Hahaha! Personally, I ADORE the coloring of this rose...but my sister hates it.

When she came over yesterday I proudly showed her the first huge, sumptuous bloom I have ever grown of this rose...arranged in a beautiful vintage cut glass vase.

I was fully expecting rapturous praise...instead, she says in a deadpan voice "that rose looks like it belongs in a funeral parlor, or in a goth garden".

Goth garden? Is that one Morticia Adams might grow? Her reaction really made me laugh!

I like the unique difference in the bloom. It breaks up all the pastels I have in the garden. Then the scent is very pleasing. It seems like everyone that visit's my garden likes it. Especially when the stick their nose in one of the blooms.

dublinbay.... those are absolutely beautiful pics of MW!

I planted 3 MW yesterday...I'm looking forward to when they look like yours.

The color of Munstead Wood is all over the map, depending on your weather. I experienced a lot of magenta blooms this spring due to really hot weather. I'd rather have the funeral parlor look, which I love. If you think Munstead is bad, you should see The Prince, which on occasion is pretty much black--or burnt up. Diane

The Prince in one of his lighter moods.

Hmm, well.. when I look in the DA catalog I think I would like MW based on the color it is in there. But based on some of the other pics I have seem I'm not quite sure. More than likely in person I would appreciate the contrast against my paler pink roses. However I can understand getting a rose then being disappointed when it blooms. I picked up some bare root Don Juans (which I could not get to grow when I lived further north) but now that they have grown some here and bloomed I'm thinking I will dig them up and replant them behind the house instead of front and center. The form is nice and the smell is ok, but they look like something was stabbed and it bled out in my flower beds. Fresh blood was not quite the look I was going for....

Actually, I have the same opinion as you, Moses. I love purple-red roses (I'm good with the "fresh blood" look, lol, and maybe I'll design a True Blood garden), but the photos of Munstead Wood fail to trigger my gasp reflex. The blotchy color doesn't do it for me (like Burgundy Iceberg, or Dark Desire). I like roses that are smooth velvety purple-red. Frankly it looks like a more double form of Dr. Huey to me (especially in the heat), and is nasty prickly to boot. I was convinced to grow it because others have commented on how well it does in the heat and how fragrant it is. In my garden, it does have the blotchy variably colored blooms, it hasn't had much fragrance, and it has wickedly thorny stems that make it a briar patch.

B-u-u-u-u-u-t.....the purple-reds that I love and have tried all fry within minutes of our intense sun hitting them, and Munstead Wood stands up better to our sun than any of those. It turns out to grow vigorously, even in the heat, and it is a bloom machine even more so than Iceberg. It has been comparable in bloom quantity to the Knockouts I had (and hated and removed). So until I find a purple-red that can take our 7,000 ft. altitude, subzero winters, 100 F summers, 5% humidity, 60 mph dry spring winds and 40 F day/night temperature swings, it stays. It actually looks nicer in real life than any of the photos I've seen. I know I need to try Ascot, as Diane has suggested, I just haven't gotten an order together for Palatine, and Ascot is said not to be fragrant.

Munstead Wood in a better mood:

I love, love, love the dark look - Kate - oh swoon to the moon!! Especially the first pic!!!

Mine is horrible so far...never any blooms, barely any leaves. I'm hoping for better this summer.

Carol

Sacrilege Moses lol. Personally I love MW. I love the deep fuchia that I am getting.

I haven't noticed much fragrance yet.

To tell the truth, so far my favorite new rose this year is Robyn Alonzo

Really pretty red/black velvety petals and blooming Its tiny little head off

But, Munstead stays because it.is just a cool rose

I actually agree with Moses here. I was surprised why so many people rave about Munstead Wood. Then I realised, maybe it's the ONLY red David Austin rose that people grow here or maybe have a few red roses. I have MW for over over 5 years and each year it's underperforming and get dieback. It could be that mine requires repotting up and change the exhausted potting mix. I have to admit that there were a few times when the blooms become dark/black red I am blown away by its beauty. Other times they are magenta red which I hate. Oh, the David Austin print of MW is such a beauty!

Come to think of it, as a newbie to these forums I do see more threads about MW than any other red English rose. I have Heathcliff and thus far am very pleased with it and am very interested in trying the other DA reds like Darcey Bussell, Falstaff, L. D. Brathwaite, Sophy's Rose, Tess of the d'Ubervilles (I also have and am awaiting first blooms) The Dark Lady, and WS2000.

l

Dark Desire has been a better rose for me so far. It's the dark purpley red color I wanted consistently in the heat (not as dark as MW can get, but I'm ok with that). Intense fragrance. Beautifully healthy Kordes foliage. (Don Juan and almost black sweet peas in the background).

Bloom in 90+ and 100+ heat. Lighter and a little smaller than when less than 90, but still consistent with what I wanted instead of the neon red and crispy bloom of MW in the heat.

Doesn't seem to need as much water in my yard either. Has a pretty growth habit. Doesn't crisp in my yard so far, even when 100+.

I'm with you Moses. But I know we are definitely in the minority from other posts and that's OK. It's nice to see MW flourishing in other yards and it's nice to read how most people have soooooo much passion and love for this rose. MW doesn't need my love, it gets enough elsewhere.

Mine looks hot pink half the year due to the heat. It only get those Goth vibes in our coolest weather. I like it better in the deeper tones than hot pink. When its hot pink it looks similar to Princess Anne's usual coloring.

I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I can understand where you are coming from Moses. MW does get that ugly dark color after it is opened for 2-3 days just before it goes into wilting. But when the bud first opens and on the first day when it is fully opened, I think it is very beautiful.

Here's MW looking a little less swamp muddy :)

Rosylady - gasp!!! So very beautiful!!! The flowers look huge!! Are they? :)

Carol

I'm also in the MW fan club and I drool over any of those dark dark red roses. Robyn Alonso is definitely on my wish list for next year, and apparently Burlington sells it!

I fully recognize though that various colors aren't everyone's cup of tea. I'm the reverse - I love the saturated colors of almost every type, but the faint blush pinks leave me rather cold. I like the "saturated blush pink" of roses like Savoy Hotel, but the "just barely pink" roses are a bit meh for me. Not that I wouldn't grow them, they just don't zing my heart.

Cynthia

rosecanadian...yes, the flowers are huge. I just measured the largest one in the vase and it was 5 inches across, and not quite fully open yet. These flowers came from bushes that were potted and not yet even in the ground!

I have cool weather right now, so that's probably why I'm getting these huge, dark flowers. I have three MW planted together to make a clump, in the hottest part of my garden. We'll see how they do this summer.

I was very excited to find a rose that is this color and this old fashioned shape that can take the heat. And by heat, I mean PNW heat where 80 degrees is scorching hot. hahaha! But...they are next to a gravel driveway and in front of a white house, so there is a lot of reflected heat...and it's afternoon heat as well.

Cynthia I am a fan of Robin Alonso. I got it a couple of months ago from for love of roses and it is flourishing. I don't know why but from the picture on their website I was expecting a pinkie red it is anything but pink it is a dark black red that just blooms like crazy and honestly on my plant I've had the same Bloom for over a week now and it looks wonderful. It is my new favorite Rose

Kristine can you post some photos of Robin Alonso? I would have never guessed it was that dark of a red from photos on HMF. Is it like Black Baccara?

RosyLady - mine 2nd summer (bare root last year), is a scrawny one cane rose that has some teeny tiny, wee, itty bitty rose buds on it. :) Hope mine grows to be like yours!!

Carol

Robyn Alonzo. It reminds me of a small version of Black Magic

Kristine - those are gorgeous!!! I love the blackness!!! Stunning!

Carol

at first I was concerned that that was even the right Rose because in pictures it shows it either plain red or a pinky red and mine is definitely a black red whoever it is it's an awful pretty rose. Lol

'Munstead Wood' is a blooming machine in my garden and the scent is to die for. It does suffer some winter kill here but comes back strong and pumps out tons of blooms. Next to 'Windermere' she is my most productive rose even though receiving only about 4 1/2 hours of sun a day. How much better would she be in full sun?

Sharon

Very pretty Kristine. It looks like it has thick, substantial petals like Black Baccara as well, but is a lighter shade of dark red.

Here are more photos of Dark Desire.

Seems to be a much better rose for me compared to MW. Not the same form as MW, but I have Falstaff for the perfect old fashioned English rose form so this one is a nice variation in my garden.

Very fragrant, healthy and seems to be consistently this color, even in the heat here. My photos look a little lighter than it is in person, but they're close. It seems to be little brighter red with the higher heat, but still the same tone. No major changes. Nice, thick petals too... haven't seen one bloom wilt or fry in the heat yet. MW just wasn't the right rose for me in the dry heat with its thin petals, color changing qualities, and my color persnickety-ness (not really a word, but you get my drift). I really hope my MWs do beautifully in Romogen's yard.

Dark Desire...

Just for good measure... here's a photo of Falstaff today (still sporadically blooming after 6 weeks, even in the almost daily 90+ and 100+ high heat here).

And Falstaff on May 1-5. Falstaff is another rose that is just so much better in my yard compared to MW. Every garden is different of course though.

And here's what my MW looked like at the same time, in the same heat. Nice, deep, dark Souvenir du Docteur Jamain on the right, showing it wasn't my camera altering the color. MW on the left.

And wilting just a day later, while a much younger and less mature SdDJ (on the right) was still fine, not wilting and still nice and dark.

Cori Ann - I have both Falstaff and Munstead Wood...both are new/newish roses. So far Falstaff has a much nicer bushy shape. It'll be interesting to see how they do in our milder temps here.

Your Falstaff is amazing!!! Sure hope mine (mine hasn't bloomed yet) looks that nice!! Gorgeous - love the shape and the color!! How is the fragrance?

Carol

The fragrance of Falstaff is one of the absolute best that I have.

It's a classic, perfect, strong rose fragrance.

Oh yay!!!! That's fabulous news, Cori Ann!!! I can't wait to smell blooms from my Falstaff!!! Yes!!!

Carol

I must use a translator to express myself in your language. So I'm not sure I can express myself well.

I will try to give an explanation of why there is so much commentary on Munstead Wood. I think gardeners are people who like challenges. A high percentage of MW produces roses much less dark than those seen in the catalogs. This way we were a bit disappointed. When ever our Munstead Wood roses give us roses of the deep dark color we aspire to, we show them proud ... hahaha. As if it were a merit award !!

Actually I think that more than for the taste for the color of the rose, what we want is to achieve the difficult. If this rose bush always produced roses so dark, I do not think it would be mentioned so much.

And if anyone doubts, read the threads of the forums that open. It is a succession of lovers of roses showing their MW .... that if this year more red ... than if last spring darker ... How beautiful yours and how clear mine ...

We expose our MW a few times to boast of them as a mother who shows her little baby plump and precious ... other times we teach them as if it were a slightly scrawny baby and should improve.

Does anyone agree with me? Gardeners are basically masochistic people. We like the challenges and the difficult.

If we do not get very dark roses from our MW it is as if we had not passed some test of a contest that we ourselves invented. LOL.

Maria.

Maria - I think you are so right!!! I don't want to grow hardy roses - it's too easy. I like the challenge of growing plants that are difficult. Here, very few people grow roses...and even fewer grow tender roses.

Carol

Maria you may be right on! I guess that says a lot about me then, since I chose rather to give mine away than to be masochistic...

;-)

Very well said Maria.

Cori Ann, much thanks for the picture of Falstaff and Dark Desire.

I have tried twice to order Dark Desire. Once right after I ordered Flamingo Rosita from Heirloom. About 15 minutes after I placed my order I decided to add Dark Desire. When I called they said they couldnt add it , it would have to be a separate order. Oh brother, two shipping charges. No thanks. It KiND of bugged me. So a week later I ordered it from J&P. After a coupleasure of weeks later I called to see when my Dark Desire would ship and they told me, no Dark Desire because they were all sickly. Good grief. Maybe I am not meant to have that one.

I think Rogue Valley roses has Falstaff and that is one that I have been wanting, so thanks for the pictures.

Moses, your advice is always so sensible and clear. If only your taste in roses were the same, lol. I personally don't get lavender roses (although I was born in the USA), so I can excuse your, uh, lapse in the case of MW. Mine bloomed the first year, has done well in a pot with no octopus growth, and this year put on a first flush that lasted six weeks. Largest blooms ever on the 3 yr old plant. And yes, I like the fragrance too.

Falstaff, on the other hand, has taken three years to become a presence in the garden. Yes -- it's possible to make a good argument for the sheer attractiveness of Falstaff's bloom vis a vis MW, but I find MW sumptuous and mysterious. Long live differences of opinion!

Interesting Sylvia. Falstaff took off in my garden right away and impressed me so much with the blooms, fragrance, color, growth, health, heat tolerance... everything. I can only imagine how great it will be in 3 more years.

Munstead Wood on the other hand, well, we all know where I stand on that one. Same age as my Falstaff (both were bought as mature bushes at about the same time, I bought 3 bushes of each). In my yard, MW was squatty and short, crispy and fried, only dark for a couple of weeks then neon red, short funky stems, extra thorny, water hog.

I'm sorry... I know it's like blasphemy on here to speak ill of MW. I mean no offense or disrespect. It was just really worse than watering an ugly, thorny weed in my yard.

I think it's also differences in garden conditions as well as differences in opinions. If the color and form of MW remained constant and didn't have such a problem with my heat, I would have tolerated the other shortcomings.

I'm so glad I ended up getting Dark Desire instead though. Every shortcoming that MW had, Dark Desire simply does not (at least in my yard).

Oh dear, if I can only have one should it be Falstaff or dark desire ? I'm still thinking Dark Desire because it would go right next to Flamingo Rosita and I thought the contrast would be pretty cool

if I had a rose that I disliked it would be out of here too

I don't put up with roses that make me unhappy because I don't have that much space. Sometimes just cut your losses and you get rid of it.

I have 3 lavender roses that I just do not love they don't do a thing for me and they're in a prime location along the street and the very front of the yard they may have to go

Falstaff isn't great in everyone's yard Kristine. For some it's been not so great at blooming at all. That's not the case for me, but has been for others. Can you go to a rose garden or nursery locally and look at how they each grow?

Falstaff produces much more attractive blooms than MW, IMHO, with smooth velvety evenly colored petals, but my four year old Falstaff produced 3 flowers this year and my second year Munstead has probably produced a dozen, with many more buds on the way. They both get crispy edges in temperatures over 90F, Falstaff possibly more so than Munstead, in contrast to Cori Ann's experience. I'm at 7,000 ft elevation and 5% humidity so that may make a difference.

I think maybe I'm hedonistic instead of masochistic Maria. ;-)

Here are today's photos of the Dark Desire rose I planted in the same place as my earlier neon red MW.

Impressive that it retains this color in my 100+ dry, radiant heat. It's a little deeper and darker in real life. I anticipate an even deeper hue once temps begin to drop in the fall. Much better choice for this spot, for my personal preferences, next to Souv du Docteur Jamain.

Cori Ann - that's incredible!!!! Such a gorgeous color!! I love it!

Carol

They are beautiful to me!! Of course I have yet to receive one(

Does anyone know of anyone selling this rose still and that will ship it?

Thank you

I am dying to order dark desire but I'm not paying $38 at heirloom not including shipping somebody else may have it but I've been searching high and low and have not found any seller so maybe I'll have to wait until next spring

@RosyLady: Funeral parlor? Goth garden? Those just make it sound awesome.

Another term that really stupefies me is "dated" (I haven't seen it here, but in other discussions) - as if you need to follow the latest trend to have a presentable garden. I like roses that evoke different periods, and I'm way too much of an individualist to adopt an aesthetic ideal merely because it is contemporary.

As for Munstead Wood, I love the dark, rich colour. I don't grow it, though. I don't care for the thorniness and growth habit.

I agree Laurie . The Roses I purchase HAve moved me

They've touched my heart. whatever the color there was something about them that has spoken to me whether it be red or yellow or orange or blue. Maybe the form speaks to me maybe it's the petal count but I buy my roses because somehow they have spoken to me and I went to live with them for a very long time and those that are big trouble problem roses usually end up having to go bye bye

I am in shock for this is my favorite rose! Munstead Wood has outperformed every rose on Fortuniana rootstock in my yard, and it is in a pot vs the Fortuniana in the ground. A true showstopper for beauty!!