Practices change over time and always have. The world is more casual today in many respects, not just in dress standards. Arbitrary standards and conventions from the past don't linger as much as they used to.

How are jeans and sweaters not casual clothing?

"...was invited to the White House. They posed for a formal photo, and
there was an uproar. Although all the young women were nicely dressed,
most of them wore flip-flops instead of shoes.

Now I'm thinking they had to be prompted about "appropriate clothing"
to wear to the White House, but someone failed to cover "appropriate
footwear". My point is that they apparently didn't 'just know', as I
believe most college women would have known in previous years."

Yeah, I remember the days when we knew better. White gloves, panty hose and heels. Thank god those days are gone!

Yeah, I'm glad those days are gone too when I'd have to wear pantyhose , heels and maybe a hat to church. Don't own panty hose, don't wear heels and don't own a hat except baseball or ski hats. That said I hate to go to a nice restaurant and see a man in a muscle shirt and baseball cap eating dinner beside me. That also goes for seeing people in their PJs in public places. I am a very informal sporty type dresser and can't remember the last time I had a dress on. There are pictures of me shopping in the city when I was first married in a shirtwaist dress and heels. Really?

Come to think of it, it was hose with a garter belt (or girdle!), not panty hose back in the good old days.

elmer & others, but don't u think they should... times are changing, fact of life, but some things from the past are good and should be maintained. i know this is my HO, but its truly how i feel. my mom used to say when we were little " if your friend jumps off a bridge are u going to do it too??" just because somebody does something doesn't make it right!

i know this sounds preachy, but my gosh, can't we keep and have some standards? i would be embarrassed to show up inappropriately dressed somewhere, so i wouldn't do it. i feel its better to over dressed than under dressed. having self respect....

it about you, the person going the event and having/ showing respect for the occasion/person, its not about being snobby. its not about what people are going to remember. its not about, "who cares, the person is dead"...certain occasions call for a certain dress code...

Should past practices be maintained, sportsfanatic? Maybe that's better as an individual decision. If you decide to be dressed in a more fancy way for a funeral or visitation or whatever, great. That's your choice for you. Why would you expect others to have the same point of view as you do or be upset when indeed they don't?

Your perspective is that dressing in fancy clothes shows respect for the occasion/person. That's fine, it's your decision for you. What would you expect someone to do who doesn't agree with that?

Elmer, do you agree that jeans/sweats are appropriate for a Funeral?

No one around here would wear a t-shirt to a funeral or visitation. Men wear a shirt with a collar at the very least. More likely a sports coat and slacks. A suit to a full blown funeral. Jeans would be all wrong and never sneakers. Dressing appropriately shows respect for the deceased, their family and yourself.

The appropriate thing to wear is kindness, love, sympathy for a family grieving. I only hope the judgement did not show on the OP face. If that showed it would be like that person was wearing the most inappropriate outfit in the room.

That said I love cloths I miss the old days of dressing to the nines as we use to say. When I have to attend a black tie event I am all in and cannot wait to get dressed. I do not like jeans they are not comfortable for me. But I have casual cloths that can take me to the store and a wake that is appropriate for me.

IMO Whatever anybody else wears is appropriate. I dress for me and do not know or care what someone else wears.

Er...jeans and sweats are not "Casual Clothing" any more "Casual Clothing" is "Black Tie". These are terms put on invitations, along with "Business Attire". Another term I see (in death notices in Hawaii) is "Aloha Wear" -- which is "Islander" for "Casual Clothing".

"Casual Clothing" is a step up from utilitarian clothing you'd wear to mow the lawn or change the oil in your car. Maybe we need a new category! Suggestions welcome.

mamapinky, I think neat and clean solid color jeans (not the ones with streaks, holes, or sandblasted patterns) in good repair are appropriate anywhere. Sweats, gym shorts, yoga pants that are clingy like tights, t-shirts, shorts, etc are great for exercising, work and casual lounging at home but not necessarily otherwise out in public. Collared shirts look best if ironed or of the permanent press type for those who prefer that, and not look like they were slept in.

I think a bigger clothing issue is that people, especially as they age, don't wear clothing that's appropriate for their age and body types. Why do fat women wear short dresses and skirts and tight pants and tops? Why do men wear t-shirts that don't cover their bellies or their butts?

Those are my preferences, I apply them to myself only.

I've seen "casual dress" on invitations. It means "not formal"--that is, not black tie. Casual dress for women can be a lot of things, from a sundress to slacks, even nice dark wash jeans worn with a jacket and heels. I'm in the upper Midwest and have never seen anyone at a visitation wearing anything but such "casual dress."

" just because somebody does something doesn't make it right!"

Exactly. Just because they dress up, doesn't make it right. Just because they dress down, doesn't make it right. And fashion and dress go through their own changes too.

There's so much important stuff going on in the world right now, maybe clothing one way or the other doesn't make as much of a difference as other issues, it certainly doesn't seem to me to require a lot of soul searching. Let people choose what they want to wear, and love them for being there.

Elmer..I just wondered because in another thread you said...

**I think the wearing of jeans or shorts to a funeral is very inappropriate.Tacky or worse**

I will point no more out but there are others in different threads that believe similar to what Elmer says.

Yet on this thread its a complete turnaround.

In the OP's post she said nothing about if she gave the innappropriately dressed people any *looks* or said anything to them..I'm of the opinion she probably didn't as it would be inoppropriate. I also didn't see where she dictated what anyone should wear as far as black tie, party dress, or slacks and blouse..only that jeans and sweats were inappropriate.

I can't believe how many think its OK to wear jeans/sweats to a funeral. And how many don't seem to understand the difference in what casual means for different functions. This goes back to what I was thinking, and after reading some other threads I'm convinced its not the subject of discussion...its the subject herself. But understand I havent been here long so I can only base my opinions about this just as it was posted with nothing to color my opinion on the original statement. I actually feel sad. I know some of you probably many will now find me unworthy at the KT because I feel differently and I voiced it.. but...so did you.

please, when you come to my funeral or whatever is done then, wear anything you wish or even wear nothing at all because I won't be wearing anything either. I want to leave this world the same way I came in... with nothing but hope and free will and sans judgement. My friend died recently, and her family didn't get all dressed up to see her off, nor did I. The only glitter worn were our tears.

Did they wear jeans and sweats? Or slacks and blouse?

I did? I'll take your word for it. I'll stick with the comment on shorts, jeans, hmm. Clean black jeans, as an example, can look better than some other kinds of pants but I'll accept your recollection. It's the risk taken when responding quickly as I typically do and I never refer back to prior threads to see what I've said. I do reread posts after completing them, to clean up typos.

I wore khaki Dockers and a light blue short sleeve shirt, no tie, to my mother's funeral. Does that count? (My father was pissed at me and I told him I didn't care what he thought. My immediate family was okay with it and dressed similarly. It was a hot summer day.).

Wow, mamapinky0, you need to find a hobby or something, rather than spending time digging up 2 year old posts. Only to prove a point.

As I said, I was happy to take your word for it.

I was consistent with the Dockers and shirt comment, though. haha. For my mother's funeral, I didn't need to change in a bathroom or in my car.

The only point that proved is that peope change. ....unless you are too rigid. Why are u so stuck on jeans and sweats?

The distinction between "visitation' and 'funeral' seems to be missing here.

The saddest statement in this overloaded thread is having said anything on the day of a funeral "just to aggravate" someone else.

Lisa, without knowledge of and taken out of the context of circumstances before and after that illuminate the incident, I can see how it may seem sad to you. That's not how it was to me. It was a detailed and nuanced situation that then, as now, I'm completely okay with (from my perspective) that needn't be shared with a universe of strangers. So that it's not quoted back to me in a few years, I removed that part of my earlier comment, added some other words, and prob should have left it out completely. It is what I said, your quote is accurate and I understand your response.

After reading and rereading this thread, one thing stands
out to me. Throughout all the comments, whether positive or negative, the OP
has remained composed. Not once has she responded in an unsuitable manner. To
me that speaks volumes to her character. She appears to be a strong woman with
class. I like that a lot!

Elmer, I'm Sorry, I hope you accept my appology. I used you as a means to make a point. I could have used someone else as there are similar posts of others here. I think I chose you because you always recieve so much negitive responses at the KT yet you remain strong, your not a wimp. I knew you could handle it. I let this thread get under my skin and allowed myself to become over reactive. I acted without thinking. I'm sorry Elmer.

I do not own a skirt, dress, or panty hose. When I go to a funeral (or a visitation), I will wear a black top, black jeans or slacks, shoes, etc. That is what I am wearing to my mom's funeral next month. She would agree that it isn't about dresses, it's about how we treated her when she was with us.

"Appropriate" is subjective. Period. I think it's "inappropriate" to impose one's standards onto another in the area of attire.

Personally, what *I* find offensive is imposing peoples' own standards onto the decedent. For instance, my great uncle was never seen (by me or by anyone I've asked) wearing a suit and tie and to put him in a box in a suit and tie was totally "inappropriate" IMO. Done because an aunt and uncle were imposing their standards on my great-uncle's corpse. He was a bachelor all his life, had no kids, lived on the farm all his life and to not see him in his overalls and to top it off, putting his reading glasses on him (glasses which he never wanted to be seen wearing) was an insult to him and an embarrassment to everyone who respected his wishes, desires and standards.

To the ones who require tux and formal gowns for these events I have to wonder if you also "dress up" in that manner when you get on an airplane? I remember the time when it was considered "inappropriate" to not be in your Sunday-go-to-meetin' duds when flying. Women had to be marinated in perfume and choke everyone out of the car, plane, train, bus or station. I'm glad that those days are gone. And yes, that's MY opinion.

LOL...I must have missed something..who said a tux or formal gown should be worn to a funeral..I can't find that anywhere.

cynic -- No one here has suggested Formal Wear, and we aren't talking about costuming the deceased. We aren't talking about what 'other people' wear to a visitation, only what the family wears -- as representatives of the deceased whose life is being honored.

Some here think jeans and sweats constitute Casual Wear. Some think they are not Casual Wear and as such are too utilitarian for the family of the deceased to wear when receiving visitors.

IMO, if this isn't an occasion worthy of Casual Wear or Business Attire, what IS?

mamapinky, no apology is needed. Nothing you said offended or bothered me. Thanks for being thoughtful all the same.

Elmer ThankYou. ..but...I offended myself. Sometimes I get too bothered by things and take it to far.

Mamapinky, it's fine to get over involved sometimes!

So, it looks like we all have to agree to disagree on what to wear, what not to wear, what you should wear/ not wear, and what the family should wear/not wear!

I have checked several sites, including Emily Post and Wikipedia and Casual Wear, in every single instance, is described with jeans.

I'm sorry, but you can't just choose a new meaning for the phrase when the rest of the world already has an accepted definition of what Casual Wear means.

Perhaps you mean Business Casual which is nicer than Casual Wear?

Emily Post

Wikipedia

Texas_Gem -- Thank you. It's *changed* (while I wasn't looking). Is there anything about footwear? Does it include slippahs (flip-flops)?

I see nothing wrong with that they wore, why are so many so horribly judgmental and more concern about what others wear then what they are attending?

I used to hear this bible study group tear others apart, did you see so and so and what wearing on sunday?

Pay attention to why you are at church and not what others are wearing.

We like comfortable clothes these days and I wear Jeans and t-shirt and sweatshirt in winter when really cold.

Also of all ages wear runners I have noticed too and why not be comfortable.

I think whatever is up to individual and its not up to us to say ugh or did you know what they were wearing.

I agree if they wore those seeing them alive, what is the problem with them going like that to funeral.

Also makes you feel more comfortable wearing what you feel comfortable in.

It bothered me when parents would say you must dress up and I am like to the stores as they would be downtown and department stores, yes, you do, thought it was crazy and other places too.

Made us not want to go with them due to that dressing up.

Don't judge, if they are clean and tidy, then let them be anyway they want to be.

Very interesting topic. It's almost like politics or religion.

Kathleen, we can put you in the "I wear sweats and jeans to wakes and funeral" team.

The thing I find interesting in this thread is that some of the posters are actually doing themselves what they perceive the poster to be doing. Being judgmental.

I just want to point how that what to wear or not was an OPINION of the poster. If you feel otherwise than the correct response is, "I disagree and I wear XYZ, as do my circle of family and friends."

In other words, stick to the topic at hand, not the person writing it. or why she/he wrote it.

Maybe people don't know what is appropriate, maybe they have foot problems & have to wear lace-up shoes, maybe they're on blood thinners and they need to wear sweats, maybe they have been at home with children for so long that they no longer have dresses or suits and they can't afford a new outfit for a funeral or they didn't have time to obtain one because the death was sudden. My aunt Lillie had a big family. Not all of them had a great deal of money. Since Aunt Lillie lived to the age of 93, and since she had had only daughters, and since their children (her grandchildren) were too old to be carrying a casket, Aunt Lillie asked that her great nephews be pallbearers. She asked that they wear white shirts and jeans. Their faces were clean, their hair was clean & brushed, their white shirts and jeans were starched, and they looked very nice. It was lovely.

I'm on blood thinners and I'm not restricted to wearing any certain clothing..what would the reason be for that?

Maybe they are colder than normal. But you would think a nice heavy sweater would achieve the same purpose.

I can certainly understand when requests are put in ahead of time, so yes honor those. But I don't think that was the case in the OP's scenario.

I remember when I first started blood thinners 9 years ago after my second stroke I was always cold..the doctor said its not from the blood thinners. That blood thinners don't actually thin the blood they prevent it from clotting...I didn't believe him and still don't about the coldness. Lol

Sorry I didn't make that clear. I was talking about the need for warmth. Blood thinners low thyroid slow metabolism old age, whatever makes people cold.

There are plenty of warm clothing on the market. Being cold for whatever reason is no excuse to dress down at a funeral. My local elementary school allows all the Teachers to * Dress Down* into jeans the last Friday of each month if they make a 1$ donation to the food bank. The other days of the week its slacks and blouse or casual dress. I think a Teachers attire is considered business casual. I know a few of the teachers outside of school, at the end of the day they can't wait to get home and change into jeans/sweats their dress down clothes. I still feel that dress down clothes are not appropriate in a Funeral Home. Just like business casual isn't appropriate at a formal function or a day gardening.

Boils down to a belief that one's own personal preferences should rule others.

I don't agree, although I will say that seems to have become an almost reflexive response in our nation to an opposing opinion.

But with this one (and speaking as a former hippie chick who scandalously wore jeans to church in 1970) I think it boils down to the customs and traditions that have, in the past, bound societies together, by showing respect for the occasion and each other. Really, when it comes down to it, why have a funeral at all? If you don't feel there is a religious imperative, why waste the money and time, much less be clean and dressed more than schlepping -to- the- grocery -store casually? What purpose does it serve?

"the essential or characteristic customs and conventions of a community"

Don't read snobbery into what I am saying. In my aunt & uncle's small farming community 40 years ago, to come to the visitation and funeral in spotless clean and pressed shirt and jeans would have been understood as one's best, and that was fine. I myself generally never wear a skirt, dress or heels, but I will wear dress slacks, and a professional looking top and jacket. If my foot is acting up, I have a pair of all black athletic shoes that my orthotics fit into that aren't obvious.

My feeling is that many customs and traditions have eroded in many instances to the point of being non-existent. When we travel or read about other nations and cultures, we usually think of their custom and traditions as charming, worthy of respect, of value and deserving of preservation, (well sure I can name some that are totally not, let's not go there) and yet, here in America, we seem to take the opposite view.

rae, I think you started with the end that you wanted and then worked backwards.

-we are a heterogeneous society, you seem to assume otherwise. The US doesn't have common relgious customs and traditions that serve as glue. Maybe your area is more homogeneous than mine is.

-for many, many people, neither weddings nor funerals are religious occasions. You seem to assume otherwise.

-most people don't live in small farming communities (about which many whose families came from such roots would shout Hurray!). Whatever might have been customary in what were likely very racially and ethnically non-diverse places decades ago aren't instructive for the world most of us live in today.

Customs and traditions have changed. They always do over time. What's more common in such matters today is neither better nor worse, just different, in my opinion. But I do prefer the more casual and more flexible attitudes that many have about such things, lockstep adherence to the past can be stifling.

PS - I knew plenty of "hippie chicks" back in the day, I'm not sure any of those I knew ever went to church at all.

But even in our heterogenous overall society, there are enclaves and local communities and neighborhoods that have been held together by commonalities. Certainly more so away from large metropolitan areas, but even Los Angeles has ethnic enclaves where familiar traditions are observed.

My point about the religious aspect is, what is the purpose of the rite in its essence? That should dictate how people treat it, as a casual occasion or not. What are we there for? Had nothing to do with assuming that they are only religious in nature.

And the point about the farm community, is that the dress that was acceptable there in another neighborhood or community might not be because it was less formal -- but it was, in that community, part of the accepted mores. It was their way of showing respect for each other. This would have been true no matter the race, BTW. (Did I hear a sniff of the nose at "small farming community"?)

PS you must have missed the Jesus people movement

what someone else wears is no of my business

raee, the urban/suburban areas I've lived in have many "enclaves" or neighborhoods of people of similar ethnic or national origin. These neighborhoods and "communities" melt away as the years pass and their former inhabitants and progeny assimilate into the general population. Old traditions and mores aren't carried on. Religious practices from the old country similarly seem to lose significance. Away from urban areas, places in California tend to have mostly segregated Caucasian populations and Hispanic populations, with an odd exception here and there I know of including groups of Armenians and Assyrians in the Central Valley. Maybe your experience is different.

The purpose of a rite? Of course, weddings are a marriage and funerals are for a burial or commemoration of life. Neither necessarily implies a religious element to it nor formality and in my experience that is becoming the case more than not. All of that is the choice of those who organize it. Seriously religious events of these kinds are becoming much less common as so many people discontinue their own religious practices and/or wish to be respectful to the differing beliefs and non-beliefs of family, friends and other attendees. I'm sure practices differ from place to place.

Our views seem different and so too may be our experiences.

The Jesus people and other evangelicals got little mainstream traction where I was at the time (LA proper). It was different in surrounding areas, like Orange County.