FYI here are my inspiration photos = first one is my color scheme but planning for a deeper brown - almost black countertop....

2nd shows the black drawers under the cooktop..would black look weird with brown countertop? Maybe i should order them unfinished and paint them myself so I can tweak it

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I'm no kitchen designer. . . and I wasn't part of the original thread. However, it seems like a long way from the frig/ovens to a landing space (over 6ft!) I know when I take stuff out of the frig, I need a place to put it down or I'll drop stuff. Same with hot cookie sheets etc. .

Have you seen this post:
http://kitchensync.typepad.com/my_weblog/2009/04/how-much-kitchen-space-is-required-for-a-cooktop-and-oven.html

Perhaps you could get a regular range and then you could have an undercounter MW and have some landing space next to the frig?

Just my 2cents

I'll look at that thread.. thanks! After its all done, I'll get some kind of bakers cart or maybe an antique dresser or something for under the window - something that can be moved if needed... but will serve as landing space for oven and fridge stuff...

That blog post does make a lot of sense.. however if my current set up is the same as the white cabinets but with a stove on the very end of that L. I have very little storage for my pots and pans - which is my biggest frustration.. Moreso than the lack of countertop.. our microwave, coffepot mixer is all on that countertop - so i have very little counter now! Moving the oven will give me better access to pots and pans where I need them. Moving the microwave will clear up a lot of counterspace. And I will be gaining which is a huge improvement! Adding the cart/dresser/table under the window will give me even more set down space. I thought about wrapping the cabinets around to under the window, but that will create another blind corner,and there just isnt clearance for the dishwasher - I'd have to have those cabinets made a few inches shallower..

My husband is cheap, so if I ended up chosing a stove, or mounting my wall oven under the cooktop, my husband would see no need for the fridge/oven unit - because the "fridge could sit there on its own" and I'd be out all that extra storage and stuck with the same layout I have now, it would just be prettier.

I have to 2nd what Jemna said - Currently in my kitchen now, my refrigerator is not next to any counters or tables and it's a pain to carry everything across the kitchen to the counters. I try to load up my hands so I don't have to keep walking back and forth.

Here's another option... we can push it back into the dining room - it take the oven/fridge out farther but would give me more room for countertop, or a larger freestanding unit for set down space. That new run of cabinets would be 22 inches deep at maximum though.
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This is what i would have if i had the oven under the cooktop - except the fridge would stick out about 5 inches into the doorway. Moving the doorway/rebuilding that wall would be "too much work just to make the fridge fit." I'd still have room for a cart, but would lose a lot of storage.

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I see your points. . . But pot storage made me realize that you have a blind corner, which is a HUGE waste of space!

I would consider moving the stove down and eliminating that 12" cabinet and making a lazy susan where you could store pots/pans.

Not an easy space to work with. . . However, there are compromises in any situation. I will have an exterior door opening right onto my island. Maybe you just have to walk 6 ft to put down groceries.

As far as a cart goes, I have never found one that I like enough to go in the kitchen. After spending so much on remodeling, I hate to have something that looks like it belongs in a dorm kitchen. That's just me, but maybe you can find one you like

Thanks for your input. I currently have the stove on the end - which is right by major traffic - the other side of that doorway is the stairs to the back door - and the entryway used most. Its an old foursquare - you come in that door and have to step into the kitchen to shut the door again. It really makes me nervous and I rarely use the left burners as a result..

The cabinet maker has a really cool blind corner cabinet that swings out - so while I may not have every inch useable in there, it will be a good solution I think.

You're right about the carts - I was thinking something like that for mobility - but would ideally find something old to repurpose old dresser or table to tuck in there. Maybe a butcher block or something...

The next to the last one, where the kitchen becomes a "u" plus part of a wall? I'd be hesitant about putting cabinets there becuase it cuts off all access to your dish storage when the dishwasher door is open.

In your layout at the top of the thread, You might double-check that the ovens' doors and the drawers beyond the dishwasher will actually clear the window mouldings.

I have mixed feelings about carts, so I'm skipping that option all together. But I wonder if you can have some temporary counter near the range by having something that flips up from the side of the cabinet or is stored in the little bitty tall cabinet or on the side of ites drywall surround that fit onto permanently mounted holders and bridge over that space from time to time.

The opposite side of the room I don't think has as much potential because of needing something very small to allow the ovens, dw and drawers to open normally.

If you did push the ovens and ref into the dining room, you could do an 18"-24" wide peninsula beneath the window - maybe 3 - 3.5 feet long? Be a great set down space, but I wonder if you'd feel it was in the way?

The next to the last one, where the kitchen becomes a "u" plus part of a wall? I'd be hesitant about putting cabinets there becuase it cuts off all access to your dish storage when the dishwasher door is open. -

- - I agree!

In your layout at the top of the thread, You might double-check that the ovens' doors and the drawers beyond the dishwasher will actually clear the window mouldings.

- - Theyre good. The drawers there now dont come close to hitting and the oven will be farther back - and its a fairly compact one - so the door isnt very tall.

I have mixed feelings about carts, so I'm skipping that option all together. But I wonder if you can have some temporary counter near the range by having something that flips up from the side of the cabinet or is stored in the little bitty tall cabinet or on the side of ites drywall surround that fit onto permanently mounted holders and bridge over that space from time to time.

-- may have to consider this. Its drawn in, but I don't plan on any drywall surrounding - so right now the side and bacak would be just plain wood - it would be nice to break that up a bit anyway..

The opposite side of the room I don't think has as much potential because of needing something very small to allow the ovens, dw and drawers to open normally.

- i agree here too. Thats why i was thinking at one time of a cart because of the wheels.. I could move it when necessary. My mother in law has this little thing that holds the trash can - it tips out. I was thinking maybe something like that with a butcherblock top that I could use for cutting also.. Its maybe 12" deep and 18" wide. She had it made, and wanted to buy me one. Maybe she can by me one now ...

If you did push the ovens and ref into the dining room, you could do an 18"-24" wide peninsula beneath the window - maybe 3 - 3.5 feet long? Be a great set down space, but I wonder if you'd feel it was in the way?

I wonder if it would too.. Maybe I could do a flip up table on the wall?

thanks for all your input!

should i swap the fridge & oven?

The layout is functional, but tight. However, it really needs a range for optimal storage. You'd gain 30" of countertop space by eliminating the wall ovens and that could be your pot and pan drawers.

I'd keep the current layout with the sink where it is, put a range where you have the cooktop and shift the fridge down to where you show the wall oven. Then put in a drawer base and wall cabinet in place of the wall oven. You now have landing space for the fridge, storage for your pots and pans, and and additional upper cabinet for food storage next to the fridge. You could put in a shorter upper cabinet and hang a MW from it to keep the countertop space and still have a MW.

Thanks for your input - I've really been fighting a range - I just really like the look of an integrated cooktop - and hate the mess that accumulates over time down the sides... yech.

I can see how the oven takes away counter space but dont understand how it is any less storage - wherever the oven isn't there is storage.. right?

Would it be strange to have an oven so tight in the corner? I just cant have it on the far end anymore.

I fiddled around with the Ikea software to move some things around... Here's what it would look like with live_wire_oak suggestions. any thoughts? I guess I'm not loving it, still pouting over the range! ;) Any ideas on how to make that fridge area look like one unit? I really was hoping to have it built to look like all my original built ins..

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Is there a reason why you only have a 12" pantry cabinet in the space next to the doorway across from the cooktop?

You could put a stove under your cooktop which will give you the built in feel. They have pantry cabinets where the top opens up and a slide out pot rack is inside and below that several pull out shelves for casserole dishes and larger pots that do not hang well. This would allow you to use a smaller size base cabinet with the microwave mounted in it and give you counter space as well as a place for upper cabinets for storing other things. It would look like the image in the thread where joyjoy shows the fridge with a small counter next to it but it would have microwave.

I much prefer the layout with the ikea software. It would drive me nuts to not have a landing spot beside the fridge! I prefer the microwave beside the fridge for quick leftover warm ups as well.

As far as your suggestion for switching the fridge and stovetop, don't like that so much. The fridge would be tight there and make the blind corner a deep, dark, scary hole. LOL. Very hard to access. The ikea layout gives you room for prep at the sink and then just slide it to the stove. Much better flow for the way I cook.

Good luck!

To me it seems that the landing spot next to the fridge would be hard to get at with the fridge door open anyway ...

And having the oven so close in the corner - I would anticipate using that counter and sink to prep, since thats where i do it now, but i would have to move out and around to open the oven door - it opens up right where I would be standing.. Maybe that wont be a problem but Im having a hard time wrapping my head around that. I do use my oven a lot - probably daily.

thank you everyone for your help.. and please know Im thinking aloud here.. not bashing suggestions, I just want to make sure I do this the best way.

Here's a link to an Ikea blog i found... kitchen set up is extremely similar to mine - they just have a little more wall length on the cooktop/oven side....

Here is a link that might be useful: Ikea kitchen

I think the range close to the corner is a problem, too. As far as access to opening/closing the oven door, it was nicer when you had a wall oven by your fridge. But, even if it's just a cooktop, if you like to "chop as you go", you will have a hot cooktop right by your elbow while you prep.

Maybe it's time for a trip to the appliance store to check out your options? How many do you generally cook for? What's the skinniest cooking appliance (range or cooktop) you could live with on that wall?

we are a family of 4 - and i often cook extra for leftovers. I do use my oven and bake alot so I'd ideally have 30 inches... I will look and see if something skinnier would work. the oven i have now is 30 inch but made to fit in 30 inch cabinet - so not quite 30 - and Its probably as small as id want to go.. unless they make some that are deeper and narrower?

in your 4th layout pic down from the top there is a tall narrow cabinet with what looks like a bunch of dead space next to it... what if you put your microwave recessed in that wall?

that way you would have a landing for the microwave-beside the stove-or-if you exchanged the tall cabinet with a wider one beneath then you could add a counter above and microwave inset above that...

then you would also have a landing/counter above the oven and beside the fridge where the microwave used to be.

Thats a drawing the KD made for me - where the door is - is my laundry chute - he drew the door way bigger than it really is. The dead space is actually where the chimey is - so I cant change that at all. Thanks though!