Sgreer13, thank you for the response! It sounds like your mandarins are doing well!

I believe that I read somewhere that yellowing leaves are common after repotting and fairly normal so I am not as worried about my trees with the yellowing leaves. The weird thing about the tango is that there aren't any yellowing leaves at all, just major droopiness!

I have thought that the problem most likely has something to do with watering, but I have watered all the trees at the same time each time I water. So maybe the Tango is just more sensitive to being watered? The soil less mix is very fast draining so I water them almost every day. Especially since I did root trim and the roots are mostly close to the top of the pot where it dries out the fastest.

I haven't tested the soil for nutrients (I don't really know how) but I used Osmocote plus in the mix and I have started to add a little bit of foliage pro in their water once a week.

I have a moisture meter that also measures light and ph and the ph seems pretty high to me, so that could be my problem? The ph is above 7 on all the trees. I don't know how accurate those meters are. When I test the ph of the water though it is more acidic, I think between 5 and 6. I have thought about adding vinegar to the water to try and help bring the ph down.

I am sad because before the re pot, the Tango was the healthiest looking tree, but now it looks the saddest.

As long as the leaves dont fall off I would just keep monitoring it. If the water is pH 5-6 I think you are good. You can add some baking soda to your water after it runs out and see how it reacts and then add baking soda to vinegar to see how it reacts (vinegar is pH 1-2). It sounds like they are getting plenty of nutrients

Thanks again sgreer13! Admittedly I do not know a whole lot about pH. That sounds like a good idea to add baking soda to the water run off and also to vinegar to compare. I know the reaction of baking soda and vinegar - should I be looking for a reaction that is similar but on a lesser scale since the water obviously won't be anywhere near as acid as the vinegar? Thanks!!

Exactly! if you are concerned that your meter is not accurate then this is a kind of common sense check

This looks familiar to what happened to two of my kumquats trees in 5:1:1. For whatever reason the 5:1:1 mixture I created didn't seem to retain enough water to combat the dry climate. Soon after potting their leaves began to droop, then curl, and eventually fell off. After reading a lot of posts on the forum, I decided to go with a modified 5:1:1 recipe that Patty S. suggested which retains a bit more water. Both kumquats, once repotted into that mixture, made a full recovery. Some folks claim that in repotting into 5:1:1 soils one has to be careful not to create "air pockets" which can deprive the roots of water. In my case, I couldn't seem to find any air pockets by prodding around, but I could see how this would be an issue. I'd check try to see if you have any air pockets then maybe go from there.

Zach

Zach thanks for the suggestion! I just found it so weird that they are all planted in the same mix but that this poor tree has been doing badly since day one. I may pull the tree out and attempt to re pot it again making sure that there aren't any air pockets. I could probably add some organic material to the mix like peat moss too (my mix is bark, DE, and perlite) but I just wasn't sure if maybe the drooping leaves are a sign of over watering, or having the tree be too wet, in which case I wouldn't want to add anything to the mix.

I have heard of people soaking their pots by submerging them in water for a few hours - do you think this might help the mix settle if there are air pockets? Would it do any long term damage to the tree if the actual problem is too much moisture? Thanks a lot, I am grateful for your advice Zach, as you live pretty close and experience a similar climate!

It's tricky with watering as you know many of the symptoms of overwatering can look like that of underwatering (as the roots are simply not delivering moisture/nutrients to the leaves). From my understanding, overwatering a 5:1:1 soil mixture isn't too easy as the drainage on these types of soils are quite good (which is why people use them as they take the guesswork out of the watering). More often than not (from what I've read on the forum) the wilting of leaves in 5:1:1 mixtures results from inadequate water making it to the roots or from air pockets. Let's see if we can troubleshoot this. Here are some questions I can think of that could also lead to issues:

1. Did you bareroot the trees (remove all existing soil) before planting in your 5:1:1?
   2. Do you saturate the 5:1:1 soil when watering? (Then fertilize afterwards)
   3. If you prod the soil with a stick, will the soil sink (an indication of an air pocket)?

I'm not sure if submerging would help. I guess it could, but air pocket could also fill with water temporarily and then drain out again too. It depends on the structural integrity of the air pocket. Perhaps repotting, by carefully adding 2-3" layers of soil and soaking after adding each layer might minimize the potential of air pockets. At least you could see what is happening as far as the roots interactions with the soil. It'd be easier to monitor. Once you get it planted and the tree recovers you should be good to go for at least a little while.

Zach

Hey Zach, I think you are probably right. It doesn't really make sense that I would be drowning the tree, especially as I have started watering it every other day to see if it helped but it doesn't look any better while it is receiving less water. I have just heard that drowning a plant can have a worse long term effect than under watering so I was really nervous about drowning it. The more I think about it though, I doubt it is drowning in this mix. And I doubt the effects would appear overnight right after being planted in it.

I am thinking that air pockets may be the culprit. To answer your well thought out questions, yes I did bareroot the trees before putting them in the new mix. I also root pruned them too. I kept dipping the root ball into a bucket of water during the process to keep it as moist as possible. I don't think I took quite as much off the root ball on the Tango tree as I did the others, but maybe about 1/4 of the root ball. (The others I probably took off 1/3.) The 5:1:1 mix was very wet when I potted them to try and reduce the likelyhood of air pockets, but I very well could have inadvertently created some air pockets, as this was my first time ever doing anything like this.

Your second question has me thinking because I don't know if I saturate the soil enough when I water. I have been trying to focus on keeping the top wet (which is why I am watering almost every day right now) since the majority of the roots are located near the top of the soil after trimming them. I water about 1/2 gallon each tree. They are in like 5.5-7.5 gallon pots. Does it seem like I should be more fully saturating them with every watering? And I may be fertilizing incorrectly because I usually just mix the fertilizer in with their regular water (1/2 tsp. per gallon of foliage pro) I haven't been watering them before giving the fertilizer water but would be happy to do so if that is what I am supposed to do!

And your last question- I will try to prod the soil with a stick and see what happens! I have pushed on the soil with my palms and didn't notice sinking but a stick will be better. And your advice for the re pot is good, I think I might try to do it tomorrow, and then should I start the 1-2 weeks shade regimen again? Thank you for giving me a lot to think about!

If you heavily root pruned this may be the plants normal reaction. I agree that you should ensure there are no air pockets.

I have a Washington navel in 511 and I think it is unlikely you are over watering it. I like soaking my tree in a bucket of water for several hours to ensure the bark gets soaked. If you don't want to soak it pour several gallons of water through the pot slowly then fertilize. I wouldn't do anything to the roots at this time or you might set it back more. Air pockets will only set it back temporarily until new roots grow. One last thing, keep your trees out of the wind until they get totally adapted to the new environment, wind will dry them out fast. Getting your trees into the 511 is the best thing you could of did for them, Jack

Thank you sgreer and jack! I think maybe I will try to soak the tree before doing another re pot. I am thinking now that the tree probably needs water pretty badly so I don't think it would hurt to soak it. Then if it doesn't improve in a week or two then maybe I will re pot as a last resort.

Would you recommend that I also soak my other trees as well? I think their signs of transplant shock are more normal. All of them just have a small amount of yellowing leaves and leaf drop. The more mature leaves are the ones that are being lost on them but the growth that popped up a few weeks before the re potting is looking pretty perky.

Thank you for the advice about wind also. It isn't normally very windy here but we have been having weird weather lately. I have been bringing the trees inside or on to our patio on the very windy days. There was one horrible day though that I was out of the house when the wind picked up (trees were on the patio) and my Oroblanco uprooted and fell over due to the wind. It was so awful. I believe it was only uprooted for about 10-15 mins when I found it. I quickly potted it again and then pruned off at least a foot in height so that it wouldn't be so top heavy and also so that it could focus on healing more than those branches. I thought it was going to be a goner but that happened over a week ago and it seems to be doing the same as before the incident!

Emily, I'd try saturating first with water. The idea is when you water these trees you really want to soak them then let soil dry out a bit. The drying prevents soil fungus like phytophoria from attacking your roots. I'd try watering throughly first and see if that makes a difference. Once you water, then fertilize with a FP solution (the dilutions you made sound right). The reverse order will flush out all of the fertilizer. If the leaves start curling I'd really start thinking about repotting, as the tree could die. It's possible when barerooted then potted, some of the roots may have blocked the soil from making a good contact with others roots, hence creating airpockets. Without a good surface area for these roots to interact with the soil, water uptake maybe diminished.

One thought that just crossed my mind: How soon after repotting did the drooping begin? It seems like you really soaked the plant when potting right? If the symptoms began shortly thereafter it might suggest air pockets being the culprit as the soil would still likely be wet through and though. Just a thought.

I hear you on the wind which has been downright nasty here. It blew a whole branch of new growth straight off of one of my trees. We've up to 60 mph gusts over the last few weeks. Needless to say my citrus haven't been happy with then situation.

Good luck restoring health back to your tree!

Zach

Great advice here, Emily.

The truth is, some trees are simply going to show more shock than others.

Hopefully you've done the saturation by now, and then let the containers drain.

I am curious how much Foliage Pro you are adding per week? With my established Citrus, I'm fertilizing at double strength (2 teaspoons per gallon), and they are growing like mad.

Josh

Okay guys I am feeling a little silly now but I am so grateful for all the advice you have given! It is clear to me now that I was starving the tree! I soaked the tree in my kitchen sink for several hours (which only held enough water to keep the bottom of the pot under water, but I feel like I thoroughly saturated the top layers too.) and by the end of the soak, it looks like a whole new tree! I added a gallon of water at the end with about 2 tsp foliage pro mixed in to give it some minerals and now it is just hanging out inside to rest. I feel so bad that I didn't do this sooner.

I am wondering now if you recommend doing this to my other three trees as well? Since they have all been getting water on the same timetable as this tree they may be dehydrated as well?

I am also wondering what to do if the leaves begin to droop again... Would that indicate that there may be an air pocket that was temporarily filled by the soak?

Zach - so sorry to hear that you guys are having this crazy wind as well. It is not fun at all!! That is horrible about your poor tree that was damaged :(

Josh, thanks for the comment! How much FP do you recommend right now since the trees were just re potted about 3 weeks ago? I have been doing 1/2 tsp. per gallon once a week, but was just adding the FP to their regular water instead of watering then fertilizing. So I will switch that around and see if it helps, but yeah I would like to know if I should be doing a higher ratio of FP when I fertilize or if I should be doing it more than once a week? I am very open to fertilizing advice!! Thanks!

Tango tree right after soaking!

WOW, that's awesome emilygreenie :) . I soak all of my plants, but that isn't for everyone. Jack

Bump up to 1 teaspoon Foliage Pro per week, and see how they respond.

Each week, you could increase a bit. I predict that you'll see almost immediate growth.

Josh

That's awesome Emily! It probably won't loose any leaves either due to being dehydrated. You'll want to let it dry out a bit before the next watering, and then soak again + fertilize... at least that's the routine I've gotten into and seems to work well. Hopefully the soaking got rid of any air pockets if that was the true problem.

I fertilize with about a teaspoon dissolved in one gallon of FP after each watering like Josh is suggesting too. Josh how much FP do you eventually feed your plants?

Zach

I'm feeding them 2 teaspoons per gallon right now. I'll probably stick with that throughout the growing season, and then back off as cooler Winter weather comes along.

Josh

Thanks Josh! I might up my FP dosage.

Thanks guys! Josh I appreciate the fertilizer advice, I will follow it with all of the citrus trees. And Zach thanks for the advice about letting it dry out before the next watering... Before you said that, I watered it again this afternoon, because some of the leaves were starting to droop again. I hope this doesn't mean air pockets in the roots :( I will let it dry out for a couple days at least before watering again, and hope that it does okay!

Hmm...that sounds to me like potential for air pockets. I wouldn't think the soil should dry out all that quickly. It has only been a day since you soaked it the first time, right?

Zach

Yeah it has only been one day! Maybe since I didn't completely submerge the top half of the pot, which is where most of the roots are, that could have something to do with why it dried quickly? It wasn't as droopy as before but definitely more that in was right after the soak. Should I experiment with watering/not watering for a few days to see what happens and then repot if it is doing poorly?

Good morning, Emily.

Try this. In the afternoon, when the plant begins to droop, move it into complete shade. If it perks back up in 15 - 30 minutes, you'll know it doesn't need water...but just needs more time to establish roots in the mix and get back "online," as it were.

Josh

WOW, so much to read. I am TOTALLY NEW to this as I have never planted before so I am barely learning the lingo. Is there a place where I can read on how to care, plant , transport for tangos? I do not want to ruin my first try. If anybody can point me to the right direction. Thanks so much. I just ordered mine from tomorrows harvest website.

Well Tango care and planting is pretty much the same for all citrus, so if I were you I'd spend a lot of time using the search button of this site and read a lot.

But what do you mean by "transport"? Transport of citrus fruit or plants is strictly regulated by state laws as many states have full or partial quarantine of citrus fruit, plants, cutting, etc.

You must tread very carefully there to not break laws put into place to protect the very important citrus crops in many states. People not following proper quarantine laws have put billions of dollars in citrus commerce in jeopardy. Don't be one of them; follow the laws please.

Looks like a typo, I think he meant transplant

For transplants, I inoculate the roots with mycorrhizal fungi. I also add Pro-Tekt silicon supplement to the FP routine (careful with mixing them - do it in order, or else coagulation). These two things have made a big difference in post-transplant vigor, whether up-potting or going into the ground.,