The short answer: The list exists to make money for lawyers. Lots of drugs on it are effective for a variety of indications, but may have side effects that can be exploited in lawsuits (which mostly benefit attorneys). Of course, this is an herbalism forum and neither I nor anyone else has suggested that posters take prescription drugs for bladder infections. What's been pointed out is that ACV has no demonstrated effectiveness (or any mechanism by which one could imagine it being effective) against such infections. Cranberry juice, on the other hand, does have some evidence in its corner. "I have noted that tests for natural medicines printed in the peer reviewed journals use doses clearly below the theraputic dose recognized by the majority of herbalists for their studies. I noted this in tests printed in the New England Journal of Medicine, no less. This crap must stop. That it goes on at all is WHY there is a growing number of people using herbal methods. I have also noted that herbs that are usually used in a mixture with other herbs are tested alone, in a way they are not used. This happens with tests of Chinese herbs." This would be an interesting subject for a separate discussion, to include any examples of studies supposedly using suboptimal doses of herbal drugs. As to mixtures, there are in fact numerous studies looking at them. What can be problematic is when a mixture contains one herb believed to be the effective agent and the rest may or may not be filler. The only way to know if the purported effective component works is to test it separately (it could be, for example, that one or more other components of the mixture actually interfere with the active herb which might work better on its own). One old-time example is the folk remedy for heart failure that an 18th century British physician, William Withering studied, and discovered that while multiple elements in the herbal mix were unrelated to its actions on the heart, one herb (digitalis) was responsible for increasing heart contractility. That discovery paved the way for digitalis' use in general medicine (at a standardized, safer and more effective dose than one could count on in a home remedy). Chinese herbal mixtures are notorious for containing elements not listed on the label. "Contamination" (apparently deliberate) has included powerful prescription drugs (such as indomethacin and steroids) or toxic herbs like aristolochia, so that would be a major reason for being careful about using such mixtures. To get back to the cry of "They don't want you to know" (about supposedly cheap and effective home remedies): this hits close to home for me and many other health professionals who have experienced serious illness in ourselves or close family and friends. My mother (a physician) died of colon cancer. Does anyone doubt that she would have been willing to use a cheap home cure and enthusiastically promoted it to others if one existed?

I don't usually show up on the conversations side but for some reason, did tonight. Try and tell my dog that homeopathic is placebo or quackery. Its worked on his bladder stones. My experience with classic homeopathy started when I needed an alternative for my thyroid as all conventional medicine that I tried failed. I was unable to tolerate any form of thyroid gland. I tried Synthroid, Armour, Naturethroid. I read extensively about it and found a doctor who used synthroid in drops so that I could use just one watered down drop. I could not tolerate one drop. The tiniest amount of synthroid OR descicated thyroid made me feel thyrotoxic and drove my thyroid stimulating hormone down to hypo levels within only a couple of days on the meds. My finger nails were peeling off and a I had a host of other symptoms. My TSH without being on the hormone at one point, got up to 40. (VERY high). I was miserable. I had tried at that point with Western medicine for many years. I contacted a classic homeopathist. At that time my dog was having blood in his urine upon emptying his bladder when he would mark. Dr. Alan was willing to advise me on my dog. He suggested a particular remedy. My dog had the remedy, and the blood ceased that day. He was symptom free for the next three months. He did need the remedy again, and had more results upon taking it.( It later came back here and there and right now is much better when he takes glucosomine, because that helps with the mucus on the lining of the bladder.) Next I took my assigned remedy. With no other treatment, my TSH went from 40 down to about 5.9, then down to 3.9, then 2.9. It remained there for over a year, and when it went up a bit again, I went back to the doc and we tried another remedy or two. It was better, but not optimum, and so the doc and I agreed that would try Chinese medicine. I switched to an Asian doctor and am taking Chinese tea and getting results there. And as with valinsv, the least amount of money I spent on docs was for the homeopathic one. I have also had full blown flu instantly leave once upon taking a homeopathic remedy. A lot of people find that hard to believe because it is true that the original substance is not in that vial or sugar pill. It is the essence of it or the energy, or vibration that is there. I would totally use Western medicine for certain things that it is good for, but I am not married to it at all. Pharma has a lot at stake and pays big money to disprove vitamin studies and show that vite e is "bad for you", etc. They have PR men that figure out how to promote diseases so that you will except the "cure" that they are selling. My brother is a pathologist and does not believe in homeopathic, chiropractic, or most natural cures. He would not even try one chiropractic adjustment for his trigeminal neuralgia which had become excruciating. So he elected to have a risky surgery that went behind his brain. Thank God it was successful. But my chiropractor who practices Upper Cervical adjustments using a technique called Advanced Orthogonal, cured a patient of the excruciating pain associated with the ailment. The pain disappeared six weeks after the patient received his adjustment. My brother felt if would not work on him because he does not believe in that. However, when my mom fell on her face (86 years old) I took her to this chiro, and she is doing better than ever, and we put the walker away. Here is a link that might be useful: How to brand a disease and sell a cure

Poor Coda, POOR YOU!! What a mess. I'm sure the stones are not very comfortable. I've been investigating various foods (one of my dogs has a liver issue). This in addition to my UTI dog and all of her issues has educated me about what different foods do and how they target problems. You might want to Google your dogs conditions and food recommended just to educate yourself. It really does help. There are also supplements that are available, but I have not used them. From what I gather, a good diet that targets the problem is usually enough to keep things under control. Also, if you are going to your regular vet, you might consider consulting a specialist just to get another opinion. This route has saved me tons of time and money. Good luck!! SG

Comments about cystitis in younger cats (no idea how old any of the cats in the above discussions are, but for now I will just assume they are all under 10 years?). Cats with urinary issues under 10 years of age are almost always due to a non-infectious condition currently referred to as FIC (feline idiopathic or inflammatory cystitis). Less than 5% of these cats (male or female) actually have UTIs (urinary tract infections). For years and years we assumed these cats had infections... and when the evidence finally proved us wrong, we then assumed it was a dietary issue (most vets still believe this fallacy to this day)... but recent research has been showing that though canned food is generally recommended, the actual diet often has no bearing on the cystitis (still hard for me to get my head around this as this has been drummed into our brains for over 20 years now). It is STRESS that is the cause of 90-95% of these cases of FIC... there is a very complex physiologic reaction to stress in some cats (not all obviously, or all cats would be having FIC half the time... turns out genetically only 5-10% of all cats tend to have this abnormal reaction to stress... the other 90% of cats will NEVER have this condition no matter what happens to them. The actual physiologic responses that lead to bladder inflammation are not clear to me, but they obviously exist. Not all these cats with FIC have crystals in their urine... in fact, most do not. The presence of crystals in dog and cat urine is, most of the time, meaningless and considered normal (though some crystals are more common than others). We used to think it was always crystalline plugs that caused male cats to block, but sometimes it is just mucus plugs- no crystals at all... and sometimes it is little tiny oxalate stones (these are the worst as they do not dissolve and even pushing them back into the bladder just delays the inevitable... having to surgically go in and remove them). Female cats get cystitis as often or even MORE often than do male cats, but thanks to their wide urethras, are far less apt to block up (and as a result are far less worried about when they have urinary issues). All these cystitis cats are in pain. All need pain meds (male and female) along with whatever other treatments are used to relieve them of their cystitis. So be sure if you have a cat with cystitis (straining to urinate, blood in the urine, frequent urination) they need to be on pain meds, sometimes for extended periods of time (weeks sometimes). Alleviating these cat's pain will often alleviate their stress as well and can sometimes 'cure' them (temporarily or permanently) of their cystitis. But the goals now for treating cystitis are aimed also at decreasing these cats stress levels (not always that easy since most of the time we have no idea what is stressing these poor kitties out). Stressors that we can manipulate include not having enough cat boxes in the house (always should be one more cat box than there are cats)... and cat boxes need to be in open areas (not corners or between objects)... in other words, easy to get in and out of (in at least two different directions- so NO lids, either). Also pheromones are often recommended now (in the form of diffusors or sprays)- most common brand is Feliway. These pheromones make the kitty relax and be less stressed and the resultant physiological response will be less inflammation in the bladder. Believe me, it is hard sell sometimes, particularly as most clients assume their cat has a simple bladder infection and only want antibiotics... not all these 'stress crap' that actually is the cause. Historically cats given antibiotics often get better, but only because this disease is a normally waxing/ waning condition that gets better often on its own, though the owners conclusion is the antibiotics are what worked. Can't blame them as most dogs and many people with cystitis have UTIs, so why not cats? No one knows for sure, but turns out cystitis in people is sometimes stress related, too. On top of all this 'revolutionary' thinking about cat cystitis is the realization that not every bacteria in urine (dog, cat AND even people) needs to be treated- also a 'new' idea in veterinary medicine. We used to ALWAYS treat any bacteria found in urine assuming urine is supposed to be sterile always... turns out that is not the case. So when we find bacteria in urine in cats that are asymptomatic, we are now told we should not necessarily put them on antibiotics. Yikes! Medicine is getting MORE complicated as I get older, not less. Now, cats OVER 10 years of age have a rapidly increasing risk of real urinary tract infections (the older the cat, the more likely UTI IS the cause of the cystitis... but still not always). So for any of the above cats that are OVER 10 years of age, the chances are 50% or more that they DO have an infection... particularly if there is another disease process (renal failure, diabetes, hyperthyroidism etc.). Sorry for the long story, but just wanted to chime in the above discussion so you can understand why sometimes food is NOT the issue and crystals are NOT the issue, and bacteria is NOT the issue. Hope this helps.