Looks like she is getting more comfortable with you, that's great.

I love the picture of your bed ... I have a King for myself and the 5 cats, the 2 large dogs are relegated to their very comfy couches downstairs. If the two 80+ pound dogs also slept in my bed, there really would be no room for me!

Love, love, love the pictures....We just have a regular size bed and with 2 of the cats sleeping with us, it's crowded....
It looks like Ruby is quite content....So glad to hear things are going good.....

Sue,

How is Momma Dora?

I'm working at home today in my office, forcing Ruby to be in the same room with me all day. (I'm so mean!)
I shared a bit of my scrambled eggs w/ham with her this morning. Of course she didn't come out to get it. I put them near the dresser she hides behind. When I left the room for a bit, she came out and gobbled them down!

Mindy

Mindy, Don't let her get to you....Eventually, she'll come around and probably won't leave you alone...You know these cats have minds of their own and we human will never figure them out....I have one, I want to bad to be able to pick her up and cuddle, but that's a no no...I can pet her, on the run, but don't try to pick her up...But we love them no matter what and continue to treat them special....
You both are doing so well.....Do these furbabies really know how lucky they are......

Well Mindy, looks like you got a good picture of her and not a blur on the run. that's great. I love the pic of the bed. I'd be sleeping on the floor if there was no room for me, just to give those babies a soft place to sleep!

Momma Dora is coming along. She now has the run of the second floor and is much better at night when not confined. I just leave a couple of gates on the stairs so that she can venture downstairs if she wants, and can escape my Boxer if he chases her (he can't jump - he's chubby).

Today is the first time I left her with only one gate in the doorway of the guest room (so she feels secure)and a couple going down the stairs. Only my Sophie can jump, but she doesn't seem all that interested.

I will be on pins and needles until I get home. I feel that since I can't force her to come down, I still have to keep things changing slightly or we'll both be stuck doing the same thing all the time.

Her babies are doing well. Buster did go to boot camp but is back and now Figaro is more wary than before. He was doing fine when Buster was away, snuggling and seeking out his new mommy for long naps on her lap. Now they spend all their time playing, and since not caged, harder to snag (might have to get them back in the cage for a refresher course). They weight 5.1 and 4.9 lbs and will be neutered next week.

I give Momma Dora regular updates on her babies. I wish she understood. I pray for her to be at peace in my home...it hurts to think she is still unsettled.

keep up the good work Mindy. Glad you restarted this thread!

Sue

Now I will have to read part I,II. The picture of the crowd is great.

Carla

Good to see updates on both Ruby and Momma Dora (or is she called Madeira now?)

Love that pic! Mindy, what are the names of your other furkids? Are both the B&W cats boys? And is the little brown darling using something as a pillow? That's just so darned cute!!

Only one of my 5 cats sleeps with me, inside the comforter, between my feet ... how I wish ALL of them would do that!

Pranjal

Pranjal,

My other kitties, the black and whites, are siblings. Lucy is on the left back by the brown pillow, and Louie is in his spot at the front right of the bed.
The little brown dog, Emma (red mini doxie) is laying on her beloved chewie. She's a chewie fanatic. Theodore is my long haired mini doxie, laying right by Louie the cat, and finally there is Remy, laying in front of my pillow. Normally Remy lays up on top of my pillow above my head when I'm in the bed. She's a terrier mix. Part Yorkie, part Scottie.

Ruby continues to progress. I can now stand or sit in front of the gate (on my side) and she will stay where she is and not run and hide behind the dresser. I've tried the toy on a stick thing dangling to get her attention, but so far, she hasn't gone for it and come up to the gate.
I am being patient and I know it's only a matter of time.

Mindy

Mindy, You certainly are doing the right thing...You really have a loving family and eventually, Ruby will be on that bed with the rest of them....
Sue, I can just hear you talking to Dora, telling her about the babies...Don't you wonder what's going on in their heads? Clancy and I have conversations all the time and I swear, he knows what I'm saying and answers in different tones...Of course he's probably thinking to himself, "If I humor this old crazy lady, she'll give me some chicken"....Twisted right around his little paw, not me!
Keep up the good work, Ladies

Ruby's getting braver every day. I think she likes getting her picture taken.

Mindy

Oh Mindy, that's fantastic. I can see the love in her eyes. Love the bowl!!!!

Sue

Irish was asking how the babies were doing, so i guess we need to move this thread up.

Momma is doing well, although she's hit a plateau of sorts. She has no interest in leaving the second floor. When I am home the only gate that stays in place is the one to her room, this way she can escape Boxer should he venture up to her room.

Last night I slept in my own bed! Momma had the run of the 2nd floor and could have slept in my room, but she opted to hang out on her window seat and do her usual thing. She came by at 5 Am to play but for the most part stayed to herself.

She's here with me now, intently looking out the window.

So while I am making changes it doesn't look like Momma cares to mix it up with Boxer and Sophie, but that's fine. If this is as good as it gets, I'm fine with that as long as she is fine with it.

Her babies are thriving. I hadn't seen them for a few days and when I walked into the den where they're sequestered (its the heart of the home so they are right in the middle of all the action)they didn't run and hide or act skittish. They just hung and only moved when I went to touch them. they're pretty easy to snag now.

Their mommy scoops them up all the time (she recuperating from rather extensive foot surgery and these babes get lots of attention)and kisses them until they squirm away or fall asleep! They are very active, with frequent mid-air body slams and are quite the poop machines.

Momma just came over and licked me, guess she feels left out or saw me typing about her babies!

Gotta run. Will post pics next week. i am sure it won't be hard getting Momma to pose on her window perch! If the babies hold still for a minute, I'll get them too!

Have a great week.
sue

!

Sue, So glad things are quieting down or maybe just more content...I wouldn't worry about Momma wanting to stay in "her" room...She probably feels that's her safe room...One of the last one's I trapped is pretty much that way...She was the shyest and the wildest of the 2 and I kept her in my sewing room/spare bedroom until she was comfortable with me and the rest of the zoo...But, she still spends most of her time in that room, looking out the window..She is a dainty, sweet little tuxedo and her fur is just like velvet...I want so badly to hold her but that's just not her...She'll wrap herself around your legs and let you pet her, but don't try to pick her up...So, I go on being content just talking to her and petting and knowing she's having a good life....
You've come a long way with your "Momma"....Keep up the good work!

For the past two days, I've put Louis, my disinterested in the new kitten kitty, in with Ruby for a while a few times per day.
Ruby seems to really like the company when I do that. She comes out and follows him around. If Louis ignores her and turns his back on her, she playfully swats his bum to get his attention.
I sat in there myself the first time I put him in, up against the wall, across the room, and Ruby came out to see him. If I attempted to get up, she'd take off and hide for a minute, but I think having Louis in there with her occasionally is doing her good.

Lucy, my female tuxedo, still gets ornery on the other side of the gate. She's going to be the challenge.
I'm considering trying to put Emma, my little red mini doxie, in there next with her. Emma could really care less about cats and Ruby always runs up to the gate when Emma comes up to it. I think she likes her.

Mindy

You're both doing great with those girls!

Sue, it's very common for there to be an evolution of relationships and behaviors over time. I've had newbies start out very submissive and timid and turn out to be real bullies within a year or two. I've also had bullies mellow out and adopt a more peaceful lifestyle after a period of time. Dora today may be very different from Dora next month, next year, or next decade. The trick is to not have expectations and to take each day, each mood, and each behavior as they come. It sounds to me like she's adapting beautifully. You're doing all the right things to provide her with both safety and freedom to find her place in your family.

Mindy, you, too, are doing all the right things. I think it's wonderful that Louis is willing to be a peaceful ambassador for Ruby. One of the very best strategies for winning over my ferals has been having them watch how comfortable the other animals are with me. They learn so much from each other, and one of the most critical things they learn is who is a friend and who is a threat. Louis will teach Ruby that you are a friend. Emma will do the same. I suggest you stay in the room whenever you have one of the other animals in the room with Ruby. If she wants to spend time with the other animal, she's going to have to accept your presence to do it. Tit for tat. It'll also give her more opportunity to watch the other animals interact with you.

Just so you know, Ruby may always run from you. Timid cats sometimes never get past the instinct to run when approached. Phantom, Feather, and Sweet Sweet all still usually run when I approach them, but they have no problem approaching me at all. Never take instinct personally. You WILL win Ruby's love and affection, but you will never overcome her instinct.

Congratulations, Ladies! Good news all around!

Laurie

Thanks Laurie.

Well, wonder of wonders...for the second day in a row my bully tuxedo Boxer came calling for Momma and plopped himself on the bed with her.. Him at the top of the bed, and Momma at the bottom, with me and Momma's ball-on-a-track toy in the middle. They were both stretched out and relaxed. Occasionally Momma would play with her toy or clean herself, and Boxer too.

They did this yesterday morning, and again last night and this morning. At one point Momma left the room to follow an imaginary friend, and Boxer began playing with her toy.

I make sure to give Boxer praise, love talk, and good belly rubs while he's there so he knows he's still my boy. Momma doesn't seem timid of him at all. I wonder if they've been canoodling while I am at work either through the one gate I leave up or if Momma ventures out while Boxer is visiting. quite amazing.

Buster, Momma's holdout kitten may have also completely surrendered. Although he is easily snagged and spends lots of time with his human mommy, he showed his belly for the first time yesterday completing his bonding with mommy.

It was just over a month ago that we brought these loves into our homes and the changes have been incredible.

Love, patience, and time...a perfect recipe.

s

What great news from both of you.....I get shivers when I read these posts, lol...I can just imagine how you both feel...You both have life long lovable fur babies....
Sue, you're right about that recipe.....

It's been 3 days in a row now that Boxer comes to spend time with Momma Dora. Here's some pics...

My chubby boy Boxer's in the foreground:
{{!gwi}}

Momma likes the camera:
{{!gwi}}

Play time:
{{!gwi}}

Nap time:
{{!gwi}}

Nap time for Boxer...play time for Momma:
{{!gwi}}

Patiently waiting for treats:
{{!gwi}}

Window time for Momma:
{{!gwi}}

Great Pics Sue! Love them!

Ruby has been introduced to Louis, my male tuxedo, many times.
She's met Emma, my little red mini doxie about 3 times, and met Theodore, my long haired mini doxie once.
She was curious about them all, but appears to really like Louis the best.

I am working from home today, so I am spending lots of time in the office with her.

Momma Dora seems to be fitting in great. Boxer was the one you were worried about, right? I'm hoping my Lucy takes to Ruby the way your Boxer took to Dora. Lucy still does body slams occasionally against the gates hissing at Ruby.

Have a good day!

Mindy

Great pictures, Sue...Boy these fur babies have come a long way, haven't they? I love seeing these posts...Keep up the good work, ladies....

Here's some pics of Momma Dora's kittens. As you can see, they are quite relaxed in their new home. They've come a long way....
Figaro snuggles up to mommy's leg:
{{!gwi}}

Figaro conquoring Mount Couch:
{{!gwi}}

Snooze time for Buster:
{{!gwi}}

Buster fell asleep draped over mommy's arm:
{{!gwi}}

So adorable Sue.....

I'm glad things are working out.

I think I'm going to try to introduce Ruby to Lucy this week. Everyone but her has met Ruby from my gang, and are just fine. The dogs could care less about her. Even my little terrier that I sort of wondered about. I had her in the office with me with Ruby and she wasn't even curious about her. She just ignored her.
Lucy is the one that worries me. Sometimes it looks like they are playing through the gates with each other, but at times I hear her do body slams, which makes me think maybe not so much friendliness in those times.

Also, my son broke our good digi-cam, so I will have to find the old one before I can post any more pics.

Mindy

Just love the kitty pictures....Boy they have come a long way, haven't they? They look so content....

Good luck Mindy! I find that if there's no growling or hissy, we're in pretty good shape. Not sure what the body slam is about, but perhaps Laura or Irish can weigh in on whether that is aggressive behavior or now.

We had a minor setback during the overnight where a few skirmishes broke out. No gate and a full house in the guest room.

When I drifted off to sleep Sophie, the my 12-year old tuxedo princess, was on the radiator cover getting toasted, Momma was wandering around, and Boxer was on the bed. All was well. Full house, no problems, everyone in their own space.

I awoke to some growling (Momma) and had to distract them from going any further. Fell back asleep and awoke to Boxer running after Momma and then trying to stuff himself under the bed to catch her.

After admonishing Boxer I put the gate up to keep him out and Momma seemed more relaxed.

This morning Boxer wanted to come visit (or did he want to get to her leftover food??) and I wouldn't let him in. Momma seems more relaxed with the gate knowing that chubby boy can't scale it. I left the gate up this morning so she could decide when to interact with him.

I really don't know if they were fighting, I just heard the scuffle. I assume it would have escalated where he to get to her.

I'm fine with leaving the gate up but I have got to get into my own bed and close the door so I don't keep waking up all freaking night. I'm going to try it tonight (I feel she'll think I abandoned her) but my fear is that she will make noise trying to get into our room, and then me and DH are up. One of us being sleep deprived is one too many as it is.

I am trying to keep it all in perspective. Things could be much worse at this point.

Sue

Ok, just when you think you've seen it all.

Boxer had a time out for a day or two after his skirmish with Momma, but now is allowed to visit with Momma and all has been well. I think he really wants to get a close look, but she doesn't trust him so just growls and hisses.

Anywhooo, this morning, wonder of wonders, I saw Momma coming UP the stairs to the 2nd floor, which meant she had ventured downstairs for the first time since I snagged her in September...perhaps to find her chubby BFF.

She then went back down and when I got to the foyer, Boxer was staring at the coat closet. Of course she was in there, so I put myself between him and the closet and gave her an out. She ran up the stairs. No confrontation.

So, I think they are doing a little dance and perhaps are on the brink of becoming friends.

She has also been great at night. I felt guilty and for the last 2 or 3 mights have been sleeping in the guest room and frankly she's been fine. No craziness and I am actually getting some sleep. She loves when I pet her (just 6 weeks ago I couldn't so much as touch her) and rub her ears. She also loves toasting on the radiator cover!

So I'd say we're doing alright!

Mindy, how's the zoo on your end?

s

Sue,

My zoo is doing fine. Everyone has met Ruby now, including Lucy (twice).
There is a little growling and hissing coming from Lucy when I bring her into the office, but not as bad as I feared. She really intimidates Ruby, and Ruby pretty much hides when Lucy is in the room, with the exception of when she hears Lucy munching on her food. That gets her curious enough to come out from behind the dresser and peer around the corner.
Lucy wont hardly come near me anymore. She's smart! She stays away so I can't catch her and bring her in with Ruby. I was going to make them spend a little time together each day this week, but I've only been able to catch her twice, so it's not exactly proceeding as I had planned.

Mindy

Mindy,

Apparently these cats have no respect for our plans!

Momma let me plant kisses on her head today which is another milestone.

I reminded her that if she were still outside I wouldn't be able to find her torti self with all the leaves on the ground.

I think back to when I first started feeding her and she would wait in the nearby bushes until I was out of sight before she and her babies would come and eat. I am so thankful she and her peanuts are adjusting to their new pampered life. They can just be happy cats now, with no stress. Sue

Hi All,
Such beautiful little kids.
I decided to post my question here because obviously you folks love pets, and it is a live thread.
I will be 70 in January; live alone in my family home which has 4 bedrooms and a finished basement. I have a 10 year old German Shepherd, a 4 year old Mini Schnauzer, an 18 year old Tiger cat, an 11 year old grey cat, a 1 1/2 year old calico and, heaven forbid, found a 5 week old kitten in my front yard three days ago. I am in good health, do my own housework, drive anywhere I want to go and keep the pets I have clean, groomed, well fed and as happy as possible. I mention the house size only because I feel I have ample room for these little critters and we are not crowded or anything. I can afford their food right now and don't worry about that. I have monthly expenses providing medications for the oldest two cats and the Shepherd, but we get by. I tried to find the owner of the kitten, but no luck; I think it was just put out. It does not smell like it has spent much time outside and was pretty clean, tho had fleas. The vet wormed it, gave a flea treatment, checked it for feline leukemia, etc., clipped its nails and....sorry for running on. My question is: Do you think it is right for someone my age to take in a kitten this age? Suppose it lives to a ripe old age, like my Tiger. In 18 years I will be either 88 or, well, dead. Is it fair to the pets? My kids would take the dogs, but I doubt they would take any of the cats except the really old one if anything should happen to me. I am not being morbid, but just practical I guess. Should I try to find a home for this kitten? I like it a lot and the others have accepted it well. Just wondered if you guys have experienced anything that would help me.
Thanks a bunch
mh

mh, I applaud both your compassion and your common sense. I understand exactly where you're coming from. My mother is in her mid-80's with several recurring and/or ongoing medical issues. She lives alone but in the same town as one of my siblings. She has always been an animal person and served for many years on the board of directors of her local humane society. I think she was right around your age when she decided that she would adopt only geriatric animals, in spite of the fact that I and several of my siblings assured her that her animals would always have homes with us in the event of her death. Still, Mom wanted to do everything reasonably possible to insure that she would outlive her pets so as not to leave her children with the responsibility of their care.

Right now, Mom has two geriatric cockers who she adopted from a rescue gal who agreed to take the dogs back should Mom become unable or no longer around to care for them.

Although I am only 53, I, too, have set certain adoption criteria with an eye to the future of my 4-legged family. I have dogs, cats, and horses. I decided several years ago that I would no longer keep young horses. I do not wish to commit to cleaning my barn, hammering ice out of frozen water buckets, and hauling 40# hay bales in -25 degree winter weather when I'm in my 80's. So I will now only accept a maximum of three horses under my care at a time, and all horses must be a minimum of 20 yrs old. In a few more years, I'll raise that age minimum to 25.

I have also set a weight limit on my dogs. The door to my house is at the top of 7 steps. Several years ago my 65 lb Moondog lost the ability to navigate the stairs under her own power, so I had to carry her up and down those 7 steps several times a day. It was then that I realized I could no longer comfortably handle the needs of larger, geriatric dogs in this house, esp. in winter with snow and ice covered steps. So my max dog size now is 50 lbs, and that will be decreasing with the next generation.

But back to your issue. If you can find a suitable future home for your kitten, should it become necessary, then I see no reason to deny yourself the pleasure of his/her companionship. Do you have or can you recruit potential adopters other than your family? If not, rehoming the kitten now may be the kinder option.

You are a wise woman to consider these issues now.

Laurie

Laurie,
Thank you for your kind and thoughtful answer. It was a big help to me. I decided to talk to my younger daughter about my concerns and she said, "Mother,don't be silly. Of course we will take care of the little ones if anything should happen; just don't let anything happen." :-) She just worries that I will be cash strapped and made me promise not to bring home any more pets; of course, I definitely won't do that. It's the medical aspect that worries me a little, but I carry insurance on the dogs and will just have to hope for good health with the others. Once again, thank you for your reply. Good luck with your little ones as well.
P.S. Sorry if I high jacked the thread about the feral kitties. Please continue with it. Thanks, MHB

mary helen,

Though I am younger than you, I have more pets that anyone in my family. I asked my sisters if they would care for my animals in case of my death, and both said yes.

So, I put it in my will. And put it in my will that whoever took care of my pets, or found my pets good homes would have a fund for the animals care. Mine is a little more complicated since my pets includes dogs, cats and miniature donkeys.

The dogs would be easy, the cats not so easy, and my donkeys would be a challenge.

Good for you though to think about their future. Hopefully you will outlive all of them!

Mary Helen,
I have nothing to add because Laurie and Pam covered it.

Just wanted to say that it is so wonderful to meet such warm, caring people such as yourself, and all the contributors, in this forum.

Sue

Laurie, Pam and Sue,
You guys are all great and do restore my faith in humans.
Sometimes I think the world is full of baddies and then I meet, in a way, folks like you and realize again there are some lovely people on this planet. Good luck to all of us, and our beloved animals. :-)

Update - Ruby has officially become a member of the crew.
The basement door has been closed permanently for a while and the baby gates are down, so she has free roam of the upstairs and main level.
Everyone gets along fine with her. Even Lucy for the most part. There have been a few little hissing spats, and Lucy is still obsessed with her.
With the exception of once, Ruby has remained upstairs, even though she is no longer confined behind gates. She still spends all of her time either in the office or in my bedroom next door, primarily under the bed. She loves to wiggle the beadspread so one of my pups comes up to inspect and she can then pop them (playfully) upside the head.

The other two cats for some reason have decided to start using her litterbox instead of their own for some reason, and it's much smaller. I'm not too pleased about that. They are also helping themselves to her food. Oh well, a small price to pay I guess.

I've still never touched her, but she's out, so I imagine continuing to be patient will pay off eventually. She seems happy now that she can be with the other animals. I do try to shut her back in the office if no one will be home for extended periods, but I haven't always been successful getting her back in there, and so far, so good.
I'll bet in another week, she'll start to venture downstairs.....

Mindy

Great news, Mindy....Ruby is making herself right at home, isn't she? As far as touching her, that might take awhile...I've had 1 little girl for 3 years and probably have only picked her up 3-4 times and that's because I caught her off guard...But she does let me pet her, at arms' length and she loves it..In her own way, my Kelly is a very loving fur baby with the sweetest little meow. We love her just the way she is...If it ever gets to the point where I can pick her up, that will be an extra bonus...
We also take care of 3 ferals and just in the last couple of months, I've been able to pick up the oldest female and she's be around for 8-9 years...Her 6 yr. old son loves to be "loved"...Each fur baby is different.....
Love to hear the stories of Ruby and Dora.....

Mindy,

How wonderful. Its incredible how things change with time. I am so glad your babies are working things out.

I can hardly believe the change in Momma and her babies in the two months since we brought them into our homes. I was just with her babies last night and it is incredible how they have bonded with their new parents.

The early days were incredibly stressful. Without the experience and guidance from the wonderful people in this forum and my local cat rescue wonders, I never would have known how to proceed or to know what to expect.

Their experience gave me hope, and that hope turned into a beautifully adjusting cats who will live the rest of their years as pampered furballs who never have to worry about where their next meal will come and will always be warm and cozy.

My heart is so full when I look at Momma and see no more stress, and at her babies who have not a care in the world.

Oh, one more piece of progress...today the kitties will be exposed to a new room...the dining room. They've been limited to the den for the last two months, and are now ready for the next room.

I am going over to cat-proof it for their human mommy who is still recuperating from surgery, and then, tah dah, we get to move the kitty litter our of the den and into the dining room which gets less use than the den.

Should be interesting to watch them investigate their new space!

Mindy, all the best to your brood. My babies are all curled up on one bed in the guest room with Momma. Its all working out.

Sue

So happy to hear about all the fur babies...I can imagine what you are feeling, pretty nice, isn't it? I get that feeling, especially during the night, when I have 2 or 3 snuggling so close I can't move...I might not be able to sleep, but it's a good thing, as Martha would say.....
Thanks for keeping us posted....

{{!gwi}}

Here's a shot of Figaro last night. He seems to have an affinity for my husbands shoe and slept this way for quite a while...

I thought the worst was over but apparently we have one final surprise....my friends decided to have the kittens declawed this Tuesday when they go in for their neutering. They know my feelings on this and were not seeking my approval, just my understanding. They want the cats to have the run of the house (no way to close off the rooms where they can cause the most damage) and feel that this is their only recourse.

I am opposed to declawing having declawed my first cat, later realizing parts of his digits were removed (I thought they only took the nails) and have used other natural means to discourage bad behavior in my home, but its not perfect and I'm fine with that. They have rooms with fringe, chenille, and other fabrics and decor items that cats will be drawn to and they anticipate the worst.

Their decision was made a long time ago in their heads and validated when the cat rescue woman who helped out with Buster, saw their home and said that the cats would cause some damage and that sometimes it makes sense to declaw them.

This is incredibly frustrating for me in that I have no say and basically have to keep my mouth shut. All I could do is let them know this is a permanent decision and one they have to live with if things don't turn out the way they envision in their perfect-world head (I didn't actually say that last part).

I suggested they make sure the vet has performed a lot of laser surgeries because they do not want these cats to be practiced on.

I pray their personalities remain the same and that I never hear 'maybe we shouldn't have done it'. I just couldn't bear that.

Anyone have some encouraging words?

Sue

Sue, despite all the dire warnings and predictions of personality changes, bad behavior, litter box issues, etc., following declawing, those things usually do not happen (especially if it is done when they are young).

I have known a number of declawed cats over the years, and each one has had good litter box habits, and was no more ill-behaved than any other cat. Their mobility was fine as well--I have seen them jump from the ground to the top of a bookcase, and balance on the backs of chairs.

I am not saying this is a decision to be made lightly, believe me, but I just had to say something about this. A lot of those things being said (as reasons not to do it) just aren't the truth, and I often wonder if the people saying those things have ever even spent time with a declawed cat......

So glad to have found an update thread on Mindy's feral kitten, Ruby and here she is progressing. I am also glad to hear about Sue's feral mommy cat and two adorable kittens.

Please keep us all updated.