Dawn, I hate to burst your bubble, but Papaver paeoniflorum is just P. somniferum double strains. I've never heard of any old lady yet being harassed for growing them in Arkansas.

Shhhh. I know that but I wasn't going to publicize it. (grin) I generally try to avoid even mentioning P. somniferum online at all as all kinds of people will find that mention through googling and then will come here and make comments that have nothing to do with why we gardeners grow the flowers.

My husband is a police officer and has been for over 30 years, and I agree that most cops don't harass innocent gardeners who grow poppies as ornamentals. But, we know a whole lot of cops, and I know some old stick-in-the-mud types that I think might do that because some of those guys get on ego trips that are totally ridiculous. (My DH does not, but he'd be the first to agree that we know some cops who do.)

If I ever was to grow plain old breadseed poppies, I'd grow them out back where no one would see them as it would be several hundred feet from the roadway, and no one goes back there except us, the deer and the other wild critters.

Every year I see teenagers stop and harvest poppies from the plants growing in our bar ditch. I have no idea if they think the flowers or pretty or if they are hoping to get high, but they will be disappointed. I only grow corn poppies in the bar ditch. Because some teens have used some plant parts from some types of daturas to get high (and even to accidentally kill themselves), I grow those out of sight of passers-by as well. I just don't want to make anything readily available that someone might use to inadvertently harm themselves.

Some folks do improve the gene pool (and win the Darwin Award) by doing things that most of us never would do, but I don't especially want to facilitate it.

I'm not much for taking medications either. I feel like we are putting things in our bodies that we probably shouldn't, and I prefer natural remedies when they are available and they work.

It is unfortunate you cannot grow poppies there. Nothing says spring to me like poppies in bloom. I don't know why more folks don't grow them here. While our place is mostly clay, much of our county has the sandy loam and sugar sand they love, and we are dry a whole lot more than we are wet. I had to reseed the fields after 2011 because the poppies didn't survive the early heat long enough to set seed, and then we went over 100 degrees for about 3 months with no rain, so if they had set seed, I don't know if it would have been viable. I think it might have burnt up. I didn't get results that were as good as I wanted in 2012, so I am overseeding again. I believe I used a quarter-pound of poppy seed in 2012, and it was either the poppy mix or a wildflower mix so there was a lot of California poppy seed in there that didn't do well in the clay. This time I bought a pound of corn poppy seed, so that pasture is going to be filled with poppies this spring and summer, or at least I hope it will be. All I can do is surface sow those tiny seeds and hope nature does the rest.

Take pictures if it works :)

I believe I will because poppies in bloom are just the prettiest thing around.

Now that you mention it, I'd probably be killed by some of the local police even if it weren't that particular variety. Really, I've only been thinking about the locals that it might attract. I've spilled cappuccino while driving away from the store at 2 o'clock in the morning which resulted in a rookie pulling a gun on me - and surprising me with it. It's a wonder he didn't shoot me in the face with the gun pointed at me as I turned around in utter surprise. My surprise could easily have been mistaken for aggression. I still make occasional trips to the convenience store in the wee hours of the morning to have a delicious cappuccino. Stupidity and oppression be damned.

The local DMV placed the wrong tag on Bill's old truck. He drove it for more than fifteen years. But it wasn't until Cushing popo got their new database hooked up and were eager to use it against someone did this discrepancy reveal itself. I happened to be the one driving when it happened. The police officer was clearly on drugs: sweating profusely, highly excited, paranoid, stubborn refusal to accept reality...blah blah. He unholstered his gun as I was getting out of the vehicle. I was eight months pregnant, 1-1/2 blocks from home (and the owner of the truck) and 2 blocks from the bindery that I owned where that exact truck sat six days a week. That scenario was so bad I quit talking as I usually do when engaging a conversation with paranoid and irrationality. I fully expected them to haul me in. Then, Bill walked down to where we were. Everything was fine after that. They know us now. And they've moved next door to us. I have yet to take the kids for a tour.

The city requires we tether the dogs. I don't know exactly why, but we comply. Yet, I cannot keep the dogs in a better place in front of the house by the road. They'd get more attention, be fed and watered more frequently and be happier. People driving buy who disagree with dogs being tether but not understanding the city rules make threatening gestures because our dogs are tethered. This behavior has increased. After a while we placed a legal fire arm near the entrance of our house. It's only a matter of time until one gets out of their vehicle and steps onto the property. People are nuts. Of course, they don't realize I let them off to exercise all the time - if I'm outside to watch them - and I even cook most of their food to avoid cancer-laden dog food.

So, poppies? I'm thinking ... now .... it's probably a thought I should drop entirely.

thanks, Dawn. It was a good idea to start a new thread. I've certainly bookmarked it for later use. I might find a way to grow poppies indoors.

Bon, Most poppies are just fine to grow. It is only the opium poppies that have caused problems for some gardeners in some states, which is ridiculous. Any intelligent person (whether they work in law enforcement or in another field) can tell the difference between a gardener growing flowers for their beauty and a criminal trying to grow poppies in order to produce an illegal substance from them. Why shouldn't someone who bakes their own bread be able to grow breadseed poppies so they can bake poppyseed rolls?

If the thought of growing bread seed poppies makes you fear police harassment, just stick with corn poppies or Oriental poppies or California poppies. Or, grow the Mexican tulip poppies or Prickly Poppies. There's between maybe 70-100 different kinds of poppies and only the P. somniferum poppies are used to produce opiates, so why should all the gardeners of the world shun all the other types of poppies?

There was quite a fuss maybe a decade back when the DEA or the USDA seized a bunch of poppy seeds that T&M was importing into this country to sell as seed of ornamental plants to gardeners. Some retailers, including Thompson & Morgan, responded by dropping the P. somniferum types from their inventory, not because it was illegal to sell them, but because they just didn't want to deal with it. Some of those companies have since resumed selling the seeds. Other companies used some of the "other" names that apply to some of the doubled or fringed-looking named varieties like "Black Swan" that I mentioned, figuring the average cop wouldn't know that Papaver paeoniflorum or Papaver lacinatum was essentially, at least biologically speaking, the same thing as P. somniferum, just with a prettier flower. I have noticed that since that time, fewer people grow poppies than they used to, even though most people seemed to be growing the corn poppies or Oriental poppies which aren't even illegal to grow. I think it likely is a case of people feeling nervous about bringing trouble upon themselves, so they just skip growing poppies. I love my corn poppies, and I love Lauren's Grape, and I'm not giving them up.

Not in Texas P. somniferum is all over the place and in my yard. I think the law was clarified , as I under stand it that growing it is legal but taking a knife, cutting the pod and collecting the sap that forms on the cut is not legal. Major seed companies sell it all over the country. I would love to get some Armenian poppies for next year. They have a beautiful apricot color. It likes a hot dry condition. I do not know if it is a perennial or an annual. Most all poppies are burnt out with the length and strength of a Texas summer. P. teriniifolium is also a Lauren Springer-Ogden favorite mentioned in her book "The Undaunted Garden". Our winter has been wet and that means a good poppy spring in Central Texas,

I an happy to hear that the law has been clarified and that P. somniferum can be grown freely, but I'm not convinced all rural police departments necessarily are up to speed on this issue.

The last time we had a long thread on growing poppies on this forum, we eventually got some inquiries from people who were wanting to grow poppies for illegal purposes and I generally just avoid discussing them for that reason. That was probably 6 to 8 years ago.

Do you have a source for seeds of the Armenian poppies? I think they are beautiful but haven't ever seen the seed listed anywhere. For some reason I have it in my head that they are perennial but I don't know why I think that.

A friend of mine says her mom used to grow a wide variety of poppies of many colors here in OK a long time ago, including orange ones, and she doesn't think they were California poppies because they had better cold tolerance. We've about decided they probably were Alpine poppies. I haven't grown those either, unless they came in a Poppy mix that I bought and sowed here in either 1998 or 1999. That one did have a lot of colors I've never had in a Poppy mix since then. Unfortunately they didn't seed well and come back heavily like many of the other types.

Nothing has given us more garden bang for the buck than poppies. I love them so, but I'm still careful about discussing them too openly. I've seen too many shady-looking characters stop and help themselves to the poppies growing in the front pasture between our house and the road. I don't think they're cutting a bouquet to take home and put in a vase, and seeing them stop and help themselves to flowers they didn't plant and care for sort of irritates me too. I had to promise my DH I wouldn't shoot the people who were stealing my poppies. (If they'd ask, I'd tell them they could cut a bouquet if they wished, but I think I'd also warn them that if they are thinking they'd get high off of corn poppies, they are just wrong about that.)

Drug use is epidemic in my county as are the types of property crimes that support addicts' habits and we are in a fairly remote area, so I am extra cautious about not doing anything that would entice the criminal types to come onto our property. Life here has changed in the last 10 years or so, and not for the better. I don't want someone hanging around thinking they will cut any of my poppies and use them for an illegal purpose, so all my double, peony or carnation type poppies aren't visible from the road. Years ago one of our neighbors warned us we needed to keep our driveway gate closed and locked at all times, which I steadfastly resisted doing for about the first 15 years here. They said we'd have all sorts of potential criminal types lurking about and up to no good, but I didn't really believe them. You know, it isn't that I didn't believe them. I did. I just felt like they were closer to main roads and not as off-the-beaten-path as we were and I thought we wouldn't have the same issues in our more remote area. Lo and behold, they were right and now we keep the driveway gate locked all the time. I don't like it, but I got tired of having strangers creeping me out by roaming around on our property without permission. There is no reason for them to be there and I suspect when I spot them that they are up to no good. So, I just figure that having P. somniferum/paeoniflorum/laciniatum out front to lure in even more of that type of people probably isn't smart in my particular situation. I'd love to have the front pasture filled not only with corn and Oriental poppies but also with all the others, but it isn't likely to happen.

Dawn, wow. I don't think I can move next door to you. I may have to move in. :) I grow papaver s. when I can get them to grow, they are my very favorite poppy. I haven't had any trouble with them legally or with sneaky visitors. I might also grow datura, but I would keep them in the back, not that that would stop anyone who really wanted them, but they would have to know to come look for them.

Your mention of dry sandy soil gives me a very good clue about why they grow so well for you and so not well for me. I spread several, several grams of shirley poppy seeds in the last month. Maybe I will get some this year!

You better include lions tail too. half of africa smokes it . they call it Dagga. and mexican tarragon is smokable. I do not burn it , But I use it in my cooking.. It is just knowledge that WAFTS around. I get so p*ssed that any PLANT is made illegal because we fear . The list is amazing and long . There is a move to make all salvias illegal because one species in the huge family has "qualities" , so they are going to rip out of the ground how many species many of them wild and indigenous... thousands. Talk about a rational act. The salvia forum treat the inquirers with a cold shoulder and tell them to go away when they start asking for it. I ignore it all and grow what I like.

Lisa, Things have changed here. It isn't that the people who live here have changed (all our close neighbors are as wonderful as always)----it is the creepy, thieving, predatory types that prowl every road in our county looking to steal stuff that makes it feel like a different place now. Homes here are spaced out so far apart that we actually can see only one neighboring house from our place, and the house itself is at least 200 yards from our house. If anything happens, here isn't anybody close enough to hear you scream. I'm not paranoid, but I've learned to be very careful. To me, there is no reason to plant flowers in a visible spot if they might attract druggies looking for a quick high. Lots of perfectly good garden plants (poppies and datura are two great examples) can be abused by some people, so I'd rather have those tucked away out of view of the general public.

I sow different kinds of flowers in different kinds of soil. After watching how the wildflowers in our fields ebb and flow in different kinds of soil and different kinds of weather, I have a pretty good feel for what will grow well, but I earned that through a lot of observation and a lot of trial and error. I've actually learned that a lot of plants that "must have" sandy soil will grow pretty well in dry clay, but then fail miserably in wet clay. So, if I expect a dry year, I can sow poppy seeds where I normally wouldn't. We rarely have one of those really wet years where the poppy and larkspur plants rot off right at the soil surface because the ground is perpetually wet, but when it happens, it just breaks my heart. A year without poppy and larkspur flowers is as bad as a year without tomatoes. Actually, we've never had a year without tomatoes, but I imagine it would be even worse than a year without poppies and larkspur.

I grow Mexican hat and Plains coreopsis out in the back pasture to ensure we're never completely without flowers back there. Well, there's always some green milkweed back here, but in a dry year, there's not nearly as much of it as usual. I think there are plants for every soil type and every situation but it sure can take a lot of years of experimentation to figure out what they are.

I love Shirley poppies. I cannot even go to websites, like Select Seeds Antique Flowers or Swallowtail Garden Seeds, that sell a nice selection of poppy seeds or I'll find myself ordering more and more and more.

Mara, lol. I do grow Lion's Tail and I love it. I think (hope) it is rare enough in my neighborhood that nobody knows what it is. I do grow it in the front garden between the house and the road. I had forgotten about salvia, and I think they have made the one variety illegal here in OK. I also hate that so many people abuse plants in a way that makes it hard for normal people to just grow them freely without worry or constraint. I remember when Thompson and Morgan dropped all their poppy seeds after they had a shipment seized as it entered the US. I was afraid we'd never be able to buy poppy seeds again. That was long ago, and it is easy to find seeds of all kinds of ornamental poppies now, but sometimes I wonder how long that will continue. T

I am not anti-government, but I just wish they would leave us alone. They can write laws all day long and it isn't going to change human nature. As long as there are plants that people can use to get high, they are going to use them.....no matter how many states have laws written to outlaw that sort of behavior. Meanwhile, nice, normal gardening type people have to worry about favorite plants becoming impossible to find or maybe being outlawed so they cannot grow them.

I cannot imagine any local law enforcement officer in my county coming to my door and telling me I cannot grow poppies or daturas or salvias.......if they try it, they are going to have a mad woman on their hands. I think they need to focus on the people out there committing the crimes (and in our county they seem to) instead of harassing innocent gardeners who just want to grow the plants they like. I bet virtually every plant grown could be used for nefarious or recreational purposes by somebody-----and the government cannot outlaw all plants. Every now and then, though, I read about a gardener being harassed or even arrested for growing "opium poppies" and it makes me crazy. Surely the local officials in those areas have better things to do than to arrest a person growing poppies in their cottage garden or flower bed or mixed border.

Yeah, my adventure in all this was for the bread poppy seeds. Of course, I had to find which variety was most prolific and easily obtainable. Happens to be THE one type or one of them. Hens and Chicks, I believe.

I completely agree with Dawn. I don't want people to die as they do while ignorantly trying to manufacture their own chemical high from natural plants or from bathing in god-knows-what-type bath salts. But nothing, absolutely nothing is going to stop them. Instead of calling the cops on people, people should be communicating with one other, try to impart some wisdom on the matter. Humanity is awesome and comes up with awesome solutions but only if they're free to do so.

I'm one that thinks pot should be legalized, not so that I can smoke it. Never liked the stuff. I'd like to know who's on it and who's not! But the laws will never stop people from using it. Ever. So why the harsh prison sentences for those smoking it? That's not productive to society at all.

I love that old Hen and Chicks variety. Old-timey names are often more interesting than the ones companies come up with nowadays.

I just keep thinking that with all the more serious drug problems in the world, surely the law enforcement community has bigger fish to fry than hunting down gardeners growing breadseed poppies or any other of the P. somniferum family's highly ornamental varieties. You never know though. And, I completely understand that there would be a difference between the way law enforcement officers might view a gardener who is growing a handful of plants in their garden or who grows them in a meadow interplanted with many other wildflowers versus an individual growing an acre or more of them as an obvious row crop.

One day when you have an hour or two to kill, Google Michael Pollan and the word poppy or poppies or opium poppies and you should get an article/essay he wrote back in, hmmm, probably the 1980s. It might even have been the 1970s. It details not only his desire/attempt to grow poppies but also his connection with a person who got in lot of trouble, not just for growing poppies but for writing about it and for discussing how to use them. He discusses extensively what he went through trying not only to grow them but to research and understand all the possible ramifications. It is a fascinating thing to read, but sort of ventures into forbidden territory as well. If I had read it before we moved here and I planted poppies (I HAD to have them after reading about Celia Thaxton's garden and then hunting down and finding a copy of her book and reading it), I probably never would have planted them in the first place. Once you've grown them and have enjoyed/appreciated their beauty, you'll never want to be without them.

Oh, and if you sow your seed, rake the seedbed flat and surface sow them only. I mix mine with sand before sowing so that I don't get 400 plants per square inch. Just scatter them on the surface of the soil and press them into the soil. They need sunlight to germinate so won't germinate and grow if buried beneath the soil.

I sowed laciniatum and rhoeas both this year, in Nov or Dec, shortly after I moved. I also broadcast some larkspur and coreopsis tinctoria, and I do hope some of the coreopsis makes it. However, much of the winter, my yard has been nearly saturated, so I have little hopes for the poppies or the delphinum :( I didn't know the soil stayed so wet here this year. I'll be trying alternative places and plants next year.

I planted a Californian poppy mix and three types of P. rhoes. I have some wild ponies that I collected from the maritime alps in Provence, and I have the hungarian bread poppies, a poppy from Yuccaddoo and some of the opium poppys that have made their home in my dirt from years gone by. I am thinking to buy some if the odder species. Jelitto seeds has the P. triniifolium for a pretty penny. It is too late now but I will wait till this years seed crop is in before I buy.