Quick and dirty mockup, heading off to work.

36" range

30" range

Extra wall oven by fridge?

Your placement of the dishwasher won't work as you wouldn't be able to open it while you're standing at the sink. What are the dimension of your refrigerator and does the second oven need to be 30"? I also would put the refrigerator where Annette has.

Assuming that each square is 6"

Can we see a floor plan of the full space including the rooms leading into the kitchen?

I'm not a layout guru. But here you go, for your consideration. This puts all of your cooking in the same area, and your main prep area in front of the window. Not sure about placement of dishwasher.

Just so you know, your measurement labels are a bit unusual in that they don't measure the same way consistently. Plus, there are a few key measurements missing (e.g., the width of the existing DR opening...it's important b/c you did not provide accurate overall measurements). However, I think I've figured them all out within an inch or so now.

Where are you flexible? Are you willing to move/change the windows? Other walls/doors/doorways?

What is your family composition and how do you see yourself using the new Kitchen?

Is the "Kitchen Dining Room" your only table space?

What are the dimensions of the current dining space?

Could you please post a full-floor sketch so we can see all the rooms on the floor? This helps us see how the other rooms relate to the Kitchen and how traffic flows in, around, and through the Kitchen.

Is that a 30" or 36" range? It looks like 36". If it is 36", do you really need that big a range? If so, then have you considered a 36" range with two ovens instead of a 36" range + wall oven?

Have you had a chance to read the "Layout Help" FAQ? It discusses the information we need to help you find the best layout for you and your family (including the questions above - plus others.)

How do I ask for Layout Help and what information should I include?

• http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2767033/how-do-i-ask-for-layout-help-and-what-information-should-i-include

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Thanks for the responses so far.

I cook a lot. I don't have many gadgets, but need a nice cooktop with a lot of burners and two ovens are preferred. I was planning on the 36" range and the wall oven would be a 24" steam oven.

We are flexible with moving the windows. The entry ways other than the wall to the dining would be difficult to change.

Below are a few more images.

This is the layout with the attached dining room

for the family room was added on.

Thanks for all the input.

Until we hear more...here's an idea with a couple of tweaks to the walls:

• The left wall with the current pantry is extended another 12" toward the "top"
• The short wall b/w the Kitchen and Basement Stairs/Study is shortened by 12"
• The wall b/w the DR and Kitchen is not completely removed

Other...

• It does not have a wall oven
• It has a standard 30" range - it could be wider if there was only one seat at the peninsula.

What it does have...

• It has two seats at the peninsula
• It has a nice primary Prep Zone b/w the sink and range
• It has a secondary Prep Zone to the left of the sink
• It has a tertiary Prep Zone on the other side of the range. Since there's no direct water source there, it won't be useful as a primary or even secondary Prep Zone.
• It has a tall pantry cabinet in the Kitchen - 39"W x 13"D
• It has 5' of additional pantry space directly behind the range and next to the seats - 60"W x 12"D x 34.5" H. A counter is then over the top - extending from the seating. This gives you 13.5" of additional staging counterspace in the DR. I don't know how this will affect the DR, though, since I don't know what the DR looks like or its size.
• It has a 12" tall utility cabinet b/w the refrigerator and the left wall. You need 12" there to allow the doors of the refrigerator to open fully. With the shortened wall, you may be able to reduce it to 9" and add those 3" to the cabinets (base & upper) on the other side of the refrigerator.
• Dish storage is to the left of the sink and DW. there are 12 inches b/w the DW and counter around the corner. I don't know if it will be enough room for you. I know we had that in our old Kitchen and it was never an issue - we could all stand in that space and unload the DW into the cabinets above and around the corner from the DW. But, it will depend on the size of your family.
• Since your Kitchen is a bit small, I did not put any cabinets on the window wall. This will give you a better feeling of openness. You wouldn't be able to fit very large ones anyway, so I thought it would be better to just put one long one along the "top" wall.
• Seating is along the peninsula - it's not quite 48" of linear space, but it's within a couple of inches and even I don't think those couple of inches will make a difference!

While it doesn't give you the "extras", it does give you a very functional Kitchen with workspace where it's needed most.

Layout #1:

Zone Map:

Cross posted!

If the DR is only 12' x 12', I don't think you can afford to take any space for peninsula seating or additional dish storage. Plus, putting dish storage on the other end of the DR will not work well b/c it's just too far (and with too many obstacles) to walk b/w that storage and the DW.

Would you be willing to have less formal seating in the DR, such as a partial banquette? You didn't tell us about your family, so I don't know if it would work.

Let me see what I can do with this additional information.

You cannot remove (or move) the Living Room wall? What is the reason? Load-bearing? Did you get an estimate of the cost to move or remove it?

How many people does the DR table have to seat on a daily basis? (Again, more information would be very helpful! See the Layout Help FAQ above!)

Edited to ask:

How high off the Dining Room Floor is the window on the "bottom" wall?

OK, here's another one. It gives you most of what you want:

Layout #2 Kitchen:

It has:

• Good workflow
• Nice separation of work zones so more than one person can be working in the kitchen at the same time - preparing a meal or snack, cooking, or cleaning up.
  -- Refrigerator, Prep Zone, and Cooking Zone are one side of the Kitchen with plenty of workspace
  -- Cleanup Zone is on the other side with plenty of workspace and, now, quite a bit more dish storage. In addition, the dishes and Cleanup Zone are near the DR for ease of setting the table or clearing it.
• There's a 24" wide x 15" deep tall pantry on the end of the Cleanup Zone - this is to hide dirty dishes a bit from the DR and hide them completely from the LR. I discuss pantry cabs in the DR discussion below. Between this pantry cab and the two in the DR, you have 6 feet of pantry storage. I wish they weren't separated, but with your wants and constraints, compromises are needed.
• 36" range. The Cooking Zone is also well-protected from traffic - both the range and the ovens.
• There's a 24" wall oven in an oven stack with the MW in an alcove above.
  -- Under the MW alcove and above the oven is a pullout shelf to use for MW landing space.
  -- The reason for the alcove is that you can place an inexpensive MW in the alcove and, if it ever breaks down, you can easily replace it - no worrying about whether it will fit the existing trim kit for a built-in.
  -- Oven landing space is on the other side of the refrigerator 48" or less away. NKBA Guidelines recommend oven landing space should be within 48". You could also use the counter over the DW - although it will be a bit more than 48". Finally, you might be able to use the MW shelf - but be careful of heavy items.
• It has three seats at the peninsula. With the different seating in the DR, there is sufficient space for both the table and peninsula seating.
• The trash pullout is located in the Prep Zone and near the Cooking & Cleanup Zones. Far more trash & recyclables are generated during prepping and cooking than cleaning up, so locating it in the Prep Zone makes the most sense.

Peninsula:

• Yes, there is a sink in the peninsula - a prep sink. I know you didn't want one, but, again, if you want the large range, the extra oven, etc., compromises are needed and this is one that I feel strongly is needed. Without the prep sink, this layout will not work well. The peninsula still has plenty of space for staging.
  -- I did do an alternate layout with a corner prep sink, assuming it can be done with the chase. However, it doesn't follow very good workflow b/c you're moving back & forth from the peninsula where all the workspace is to the range on the other side of the sink. There isn't enough workspace b/w the range and sink - and that's where it's most useful.

What did I tweak this time? :-)

• The Living Room wall is no longer extended "up" - it's extended "down" toward the Dining Room by 26" - based on your previous removal of part of the LR/DR wall. I.e., I would keep 26" of it instead of taking all of that part of the wall down. That may or may not help with expanding the LR/DR doorway down toward the bottom wall. (See the DR layout to understand what I'm talking about.)
• The short wall b/w the Kitchen and Basement Stairs/Study is still shortened by 12"
• I moved the windows so they flank the range and they are both 39" wide. I strongly recommend counter-height windows! (See this thread: http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2484108/counter-height-window-pictures-please)
• That black box, btw, is what appears to be a chase of some kind that you cannot move - based on your layout.

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Layout #2 Kitchen Zone Map:

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Layout #2 - Alternate Peninsula:

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Layout #2 - Alternate Peninsula's Work Zones:

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Layout #2 Dining Room:

I changed the doorway to open it up more - assuming you can do it. If you cannot, then leave it as is.

This layout has a partial banquette - a bench along the window wall for two seats and the rest are chairs. This should work for just about any family - with or without children and empty nester or not.

It also contains two 24" wide x 15" deep tall pantry cabinets - shelves, not pullouts or roll out tray shelves (ROTS) since shallow shelves are much more useful than deep pullouts. With 24" wide cabinets, things easily get lost in anything deeper than 12" to 15" - shelves or pullouts or ROTS. If you wanted a pullout, then, I wouldn't have it any wider than 18" so you can see everything by looking on one side or the other. I do not recommend ROTS - you end up opening & closing them looking for what you need. With a narrow pullout or shallow shelves in a cabinet or built-in pantry, you can see everything at one look (or maybe two with a pullout).

The table is not centered on the room b/c of the door on the right. You need more space to get by b/c of the door. If you moved the door "up" toward the Kitchen, you could center the table and have 38.5" aisles on both ends of the table.

The bench, however, is centered on the room - mainly so I could symmetrically place the two 24" pantry cabinets.

If you can move the door, I would.

Have you thought about moving the kitchen to the dining room? In it's present location the kitchen also acts as a hallway. If the kitchen was in the corner you wouldn't have that issue. Also, It might be a pretty sightline from the front door to see a dining set instead of the kitchen. The doorway between living and dining could be closed and moved to behind the pantry

I like the idea of switching the kitchen with the DR, but if you can move the DR/LR doorway down at least 12", you could make the wall long enough to accommodate the fridge, wall oven, and landing space between. With the clean-up zone on the short leg of the L, the existing windows wouldn't need to be altered, and you'd have sufficient prep space between the sink and range/cooktop:

Click to enlarge.

Another idea.

I couldn't fit a 36" range.

I have just a 15" wide cab b/w the oven/micro cab and the range, but if you can remove the wall you may be able to have an 18" one.

On the exterior wall, instead of fillers you can consider using those areas to store cutting boards, trays.

Sussex New Build · More Info

Fridge doesn't have landing space next to it, but you can have something like this.

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