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Electrical Wiring

Smoke Detector Install Cathedral Ceilings and SIPS

10 years ago

Ok trying to get one answer. SIP supplier and General Contractor disagree on smoke detector locations.

We are in PA and under 2009 ICC Building Codes.

New Construction, single family residence.

Trying to find out once and for all if the bedroom smoke detectors can be installed on the walls of a bedroom with a cathedral ceiling? SIP guy says wall mounted is ok as long as the top edge of the smoke detector is 4" below the peak of the ceiling but not more than 12". General Contractor says it needs to be ceiling mounted.

Wall mounted is not an issue, but ceiling mounted means we'd need to plan ahead for a wire chase in the panel to account for the ceiling mounted smokie.

Any help is appreciated.

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Comments (5)

Ron Natalie
10 years ago
This is NOT an electrical code issue. The electrical code doesn't address this issue.

A single family residence appears to allow them to be on the wall. The few places it mentions ceiling it also says "or wall". The ICC pretty much dumps you on NFPA 72, which unfortunately, I don't have (and the NFPA website is currently crocked and I can't get at the free one).
bus_driver
10 years ago
Be sure to learn and follow the local code(s). It may be in multiple codes, all applicable to your premises, and they may conflict with each other.
NC building code permits smoke detectors on ceiling or wall, with specifications for placing them. But the housing codes for some NC cities requires them on the ceiling only. And different departments enforce the codes. So you build your NEW house with detectors on the walls. Building inspector approves and issues the CO. Then the housing inspector declares your NEW house to be uninhabitable. Your out? The building code requires that smoke detectors be hard-wired to the electrical system. The housing code permits use of battery operated detectors. So you add battery-operated units on the ceilings and now are in compliance. And you have detectors out the wazoo.
Ain't gubmint wonderful?
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The inspector that I dealt with let us attach the wires to something solid and then drop down to the tile as you suggested. However, you will find as I did that attaching a box to either fiberglass backed tiles or the stiffer tiles...there is no solid way to mount a box. You can try putting a piece of plywood behind the tile and use 1 1/2" - 2" screws to catch the plywood, but it's still not a good solution. I found the best way to do it is to replace part of a tile with plywood painted to match the ceiling tile. I cut off 12" from a tile and cut a piece of 1/2" plywood the same size. I mounted the box and smoke in the plywood section. Then I purchased an extra 2' piece of ceiling grid and treated the plywood piece as just another piece of ceiling tile. If you have a fuel fired heating system I might suggest you use a combination smoke/CO detector. And, if possible, interrconnect with smokes on the upstairs floors.
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"For safety reasons, smoke detectors should be on their own circuit. You don't want someone to trip the breaker with a hair dryer or something and cut the power to your home's smoke detectors." That is why AC powered smokes have a battery backup, and should start chirping if the AC is missing. "For safety reasons, smoke detectors should be on their own circuit. You don't want someone to trip the breaker with a hair dryer or something and cut the power to your home's smoke detectors." This is actually a better solution, and with the AFCI requirement the smokes need to be on the bedroom breaker anyway since they are an 'outlet.' The same thing goes for that freezer in the basement. It should share a light used on a daily basis. You NEED to know if power is off.
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Thank you for the responses. I bought all new units just alike. Didn't get the CO combo, with no natural gas in home don't think they are necessary....may be wrong on that. At any rate, I called our local fire department to ask about the best units to get and if they could recommend anyone to install for me. To my surprise they said they would come and install and they did yesterday afternoon! Two guys, one a volunteer and one on county payroll. Took them about 15 minutes. I paid close attention and bus driver, you are right, I could do it, and will in my house. Just to pass it along, check with your local fire department, they too may have a program to help you with these things. In fact he offered me three of the battery operated smoke detectors as part of their program. And again, tax dollars at work for ME. Thanks again for your responses. Murphy
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Ron Natalie
10 years ago
I finally got the NFPA 72 to load (NFPA moronic site). Smokes need to be on the ceiling or on the wall within 12" of the ceiling.

As pointed out, your local authority may have different ideas.
elltwo
10 years ago
Put in a call to the head of the local fire department and ask him about your problem. On a wall, "within 12" of the ceiling", is one foot away from where the ceiling meets the wall and is so specified because fresh air can be trapped in space between the top of the smoke and the ceiling surface, delaying an alarm. The trapped fresh air space is likely to have more depth at the apex of a cathedral ceiling and a smoke detector placed there would only be activated after quite a bit of smoke was generated, (to travel that high and then to overcome the pressure of the trapped air.) There is also "stack effect" to be considered, but it's unlikely in most single family homes.

If the the code and inspectors permit it and hold you to a standard that requires placement of a notification device at the highest point in the room, ask if a heat detector can be substituted.
Ron Natalie
10 years ago
No way by every code I've seen (including the ICC mentioned in the original post). You must have SMOKES in the sleeping areas. You can put additional heat detectors in if you want (and they're mandated in places like furnace rooms).

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