all, both are exactly the same mineral.

I prefer leather to fake leather, but I've been known to buy fake leather belts out of convenience. And I guess all of our car tires are made of fake rubber...

I do have wood look tile in my kitchen but it doesn't look like any of the real wood in the rest of the house.

I really love real wood furniture, and have replaced just about every last bit of presswood dating from the days when I was first out on my own.

Oh, I am really tired of fake news...

I wouldn't say that fake can't be ok. Gretta Van Susteren had the plastic surgery years ago, and I'd say that's fake, right? Well I think it helped her, though I read only a small amount.... if another or thousands of others who go that route do it partly cause they hate themselves, that's 'fakeness' of a sad kind.

Getting this or that part of your body re-shaped, it's ok, but I've never done it.

Mojomom, I hear you on earrings! I saw a pair I liked when I was getting my rings cleaned and inspected but I don't trust myself with any earrings of major value to wear every day.

$15.000 Dollar real diamond vs A $25.000 fake diamond. Which has more value.

Diamond value is always problematic because it's a cartel-controlled market. Run of the mill diamonds are not rare and the price is always somewhat "fake" if you want to think about it like that.

When I think of "real", "fake"...I think in terms of "knock-off". IMO, if I can't afford a real Louis Vuitton, I'm not going to try to pass a knock off as a real one. If I'm going to wear a fake diamond, I will say it's cubic.

My son gave his fiance a "fake" diamond for her engagement ring. It is "real" moissanite and is beautiful. She did not want a real diamond for ethical reasons, but wanted a ring that said "engaged" I guess. She is happy with it and does not pretend it is a diamond.