strumhead - I wish I could post pictures, but I can't. I agree that it's hard to get a feel for things without them, and it doesn't help that I can't figure out a way to post a more legible copy of the proposed plan! The front entrance is definitely a problem for a number of reasons. What I've drawn is an improvement to what is there now but but may not be the ideal solution. It is the lowest cost one I could think of; I suspect any major/expensive change would only be viable years down the road.... There are no sidewalks on these streets and street parking is restricted, so the entrance walkways are all oriented to the driveways as that is primary means of access. I agree that it is better to get rid of the maple (which I think is a wimpy, unattractive one!) to allow for more flexibility re width etc. Now to convince the owners, who are reluctant to remove the previous owners plantings, to remove such a visible one...! I don't like the path in the woodland area as it appears on the plan. The reality would likely be different as it will depend on what makes sense when we actually lay it out. The overriding issues that the squiggly line of the path was trying to show is that the path needs to sort of zig-zag across and down the slope to make walking it easier and also to minimize washouts by slowing down the speed of waterflow in a rain; provide access to as many of the plantings as possible to make maintenance easier; provide access to compost bins; etc. Part of the reason the path loops around the tree is actually to provide access to the back side of the saskatoonberries for harvesting. The actual eventual path will undoubtedly be different than the rather awkward one shown :-) (Part of my problem is I'm still learning how to make this cursed software draw the curves I can see in my head!) The grass patch running up the slope to the back fence is somewhat necessary 'breathing space' I think. The owners would be very intimidated with even more of the yard planted than it already shown! Also, while the kids are still young, they expect to use that slope in winter as a place for the kids to slide down. So grass is the best thing there. Since the area is sloped where the veggie garden is drawn, only the bottom strip is flat enough to use for easy planting. That is, in part, because there is the remains of what was obviously once a raised bed made from 6x6 wood. At this point, they are unlikely to be strongly motivated to go to the effort to remove that, so using it as the edge of the veggie bed seemed the best option. Essentially much of what I've drawn/proposed is seeking to minimize the work - and cost - involved in giving what's there a stronger shape/structure while making it suit their current needs, without causing issues for their future (somewhat undefined) plans, while also keeping maintenance relatively easy/simple. As I've said many times before - I have no intention of ever doing this sort of thing professionally! If this was my own garden, there are a lot of things that I would do that I have to eliminate because I know that they would consider it too much work. It would drive me crazy to be constantly running up against that sort of constraint, which would undoubtedly be the case when doing this sort of thing professionally. I'm definitely a gardener (who thinks a lot about the design of the garden). And, I'm very aware that most people do not garden - and have no interest in gardening - to the extent/level of detail that I do :-)

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