Do you have the police report?

I was once the third car back at a light when the first car braked suddenly. Car #2 braked, but hit Car #1. I braked, but hit Car #2. Neither I nor the driver of Car #2 were ticketed, and our insurance paid for our damages.

Yeah, unfortunately, that happened to me before. The police officer said that I should only drive at the speed I can comfortably stop my car, if the car ahead of me stops suddenly. He gave the example that if someone's brake lights have gone out and they haven't become aware of it yet, it'll falsely convey that they intend to go through, so one should just always assume the car ahead of them might stop unexpectedly, for whatever reason. Now I'm especially careful if I'm the second car in line, approaching an intersection. Glad you DH is fine!

Police often shortcut the report.......whoever has the front end damage is at fault. :-(

That sucks, sorry about the car.

Perhaps a good reminder to everyone that we should always keep a safe traveling distance between us and the car in front of us to avoid incidents like this.

We did get a police report, only problem is that the officer refused to listen to hubs and said that he was at fault anyway... Is there anything that we can do or did this guy in front of him screw us over?

Sorry to hear about the problem. In my state, I believe in a two car rear-end type accident, the car whose front end hits the rear of the other is ALWAYS considered to be at fault. It doesn't matter that the rear car's driver believes the car in front made an unexpected or improper maneuver because the obligation is to always allow enough room to stop without impact no matter what may happen.

That guy isn't screwing you over. Even though your husband may not realize it, the fact is that if he couldn't stop in time, he was either distracted or he was traveling too close.

Unless I'm on top of the intersection when the light changes, I always stop when the light turns yellow because I got a ticket once when I didn't. The cop said it turned red while I was still in the intersection and it was his word against mine. I'm not willing to do it again and risk getting another ticket, so if the guy behind me isn't prepared to stop and hits me, that's his problem, not mine.

Guess I was just lucky. I remember it so clearly because I was returning home from taking DH to the train, and I was wearing a coat over my robe and nightgown. (Taught me not to do that again!)

Glad it was only car damage, not people damage. Despite best efforts, accidents will happen. Told my daughter, who is an excellent driver, my favorite rule just yesterday:

When driving, use your rear view mirrors to keep track of who is behind you, and how far. Scan them often. Especially on the highway in heavy traffic, adjust your distance to the vehicle in front of you, to how closely a vehicle might be following you. When you're panic-breaking, you don't have time to ascertain if the guy behind you is going to hit you, you have to know already how likely/unlikely that is.

"Failure to maintain safe traveling distance" or "following to closely" is what is most likely written on the ticket. The fact that the man slammed on his brakes is not an indicator of fault on his part.

In the eyes of the law and the rules of the road, your husband was in the wrong.

It sucks, I've hit someone before too when they slammed on their brakes and I was the one who got the ticket.

I make sure to stay far back from any vehicles in front of me now!

"Hubs was in a fender bender today. He is okay, thank god, but his car isn't... :-( As he was coming up on a light, the person in front of him second guessed their attempt to burn a yellow when they realized there was a red light camera and slammed on the brakes mere inches from the intersection. Hubs was already coming to a stop but even with slamming on the brakes, he couldn't avoid this guy. So basically, guy in front of him did something dangerous to avoid a ticket and hubs and I are going to pay for it now. Great!" [emphasis added]

As others have already pointed out, you can never assume to know what another driver will or won't do. You must always drive defensively -- presuming that the other drive will do the wrong thing, or the thing that will put you in harm's way.

You have no way of knowing, absent a confession to it from the driver in the front car, that he "realized there was a red light camera," and that he was trying "to avoid a ticket." For all we know the driver in front is a fine, upstanding citizen who didn't want to violate the law and mistakenly assumed that your husband would also be abiding with the law by following at a safe distance.

Was your husband also thinking that he could speed through the intersection right after the driver in front?

"absent a confession to it from the driver in the front car, that he "realized there was a red light camera," and that he was trying "to avoid a ticket." For all we know the driver in front is a fine, upstanding citizen who didn't want to violate the law and mistakenly assumed that your husband would also be abiding with the law "

No matter how far fetched, assume he were to "admit" to making a radical move. Assume he's an escaped felon.

Both hypotheticals are irrelevant. The answer is the same, the driver behind would be at fault in California and I suspect in other places too. The driver in front has no obligation to look into his rear-view mirror before making any maneuver that doesn't involve a lane change, including slamming on his brakes at an unexpected place or time.

It's puzzling because the driver who stopped at the amber light was doing the right thing, not the wrong thing.

And what's with all the tail-gating these days?

Did you ever notice that if you leave a good distance between you and the car in front of you.......Someone will cut in and fill that space?

ElizabethA- yep, happens all the time at which point I slow down to once again put a safe distance between me and the car in front of me.

Me too. Which isn't to say that I don't find it frustrating, I do.

Awwwww, this is sad. In a better world, the guy who gave your DH no options would help out. I'm glad he's not hurt. This sort of accident happened to a friend. She was being safe but the other driver was not. She tried to get out of the way and bumped another and the one that caused it all drove away. But she might have been killed or her friend if she had not acted in time. I'm super cautious now and get honked at all the time but I don't care anymore. Cars can take lives so we all need to be extra careful as if we're teens with dad watching us from the passenger seat.

Someone hit me at a red light in December. I was going to make a right but the car coming on the cross street was approaching too fast for my liking (I think he might have gunned it for a yellow light) so I stopped suddenly, The police were too busy to come. The other guys insurance spoke to me and said its always the drivers fault who hits you from behind and gave me a claim number and said they would immediately email instructions on retrieving a free rental car. It appeared to me pretty minor damage but parts were needed. I asked at their body shop if I could just keep driving my own car while waiting for parts. No! I was treated like royalty-rental car was waiting at the body shop. daily updates on my car, terrific body shop!

Seems a common error is that a lot of drivers (I'd say most) focus on the car immediately in front of them instead of looking ahead. A good practice is to scan ahead at by around a half mile or even more if visibility allows. That way you are predicting hazards or potential changes in road conditions or speed before they happen.

Aiming high in steering is adjusting your steering and reactions to what is way ahead, not directly in front. You assume there will be hazards and you are prepared for them. When I see a large truck ahead I always assume he may blow a tire or get cut off and jack knife and adjust my driving accordingly far before I catch up to him. When driving in the twisties you slow going in and accelerate going out of the turns. Not only do you see what's ahead but you have better control of your vehicle leading to less unnecessary braking and being able to brake safely should the need arise.

In our state, a driver is meant to keep a safe distance in order to stop for any unexpected stop ahead. As far as someone cutting in front of me, I am not bothered by that, perhaps they need to make a turn. At any rate, it is a public road and does not belong to me.

Your husband is the one at fault...period, end of story. Where did your husband think he was going anyway, the light was already yellow and he wouldn't have been able to go through the light because it would have been red by the time he was up there. I've been hit from behind when I began to take off then put on my brakes because there was another car that pulled out from the side street and was too close for me to continue going. I didn't SLAM on my brakes but the person behind me should have been keeping his distance. Luckily, only his car had a tiny dent. He did not try to pass blame either. Own it! It was his fault for not keeping a safe distance.

We did get a police report, only problem is that the officer refused to listen to hubs and said that he was at fault anyway... Is there anything that we can do or did this guy in front of him screw us over?

I don't think that the guy in front of you screwed your husband over. Unless he would have actually stopped and backed into your husband's car, his driving was independent of your husband's driving.

arkansas: DH was in a similar situation. He was stopped at a red, ready to turn right. The car to his left had pulled up too far forward for DH to see the approaching cross-traffic, so DH scooched his car forward a bit. A guy coming from behind thought DH was proceeding with the turn and barreled into our car, caving in the rear and giving DH quite a jolt (funny now, but he remembers distinctly his flip-flops ending up on the floor of the car). The insult upon almost-injury: when the rear-ender filed his claim with insurance (same company as ours), he claimed that DH shifted his car into reverse and backed into HIM (to the tune of 5-10 feet, given the damage). Needless to say, that guy lost and and had to pay full damages.

I remember nearly 50 years ago in Drivers Ed class, the instructor told us to keep your eyes moving, check your rear view mirror frquently to see how close the car behind is, Good advice. (Which I don;t always follow-teehee).

*I* was probably looking TOO far ahead. I could see the green light two cars ahead of me. I couldn't see that a car making a right on red into our lane had squeezed in behind stopped traffic on the far side of the intersection. This caused the driver two ahead of me to brake. We were all moving about 10 MPH. I had my right turn signal on. The car behind me was also taken unawares, but merely tapped my rear bumper. I guess the officer decided it was a no fault situation for the four of us with bumper damage. The person who was at fault (the driver squeezing into traffic) was long gone.

I have three friends in California who have all been injured -- two more than once -- by being rear ended while they were at dead stops on freeways. Distracted, high speed driving.

watchmelol wrote: "Seems
a common error is that a lot of drivers (I'd say most) focus on the car
immediately in front of them instead of looking ahead. A good practice
is to scan ahead at by around a half mile or even more if visibility
allows. That way you are predicting hazards or potential changes in road
conditions or speed before they happen."

I think this is so true, but good luck trying it around here where everyone seems to have to drive a behemoth suv that you can't see around or in front of them at all. I do my best on the freeway to try to avoid driving behind them, but sometimes it's impossible.

Seen too often on the freeway - a woman (sorry ladies) driving alone in a too-big SUV too fast, holding a phone (repeat after me - bluetooth) , with a cigarette or food or makeup in the other hand (steering with feet?), constantly looking at herself in the rear view mirror (which is often adjusted upward and leftward to allow for convenient use to apply makeup or just normal female preening), careening down the highway, often straying over the lane markers.

The only thing these mindless drivers use their eyes for consistently is to look at their phones. I wish the police and CHP would begin a serious program to ticket drivers who violate the "hands free/no texting" law.

In our area, if you're the following driver and run into a guy ahead ... you'd better have a real good story if you want to avoid getting that ticket ... with all of the attendant current and future difficulties.

Leave space between you and the vehicle ahead ... and, in multi-lane roads, to vehicles in other lanes - including what's going on a long way ahead, and who's behind, where and how far.

They say to keep two seconds from the car ahead before you pass a roadside marker ... and at our 80 and over consultations (every two years to renew - I've had my fourth), they say that we seniors, slower to think and to react, should make it three seconds.

Moreover, after about 70 or so, when one is in any kind of an accident, there's a good possibility/probability that you'll receive a letter from the Ministry of Transport to instruct you to turn in your driving licence. Here on the farm, I'm paying under $600./mo. for a nice bungalow, and in the nearby city a smallish apartment will run about double that - not to my liking.

Yes - having people cut in is frustrating ... but I'd rather arrive with both me, the other driver(s)/passenger(s) ... plus vehicle(s) intact, than have a visit to a hospital (or morgue) intrude on our route to home/wherever.

As I see a signal light go yellow ahead, I tend to develop more space between my vehicle and the one ahead.

ole joyful ... thankful to still have a driving licence

Down here in OC, I have noticed a lot less usage while the car is in motion, but at every a red light, the phones come out. Biggest offenders in my observations are teens/young adults and middle aged women.

I have noticed the police being pretty aggressive in ticketing. I've personally seen 3 people pulled over for texting at a red light. A friend of mine was ticketed for doing so. I think these tickets are several hundred dollars.

I think anyone using a cell phone while behind the wheel, even if the car is stopped, should get jail time. A fee doesn't seem like a big enough penalty as people still risk it every day.

joyful, in the US tickets/citations aren't given just for causing an accident. Absent the accident being the result of an infraction like reckless driving (rarely given in vanilla situations without something extreme involved) , speeding, running a red light or stop sign, or DUI, it's just an accident that traffic laws don't impose sanctions for.

It is this simple.... 1 car length following distance for every 10 mph of speed plus 1 extra car length for speeds over 40 mph plus more car lengths for rain/ snow or other conditions affecting stopping conditions. That means on the interstate, in good weather, traveling 70 mph an appropriate following distance would be in excess of the length of a tractor trailer which is around 70'.

Seen too often on the freeway - a man (sorry gentlemen) driving alone in a too-big SUV or pick up, too fast, riding someone's bumper because he's WAY too important or macho to have to wait his turn like everyone else. He OWNS the road and you better get outta his way.

Sounds okay to me, a male will always be in full control of the equipment he's operating. Just kidding but this in keeping with other comments you've made before.

I'm normally a middle of the road, live and let live, open-minded kind of guy. I'd love to rise above a generalization I've developed but just can't. My bias - is it just me, or does it seem that the size of a truck a man drives is inversely proportional to his height, or his intelligence, or also (likely) the personal equipment contained in his shorts? In other words, the smaller any or all of these three things, the larger the truck - is it a way to compensate for an insecurity or inferiority complex?

For women, it's different. Many have a cocoon attitude - the bigger the car, the larger (and more protective) the cocoon and the more danger is averted. There's no need to be concerned about avoiding stupid maneuvers or distractions because the cocoon provides all protection needed.

Short of having whole thing caught on some traffic camera... the car that HITS is technically at fault. Fair? Not so much!

What happens if a car switches lanes without seeing you and you collide? Who is at fault if you hit them? You can't really control that.

In Los Angeles, if you leave any space, someone will squeeze in at freeway speed. Driving in LA is not fun and I try to avoid it.

kittymoonbeam, I think the SF Bay Area is worse than SoCal for what you're talking about. I like to say that around here it's almost as if there were a wireless link between my turn signal and adjacent cars' accelerator pedals. Signal a lane change, or even a merge when entering the freeway, and the car in the adjacent lane where you want to go will speed up and block you.

I go down there frequently and while LA has many more daily hours of heavy traffic and covering very significantly greater miles of road, I think the drivers down there are mostly (not always) more polite than up here. There are exceptions and unfortunately it sometimes varies with what area you're in and what kind of car you're driving.

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https://nyti.ms/25a2We2

Hi there midlin,

Some yellow line, that ... down the middle of that road you're driving!

o j

It's hard not to agree with that Mdln!

I'm with those who say your hub was at fault in this situation. Already coming to a stop, but didn't. The guy in front stopped inches from an intersection, then hub was too close or distracted or something else. Why get so worked up over it? It was an accident, despite the link and it happens. Maybe he will learn a lesson from it. Maybe everyone should. Blaming someone else won't help. Be glad nobody was injured. Be glad you're not getting sued. It's a nice day out. Go enjoy it and move on. The car can be fixed.

And for those who say front damage is always at fault, not so in this state. The example of someone pulling in front and you hitting them is one of many situations. And very seldom is anyone (at least in this state) 100% at fault. Insurance companies pretty much agree that if you're on the road, you're automatically partially at fault for an accident. It wouldn't have happened if you weren't on the road. I had a situation where a guy passed me, swung back, hit my front end and kept going. I chased him down and had the cops called. I was declared 20% at fault for being on the road. And yes, I guess you're right, I had front end damage and was at fault!