Do soil amendment products really help our adobe clay soils?
Larry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years ago
last modified: 7 years ago
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Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)Related Discussions
To amend or not to amend? Clay soil...
Comments (22)"It seems that it is highly recommended to plant peach trees in raised beds from the experience on this board. Does anyone have a good link or more detailed directions as far as how to do that? What type of soil do I need? How deep do I dig the hole? How high should the bed be?" For my peach trees I use mounds and terraces. It doesn't seem to make a difference how tall the mound is. Some of my mounds are 1' tall, others started out 4' tall (before settling). The peach trees do about the same either way. Some people enclose their raised beds with a raised border of some kind. I think that's fine too. I don't think it makes much difference what soil you use for the raised beds/mounds. Several years ago, I installed drain tiles in the orchard area (The drainage was horrid and I was tired of losing peach trees.) In places we had to excavate to a depth of 4' to install the tile. What we dug out was pure clay. I used this material for some of the mounds. The peach trees have done fine in the clay mounds. Per the above posts, I would only use mounds if the drainage is poor. But since you mention puddling, I strongly suspect you could benefit from raised beds/mounds. Mounds not only provide good drainage, they also loosen the dirt so there is minimal resistance for the roots to spread. Mulching on top keeps the soil moist longer into the growing season, further encouraging root growth. It's hard for peaches not to succeed when they have moist (but not overly wet) loose soil with no weed competition and plenty of sunshine. Here's a picture that's a couple years old. You can see some tall and shorter mounds. Some of the older trees aren't in mounds. The drainage tile helped them. Here's a pic of some terraces I built last fall for planting peaches this spring. By the way, I don't bother with mounds for more water tolerant trees like apple, pear and plum, unless the drainage is really bad....See MoreWill plants that don't make it help amend soil or clay?
Comments (7)Do, do keep your photos of your yard now - and brag later! Before and after... Plectranthus ciliatus is a South African plant which does awfully well under trees. Awfully. In a lot of our areas it settles down and suppresses native plants with much efficiency. Frost whacks it back but it does recover to go on its way. Zones 9-11 usually, but will probably do its best in a zone 8 microclimate. OK for a patch but you'd have to be desperate to bulk plant it, IMO. I've not been clear, and I apologise. Humus is ancient compost. When all the bacteria, fungi, bugs, worms and weather have finished with the banana skin you popped into your compost bin humus is what is left - and a thin layer it is, too. That's why gardeners keep adding more of it. Mulch is the top layer. It can be 'hard mulch' such as gravel or shells. There are some plants which do brilliantly with that kind of mulch - lavender, for example. There's reflected heat for the top and cool feet for the roots. It is also surprisingly good at retaining moisture. Softer mulch such as bark cambium or nuggets. Single season mulches such as a layer of newpaper topped with grass clippings or shredded small (ie no fatter than quarter inch diameter) twigs and green leaves. Always put mulches on when the ground is wet. Know that having the mulch can 'slow down your season' because the soil stays cooler. That can be either a drawback - or a plus if your hot weather comes in with a rush and saddens any flowers you have out. In the 'middle' of these two - humus and mulch - is compost. And it varies a lot. You can put it on when you can still tell what some of the ingredients were - and use it as mulch. Or you can wait for a couple of years and use it when it has a nice earthy smell, feels delightful to put your hands in, and you'd never know what it was made of. Making compost is a bit like making bread dough. If you can do one - you've a good chance of success with the other. It's all about ingredients and activators, warmth and moisture. It is NOT tricky. Nature does it all the time. Look at what happens to fall leaves... What you the gardener are trying to do is to increase the thickness of the humus-rich layer on the top - and the depth to which roots can go - plus the worms. My own personal view as a clay soil gardener is to minimise the amount of digging/rototilling that's done from year to year. The worms set up their runs and burrows and start shifting food particles down to where the roots can make use of the food - and we come and remake the bed! Dig over when you take out plants at the end of a season, add more compost on top and fork it through the top 6-12 inches (it will happen!), then mostly leave it alone - and stay OFF the beds as much as possible. When fall comes - stash some plastic totes in the vehicle - ignore the stares - and scrounge as many fallen leaves as you legally can. You can either put them directly on bare soil, or into the compost heap. Or, best of all, hold them in a plastic container, add some water so they're damp, and let them rot in their container in a quiet patch in the garden for a couple of years or so to turn into precious leaf mould (aka humus). It's great for adding to containers for growing plants that like a touch of 'soil' in the mix to do well....See Moreliquid soil aerator? clay amendments, etc
Comments (9)We did use the liquid soil aerator, and it worked great for us. The back of my yard was too shady for grass, so I bought some bulbs to plant last winter. You couldn't get an inch down in the soil. My husband tried a power drill with a wide drill bit, but even that wouldn't go into the soil. I ordered the aerator on line, not expecting much. I am happy to say, we are now planting bushes and shrubs in the back with no problem. Also, we have used this in our entire yard, and our grass was beautiful last year. Now, we did use it more than once. I think all together 4 times in the trouble spots, but after the first application, you could tell a very noticeable difference....See MoreTrying to make a perennial rock garden.Do I really need to amend soil?
Comments (23)The vast majority of reading I have done recommends either a no-dig amendment method or tilling/digging and amending to about 10-12 inches. I looked through all my garden books and can't find anything recommending digging to three feet of depth! My soil has some clay content, so when I have built a new bed, I have generally chosen to hand dig and mix in my favorite bagged compost to improve the soil. The one time I rented a tiller, I found it didn't work as well as my trusty shovel and hand mixing. (In fact, the perennials in that particular bed have been the slowest growing!) However, I then tried layering with cardboard and mulch last fall for yet another bed, and frankly, that bed has been an absolute delight - hardly any effort and the soil is lovely, well draining, and easy to plant in. I will definitely use no-dig methods if I have time to wait patiently for my next new bed! For a rock garden, with plants that need even better drainage, I understand why you might add gravel, grit, or sand along with the compost, but regardless of what you amend the soil with, I can't fathom digging to three feet - I have planted trees without digging that deep. I think, maybe, the guys that installed my deck might have buried the concrete supports that deep, but other than that, I can't think of a reason to disturb the soil to that level....See MoreCori Ann - H0uzz violated my privacy
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Cori Ann - H0uzz violated my privacyecholane
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agolgteacher
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoecholane
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)Larry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)echolane
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)bike2work
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agobike2work
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agobike2work
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19) thanked Nil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)bike2work
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agoLarry (Los Angeles, 10a, Sunset Zone 19)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoNil13 usda:10a sunset:21 LA,CA (Mount Wash.)
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agokittymoonbeam
7 years agoJXBrown (Sunset 24, N San Diego County)
7 years ago
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