Can you move the door to the laundry up a few feet, so it's next to the laundry room sink? This would allow you to use the entire 'back wall' of the kitchen (next to the fridge) for your microwave, toaster, maybe a prep sink or the clean up sink and dishwasher. This would give you two walls for upper cabinets, too...well two and a half, with the range wall.

I'd move the range to the right about a foot, so the backsplash/wall would be behind it, but you could still easily interact with stools and family room area, while you're cooking and prepping. This will keep hot grease and other cooking dangers away from people on the stools.

Can you put your bookcases on the other side of the peninsula, facing the dining area? I think I'd move the wine fridge to where you have the trash, but have it facing the kitchen, with bookcases behind it. Using that back wall would really open up your plan. I like the possibilities! :)

If you do add the back wall of cabinets, there would be a small gap behind the fridge. Maybe something like this utility cabinet would work, where you have the slide out pantry? It could be pantry storage, too...but I thought I'd show it to you. It's from BH&G Renovation Style/Kitchens & Baths.
{{!gwi}}From Cottage house plans

Hmmm... trying to draw this out and not really liking how short the legs of the U would be. Clean up sink on right would be one of the major benefits, cost wise but will put it right behind range if I move door up, plus, not sure how I feel about clean up located in the major walk way.

I think you can still have your island. Here's my suggestion:

> recess the frig into the mudroom and put it where the DW is located on the above drawing. You won't have a pocket door but the door can open against the (south) wall
>move the range a little more to the right and extend that back wall into the family room a foot or more so you can have upper cabinets for glasses to the left of the range
>add an island 35" wide (24" cabinets facing the range wall and 12" bookcases along the other side) If each square is 6" and taking into account 1" overhangs this should give you two 45" aisles
> Island facing range wall from left to right would be DW, sink and then trash
>add another 12" to kitchen run (both range wall and island) and then put the microwave drawer in the island facing the frig. I think you can add that extra 12" in the kitchen with a banquette in the far left niche in the wall in the DR area
> add a prep sink left of the frig
> the wine frig would be at the end of the range wall facing the dining room
> where the frig is located now put in 21" deep pantry

Thank you very much for all the suggestions, but we do have some things that can't change.

Pam, if you are talking about moving the wall where it say 54", that is the outside, so I can't go anywhere north of that wall. We are NOT increasing the footprint of the house besides enclosing a porch that already has an existing high quality roof and full concrete slab foundation. That porch is to become the "family room."

The dining table and sideboard are bought and set. The table was actually my grandfather's, and the sideboard is a piece I fell in love with. We hate banquettes, so that isn't happening, no matter what it does for the kitchen.

I'm not trying to be difficult, but these are the realities of our restraints. As it is, moving the kitchen to the other side will require us to make major changes to the family room plan, such as where to put the fireplace and then re-lay out all of our furniture. I am willing to try to do that, but I can't afford to do a $100K job to the house then go out and buy all new furniture, we just can't do that right now. So, on some level, I have to work with what I've got.

I really like the idea of having the additional wall space, and I'm not sure why it never crossed my mind to move the kitchen to this side of the room before. I feel like there has to be a way, I'm just not seeing it yet, so please keep the ideas coming, just keep in mind our restrictions. Thanks!

controlfreak, I don't have much time this afternoon to rework this. I like the idea of moving the kitchen to this other side...seems more logical. I'd say to try to play with the entire 25'6" x 14'6" space as an eat-in kitchen, rather than just kitchen squished into one side. I also think you should bump the pocket door to mudroom up enough to give you a run of cabinets along the "south" wall, next to your fridge. I like the fridge there, for access to eating area. I think bookshelves can come in at the end of the fridge (someone JUST did this) or an end of cabinets run. Sink and DW against mudroom wall for clean up zone. Then the "north" wall is prep/cooking area.

I will check back in later to see if any of the gurus have drawn something up for you :)

Hang in there :)

Home, I agree with you, except the dining area is what it is, and it is important to me. We don't have a huge family, but we love having people over to eat, and we need that space for when we do. I love the idea of moving the door up just enough to make better use of the "south" wall, and keeping the fridge where it is (good call on putting a bookshelf there) but the 21" jog is throwing me off, I don't know how to incorporate that properly without things looking too weird. I hope a guru takes a look and comes up with something I haven't. :)

Control- I completely understand what you're saying about the furniture. When my mom got her house, she designed it to suit her existing furniture...so she wouldn't have to spend more money.

It didn't seem as though the laundry room was 'done' yet, so I'm hoping that moving the door is a possibility. You said you need 13' for the dining area...and it says 25'6", so I added 6" to the kitchen peninsula...and 6" to the other side, which gives you room for cabinets and bookcases. It leaves 7'6" between the two legs of the U, if I measured correctly :)

Here's a rough idea. Mainly, I wanted to show you the back wall, with the fridge, microwave, sink, dishwasher and bank of drawers. The trash could be under the sink, with a larger trash, by the prep sink.

I put the wine fridge at the end of the peninsula, facing the dining area, with open shelves on the kitchen side. Great for extra mixing bowls or more cookbooks. The rest of the peninsula (dining side) is for your cookbooks.

On the kitchen side, I don't know what you want to do with the corners. Instead of taking one foot off each corner (for a lazy susan) maybe have it pull out from one side only, so you could have more drawer space on the other. I don't know what they're called, but I've seen lots of 'corner options' on previous threads.

The prep sink and range can go wherever you like...but there's more than enough room for both and plenty of prep space. While the island design was nice, it was a bit cramped, if you're cooking and someone else is doing dishes. In this layout, the dishes are on the back wall (easy to get to from the dining area) and that sink also serves as your 'snack area' sink. The microwave, toaster (toaster oven?) etc. will be back there...so kids will not be working in your main cooking/prep area.

Unless you see a LOT of traffic, between the garage/laundry and the rest of the house, I think this will work out very well for you. Also, since you have great prep/cooking area, between the sink and range...if also gives you a nice baking area, on the peninsula. Hope this helps :) {{!gwi}}From Cottage house plans

Thanks Lavender, I needed it drawn out for me. Still not sure how I feel about putting the sink on the south wall. I guess if I wan to use that wall, the only thing I can do is pull the fridge out about a foot. . . . that's what threw me off, that seemed like a waste.

I put the wine fridge where I did, because I thought it would make good use of the one corner. It's the other corner I'm not sure how to use.

And you are right, the mudroom isn't' done yet, and you didn't steal any space from my dining area. :)

I'm not sure how far out the fridge would be, but maybe you could have a pull-out broom closet or pantry? That could slide out, behind the fridge, to the right of pantry/bookshelves, at the end of the fridge?

Storage can be so creative these days. Like the base corners of the base cabinets. They're excellent storage spaces, if you can get to them, easily. There have been some threads with some great solutions to this, so you might want to try a search or post a new topic.

Ok, I'm still drawing it out, but here's what I have:

Bottom ("south") wall from left to right - 10" deep tall bookshelf facing hall, standard depth fridge, 6.5' of base cabs containing MW drawer, wine fridge and a drawer base with uppers above and 30" tall pantry cab with ROTS on the end. Right or "East" wall from bottom to top - DW then sink then corner lazy susan. Top wall is where I go back and forth - if I ignore symmetry and put the range against the wall, we not only save money by not having to get an island hood, but we could potentially not replace the range at this time (our current one could not go on a peninsula due to controls at the back). Would I regret doing this? If I have it to the right against the wall, there'd only be room for the lazy susan to the right of the range, then drawer bases (whatever would fit per cabinet designer) to the left (about 4 ft. of space). Then put the prep sink in the Left corner with trash pull out just below it and additional drawer base at the end.

Thoughts? I need to take a picture of my sloppy drawing. I also need to find the best spot for some vertical storage....

I completely understand having some non-negotiables :)

I didn't realize this was your primary eating space; I thought one of those doorways led to a dining room, so I figured you might make the kitchen space a less-formal eating area. But I have an eat-in kitchen and can't imagine not having it.

I actually think you go go with a u-shaped plan like lavender's OR you could drop the peninsula part and go with an horizontal island in the middle instead, sort of like you showed in the last thread you posted, but of course, differently laid out this time around. Which would you prefer?

I've always liked fromthesouth's stand-alone clean-up sink wall. Yours could look like this, but have the fridge at the end of the run. And then pantry/storage behind the fridge, in the empyt area where you pulled it out from the wall. And bookshelves directly next to it.

Another kitchen I have been thinking of was jbrodie's, specifically her island with raised bookshelves at the entry end of it. Your peninsula end could be like this?

And this bookshlef at the end of her run could be what you pop on the end next to your fridge?

Here is a link that might be useful: jbrodie's finished kitchen

controlfreakecs - I was talking about extending the INTERNAL wall (make the 54" wall to maybe 64" or 68" long so that the range would be completely against the wall). You could also extend the wall in ll layout so that the range would be completely behind the wall. I think it may look awkward seeing only part of a hood.

I really like LL's latest layout. It cuts off a small amount of the "u" but gives you a much longer lower wall of useful cabinets and sink. If you're worried about traffic from the mudroom you could cut off a little more of the sides of the "u".

Another idea using LL's layout would put the prep sink on the peninsula or where the range is and put the range where the prep sink is located. You could move the wine fridge to the upper left corner where you had it located before and not deal with a blind corner there.

Also, your measurements to me don't add up. On one sheet the room is 25' 6" (306"). On that same drawing you have 16'6" opening to the LR plus the 54" wall which would make it 252". There's a niche but in your previous drawings it looked like 25" not 54". 29" is a lot of space to lose.

Is this the idea? I didn't throw in your prep sink, not sure where you wanted it?

This place is truly amazing! Home4all, you pretty much nailed it! Here's my rough drawing.

Pam - closing up some of the opening to the family room is something I'd have to negotiate with DH - the bar area and the wine fridge are his 2 big things and he thinks I'm a little off my rocker with suddenly deciding to change everything now anyway. ;) I made the "north" wall the length to the outside wall, not the length it was when designed to be the eating area. It also maximizes the bar to allow for 3 seats, which was what we hoped for, minimum. Does that help the measurement issue? The 25'6" is correct, that plan allowed 12' for the dining area, but we had decided that was a bit tight for our existing furniture.

Home- Nice layout! I really like all the example pictures you posted, too. It's so much easier to see if something will work in the space, with a picture.

My only concern is no sink in the fridge/snack area, but that's what Control said she wanted. There was a prep sink in the snack area, in the earlier plan (kitchen on other side) and I wonder if it's going to be too crowded having both sinks (and dishwasher, etc.) so close to the cooking area.

Personally, I'd like to see a window on the short wall (between the laundry room and family room) and somehow incorporate the prep sink into this corner. A view and more light would be really nice. If Control doesn't mind an 'island' hood, than I'd think about putting the range on the peninsula, so you can see into the dining area and the family room. Since you don't have seating planned for this area (stools on family room side) it would be a lot safer with the range here...and you could have bookshelves/display facing the dining room. A raised backsplash would hide a bit of the mess and keep things from falling off the back of the counter, too.

Maybe something like this? Yet again, I'm running out of white out, so I hope this is readable. Basically, same back wall, with prep sink in the corner (like Circuspeanut) and a window on the side overlooking the backyard...and the range on the peninsula. The wine fridge is by the door to the mudroom, but still handy to the prep sink. There should be room for some big drawers, where the range used to be...and between the wine fridge and the prep sink. A trash could go just left of the prep sink (to the right of the drawers) and still have a lazy susan in the other corner. You should have at least one, just for the extra storage...great for punch bowls and other rarely used items. {{!gwi}}From Cottage house plans

I was also thinking she might to place the cooktop there, Lavender. Just because she started out saying she wanted to cooking/prep space to be open to where the people were, in the family room area.

Well, I showed DH my plan from Tue, May 15, 12 at 17:05 and HE LOVED IT!! Thinks the whole thing is a great idea and completely had my back when we broke the news to the GC. Can't wait to see what his cabinet guy comes up with based on my general idea. Looking to start when GC gets back from vacation 3rd week of June!

Congrats! I'm so glad your husband liked your plan so much...and I think it will work so much better, in your space :)

Just in case your cabinet guy doesn't share your vision...you probably have this already, but here's Circuspeanut's corner prep sink. It really does look great in the corner! {{!gwi}}From Kitchen plans

Thanks Lavender! I love Circuspeanut's kitchen, one of my favorites.

Just an FYI, my kitchen looks a lot like Lavender_lass's plan from May 15, 12 at 14:39, except the prep sink is in a corner sink cabinet...and we absolutely love the layout...it's so very functional and allows several of us to work in the kitchen at one time w/o getting in each others way. (I think we have 2 feet or so more space b/w the legs of the "U", but I don't think those 2' would make that much of a difference.)

The one concern I have about the 17:05 layout is that the cleanup sink is crowding the range and Cooking Zone...will there be enough floor space for someone to be working at the cleanup sink while someone else is cooking on the range?

I have a prep sink in the corner of a peninsula just like circuspeanuts, with my range in the same place as you have planned. I like it because it allows me to be near the conversation while prepping meals when we have guests. My eating area is where yours is, just on the other side of the peninsula with my sitting area beside it. My old kitchen didn't have the prep sink and was set up with the one sink where your clean-up sink is and the range in the same spot so then I was always prepping to the right of the range which is quite far from conversation. Hopefully, you can fit the prep sink in, it will be well worth it.

You know Beuhl, I realized later that your layout is nearly identical to the one Lavender suggested. Is that a major walkway in your kitchen? I'm afraid of a bottleneck especially when the DW is open. We have enough on that right side of the U to fit the sink. We talked to our GC about leaving more wall space in order to center the range a little more and still have the range/hood fully against the wall.

blfenton - the prep sink is a "must have" for me, kinda like the wine fridge for DH. I don't anticipate any issues with putting it there in the corner. I feel like it is the perfect place to prep, but also the perfect spot to fill with ice and keep a few beers or bottles of champagne cold when entertaining. :)

Control- I think you might be a little tight, with the ROTS, pocket door and dishwasher, when you count trim pieces and countertop overhangs. However, I think (?) you only need one foot on each side, for the lazy susan. If that's true, you should be fine. Just wanted to bring that up, in case anyone with more expertise, wanted to address it.

Also, while I really like the corner prep sink, just another question (I think it was mentioned earlier) do you have enough room for one person to stand in front of the range, while another person is in front of the main sink, leaning down to load the dishwasher? It looks a little tight...with each square equal to 6".

That being said...would it work to move the range to the left a few feet...and move the prep sink down to the end of the peninsula? It would mean a different hood, but you could see into the family room (again) while cooking.

It would also bring the prep sink closer to the fridge/snack area and you could put the wine fridge back in the corner, where you have the prep sink. The advantages...wine fridge closer to entertaining area, bigger drawers in the snack area and a bigger pantry, too. Just an idea :)