jmith, thank you AGAIN! I really appreciate your posts :-) Uh...where does the air make-up unit go?? Breezygirl, wow, thank you for your thoughtful and reasoned post! Yes, upon reflection, an underccounter oven would not be good for my back. I was thinking that maybe I would only use the second oven for parties and holidays, but sometimes we have friends over every weekend. Good point about the cost of separate ovens. I do like the look of double ovens, too. Especially the Bosch 800 series and the Kenmore Pro, but it is very hard to find anything on them...few mixed reviews online. I will ask on this forum. And do some research on Electrolux as well, since they seem to be popular here. I saw the Wolf cooktop at Great Indoors. My mother has a Wolf range, but she hates to cook. Lol. OK, will also look for the Capital. Hadn't heard of it until this forum. Yes, found ajmadison and HomeEverything. HomeEverything has slightly better prices, and usually free shipping. Yes, you're right, I couldn't find a published price on the GE Monogram counter-depth anywhere. I have to call or email each site to get the price, and from what you and the GI saleslady said, there probably won't be much difference except for no tax if I buy online. I have accepted that I can't vent with an OTR MW. I will have to spring for an undercabinet hood. Bleah. $1400. Ugh. Loss of cabinet space. Boo. I am thinking that, since I was planning for stacked 42" + !2" or 36" + 18", I will have to mount the MW under a cabinet...h'mmm...maybe I will have to do a mullion door on a 36" or 42", since the 12" or 18" are supposed to be mullion? Thought briefly about putting MW in island, but kids are 6 and 10 and tall, too. LOVE the Kitchens forum. Haven't posted my floor plan yet, trying to get up the courage to post pics of my truly UGLY kitchen. It doesn't look as bad or difficult on the floor plan as it does in the pictures Will check with contractor. Presumably he is up on all this stuff. Never heard of MUA until cooksnsews mentioned it! The GE Monogram ZFSB25DXSS is currently $3825 @ Great Indoors, on sale. I liked it bc it is 25 cu ft and well-planned inside. It looks.like close to the same amount of space that we have in our KA Superba, which we bought 9 years ago and has never given us a problem. I will look at KA fridges, thank you! I need the MW drawer money for the undercabinet hood. Boo. But the fridge isn't in my appliance budget, anyway. Lol.

I forgot to add the Thermador MED302ES.... How close is it to the Bosch? I seem to prefer the blue display over the amber.

I had the Dacor epicure discovery oven and ER36D range when they first came out. It looked good on paper but there was no instant preheat(I think it was called rapid heat), precise temp or even heat. Both were nightmares and I wonder if they ever got any of these issues fixed. I replaced the oven with the Electrolux regular oven(half the cost) because it had more features than the Icon at the time. It had the enamel flake but Electrolux replaced it and I love the way the oven bakes. Very quick preheat and accurate temps. The lights are on the side and placed so the visibility is very good. Service was no quibble. Whatever oven you buy, make sure you get an oven thermometer and check it. If you get the Dacor I would love to hear how it works now. There was another poster who got his oven around the same time I did who had initial problems with Dacor but eventually after 3 ovens I think got it worked out and liked his oven. Other Dacor owners I know -6 year old mid range oven works great -cooking school with Dacor double oven-top of the line a year older than mine -multiple service calls won't hold temperatures very slow-can.t be fixed -2 other acquaintances have my same oven-they don't really use it much, but one said it didn't heat well very slow Others on this forum have liked the GE monogram oven too

That location is where the OP proposes to place his new ovens. It's not my suggestion. I'm just trying to work with his proposal. If this kitchen were presented to me as malleable and completely open to change, what I would suggest would be moving the refrigerator to the proposed oven location (on the far end) and creating a snack center there, as well as placing the cleanup sink and DW there. A laundry room does not create a big traffic pattern to worry about at all. I would choose the current refrigerator location as the oven location. I would also eliminate the funky peninsula with the cooktop on it in favor of placing it on the back wall where the DW is currently for better ventilation. Then put a prep sink on the island and extend it (at an angle) into the former peninsula space. The current oven and desk area would be narrowed down for better clearance behind the seating and become pantry storage. But this isn't a wholesale remodel. That already happened, and he's just trying to make the best of what exists currently. And that's why I suggested creating a "baking center" out of the proposed location rather than attempting to make it the destination for popping in a seared steak from the cooktop to finish off. That will most likely still happen with the current oven as it is more convenient in location for that type of usage. Even if it does die, a cheap 24" replacement would keep that cooktop to oven function happening. However, for dedicated baking, the current location is sub par. For extended cookie or pastry making, the new oven would work great for production if there were a counter and a closer source of water nearby. Thus my suggestion for the counter above a mixer cabinet and baking sheet cabinet and a prep sink on the island. That is my logic behind that suggestion.