Help with New Build Kitchen Layout

9 years ago

Hello all! I usually post on the Building a Home forum, and this is my first post over here on kitchens (although I do read here too).

I've been impressed with your vast knowledge and hope you can help me design my new build kitchen. We are breaking ground as soon as our architect has our final plans complete.

So, let me know your thoughts on my current kitchen set up. I will have a full size Frigidaire refrigerator and a full size freezer, with the freezer being in the pantry. Contrary to the plans, there will be no upper cabinets on the window wall....that will be all windows, going to counter height, with an extended 10-12 inch counter like I've seen here. I'm planning on the window wall being the clean up area, with the island being the prep area. I'm planning on a Kohler stages 33 (or should I go 45?) in the island. Which side of the island should it be on? Also, I'm hoping to make the island 4 feet deep (whereas now I think it's about 3 feel deep). Also, there will be no raised countertop on the island....it will be one height.
To answer questions from the FAQs....

How many people will work food in the kitchen at the same time? Or, IOW, is this a one-butt kitchen?

I am really the MAIN cook....my husband and kid (three of them, ages 12, 9, and 5) do help with cleanup. And, I'd like to include my kids more in the cooking end as well.

Are there any special cooking needs - and related appliances and storage - to consider? (Do you bake, microwave popcorn, keep Kosher, make espresso, grill indoors, etc.)

Yes, I bake and we microwave popcorn. We also love espresso, but have a Nespresso machine that will sit on the counter. I don't think I have any room for wall ovens, so we'll just do a nice oven/range combo. Either gas or induction. Microwave will either go in pantry, or a microwave drawer in island....thoughts on that?

Who else will use the kitchen and for what? Coffee with the neighbor, feeding the dog, little kids doing homework, big kids surfing the net, etc. Consider all the possible non-food activities as well as any usersÃ¯Â¿Â½ special needs: toddlers, elderly, physically challenged, etc.

We do have three dogs that need to be fed. I picture kids doing homework at the island. I will have a computer in the desk nook near the pantry.

What is the traffic situation? Does part of the kitchen function as a passageway from one part of the home to another? Where do the groceries come in and where does the garbage go out?

Traffic will go through to the office/pantry/and out to door to the screen in porch. This traffic will mostly be myself. Pantry has two doors, one near the entry from the garage, that is where groceries will mostly enter. I'm planning on two garbage pullouts....one near window sink and one in island for prep garbage. I will also need a recycling center.

What are your storage needs? Do you shop frequently or prefer to keep a lot on hand? Do you...

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Comments (6)

Buehl
9 years ago
Welcome, Michelle1973!

Please see the following Kitchens FAQ as it is the most helpful when asking for layout help:

FAQ: How do I ask for Layout Help and what information should I include?

Other helpful FAQs:

FAQ: Kitchen work zones, what are they?
FAQ: Aisle widths, walkways, seating overhangs, work and landing space, and others
FAQ: How do I plan for storage? Types of Storage? What to Store Where?

You mention that looks are more important to you than function - OK - so is function important at all? Note that most of us here are function first/form second. Why? For two reasons,

(1) A nice looking but dysfunctional kitchen can become a nightmare to deal with over time - assuming you cook, that is. [No, not everyone actually cooks. For some people, a kitchen is solely for "show" and will rarely, if ever, be used for more than heating up take-out or similar. That's OK - in that case it probably doesn't matter (until resale...)]

(2) It is relatively easy to make a functional kitchen look nice - but it's almost impossible to make nice-looking but dysfunctional kitchen function well (short of doing another remodel).

Do you have a layout of the entire first floor?

A comment on your current design - it's actually not too bad, functionally!

Dish storage may be an issue, but if you're OK with dishes in drawers, then I think you will probably be OK.

A few other items:
- Be aware that a "full size refrigerator" will take up more room in the aisle than you show, even if you recess it into the wall behind it. If you can recess the refrigerator into the wall and room behind it, then figure a depth in the kitchen about 5" to 6" deeper than the deepest item next to the refrigerator....if the deepest item is the counter - then another 5 to 6 inches beyond the counter - so: 25.5" + 5.5" = 31" deep. Doors & handles of non-true built-in refrigerators must extend past surrounding items - walls, counters, cabinets, other appliances, etc.
If the refrigerator (or freezer) is next to a wall that's deeper than the carcass/body of the refrigerator, then you will need a 9" to 12" cabinet or filler b/w the wall and the refrigerator or freezer to be able to fully open the refrigerator/freezer doors. If they are next to walls that can be changed, then try to make the walls no deeper than the carcass/body of the refrigerator & freezer.
For the island, be sure there is sufficient space b/w the edge of the island and the table on the left - at least 60" - more if there will be a lot of traffic passing b/w them.
In the "Dining" room, also be sure you have at least 44" b/w the table and what appears to be counters to the left of the table - more if you intend those counters to be work space or a place for staging food while someone is sitting at the table. If so, then plan for 51 to 54" so there's room for someone to be at the counter while someone is sitting at the table. 44" is needed for...
annkh_nd
9 years ago
I like it too.

You don't show dimensions in the kitchen, but it looks like you have 12" upper cabinets on each side of the sink. I can tell you from experience that a 12" cabinet is a pain. In my remodel, I went from 12" to 15" uppers around the sink, and the difference is very noticeable, and much more user-friendly. Since yours are against a wall, you'll need to allow for the door swing, which could make the opening even smaller.

In your case, with a big window on the wall, I think small upper cabinets would look out of proportion. Try to get an elevation view to see how it looks to you. It might look better to skip the uppers completely - maybe you could make the window even bigger.

If you moved the prep sink to the other end of the island, you could put dish drawers closer to the DW.

How do you envision using the desk? It's windy where I live, and if I had papers on that desk, they would blow away every time the door was opened. There isn't a lot of room to come in the door if someone is sitting at the desk. And your view from the desk is of a wall. I don't necessarily have suggestions, because so much depends on how you will use the desk and the door, but those are things I'd think long and hard about before putting a desk off the kitchen.
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I agree with cpartist--omit the second island. You could put the breakfast table in the blank space, and make the nook a screened porch. It appears that both aisles are traffic aisles from back doors--I don't know how much traffic, so don't know if this plan is feasible, but I'll post it. I put the fridge next to the pantry, as you suggested, but lengthened the wall, to provide a landing space between the fridge and oven, and to provide a space for a MW. The MW could instead be located in a drawer in the island, across from the fridge. Breakfast items could be kept in drawers below, and in drawers across the aisle in the island, facing the fridge run. The DR wall is also lengthened, to accommodate the clean-up sink and two DWs. Optional dish storage is across the aisles, in drawers on the island and on the cooktop wall, but I included uppers over the sink run. Glasses and cups could be stored in the uppers, or the uppers could be omitted. I normally wouldn't put the clean-up zone in a traffic aisle, but there is another route through the kitchen, and this plan puts the dish storage near the DR, and keeps the hood centered on the back wall, as a focal point. The hood I drew is 6" wider than the cooktop, to provide a wider capture area, since there are no uppers to help contain grease and steam. The measurements are difficult to read, but it looks as if the traffic/work aisles are 3'+?, so I reduced the width of the island. I'd suggest at least 48" for each aisle. Since the counters beside the range will be the least useful for primary prep, I made the windows wider, to let in more light. Incoming groceries can be placed on the counter to the right of the cooktop, to be loaded to the pantry and fridge. Frozen items, likewise, can be placed to the left of the cooktop, to be loaded to the freezer, which is now in the MR, in the former extra pantry storage--just make sure the door swings left-to-right. Click to enlarge: An alternative would be to have double windows on each side of the hood, with a dish hutch on the clean-up side, and an appliance garage on the pantry side, to increase storage while preserving symmetry. Kitchen planning info: New to Kitchens? Read me first.
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If it's not too late, I'd omit the dividing wall, and use an island with a prep sink. The clean-up zone will be hidden from anyone entering the front door. NKBA guidelines New to Kitchens? Read me first.
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This is me, speaking gently... It's perfectly fine, of course, that you want your new kitchen to be anyway you want it. I'm just going to mention stuff in the next paragraph that is more fact and less feel. I am happy for people to have what they want for whatever reason, but this is what I think you should know. The light from the kitchen windows is never going to reach the family room through an opening that is 90 degree angle. There is somewhat of a view of the kitchen windows (probably) but it's kinda far and pretty much angled away. The opening over the sink area should preserve some connection. The family room seems to have a triple slider facing in exactly the same direction as the kitchen windows - but it's bigger and closer, not turned at an odd angle with much smaller glass area and people standing in front of them using the sink, etc. Maybe think about where furniture and stuff will be placed in the family room - like sofa(s)/TV/AV/Game consoles, recliners, game tables and how those interactions will change as people grow and change. I like to think of the traffic to/from the family room as being "channeled" so people aren't wandering everywhere but you sound like you like that. The Last Thing I Ever Want is to be able to hear a TV while cooking, but you're probably different. I'm still recovering from 7 sibs growing up together in small homes. Everyone proposes stuff based on what they like or dislike or have found to work or not work.
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I know your question was about the location of the refrigerator -- hope you don't mind input on the kitchen as a whole? You said this is new construction, so, better to make changes while it's all just paper? The first thing I notice is that you have limited clearance on two sides of the island -- 36" is really not enough space, particularly if that measurement is cabinet to cabinet vs. countertop to countertop (the measurement will be 35" or less from countertop to countertop). I would consider turning the island so that the long side is perpendicular to the dining table (as well as reducing the width of the island -- see below). If I had to "steal" a foot from the workshop to have that work, I'd do it -- you will spend more time in the kitchen than the workshop (?) and you won't miss that 1' when you are in the workshop. Another happy result from taking that extra foot from the workshop is that the refrigerator would not be so constrained - there would be breathing room between it and the corner. In that scenario, I'd leave it where it is, but no matter where it is on that wall, I'd consider recessing it into the garage space if it is a normal full-size refrigerator, so that it doesn't stick out 6 inches into whatever walkway you have there -- on paper it doesn't look so bad, but in real life, if you are going to spend all that money (and it is ALL that money) on a kitchen, get the refrigerator right. I would make sure that there was seating for 4 people at the island, with at least one seat (2 better) on the dining room side (assuming you rotate the island to perpendicular), so that you are not all seated like you are in a diner. If there was one thing I could change about my kitchen -- that would be it. We have a similar set up to your plan and I thought we'd use the dining room table all the time -- not so much - you will end up eating at the island a lot, so you want enough seating for everyone/every day. With both you and your wife being 6'+, I would not reduce the overhang on the island to 12". I'd give up the backside cabinets (under the island) before giving up overhang for leg room. I think you would not even miss those cabinets, but every time you sit at an island with a 12" overhang, and bump against those cabinets, you will wish you had more of an overhang - 15" would be a minimum; more would be better. I'd give up some upper cabinet space on the sink wall to make that window a triple window, to bring more light into the kitchen - that's a personal preference -- I like a really bright kitchen - ymmv. Finally -- you did not ask for input at all on the whole mudroom/closet/gun safe? (I think that's what that is?), but it needs some work -- right now it's just a hallway, but it's a future bottleneck. If you try to put any benches/lockers, storage, you won't have room to walk through -- think about putting a 15" bench (or locker, etc.) along either of those walls, but particularly the 12.5' wall -- if someone is sitting, putting on shoes, etc. there is just no way anyone can comfortable get around them. Not sure the solution (smaller closet? smaller gun room? relocate gun room?), but needs work. Good Luck w/your build!
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sjhockeyfan325
9 years ago
If you moved the prep sink to the other end of the island, you could put dish drawers closer to the DW

I'd move the prep sink to the other end of the island for a different reason - the most efficient layout is fridge-sink-cooktop. the way its now laid out its fridge-cooktop-sink, with another sink a few feet away. Make the prep sink useful put it where it's needed!
Michelle
Original Author
9 years ago
Thanks everyone! Yeah, annkh, I felt the same about the window wall uppers and already scratched those. :). Good idea about moving prep sink to other side of island....will do that!
lavender_lass
9 years ago
The island seems a little tight, for the upper walkway to the clean up area. Also, there may not be room for the stools and the dining room chairs to be used at same time...and still walk between them.

I would move the prep sink down to the other end of the island...and add a baking area to that lower wall. Maybe an oven/microwave combination, with a small pantry right next to it...for flour and other baking necessities. It would save a few steps and you could still have glass uppers for nicer dishes and lots of storage below for baking pans, bowls, etc.

Moving the baking area will give you a nice second prep area and even a snack area with the fridge and prep sink so close. That would help alleviate some of the traffic through your main work area. Just a few ideas :) {{gwi:2107749}}From Kitchen plans

This post was edited by lavender_lass on Mon, Jun 2, 14 at 17:58
Michelle
Original Author
9 years ago
GREAT ideas LL! Thank you!

Help with New Build Kitchen Layout

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