If you are only having seating on the end of the island, I would consider making the rest of the island one level. The 24" depth will be enough to surround the cooktop and it may be more useful as prep space if it were flat and had a sink on it as well.

I would really encourage you to have an island range hood rather than a down draft vent.

Double ovens-how many times a year have you REALLY REALLY thought "OMG-I NEED a double oven!" Not just "It would be nice" and what was your work around? Was the workaround livable? I got double oven to replace a microwave/oven combo since the microwave hadn't worked in years. I wish I had just replaced with with a micro/oven combo. Now I have a huge microwave on the counter taking up valuable real estate and a double oven taking up room that I rarely use.
I'm kind of wondering why you would have the double layer of the island cut off 24 inches of prep space by the stovetop. I see you put seating there, but if you do not use the seating at the island now, why even have it at all? I see there is 42" of clearance between the island and wall-if you really want seating, would it be far too squished to have it there on that side? If it would be fine, I'd open up that side to allow 54" of USEABLE countertop on that side next to the stovetop.

I agree with the others about the island.

If you're not sure about the dbl oven, have you considered an oven and speed oven combo, where the speed oven can double as your microwave? Or a convection micro that can do both jobs?

On the sink wall, I'd want to hold the cabinet run back from the dining room doorway and the eating area windows. Unless you need absolutely every inch for storage, I think it's a better feel not to crowd. I'd keep the ends even with the island. Not a big deal, just a little breathing room that will make the space live bigger.

I'm torn about choosing between option 1 and 2. I prefer the fridge position in 1, so that it's a straighter shot to the fridge from sink or stove. But I sure think the center, longer counter area could serve more purpose than the short one to the outside of the kitchen. I think if it were mine, I'd go with #2.

I would move the sink to the island and leave the range right where it is. Moving plumbing will be cheaper than decent island ventilation (which would be an overhead hood NOT a downdraft) Maybe keep a prep sink all the way to the left on the stove run. Place the cleanup sink as far to the left as you can also. That gives you two great runs of counter space for prep for lots of family member help.

bahacca - You are right about the double ovens. I can totally do with a single. A friend said we should get a double oven to help with resale of the house.
Also, I like the idea of making one whole side the same height. Perhaps we can do without island seating or put it in towards the end of the raised island side (far diagonal from the cook top.)

Island ventilation question. Is it that difficult to vent an island stove top? We never deep fry but do stir fry.

Does anyone see another spot for the cook top? We were originally thinking to put in an oven cook top microwave combo next to the refrigerator. I was just concerned about the lack of landing space for non food items.

One other think I forgot to mention. If I move the cook top Microwave combo to the refrigerator wall with some landing space on either side, what do you think if I created some landing space for keys and mail from our 84" pantry. I could do 30" of counter space and then make the pantry 54".
Thoughts???

It's more expensive to vent an island cook top. It's been awhile since I've priced pop-up downdrafts - we have since decided to move the cook top from the island to the perimeter, even with moving the gas line and installing new venting, we're *saving* money, that's how much more expensive island ventilation can be - but I digress. It's been some time since I priced ventilation but it was $1000 and upwards (I think the one we settled on was close to $2K) and that did not include the duct work - that's already in place for us.

Pop-up downdrafts also aren't as effective at removing smoke and steam as overhead ventilation. If you go this route, go for the pop-up with the highest rise - KA has one that rises 14" - to get the best capture. If we had decided to keep our island cook top, this is what we would have done. We looked into installing an island hood (also an expensive proposition) but I didn't like the visual of a hood in our modest sized kitchen, especially since it visually overwhelmed our small island (only 62" long). Since your island and kitchen are much larger than ours, an island hood would be in scale in your space. And they can be quite the design statement!

Thanks for your feedback...now I am starting to rethink the whole cook top island concept and go with a single level island. Does anyone know the maximum length granite you can get before you need a seam???

Oh, and where should I put my cook top?

Thank you all so very much!

I have no idea if this is feasible or not....

You want to have the kitchen seating area as is with the windows... Do you use your dining room? Can you add a few windows to the DR and make that room airy and inviting?

Then, you move the kitchen to where the bay window/kitchen table is. So you work while looking out to your backyard, it give you lot of window level counter space which would be a contiguous run of counter... AND these would be heavenly wonderful countertop with all those windows.

Put the range on the outside wall so you can vent
properly.

Then put the kitchen table on the part of the kitchen where your wall oven and frig are.

Essentially, you are swapping the kitchen and the eating area.

Just a thought!

i've read the OP. That's all.
I've not read the response posts after the OP. (I've seen a few key words in the responses.)

icannotwait, here are my initial reactions.

Three entrances with no corner counter space is actually a nice thing, not all bad.
It enables you to install all-drawers everywhere and use them completely.
All-drawers or high pullout pantry cabinets.
I think you have a huge space overall, and if you make good use of your space you will be happy.
Some compromises will be necessary.

Your countertop that now has the cooktop and sink can be salvaged and reworked.
It will keep the cooktop and sink.
Keep reading. Within five minutes I will show you.

The best place in the big wall to put a ...
a.) French door fridge, is so that it opens right in the center of the main aisle.
b.) single door fridge that opens right, is so that it opens towards the island.
c.) single door fridge that opens left, is so that it opens towards the cooktop counter. (it's better to reverse the door swing.)
Show the door hinge side and place the fridge so that the door opening makes sense.

About point #12:
If the pantry is 24" deep, it can be fitted with the Ikea-style pullout pantry units.
large Ikea-style pullout pantry units can be great.
You can have as many shelves in them as you wish.
You can add more pullout shelves in them.
Do not limit yourself to the images shown at ikea.com; you just buy 1 more drawer, and screw it on. ($30).
Btw, I find it hard to picture your "ineffective" existing shelves or your new shelves you are dreaming of. (But, it may be irrelevant.)

The fridge+oven+pantry wall is a big advantage you have.
Use it.
You could have a countertop section in that wall and use it like an appliance garage.
Most kitchens cannot have appliance garages because garages are hard to access and they ruin the counter surface usage.
Your countertop / appliance garage could come with a rolltop to shut it when you want to shut it.
This makes it a floor-to-ceiling wall with a rolltop garage somewhere in the middle.
You can safely drop the desk idea and get more of everything you need instead.

point #9 a huge oval shape table would work well too

About point #8
the "attached" dining room seems in a weird place.
You could consider turning that door into a pass-through. Closed off.
The corner would be the passthrough. Or the garage with rolltop.

Your point #1 is a "very limited counter space" feeling.
This feeling you have is primarily due to the sink+oven being so close to each other,
and 2ndly due to the fridge having no plunk spot _near_ a sink.

--
(fair warning: this next section is difficult).

Reshape and reposition your island.
It might end up being a rectangle with a corner cut off or rounded.
It will be larger, wider and in a different spot.

Extend the island.
Extend it a lot, not just a few inches.
To give your fridge+oven+pantry wall more breathing room, you may have to slide it down also. Or reshape it.
If you beef up the big wall to make it a full floor-to-ceiling wall, you must slide the island down towards the table.

Widen the island.
This narrows the main aisle. This is good.
Nobody "needs" an aisle more than 45" wide.
That will be 48" from cabinet front to cabinet front, with an overhang, leaving 45" net width.

Some will say 42" to 43" net width is fine. Especially because there is no dead-end corner to turn. It's open space.
Some will say a smaller distance than 42" is fine, but they might be stretching it.

Your points 3,4,5, seem to make sense.
They say that nobody "sits" there.
I'll guess it's because "nobody" would ever want to sit in a _narrower_ aisle when given a choice.
And it's both narrower AND FARther away from the action zone than the big fat main aisle.

In my statement of aisle width I have not written that it is a good idea to have stools in an aisle 42" or 43" wide.
But, your image as posted shows stools in a 43" narrow aisle.
No wonder why nobody sits there.
It's narrow.
And, on top of that, it's far from the action.

Do not pay attention to my distances if you want more width in your "main" aisle.
Make the main aisle ANY size you want. It's your kitchen.
Make it 48"w if you want it to be wide.

Are you sure it is 53" wide today? Is this right?
No wonder you feel you have little counter surface.
It's far away from the "main action" counter.
It's so far, that one cannot pivot over to the nearest free counter surface.

You have not written that it is a problem to have socialization occurring in the same space as cooking.

Executive Summary:
The working aisle is a "main" aisle.
It is for prep, cleanup and socializing.
So this aisle has to be just right and not too attractive to socializers.
Perhaps the island will be shaped differently at the end near the table.
And, there has to be an attractive force to get people to go perch themselves in the other aisle that is far away.
Thus, this aisle has to be "good", in whatever way we shall figure out later: wide enough, with an overhang, with a curved countertop, whatever.

--

About point #10
a 30" induction cooktop is better than a 36" induction cooktop, so here is where modest ambition pays off.

But no to the double oven.
It's all a matter of compromises; you cannot have everything.
One Advantium or Miele Combi-Oven is a fine "compromise"; here is where a BIG budget pays off.
A cheapie microwave and one "other" basic oven is not better than a single Combi-Oven appliance.
The 2 take more space and don't give you more of anything (except on the occasion when you will use both simultaneously).
So, spend more on a highly combinatoric oven (or 2) instead of getting double ovens plus a microwave.

--

(fair warning: this next section is very difficult).

In the island, have a sink and a faucet.
In the "main" countertop, place the sink farther from the cooktop than it is today. Leave a small piece of countertop on the left.

point #6 has two ideas in it. Implement neither of them. Also nix point # 7.

point #2 is joint cleanup, joint cooking, and large group meals.

Executive Summary:
Keep the cooking and exhaust hood on the wall where they are today.
Keep a sink there too.
This is the compromise suggested.
Keep what you have, and add a sink in the island so that fridge outgoing stuff has a destination within five feet.
Where you put keys+mail is not a big deal, and you will figure that out at a later stage in this planning process.
First, the aisle, the island, the fridge placement in the wall, the rest of that wall, scootching the sink away from the cooktop and adding a new sink near the fridge. Then, the storage details like whether to go rolltop or all open garage, or no garage at all, and where to toss unopened mail.

--

My not reading responses from other people allows me to write a response without rebutting anyone.

Hth.

p.s. when I wrote out the ideas, i forgot that you drew a larger island in your proposed options. With that in mind I'll say one big flat surface not a 2-tiered thing.

You might consider a peninsula arrangement with the sink in it facing the DR, with seating on the DR side. The island could then be smaller and more functional. That would give you a plunk space for your fridge right on the island, keep your range where it is for easier ventilation, and give you a LOT more room between the sink and stove---which is your most used prep spot in the kitchen. It even gives you a window to look out of while prepping, If you added a secondary sink to the island, two people could prep at the same time.

Another thing I forgot to mention: when one opens a single large fridge door, one only opens it part way, 99% of the time. This makes the hand+arm action a diagonal into the fridge. Then, once you get something from the fridge you are not in front of the fridge but standing next to it, on the side where the fridge door opens. This is why a door that opens on the right hand side is going to put you near the island, and why a left hand side opening door will put you near the other counter (where your cooktop is).

I've read more of this thread now, and I see now that your proposed layouts have 42" aisles and a huge island... We came to the same conclusion. You might want to tweak the sizing of the main counter and the island. You might end up making the island smaller than proposed, and the main counter bigger (deeper from front to wall). But this can be fine tuned in a later stage of the planning process.

I want to thank all of you for your valuable help.
A few comments and clarifications from me:

Live-wire-oak, as per your suggestions, I assume we would move the dishwasher to the island?

Kaismom, thanks for thinking out of the box. My windows come down very low below counter height so it would not be feasible.

Davidro 1, thanks for giving me so much to think about. I followed you for the most part. One thing to clarify, right now on our wall with the cook top, we also have our oven. Are you thinking we split it up and put the oven/microwave on the refrigerator wall and just have the cook-top and exhaust on the sink side?

Yes, I want to do a French door fridge.

The current pantry problem is that the with the folding door open, there is around 24" on each side that is behind the wall and it is an area that is hard to reach. Also, the current shelves were not put in correctly and don�t have the proper support. Great idea about the ikea shelving. One thought we had was to divide the closet and use the left side for a mail/key landing zone and remake the pantry with better access the entire space

I wanted to clarify my lack of counter space. On the sink side, we have 18" on either side of the oven/cook-top. The only idems we keep on the counter are a coffeemaker, a smaller toaster oven and a dish drainer. They take up most of the counter space we have. On the fridge side, I keep the mail and keys and current paperwork. We do almost all our prep work on the island but I do want any appliances on the island because we only have around 8" depth on the counter till you bump into something.

Yes, the space between the current sink counter and island is 53" and it is too big a space.

I was planning on a gas cook top not an induction. I will look into the combi-oven you are suggesting. The double oven idea is out.

You suggest moving the sink to as far left as we can but where would we put the dishwasher???

Finally, if we end up not putting the cook top in the island, we will do one level, not two.

THANK YOU!

The big thing is this: keep cooking on the wall. Keep a sink on that counter. Make a big countertop space between the two. Then, to make your fridge+prep experience more user-friendly, put a sink and faucet in the island.

About the DW; it is a valid question. But I'm lazy when it comes to some of the details. I don't care much whether or not the dishwasher goes between the cooktop and the far-LHS sink, or in the island, or somewhere else. Other minds will know best. But, is there a strong reason why it didn't seem obvious that you could put the DW in the middle, near the cooktop? People don't use the DW when they are cooking. They use the DW before cooking, or afterwards. (compromises, tradeoffs. Not ideal but "ok"). Putting it in the island is fine too. Other people will help you plan zones and workflow.

The microwave oven is currently underneath the cooktop... is that what I'm reading? I saw the word "microwave" in your first diagram pointing to the cooktop. I think you might enjoy making the cooktop counter extra deep and then putting the microwave on a shelf near the exhaust hood. Then you can keep the advantage you now have, of sending cooking smells into the exhaust. If the cooktop counter is deeper, the island can be thinner. But there may be too little space for the microwave to go above the counter. If so, a drawer microwave solves that problem. But again, I'm a bit lazy when it comes to some of the details. I don't care much whether or not you end up with ovens split here and there or all in one impressive wall "to die for" or wherever.

If there is not enough room for the big cleanup sink at the far left hand side, then try a peninsula; I think this is what green-d wrote about. A smaller sink could be there. Of course a peninsula at that end then makes the island shape into something non-retangular. (compromises, tradeoffs). live_wire_oak wrote about a smaller sink on the cooktop run, and also about a big sink across from it, not near the fridge. This is good too.

jmith in the appliances forum uses gas all day commercially and is now going to buy induction at home after asking a hundred questions and going to working showrooms to see induction in action. He wrote that induction people were actually too humble in singing the praise of induction. (Gas is good too.)

The big thing is this: keep cooking on the wall. Keep a sink on that counter. Make a big countertop space between the two. Then, to make your fridge+prep experience more user-friendly, put a sink and faucet in the island.