Oh how I wish we could edit posts! I forgot to point out that to the right of the dining area in those plans are turned stairs which we can leave exposed. I'm sitting here looking at the current Coastal Living Ultimate Style Guide and saw some neat examples of casual eating rooms with exposed stairs. So that's one advantage to leaving it the way it is I suppose. But again, not having all three rooms open to each other wasn't in our vision. If we have people over and there's a game on or what not, we'd like the option to see the TV from the main eating area (non-island) and have more than four people in the room at a time.

What about taking down the wall b/w the kitchen & dining area, putting the range on the exterior wall (flanked by windows, maybe), the refrigerator and perhaps a pantry or utility cabinet on the bottom wall, and the sink & DW on a deep counter facing the dining area (18" behind the sink w/cabinets below facing the dining area for storage).

It might encroach too much on the dining area, but maybe that could be worked out.

I like your idea of exposing the stairs, but I think a banquette would solve a lot of your space issues, too. Can you do both?

Buehl has some great ideas about the layout...and using a banquette against that stair wall would give you the extra space you need. If you move the fridge, to the wall by the pantry, you could put the hutch there, too and have more window space in the dining area.

I'm planning a banquette for my dining area (no formal dining, either) so here's some of my pics. I'm putting the banquette against a window wall, but it would look good with the stairs, too...or you could do a corner banquette and have some windows :)

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I like the idea of opening up the wall between the kitchen and dining area.

Here are some pictures of different open pass throughs that look great. In these pictures it's a family room that is on the other side of the pass through from the kitchen, but that could just as easily be your dining area.

First is from Molly Frey Design, next are thanks to Shanghai mom who posted these long ago. Not sure of original source.

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I'm ALL about a banquette! I love them and love the ideas so far! You guys are great!

My concern about putting something on that lower wall is that if you look straight right, the front door is down that way. I'll post the whole layout of the first floor below. It's a New Orleans home...longer and more narrow b/c of the lot width. So that's where we have some constraints.

So with that in mind, would you still put something on that lower wall? I guess with that wall gone and the stairs exposed, it will open up that space considerably so it won't matter having something on that wall? I don't know. But will I be walking across the earth to get things out of the fridge? I like the idea of the range on the window wall at the top and the sink in the island (but facing the living room) instead.

I also like the photos of the pass through walls. That gives me an idea I hadn't thought of before...

What about taking down the wall between the Kitchen and Dining area and reorienting the kitchen a bit and having some part of it in the same orientation and comparable position as the sofa across from the family room fireplace?

I would not want anything on that corridor wall at all--I would make sure that even the edge of the bar does not encroach on it...having something like a cabinet on that wall would totally ruin the Shotgun you have going in the North end of the house from front door to back, and that's what that part of the country is all about.

You may also want to have a "back door" link from the Master Bedroom Closet to the Office.

Palimpsest and all,

**To note, the windows aren't fixed, nor are the walls. The furniture is just there to define rooms really.**

I really like having the island where it is with the seating...though we could shorten it a bit and widen it and have a seat on the bottom end.

I hadn't thought about doing anything on that particular plane. What about the space left from the lack of the wall?

What if the range moves to the top wall and slightly left and the fridge moves with it to the far right of that cabinet run before that window to the left of the hutch in the dining area. Then instead of that wall, we could do another island/counter (or a pass through area like chicagoans posted) with the sink/dishwasher?

Ugh. This is hard. I'm just trying to picture SOMETHING before I give in to switching the dining and the kitchen with each other. Maybe that would just be a better option...

Though they're narrow houses, they're not really "shotgun" houses since you don't go through rooms to get to another. But they can really only be two rooms wide with a hall way. It's limiting for sure!!

Palimpsest, I posted the full plans on the home building forum and the laundry/office area came up. I agree...I'm actually wanting to ask about flipping or rearranging them somehow to see about accessing the laundry from the MB closet. It was also pointed out about having the w/d under the windows. I don't want them under windows b/c I'd rather have cabinetry there. Good call on that "back door" link! We're on the same wavelength with that!

looking at this I thought about what I would do if it were mine. I like informal open settings. Maybe completely open between the kitchen and DR. Do one looonnnnggg run along the window wall with two smaller islands facing it. Then the table below it. It's a crazy idea but I love the notion of a long run like that. Maybe too much wine... :-)

Essentially the architect has it drawn as a shotgun on the north side of the house, though, and I like that. While you are not passing through the rooms per se, the hall gives you that illusion because it is articulated with doorways and something going across between the kitchen and family room, at least in this rendering.

(the other "half of the duplex" has been offset to the back of the property, but the overall form reminds me of the shotgun double houses that have been combined and the circulation occupies one half and the other half is no longer a shotgun, but rooms that open off that hall.)

My tendency would be to allude to this anyway, since the shotgun or side hall is an important vernacular architecture in the region.

You need a wall somewhere for the refrigerator! If you don't want a wall b/w the LR & Kitchen, you don't want a wall b/w the Kitchen & DR, and you don't want the refrigerator on the "bottom" wall...your only other option is the exterior wall...blocking the windows.

So, which do you choose?

Maybe you could eliminate all windows in the kitchen and put the refrigerator & range on that exterior wall. Just be sure the other rooms have lots of windows to make up for the loss of light in the kitchen.

The fridge could be in a column, as so: (beyond the sputnik, aligned with the fireplace column...

Or as so:

These columns were not freestanding when all was said and done. Cabinetry linked them to something else, but the column reads as structure and the cabinetry doesn't (quite)

Ah! I see what you mean. It's still wide open despite the column. Thanks Palimpsest.

You know, the more I think about it, the more I think I'm better off switching the kitchen with the dining. One of my MAIN goals in this house was to have a wide open family room with an eat-in kitchen. Right now we have a living room that's fully opened to the kitchen with an island where the four of us eat. But the informal dining is kind of closed off so that room rarely gets used. I fear that having the plans like this will have the dining area rarely used or put us in a situation where when we're in there to eat with 5+ people and others are in the living room, finished, you can't converse. That's going backwards from what I envisioned.

Also, I started thinking about kitchen storage and cabinetry. Unless I partially close in that wall, I will have NO upper cabinetry for storage other than a teeny amount on the upper wall. I have such a functional layout now, I don't think I can think about dealing with that. Moving the kitchen will allow me to have an L-shaped kitchen and more upper cabinets and put the range on the right wall and the sink on the upper wall. I just feel like it works better.

Now the issue with that is the pantry being further from the kitchen. I think he could switch out the pantry with the 1/2 bath but won't it be odd to have a pantry right there? There are always issues aren't there?? LOL!

Of course, I had originally envisioned this in an L-type scenario with the kitchen/living on one plane and the breakfast/dining off the kitchen. I prefer that to having the table between the two rooms. But I think out of having the table between and the dining semi-closed off or partly separated, I'd prefer the table in between.

(warning - painkillers are speaking to me ...)
If you want it as open and casual as possible, I would let go of the idea of three box rooms in a row. The kitchen has to have some wall, so I would put that in the corner against the bathtub. So maybe twelve feet of cabs down the window wall from there, and some stuff against the stair wall.

Then instead of a formal rectangle island, I would copy that piano bar island that's on here somewhere. Establish some diagonal. Leave the whole rest of it wide open and move the pieces around at will.

I would also move the fireplace to a corner. That would be less formal, and more adapatable because it doesn't establish a center point that will need balance.

Put some wiring into those brass floor plugs, and mount the tv on a movable wall unit.

One last thought - you seem to want an open community lifestyle, except for the office tucked into a back closet. (no mention of kids unless I missed it.) In our house we hang at the computers, so we purposefully put three of them together. We share funny videos and stuff. Yours is probably better for quiet isolated work, though.

Anyway, good luck and happy designing.

I really like your home so far. Your hall and view down the house are wonderful and will do great things for it. I have something similar, with windows and single French door at the ends, but less "clean" and lined up. I want yours (!) and agree with recessing the bar slightly so there aren't always messy snags to the view you've created. Ours not only makes our home feel much larger than it is and connects us to the outside, but its simplicity makes our home seem more orderly even when it's not. That rear cabinetry could be much, much shallower and still provide excellent bar storage.

Although if it doesn't fit your lifestyle, it just won't do, the three rooms carefully opened to each other could be fantastic, with an open staircase too. A neglected or unappealing dining room is definitely something to worry about, though. If you were to leave the dining room where it is, could you work on its function a bit, "break" the usual dining room box? How about putting a TV in there too for when a game's on? The table could have the kind of comfy armchairs people end up spending whole evenings in. Even a couch, or a very cushy wall-to-wall banquette, where the china cabinet is.

What's out those side windows in the dining room? Do you have 8 (even 5?) feet to...perhaps a creeping fig or ivy-covered wall with a quiet water source dribbling down into a little deep green pond running along the wall, even a few ferns poking out of the corners, resident frogs, mossy brick if you wanted? If so, how about "breaking" the otherwise front-rear orientation a bit with windows across most of that wall to your secret garden? If so, would you need a window in the kitchen?

Lyvia, we have two kids. Their spaces are upstairs. There are two bedrooms and a large media/playroom. My exercise room is up there also. The small office is because we have a regular one now and it's just not used much at all. We're a laptop family and use them in the main family spaces. So our office is mostly used to store things, pay bills, file, etc. That's why we reduced the size from what it is in our current house.

We don't want to have unused rooms in this house.

Rosie, The lot is 50 feet wide. The house is 36 feet. I think there's 10 feet of yard on that side. But I definitely want a window over the sink if the sink's not in the island. I don't want to look at a wall while at the sink. It's just a "thing" I have. :) Thank you for the ideas re: the bar and for the compliments on the house!

I started drawing out the house with the kitchen by the stairs and in an L formation with the table in the middle and though I didn't prefer it initially, I prefer it to this layout I think. I was also able to fit the the refrigerator on the top wall and shorten what's on the stair wall to hopefully expose some of the stairs and open up that entry to that open living space. And with NO walls, it will be a nice, open space with no breaks.

I'm meeting with him Tuesday and will share this with him to see what he thinks.

I'm still open to more ideas!