Just think...this is the last part of your winters...soon spring will be there...

:-)

Sam: That's too cold for us. The lowest recorded temperature in Islamabad was probably -2*C. This year, the lowest that we have seen is 2*C. Seeing white mountains around my house early in the morning was therefore a very pleasant surprise. I wouldn't say that Islamabad is tropical because in tropics, temperatures rarely come below 15*C. I hope and pray that you get over your cold / flu soon. I think the ordeal that Straw has been through is enough guidance for us and I have decided that I will never take a flu shot, come what may.

Jess: Other than the highways which are much better constructed, smaller roads in mountains in Pakistan are actually quite scary. Few photos.....

This is the only road going to Shimshal Valley which is a very remote area. Only one vehicle can move at a time on this road at most places and if there is another vehicle coming from front than one of the vehicles has to move in reverse gear till they find a place wide enough to allow crossing of two vehicles at one time. These are really dangerous roads where one not only needs driving skills but also lot of patience.This is what I am talking about. This village track is actually quite wide. There are others which are much less wide. But even on this track, two vehicles can't cross at most places. However, the advantage is that population is very less and everyone knows everyone. So nobody minds stopping his vehicle and making it convenient for the other to pass. Guests however sometimes do not understand this culture.

This photo was taken from air. A road and a river flowing down. Just imagine if the vehicle goes off the road??? However, this road is quite wide and not dangerous.

This is mighty Indus River. KKH is moving on right side of the river while a smaller village road (most probably a shingled one) is on the left size of the river.

KKH, though very well constructed and quite wide, passes through very dangerous places with no room for error. A mistake means the vehicle disappearing into the mighty Indus River which flows very fast and is very deep too. Vehicles that fall into the river, in most cases, can't be recovered and most of the times, there are no survivors.

Another view of KKH with a smaller village road in the right bottom.

A typical mountain village and the valley behind it with a road leading to the farthest village in the valley.

A typical village road originating from a main road in Skardu Valley

Look at this winding road.

Few more of village roads

Some of them are quite scary but when one gets used to them, one starts enjoying the ride. Of course one has to remember always that there is hardly any room for error here. What I like most about these small mountain roads is the ultimate reward that one get in the shape of reaching a place which is unique and spectacular.

Khalid: Those roads on high mountains look scary like "rock climbing with a car" !! We went through winding roads up the mountain when we traveled from Saigon, VN, to the resort Da Lat up high. The mountains in VN are black dirt, with lots of overhanging trees. It was fun to have the trees scraped off the top of the car. It was thrilling to see the depth below.

We traveled before 1975, when there were communists. Our biggest worry was the communists would jump out of the jungle to ambush our car. Terror from man is worse than nature. Khalid: how safe are those mountains politically? Thanks for the info.

Straw: All the photos that you see in this thread are from Gilgit Baltistan region of Pakistan which is an absolutely safe area. No political problems. The problematic mountainous region was FATA (Federally Administered Tribal Area) which is entirely a different zone and at least 600 km away from these mountains.

Yes, mountain roads do look scary. But they look far more scary when you see them from a distance (as shown in these pics). When one is travelling on these roads, they don't feel that scary somehow. That has been my experience and I have travelled a lot on these roads.

just found a quote that desrcibes the blue in your photo's so well...

from the book: Midnight’s Children by Salman Rushdie

‘the blue of Kashmiri sky, which sometimes leaks into eyes’

Khalid, these are such amazing photo's and such an amazingly beautiful place! I would LOVE to stay in one of those smaller villages, secluded from all man's horror's, where everyone knows and respects each other and nature....what a delightful journey, I was so happy to see more posts of your travels!

The small roads seen from the air are like snakes moving across the landscape...and yes, I see now that you also have some very dangerous roads there...

thanks so much for posting these lovely photo's!

Are you all cozy and warm in North America?

Straw, how scary is that - having to travel knowing Communists can jump on you from nowhere and perhaps even capture you, or kill your whole family!

Jess: I'm OK in Chicagoland, all white with snow .. our electric & internet cables are buried underground, so we are safe here. All white & gray sky, haven't seen the sun for days !!

The east coast where Sam lives might be worse. Sam is in the state of New York. My sister is also in New York, and she has zero electricity due to bad snow-storm. My sister in Connecticut (next to New York): her internet & phone is down.

so glad to hear that your'e okay Straw!!!!!!!

I hope Sam and everyone else are okay where there is no electricity! Good reason to stay in bed :-)

Jess: I also wish many times that I get an opportunity to permanently live in an isolated far flung village.

Something like this. This is Sharda village in Neelum Valley. I visited this area in 2012 with my family and my son Haider took this photo. Located on the banks of Neelum River, Sharda is a very fascinating place.... just out of this world. Sharda is around 6500 ft above sea level (asl)This is Minimerg village in Astore District. Height is 9500 ft and that is the reason you see very few trees in the area. Most trees can't grow at this height, only a few pines can and of course the remarkable Paper Tree (Betula utilis) that can grow up to 12000 ft. I haven't seen any large size tree growing at that height. This is village Thali in the picturesque Minimerg Valley in the Himalayan Region. Mountains in Himalayan Region get lot of rainfall during summers and heavy snow during winters; hence so much greenery. Thali village is a very remote and far flung area and is linked with mainland Baltistan for only 5 months (June to September) as the only route to this area passes through 13500 ft high Burzil Pass which remains closed due to heavy snow from Oct to May. Not many people visit this area and therefore, the people here live in a primitive way. Their houses are made of wooden logs. People here are not very educated but very simple, straightforward with good heart.

A few km ahead of Thali village is the fascinating Domel Lake. I have posted this picture earlier as well but can't resist posting it again. This photo was taken by my youngest son.

for me............Time stops on Domel Lake

In the next post, I will post wild roses and other flowers found in the area of Domel Lake and Burzil Pass.

That last pic. is spectacular, I'll use as my screen-saver to remind me that God is powerful in His creation. Thank you !! Your son Haider takes really good pics.

This last one is my favorite picture of Khalids . They are all really good. I am glad it is safe there in Karakorum. I found Burzil pass on the map but Google doesn't label the Lakes. It is so remote.

How utterly beautiful thanks for these photo's and their descriptions Khalid....How I wish I could stay there, in one of those remote villages! I agree with Straw - the photo of the mountain reminds me of the power and beauty of God...

Looking forward to more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this thread always lifts my spirit and make me smile deep inside...

I just watched the movie Everest. Nice scenery. It was about the season of 1996. I like to watch all the movies about Hiking climbing K2 and Everest.

Straw: This photo stayed on my desktop for six months and has now been replaced with a new one. It's a great click and surprisingly taken by my youngest son Wajeeh who is 16. He doesn't know much about photography but he managed to capture this and myself and Haider find it hard to produce a photo of this quality.

Sam: This lake is in Himalayan region. There are three major mountain ranges in Pakistani north. Himalayas, Karakoram and Hindukush. Himalayan Range is the biggest, starts in Nepal, passes through India & China, enters into Indian Occupied Kashmir, then Pakistani Kashmir and finally ends in mainland Pakistan. It's around 2400 km long, gets lot of rains and the mountains & valleys are lush green.

Out of 14 Eight Thousanders in the world (peaks over 8000 M or 26,247 ft), 10 are in Himalayan Range and 4 are in Karakoram Range. One of the 10 eight thousander in Himalayan Range is in Pakistan, ie, Nanga Parbat. Remaining 9 are in Nepal. All four eight thousanders in Karakoram Range are in Pakistan.

Karakoram Range is almost entirely in Pakistan with a small portion in China and India. Karakoram Range is a high altitude desert and is around 500 km in length. It hardly rains there and therefore, mountains are generally brown in colour. Overall, the valleys of Karakoram Range at an average are higher than Himalayan Range. K2 is the highest peak in Karakoram at 8611 M or 28251 ft. Many of the biggest glaciers outside polar region are found in Karakoram Range.

Hindukush is the third range which originates in Gilgit region and goes westwards into Afghanistan and Tajikistan, around 800 km in length. It is relatively lower in height than Himalayas and Karakorm but much higher than most other ranges in the world with a good number of peaks over 20000 ft, highest being Tirch Mir at 7708 M (25289 ft). Hindukush is also a relatively dry range with greenery in those valleys only which have abundant water. Mountains are mostly dry but valleys are greener because of water from natural springs and glaciers.

The place where these the great mountain ranges of the world meet is a little short of Gilgit city, the capital of Gilgit Baltistan Region.

So to sum up the difference...

Himalayan Range Lot of rain, lot of snow in winters, very green, huge pine forests

Karakoram Range Hardly any rain in summers, snow in winters (less than Himalayas), brown and black granite mountains

Hindukush Range Medium rainfall, lot of snow in winters, relatively more greener than Karakoram but less than Himalayas, pine forests at few places.

You can see a lot of clips about these great mountain ranges on the youtube.

Straw: Have a look at the photo of rivers. This was last summers and during summers, all these rivers in Pakistani mountains have muddy water. During winters, they are emerald green or blue in colour. This is the source of River Soil that I talked about in another thread. Millions of tons of soil is brought by these rivers from the mountains and gets deposited in the plain areas, forming the fertile plains of Punjab and Sind areas. This soil, basically coming from the glaciers, is very rich in minerals, containing all macro and micro elements in abundance and has a fluffy texture. This is the soil I use in my pots.

Khalid: Really like this thread, and how you organize the info. on the mountain-ranges. I learn geography, geology, and about the earth from this thread. THANK YOU.

We are so small, like tiny ants, compared to these VAST mountains. That's what really matter in life: Pay respect to our Powerful God who made these mountains which last forever ... rather than fragile stuff that we accumulate.

We are like dust, here today, gone tomorrow. Growing up with 8 older sisters .. I used to let what people say bother me, but after seeing these HUGE POWERFUL mountains, what people say or think doesn't matter .. Reality is what God created, which stand for centuries.

Thanks Khalid, that's really well written. I like that Its put in your words instead of me reading it somewhere. It was so nice to hear about the three mountain ranges and learn all about them. I would love to get some rivers oil that's the best. In the movie symphony of soil it showed how the huge glaciers grind the rock.

A Friday night treat! thanks Khalid. This is so much better than a movie!

That river soil sounds fantastic.. you are so fortunate to have that for your roses and garden....

when I look at these mountains, none of my human problems matter anymore, they disappear, become meaningless...small, as they really are...

http://edition.cnn.com/2016/02/02/travel/zenith-irfan-pakistan-motorcycle-girl/index.html

I found this news about a girl motorbiking through Pakistan, having read your descriptions and the photo's you and your sons posted made this story so much more interesting than it would have been without that.

Straw wrote: "We are like dust, here today, gone tomorrow. Growing up with 8 older sisters .. I used to let what people say bother me, but after seeing these HUGE POWERFUL mountains, what people say or think doesn't matter .. Reality is what God created, which stand for centuries."

So true. I have always believed that He was always there and will always remain. We, His creations, will come and go with time but for Him, there is no time. Time is His creation..... He is eternally there.

Sam: River soil is a blessing for us. It contains everything and has a very good texture. I am so glad you like the pics of these mountains. Quoting a few links from youtube which might tell you more about the area that I love so much and keep getting back to it again and again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_n3Cyu_ngwU These guys are doing skiing in the Skardu area, mostly in the Himalayan range. Karakoram mountains are too steep and dangerous for skiing at most places.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0pPhTLvzu4 This small clip describes the tragedy of 2008 when 11 climbers died in one day. Every fourth mountaineer attempting has not been able to come back alive, unfortunately. This makes K2 the most dangerous and deadliest mountain in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3stHtVh9jM Photos of Northern Areas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOZZmiNZGOs This is just a compilation of photos with a very moving song.... you won't understand it but you will be able to read the translation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXKNc_KsxRQ Deosai Plains.... one of the most fascinating places in the world. At 14000, it's a plains ground of 60 km x 40 km size. I visited it first time in 1991 and last in Aug 2015, many times inbetween. No where in the world have I seen so many wild flowers growing at one place and of course it is home to the Himalayan Brown Bear.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygV22lvK3wE This is not about Northern Areas but about Islamabad, city where I live. The National Park, called Margalla Hills National Park is located just 600 M away from my home. It just takes a 10 minutes walk to reach the foothills and enter the park, however, the park is huge. Unfortunately, the park is so close to the city that lot many people have started visiting it and are spoiling the natural ecosystem.... very unfortunate.

Enough for the next few days I guess....

best regards

Jess: Thanks for the video. Had known about Zenith Irfan's travels but never saw this movie clip. Great to see a heart that yearns for wilderness....

Less the first photo (which is of a wild rose too but from another area), all photos have been taken in the area of the beautiful Domel Lake shown in above post and are of wild flowers.

Huge size bushes of Rosa webbiana grow wild up to the height of 12500 ft.

And here are few more wild rose photos.....

These were small size roses (around 2 ft high) with a linseed oil like fragrance that has a ting of old rose fragrance too. These small bushes with beautiful single flowers can be seen growing everywhere.

Few more wild flowers...

Surprisingly, most of these wild flowers were fragrant, perhaps all of them had some fragrance whereas we see that most of their hybridized cousins are non-fragrant

how lovely.... Khalid, you've been to places others can only dream about...thank you so much for sharing this with us...

I adore those wild roses and flowers... I can sense the cool fresh air you must have experienced when taking these photo's...

This is what I would like my garden to be like...wild flowers growing between the roses... just like in heaven itself...

Were there any wild animals around here?

Jess: Most of these flowers were fragrant and there were so many of them growing everywhere that the air was perfumed. Let me tell you that the perfumed atmosphere of these high altitude valleys is absolutely intoxicating. It's a perfume far different from any artificial perfume that I have ever smelled. It's hard to describe but it's intoxicating.

As for the wild animals, there are many. Himalayan Brown Bear, Leopards, Snow Leopards are there but live deep inside jungles. Then there are Ibex, Markhor, Blue Sheep, Marcopolo Sheep, Musk Deer and Urial also. Blue Sheep, Marcopolo Sheep and Himalayan Ibex live on high barren mountains (10000-18000 ft). Markhor lives a little low (6000-11000 ft). Musk Deer lives in thick jungles upto 10000 ft. Than there are many types of pheasants, partridges and grouse and a large variety of birds and reptiles. In rivers and lakes there are many types of fish including the local snow carp (many species) and introduced Brown and Rainbow Trout. Lot of wild life....

BTW, did you the movie clips posted in the above post. Many of your questions will be asked there, specially about wild life and plants.

best regards

I watched all the videos, starting with Jess' video of the girl who biked .. that song sung by a female was beautiful, and it's an exciting motorcycle-ride through majestic mountains. I really like Pakistan songs & elegant dialect ... at first I thought it was French.

Khalid: I watched all of links .. really like the you-tube of Gilgit Baltistan, with 27,226 views. That's the best travel-show ever, the music (sung by a guy) is absolutely moving .. I don't understand the words but that guy has a beautiful voice, and the sceneries are fun: how people dress, what they eat, the fruits they pick, and the awesome mountains & lakes.

Thank you for those special wild-flowers .. Amazing that they have fragrance too. The last flower with white cluster reminds me of the white jasmine flowers in Vietnam.

Straw: Thanks for liking the clips. Yes the song is very moving.... very nice poetry and if you see at the bottom of the screen than you would see the translation in English.

Fragrant flowers in the wild.... that's true. Actually, I have found most flowers in the wild to be fragrant. The number of non-fragrant wild flowers is actually less. Now if you see these flowers, these are wild roses, campanula, Aquilegia, Astilbe, blue bells etc. Almost all were fragrant if I correctly recall though few had strange fragrance, unlike usual flowers. However, the hybrids of these wild flowers are mostly non-fragrant. Perhaps somewhere during hybridization..... fragrance gets lost. There are numerous bulbs that grow wild in these areas like tulips, mascari, gladioli, hyacinths, Narcissus, Lilium and so many other. These wild bubls are not as showy as their hybrid off springs, actually quite simple looking, however, surprisingly most of them are fragrant too. There is a fascinating array of wild flowers and herbs in these mountains of Northern Pakistan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpzi6kXiOR8

What you saw so far was the fascinatingly beautiful Northern Pakistan and Islamabad, the posh capital city where rich people live. Here is the other face of the coin..... a video made by members of England cricket team who are playing a match in Multan, a city in central Pakistan. The movie shows the cricket team as well as the life in the slums and small streets in the downtown Multan...... the real life style of the common man in Pakistan. If you compare this with the movie on Islamabad, you would see the difference. The difference in rich and poor in Pakistan is getting too big which is not good..... not at all good.

Khalid I like the Videos!!!

Wow , nowhere in the American media do the show how nice Pakistan is. I like the Heliski one . and the Deosai one is ok. My favorite is the Margalla Hills National Park. What a great capital city to have a park as grand as Margalla Hills. That one is closest to the terrain in the Adirondacks and Lake George. My brother has a wild rose at his house that looks just like that. I'm trying to recreate it at my house.

Thanks Khalid!

I spent the day with my brother Saturday driving along the Hudson River in the Adirondacks.

This is the falls under the bridge where the Hudson River comes 50 miles through the high peaks in the Adirondack Park and meets the great Sacandaga lake and river and becomes the big Hudson River that goes 500 miles to NewYork City. The Hudson River is mostly frozen for about 200 miles south of us that is where the bald eagles float on the ice chunks to look for fish. Where the river goes to not being frozen over. New York has more bald eagles than any other state second to Alaska.

Sam: The last photo is absolutely fascinating. I bet this river will have trout.....

As for Margalla Hills National Park, it's boundary starts just 600-800 meters from my house. I live just in the foothills of Margalla.

The wild rose that you see in the pics is Rosa webbiana. One is a tree like bush whereas the other is miniature. Same habitat, similar flowers, similar scent, lot of difference in the size of the bush and leaves. One in first photo is a tree while the second one is like 2-3 feet tall and leaves are small. Actually more like a patio rose.

Sam: Nice creek pic .... looks like the weather warmed up for you? That's the 1st time I see pics. of Hudson River. I miss those tall pine-trees in your pics .. they were in Michigan, but not in Chicagoland.

Khalid: you saved the best for last: those wild-flowers are so precious ... like gemstones. I hope that you re-post those wild-flowers pics in a new thread, so I can admire them again. You have a very good camera that can capture every detail of those tiny beauties.

Thanks Khalid, I didn't watch the movies because I try to save my data bundles to do my work, and YouTube chomps that up quickly...but I viewed the pictures in Google images, and although Multan is a poorer city it still has so much beauty.

I agree, the rich are getting richer and the inequality is getting worse world-wide, creating so many problems, so much people go to bed hungry (and angry, and sad...) everyday.

I found this article while searching for news on this topic: (which means the rich are cutting of their own noses, because there will come a day when their money simply evaporates

http://qz.com/527276/raghuram-rajan-on-the-dangers-of-the-rich-getting-richer/

http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/American-middle-class-is-hollowed-out-while-rich-6690227.php

http://www.catholic.org/news/national/story.php?id=65879

http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/data-mine/2015/12/10/the-middle-class-is-shrinking-and-the-rich-are-getting-richer-pew-report-says

there are so many articles on this topic.

this is also creating revolutions, wars, horror, in short....

I wish I could smell those wild flowers in that heaven high up in the mountains of Pakistan! maybe one day there will be a way to share fragrances on the internet :-)

Samuel, where you stay is also absolutely beautiful! wow....I love bald eagles - here we call them Fish Eagles...their song. the sound they make takes you up to heaven....

we only have one pair here, and I believe they stay in Knysna, and travel over here via a strong wind stream, and it probably only takes them at the most 2 hours....

It's been 4 days Khalid... I'm checking for new posts here every day....can't wait to see more of your amazing journeys...

Jess: Khalid is a busy man, he's working full-time, plus hunting trips on weekends, plus travelling world-wide, plus he's looking for a new house. I really appreciate Khalid's spending time with us, and blessing this forum for generations with fantastic pics & sharing his travels and roses with us.

I pray for Khalid and his family daily .. that God keeps his family safe in Pakistan. God keeps my Mom safe for 90 years .. she's a giver like Khalid and blessed many people.

I know, yes, I can just imagine how busy Khalid must be right now :-) I'm just looking forward to his wonderful rose-and-travel posts :-)

but I agree with you Straw...the world is becoming a dangerous place... I pray for everyone I am blessed to know in this wonderful forum...

Straw and Jess: Thanks for your concern and extra kind words which I perhaps don't deserve. I am absolutely humbled.

Coming back after 5 days of traveling in Azad Jammu & Kashmir area (AJ&K). I have taken lot of photographs, many of them from air, giving a good all round view of the area. Will be editing the photos and post them here. Stay tuned.

Once again, thanks for your prayers

best regards

Few photos from Jhelum River Valley in AJ&K. This valley was almost completely destroyed in earthquake on 8 Oct 2005. Most of the houses were demolished and in this valley alone, over 46000 people died. It was a very very tragic incident of our history...

Most houses that you see on the mountains have been rebuilt in the past 10 years. Other than the Govt of Pakistan which is the main contributor, many other countries financially helped Pakistan to rehabilitate the area and that has been done very well. Building however can be rebuilt and can even look more beautiful than the previous one but lives lost can't be reclaimed. May God bless the souls of all who died in this tragedy. These photos therefore have a sentimental value as well and keeps reminding us of the tragic incident. The life however moves on and live nations should take it that way.

Some of the photos have been taken from the air, others mostly from the vehicle while it was moving. That has compromised the quality of photos as many of them have been taken from behind the window glass. So please overlook the ordinary quality of some of the photos.

Jhelum River Valley gets quite wide at places. Jhelum River flows through it all the way. Locals do their farming by making terraces on the undulating / rising ground. Villages like one shown in the above photo show the resilience of the local how they have rebuilt their homes.

What you see in the photo is the worst look in the entire year when the mountains are brown. The green fields that you see is wheat crop. In April, these mountain will start turning lush green and by July, mountain will have a colour closer to the wheat fields. This area is not very high and the valley height here is around 3500 ft with the mountains reaching up to 12000 ft. The mountains visible in this photos may be around 7000-8000 ft. Please note how terraces have been developed.

On the right side is the main road. See the isolated houses on the mountain. This brown mountain will be lush green in summers. Look how some of the houses have been built high up on the mountain. Many of them are the summer residences of the locals when the go up where better grazing grounds can be found. Many of them are permanently occupied too. And the river runs through it.....

Few more terraces, all planted with wheat.

Look at this village. Doesn't it look fascinating.... Actually these are more than one village. This a small valley on the side that joins the mean Jhelum Valley. It would be lush green in two months.

This is Bagh Valley, a valley adjacent to Jhelum Valley. A forest fire in the mountains has filled the valley with suspended smoke. Taken from aircraft. Another view of the Bagh Valley. Bagh in Urdu language means a garden. This valley is summers is just like a huge mountainous garden. This valley had houses scattered on the mountains, some of them very isolated. Many of these isolated houses are the summer residences of the locals. Most of them have two houses.... one in the valley at lower heights where it isn't that cold. They spend winters there. One high up on the mountains where they graze their herds and grow their crops.

This year we had very little snow. Normally, during this part of the year, all these mountains would be white with snow. The snow clad peaks that you see in the rear are 11000-12000 ft while mountains in the foreground are up to 8000 ft. The valley height is around 4500-5000 ft.

Stay tuned. More to come.......

Few more photos of an area which is higher in elevation than the previous area and is much cooler. This area get 12-15 feet of snow every winters but this winter their is hardly 1-2 feet of snow and most mountains facing sun are devoid of snow. Normally, in February, all these mountains would be absolutely white with atleast 8-10 feet of snow.

Just to give you an idea, the peak is 11000 ft and I am taking this photo from 8600 ft. Normally, you won't see a brown patch in this areas during Feb but this year, it is quite brown. Very less snow.

This peak is called Naugazi. Nau means 9 and gaz means a yard. Naugazi would there mean 9 yarder.There is an ancient grave on the top of this mountains (around 10000 ft high) which is 9 yards long. The local legend says that this grave is of a giant which was more than twice the size of normal humans. However, I believe it's a mass grave which might be containing many dead. It has been a tradition in this area during old times to bury all dead in one grave, specially during tribal wars. So much for Naugazi. Most roads, like the one shown here, get blocked during winters due to snow and open up in May / June. Roads in these areas, no matter how well constructed, have to be continuously maintained otherwise they become unusable. There are frequent landslides and rains that erode the roads. This one is perhaps a shingled track of small size, not a black top road.

This is Kotli city, a large size town in AJ&K. Of course, a river runs through it as well. The river is Poonch River and it is famous for its blue water and mighty Himalayan Mahseer fish in it. This area is around 4000 ft high and has a warm weather.

We are coming down to the end of the mountains. This is the last mountain valley in AJ&K, called Bhimber Valley. The height is 1500-2000 ft above sea level. From here onwards, wast fertile plains of Punjab province start. Whether is hot in this valley, may be a shade better than the mainland Punjab which is very hot.

A very interesting view of a village school. May be a primary schools located in the center of wheat fields. The students are sitting on the roof top, enjoying winter sun. Perhaps they are appearing in some examination or may be it is a routine class in the sun. Most of these village schools in the far flung areas do not have heating arrangements and therefore, in full sun, everyone prefers to sit outside. Despite being backward and far flung, these areas have an education rate better than the mainland Pakistan. The education rate in this area is around 80% and women education rate is better than men. It's quite encouraging.

I love mountains and whenever I get an opportunity, I try to go back to them, again and again. They are so majestic and pure that one gets overwhelmed. Far better than the cities......

Thank you for those pics .. I find the pic. with the village-terraces to be fascinating (looking down at those wavy-green fields). I feel very close to God when I see majestic mountains. I like those green & brownish mountains .. less scary than the mountains in Vietnam (black like tar .. kind of spooky).

The mountains you post recently look warmer than the end point of Attabad Lake (way up the thread) where the top is whitish with snow.

It's interesting that the people live at the bottom of the mountains in the winter, then in the summer they grow crops higher up (with a second house). Besides wheat, what other crops can be grown at high altitude? Thanks for the info.

Straw, the mountains shown in earlier posts are from Karakoram Range in the Gilgit Baltistan region. Those areas are much higher in altitude. There, the valley height is 8000-9000 ft with mountains reaching up to 25000 ft. The mountains shown in these pics are in AJ&K region and are basically the outskirts of main Himalayan Range. They receive lot of rain fall, more snow but are less in altitude. Valley height in these pics is from 4000-6000 ft with peaks reaching up to 12000 ft. Mountains in Jhelum Valley are mostly limestone which are sedimentary rocks whereas mountains in Karakoram are mainly igneous rocks, granite and dolomite etc. These mountains are sort of soft and kind looking..... those are harsh, unforgiving but majestic mountains.

As for people going to summer homes, it is not to grow wheat alone. First, most of them own just a house in a village or town located at lower heights next to a major road but do not own agricultural / grazing land. Few of them are lucky to hold sizeable land at lower heights also but most get it high up in the mountains. Secondly, higher areas have big natural grazing areas where the animals eat herbs / grasses free of cost and gain good weight during summers. If they keep these animals at lower altitudes (which they perforce have to during winters) than they will have to spend a lot on feeding them.

Straw: If you google areas with the name of Muzaffarabad, Garhi Dopatta, Bagh, Chakar, Sudhan Gali, Hattian Bala, Kotli and Bhimber than you will see the areas that are shown in the photos above.

best regards

wow Khalid, this is unreal - you live in such a beautiful country! Thank you so much for these photo's and facts about them. the rivers that run through these villages are so beautiful....

those houses are built so high, how do people travel there?

yes, the earthquakes tragedy killing 46000 people is very sad... how terrible that must have been...but how resilient the people of your country are, rebuilding their houses so fast and even better than before...the school and the children sitting in the sun is new to me...children behaving so well..so respectfully...

Do you think the less snow is because of what we as people do to the earth, creating more and more heat with our emissions? or could it be a natural cycle that happens once in every few years?

about the giants.. I think that there really could have been giants (on all continents) in ages long past... people and animals were larger than they are now, very long ago, and there are quite a few sites with good info on 'giants'...but just as many false claims as well of course... I read a book about someone claiming the Aborigine tribes insist there were giants in Australia...

I googled giants in the Bible, and found these verses in the Old Testament: 9 cubits is 13 feet, or 4.2 meters.

"Numbers 13:33 - And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, [which come] of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

Deuteronomy 3:11 - For only Og king of Bashan remained of the remnant of giants; behold, his bedstead [was] a bedstead of iron; [is] it not in Rabbath of the children of Ammon? nine cubits [was] the length thereof, and four cubits the breadth of it, after the cubit of a man.

Deuteronomy 2:21 - A people great, and many, and tall, as the Anakims; but the LORD destroyed them before them; and they succeeded them, and dwelt in their stead: Deuteronomy 2:11 - Which also were accounted giants, as the Anakims; but the Moabites call them Emims.

I know one thing that those Mahseer fish are giants. Great pictures Kahlid.

and then massive floods came and erased all of our ancient history...

Straw: Thanks for the verses on giants. In various areas of Pakistan, people have strong believe that once upon a time, there used to be giants living around. However, many people do not include them amongst humans.... they think they were genes or some other creatures, not humans.

These are the photos of Deosai Plains. Deo means a Giant (from genes, not humans) and sai means land. Deosai means Land of the Giants. Located at 14000 ft above sea level, it's a strip of 60km x 40km and one of the highest plateaus in the world. As per the local legend, once upon a time giants used to live here. Deosai plains remain under snow for around eight months and remain open only from June to September. During these 4 months, millions of wild bulbs and flowers grow here. Most of them are fragrant which leaves Deosai travellers with an intoxicating feels. One loses sense of time when your are sitting in a huge natural grassy lawn just next to a crystal clear stream amongst thousand of wild bubls with intoxicating fragrance. BTW, ancestors of many of the bulbs that we grow in our houses grow here.

Deosai is a national park and therefore, no construction is allowed here. What you can see here is just a few kiosks that are established during tourist season. It is also home to the Himalayan Brown Bear.

Khalid: So nice to see vast land, and mountains (with no human-stuff). I like your pics' open-space since it's so crowded where I am. When people refer to giants, perhaps they mean dinosaurs? When I see those vast-mountains, I realize that the earth has PLENTY of minerals to grow plants .. we don't need chemicals made from a factory to grow plants.

Why can't we trust in what God made to grow plants? Why do we have to make our own second-rated chemicals, which caused many explosions at nitrogen-fertilizer-plants, killing workers ?? I ask myself, why I didn't trust my immune system that God made me with? Why did I pay $14 for man-made flu-shot with artificial inserted virus strains ... which made me sick plus tons of medical bills? Reminds me of Proverbs from the Bible: Proverbs 3:5-6

Trust in the Lord with all your heart
and lean not on your own understanding;
in all your ways submit to him,
and he will make your paths straight.

Absolutely true Straw. Absolutely true

Straw, I have wondered about these things too. My compost pile seems to attract so much life. And then I spread it in the garden and there is so much going on.

What a beautiful country, such amazing and huge areas that are protected from man. that is wonderful to see Khalid.... Clean water is something alien here, rivers and nature that is protected...

Yes Samuel isn't that stunning... things we as humans can't see or understand, but so powerful...

I agree Straw...each grain of chemical is like a tiny bomb....

I just reread this whole thread...again...and enjoyed it even more than the first (few) times...thanks for this magic Khalid!

looking forward to more on your amazing travels...but only after your spring roses have been taken care of :-)

Valrose: Hope you would enjoy going through this thread.

best regards

I enjoy seeing those mountains & and the precious little wild-flowers .. the small things contain just as much beauty as the large scenery.